New Tory Leader

[Herman 9,825]

25 minutes ago, Yellow Fever said:

Everyone who isn't unquestionably fully signed up for the current Israeli policy is an extremist to LYB. That not only includes the UN but even Biden and the US too it seems

Perhaps the extremist is LYB!

Even Ben Gvir thinks he should wind his neck in.😉

[Rock The Boat 1,332]

7 hours ago, Well b back said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-67456174
 

Indeed, the government are claiming this, but it looks like Cameron’s finger print on this. I guess they will be withdrawing lots of the policies made to devide saying they never happened.

Makes you wonder who is the currently making the decisions, Sunak or Cameron

Cameron has been parachuted in to take over leadership of the party after the next election. Sunak will receive a generous payoff. So Cameron will be involved in a lot more than foreign affaires in the coming months.

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

2 hours ago, Rock The Boat said:

Cameron has been parachuted in to take over leadership of the party after the next election. Sunak will receive a generous payoff. So Cameron will be involved in a lot more than foreign affaires in the coming months.

Thank goodness we are back on topic.

I don't see Cameron back as a candidate other than an alternative to Braverman. The current Tories are an incompetent lot. And we don't know how good Labour politicians will be next year.

We have had little dynasties since the late 70s. People look for change. They want inspiring politics after a while. Safety and redemption are good for the first term. But just another bout of the same medicine turns people off politics.

But wedo not need Braverman's acid policies. Just because a good many think her migrant policy is good doesn't mean they might be happy with anything else she serves up. I think Cameron is the back stop. They will be out of power for two terms no doubt.

[Well b back 3,280]

1 hour ago, TheDarkKnight said:

Look at those shoes. When Sunak loses the general election he's got a spot as Kusty the Clown in "The Simpsons" live action movie.

 

Lol

Strangely enough for the last 5 years our potholes were going to be repaired with invisible money. Now suddenly the rug is pulled from money allocated to the North, and the whole country can have their potholes repaired using the money that was allocated to the North. But of course this will be done over 11 years, probably because there are now to many to cope with.

[Herman 9,825]

 

[horsefly 4,315]

On 18/11/2023 at 17:17, Rock The Boat said:

Cameron has been parachuted in to take over leadership of the party after the next election. Sunak will receive a generous payoff. So Cameron will be involved in a lot more than foreign affaires in the coming months.

Total bollox on so many levels.

1. There will NEVER be a Lord leading the Tory Party, or any other party in the 21st century.

2. Cameron is despised by very many Tory MPs, and certainly by UKIP/Brexit dominated constituency parties.

3. Cameron is mired in scandals (Greensill, and China) that will see his return to politics be a very brief sojourn. 

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

5 hours ago, Herman said:

 

Let the old people die, apart from:

Mohamed Mansour, Charlie Mullins (although he looks like he has died), Hans Rausing, Richard Sharp, Richard Desmond and any other elderly person who we have bent or broken the rules for and received generous donations for.

 

[TheGunnShow 6,006]

If Braverman's the answer, the question is "who do useful idiots think will do a job even though she has left the position of Home Secretary twice?"

Which has to be unprecedented, surely?

Edited November 21, 2023 by TheGunnShow

[Rock The Boat 1,332]

8 hours ago, horsefly said:

Total bollox on so many levels.

1. There will NEVER be a Lord leading the Tory Party, or any other party in the 21st century.

2. Cameron is despised by very many Tory MPs, and certainly by UKIP/Brexit dominated constituency parties.

3. Cameron is mired in scandals (Greensill, and China) that will see his return to politics be a very brief sojourn. 

So you've never heard of general elections? I was obviously generous in comparing you to a 10th grader

[horsefly 4,315]

42 minutes ago, Rock The Boat said:

So you've never heard of general elections? I was obviously generous in comparing you to a 10th grader

You truly are an idiot. Ready to apologise for calling the child victims of a billionaire sexual predator "well paid whores" yet? Thought not.

[Herman 9,825]

😂

 

[dylanisabaddog 4,987]

12 hours ago, Herman said:

😂

 

Why on earth would anyone think this was worth wasting a court's time? 

