What is stopping David Fox moving on?

[The Great Mass Debater 1,202]

Fox seems to have no role under Hughton. Played heavily in pre-season (as did Vaughan last season) but not featuring now, which suggests that was a shop window exercise.

Fox looked pretty peeved on the bench last year, and I remember one game in particular where he had to come on as a sub for an injury and he looked genuinely shocked the manager was putting him on.

It would seem him moving on would be best for all parties. So why is he still here?

There was the rumour of him having a flight to Manchester, but nothing seems to have come of that. Regardless of your thoughts on Fox he would surely do a good job in League 1 or the Championship. I imagine we wouldnt ask much for him, and I cant imagine he is on a huge amount of money.

So if he doesnt have a future here, and he recognizes that - where is the barrier to him moving on? Surely its not a fee or wages. Is it as simple as nobody wants him? Even in League 1?

He surely can be very happy with such little involvment in the first team and playing with the kids.

Why do others think he is still here?

[Tetteys Jig 851]

He is probably being courted by several teams and waiting for the best offer.

He''ll be gone by deadline day i reckon.

[morty 0]

Maybe we all have it wrong, and he is working hard in training, and is just a whisker away from making it into the first 11?

[ReadingCanary 0]

Maybe no one wants him?Maybe he likes Norwich

[Rolf Harris 33]

Training the youngster may be? He''s often in the under 21 games.

[Warren Hill 0]

I reckon he''s still here because anyone that might want him won''t play wages snap with his current contract.

[Bethnal Yellow and Green 2,424]

Barely played for a season, given a Premier League sized contract in 2012, 29 - not hard to see why he wouldn''t be on the top of many teams'' shopping list. Especially when you consider his CV isn''t exactly sparkling.

 

I really like Fox as a player, and think him being so overlooked is very poor judgement. However, he is also a little like Hoolahan and needs to be played in exactly the right role and have players around him to cover for his weaknesses. Fox was a Lambert favourite and Lambert knew how to get the most out of him, it is understandable that other managers might not see the him the same way.

 

I have a feeling he might be at Norwich until his contract expires - Norwich might be able to loan him out, but seeing as they would probably have to cover a chunk of his wages it might be seen as best just to keep him around for cover.

[Hannibal II 0]

I think Crystal Palace is move that would suit both parties he could be for them what Charlie Adam was for Blackpool under Holloway

[morty 0]

Seriously though, if you were the manager of another team, would YOU buy him?Based on what? A distant memory of a few good games? I''m not so sure how many reserve / under 21 games he has played to even put him in the shop window.

[Bethnal Yellow and Green 2,424]

[quote user="Hannibal II"]I think Crystal Palace is move that would suit both parties he could be for them what Charlie Adam was for Blackpool under Holloway[/quote]

 

Seeing as Holloway didn''t think Fox was good enough to give a new contract to while at Blackpool I doubt he''ll be signing him now he is in the Premier League.

[Tetteys Jig 851]

I think the wages thing will delay a move, but not stop it. He will probs go to a team and we will pay some of his wages.

[Mr Brownstone 0]

[quote user="Bethnal Yellow and Green"]

I really like Fox as a player, and think him being so overlooked is very poor judgement. However, he is also a little like Hoolahan and needs to be played in exactly the right role and have players around him to cover for his weaknesses. Fox was a Lambert favourite and Lambert knew how to get the most out of him, it is understandable that other managers might not see the him the same way.

[/quote]

 

Agree with that. He''s a player that has qualities that no other player in the squad has, but his game obviously has it''s deficencies too. Always like to see a player from midfield looking for the ball all the time and moving it on quickly. Tettey, Johnson and to a degree Howson rarely come looking for it when the defence has it, something I''m hoping that Fer will do for us if he''s played in the correct position. I don''t think it''s a coincidence that we''ve rarely dominated possession for long enough spells to build pressure since Fox hasn''t been in the side.