[Herman 9,825]

11 minutes ago, dylanisabaddog said:

Why on earth would anyone think this was worth wasting a court's time? 

IDS is a well known thin skinned, letter of complaint writer. Thick as **** too but obviously not a disadvantage in toryland. 

[dylanisabaddog 4,987]

Much talk on the BBC this morning about a reduction in NIC. That seems strange to me as it doesn't benefit the retired Tory vote. 

If a reduction in tax is appropriate it's the last thing I would have expected them to do. Have they gone soft? 

I would have spent it on health/education but they would find that odd as they favour private schools and health. 

[DraytonBoy 162]

If there has to be tax cuts then an uplift of the tax allowances would help those at the bottom the most as would an increase in benefits at the full rate based on September's inflation figure and not the lower October figure. 

[BroadstairsR 2,206]

34 minutes ago, DraytonBoy said:

If there has to be tax cuts then an uplift of the tax allowances would help those at the bottom the most as would an increase in benefits at the full rate based on September's inflation figure and not the lower October figure. 

The threshold freeze amounts to a stealth tax, and raising this would benefit so many so much and therefore invigorate the economy by increasing 'spendability.'

"Growth" seems to be the order of the day. There was much to be said for 'Trussism'  but such a pity that it was delivered in such a clumsy way by two semi-clowns.

Corporation tax needs reducing to encourage bigger businesses and provide greater employment.

Winter fuel payments (and possibly pension increases) should be subject to some sort of means testing.   I applaud the apparent crack-down on the work-shy. Why has it taken so long?

We desperately need an influx of so-called illegal immigrants for their youth and employability. There is much talent in those boats. The system for rooting out the bad apples needs complete reform. Too many undesirables arrive with those worthy of being infiltrated into our society. I have witnessed it with my own eyes.

 

Edited November 22, 2023 by BroadstairsR

[dylanisabaddog 4,987]

2 minutes ago, BroadstairsR said:

 

Winter fuel payments (and possibly pension increases) should be subject to some sort of means testing.

 

I have a wealthy friend who gives his winter fuel allowance to his daughters every year. They both earn around £100k.

[horsefly 4,315]

Record borrowing to make electioneering tax cuts?

https://x.com/carolvorders/status/1727100979932192946?s=20

[Barbe bleu 832]

22 minutes ago, dylanisabaddog said:

I have a wealthy friend who gives his winter fuel allowance to his daughters every year. They both earn around £100k.

It's really hard to comment on this. We all know that not everyone really needs these payments but the common and obvious response is that means testing might/would cost more than the savings it would make. 

Obviously government needs to be more joined up in how it does things but that's not on the immediate horizon so we must deal with what we have and I'm not sure that data is there to disprove the common response.

[Barbe bleu 832]

33 minutes ago, BroadstairsR said:

Corporation tax needs reducing to encourage bigger businesses and provide greater employment.

 

I'm a bit ignorant on corporation tax but isn't it paid on but before dividends?

If so, lowering it would seem to be an incentive to set up new businesses and to invest in stocks and shares but would increase the marginal (is that the right word) of employment as the costs of employees act to reduce the corporation tax bill and a reduction in that rate would reduce the desirability of doing so.

Am I missing something?

[Barbe bleu 832]

18 minutes ago, horsefly said:

Record borrowing to make electioneering tax cuts?

https://x.com/carolvorders/status/1727100979932192946?s=20

Whatever the colour of the next government the problem will be the same.  Why we have a big debt is an important question but its far less important than the question of what we do about it. 

Negative campaigning will be enough for labour at the next election and identifying issues is useful, but I'd much prefer to hear what they are going to do to solve problems.

[horsefly 4,315]

14 minutes ago, Barbe bleu said:

It's really hard to comment on this. We all know that not everyone really needs these payments but the common and obvious response is that means testing might/would cost more than the savings it would make. 

Obviously government needs to be more joined up in how it does things but that's not on the immediate horizon so we must deal with what we have and I'm not sure that data is there to disprove the common response.