 

[BOO 0]

What is there to showcase him, hardly any current or recent form to go on, shame he is in this position but hopefully he will be gone by the end of the deadline. I don''t say that cos I don''t like him, but for his sake another season of obscurity will be pretty depressing, good pay cheque though!

[Juggy 0]

[quote user="morty"]Seriously though, if you were the manager of another team, would YOU buy him? [/quote]

Yes. Wigan should sign him if they want to get promoted and want Grant Holt to score 20 goals.

He should be playing for us. Of course you will just attempt to explain how Tettey, Howson, Johnson and Hoolahan are all better players, but you will find it impossible to explain how we don''t create any chances for our strikers. 

Some of us can see what we are missing. It''s a big David Fox sized hole in the middle of the pitch which Hughton has made no attempt to fill. Paul Lambert knew that he needed a David Fox at Villa, that''s why he bought Ashley Westwood. 

[morty 0]

[quote user="The New Boy Le Juge"][quote user="morty"]Seriously though, if you were the manager of another team, would YOU buy him? [/quote]

Yes. Wigan should sign him if they want to get promoted and want Grant Holt to score 20 goals.

He should be playing for us. Of course you will just attempt to explain how Tettey, Howson, Johnson and Hoolahan are all better players, but you will find it impossible to explain how we don''t create any chances for our strikers. 

Some of us can see what we are missing. It''s a big David Fox sized hole in the middle of the pitch which Hughton has made no attempt to fill. Paul Lambert knew that he needed a David Fox at Villa, that''s why he bought Ashley Westwood. 

[/quote]So on the one hand you say he should be playing in the Championship, but on the other say he should be playing in the Premiership for us?If Paul Lambert needed a David Fox at Villa, why didn''t he but David Fox lol?

[morty 0]

*Buy

[Juggy 0]

[quote user="Mr Brownstone"][quote user="Bethnal Yellow and Green"]

I really like Fox as a player, and think him being so overlooked is very poor judgement. However, he is also a little like Hoolahan and needs to be played in exactly the right role and have players around him to cover for his weaknesses. Fox was a Lambert favourite and Lambert knew how to get the most out of him, it is understandable that other managers might not see the him the same way.

[/quote]

Agree with that. He''s a player that has qualities that no other player in the squad has, but his game obviously has it''s deficencies too. Always like to see a player from midfield looking for the ball all the time and moving it on quickly. Tettey, Johnson and to a degree Howson rarely come looking for it when the defence has it, something I''m hoping that Fer will do for us if he''s played in the correct position. I don''t think it''s a coincidence that we''ve rarely dominated possession for long enough spells to build pressure since Fox hasn''t been in the side.

[/quote]

His deficiencies are almost identical to Hoolahan''s, which is why Lambert would rotate Fox and Hoolahan, and would only have both on the pitch at the same time when chasing a game.

The same old tired argument is that Fox can''t tackle. We play three central midfielders for goodness sake. If having Fox on the pitch means we can''t win the ball then that says more about the inability of the players who are supposed to do this job (Tettey, Johnson) than it does about Fox.  

Fox should be rotated with Hoolahan in this league, it''s what Lambert did with great success. 

[Juggy 0]

[quote]

So on the one hand you say he should be playing in the Championship, but on the other say he should be playing in the Premiership for us? [/quote]

I think you just made that up Morty. 

[quote] If Paul Lambert needed a David Fox at Villa, why didn''t he but David Fox lol? [/quote]

Because Hughton gave him a two year contract pretty much immediately and told everybody how important Fox was to our team and how delighted he was to have him commit? 

[morty 0]

[quote user="The New BoyLe Juge"][quote]

So on the one hand you say he should be playing in the Championship, but on the other say he should be playing in the Premiership for us? [/quote]

I think you just made that up Morty. 

[quote] If Paul Lambert needed a David Fox at Villa, why didn''t he but David Fox lol? [/quote]

Because Hughton gave him a two year contract pretty much immediately and told everybody how important Fox was to our team and how delighted he was to have him commit? 