Indeed! Just as the renewed attack on the most vulnerable in society (the disabled, long-term sick, unemployed etc) will undoubtedly fail to make any significant savings, as has always been the case in the past. All we shall see is a private company given a hugely expensive government contract to employ unqualified staff pressured to exclude claimants from benefits. The majority of those traumatized claimants will then win an appeal to have benefits restored. Sadly a small number unable to cope with the stress will take their own lives. All this has been extensively documented by Private Eye over many years. 

[dylanisabaddog 4,987]

29 minutes ago, Barbe bleu said:

I'm a bit ignorant on corporation tax but isn't it paid on but before dividends?

If so, lowering it would seem to be an incentive to set up new businesses and to invest in stocks and shares but would increase the marginal (is that the right word) of employment as the costs of employees act to reduce the corporation tax bill and a reduction in that rate would reduce the desirability of doing so.

Am I missing something?

Corporation Tax is a tax on company profits. 

Dividends paid by companies are in general taxed on individuals as follows. 

It is highly likely that Labour would tax dividends at the same rate as other income rather than giving a discount. 

Edited November 22, 2023 by dylanisabaddog

[dylanisabaddog 4,987]

23 minutes ago, Barbe bleu said:

I'm a bit ignorant on corporation tax but isn't it paid on but before dividends?

If so, lowering it would seem to be an incentive to set up new businesses and to invest in stocks and shares but would increase the marginal (is that the right word) of employment as the costs of employees act to reduce the corporation tax bill and a reduction in that rate would reduce the desirability of doing so.

Am I missing something?

Probably the best way to encourage growth is to charge zero Corporation Tax on start ups for up to 3 years. That has been shown to create growth and jobs but is also extremely susceptible to abuse. 

[dylanisabaddog 4,987]

32 minutes ago, Barbe bleu said:

It's really hard to comment on this. We all know that not everyone really needs these payments but the common and obvious response is that means testing might/would cost more than the savings it would make. 

Obviously government needs to be more joined up in how it does things but that's not on the immediate horizon so we must deal with what we have and I'm not sure that data is there to disprove the common response.

If a whole new means testing system was created it would cost almost as much as the cut saved. If they do cut the fuel payment it seems likely to be tied to another benefit connected to state pensions or housing benefits. I'm afraid I have no idea how those benefits work or how many people receive them. 

Edited November 22, 2023 by dylanisabaddog

[DraytonBoy 162]

There are no easy fixes to the massive government debt, a rundown and disjointed health and social care system, poor transport infrastructure, a poorly trained workforce and an every increasing benefits bill.

The Tories latest tax giveaway is a desperate attempt from a spent and clueless bunch to win back some votes which is pointless as the forthcoming GE was lost a long time ago, Labour don't show any sign beyond a few soundbites they have any real idea of what is required either so I expect the country to bumble on for the next few years until someone emerges to take the difficult decisions that are sorely needed. 

[Yellow Fever 3,835]

56 minutes ago, Barbe bleu said:

It's really hard to comment on this. We all know that not everyone really needs these payments but the common and obvious response is that means testing might/would cost more than the savings it would make. 

Obviously government needs to be more joined up in how it does things but that's not on the immediate horizon so we must deal with what we have and I'm not sure that data is there to disprove the common response.

This sort of thing is why I'd bring in NI tax on as per income tax on all income whether retired, unearned or not. Income is income.

Treat everybody the same.

[dylanisabaddog 4,987]

4 hours ago, Yellow Fever said:

This sort of thing is why I'd bring in NI tax on as per income tax on all income whether retired, unearned or not. Income is income.

Treat everybody the same.

That works for a Labour Government but the Conservatives would never do it. 

It would cost me a small fortune but I agree with you. 

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

I can never understand when the mantra is basically eveyone has to work harder, why tax is taken on overtime earnings. If you want growth, then give people some encouragement. The incentive always seems to be at the top end. Or even raise personal allowance to £15K-£18K. TAke some lower earners out of the direct tax strata. The Government would probably get it back in VAT

The NI drop is good. Any drop is.

[BroadstairsR 2,206]

It's a crafty pile of sh-ite.

Personal allowance not being increased means that they are not as generous as they purport to be ... work it out.