[/quote]Errrr, no, you just posted that he should sign for Wigan. I''m not making anything up.Well you can''t win them all, can you. I like Hughton, and the vast majority of his contractual and new player decisions have been good, I guess he just dropped the ball on Fox. But that wouldn''t have stopped anyone bidding for him really though, would it?

[Bethnal Yellow and Green 2,424]

[quote user="The New Boy le Juge"][quote user="Mr Brownstone"][quote user="Bethnal Yellow and Green"]

I really like Fox as a player, and think him being so overlooked is very poor judgement. However, he is also a little like Hoolahan and needs to be played in exactly the right role and have players around him to cover for his weaknesses. Fox was a Lambert favourite and Lambert knew how to get the most out of him, it is understandable that other managers might not see the him the same way.

[/quote]

Agree with that. He''s a player that has qualities that no other player in the squad has, but his game obviously has it''s deficencies too. Always like to see a player from midfield looking for the ball all the time and moving it on quickly. Tettey, Johnson and to a degree Howson rarely come looking for it when the defence has it, something I''m hoping that Fer will do for us if he''s played in the correct position. I don''t think it''s a coincidence that we''ve rarely dominated possession for long enough spells to build pressure since Fox hasn''t been in the side.

[/quote]

His deficiencies are almost identical to Hoolahan''s, which is why Lambert would rotate Fox and Hoolahan, and would only have both on the pitch at the same time when chasing a game.

The same old tired argument is that Fox can''t tackle. We play three central midfielders for goodness sake. If having Fox on the pitch means we can''t win the ball then that says more about the inability of the players who are supposed to do this job (Tettey, Johnson) than it does about Fox.  

Fox should be rotated with Hoolahan in this league, it''s what Lambert did with great success. 

[/quote]

Not being able to tackle is only one of Fox''s problems, he is also poor in the air, not particulary strong and has a lack of mobility. Playing at the base of the diamond worked well for him due to the support provided by two other midfielders close by and didn''t have to cover a huge amount of ground. In a 4-2-3-1 Fox would have to cover more ground and press more - after Lambert signed Howson he tried him out in the Fox role a couple of times (without much success) but it showed that he was also concerned by Fox''s weaknesses.

 

I think Fox is a good player, but he isn''t so good he would add more to the current team than not selecting him takes away - especially now Fer is around and has the same passing range as Fox. In all honesty Fox was a good passer of the ball but he wasn''t as good as people make out - he, like many other players before him, has had his abilities overhyped by people''s memories - if he was as good as the way people talk about him he''d be Pirlo''s equal.

 

A player good in his position, but maybe not flexible enough to play in different formations.

 

[morty 0]

Blimey Morty, is that hard for you to post without demeaning Foxy? He may not be in the manager''s plans now but he was one of the most important players in the promotion season. Have some respect.

[Hog 0]

Because he is seriously overrated, cost next to nothing from Colchester United and was hailed as a footballing messiah just because he could pass a ball. Doubt anyone would match his current wages so he is probably content to warm the occasional bench and play with the kids once in a while.

[morty 0]

[quote user="Ferk off"]Blimey Morty, is that hard for you to post without demeaning Foxy? He may not be in the manager''s plans now but he was one of the most important players in the promotion season. Have some respect.[/quote]Sorry but how am I demeaning him exactly?

[Juggy 0]

[quote user="morty"][quote user="The New BoyLe Juge"][quote]

So on the one hand you say he should be playing in the Championship, but on the other say he should be playing in the Premiership for us? [/quote]

I think you just made that up Morty. 

[quote] If Paul Lambert needed a David Fox at Villa, why didn''t he but David Fox lol? [/quote]

Because Hughton gave him a two year contract pretty much immediately and told everybody how important Fox was to our team and how delighted he was to have him commit? 

[/quote]Errrr, no, you just posted that he should sign for Wigan. I''m not making anything up.

[/quote]

I said: "Wigan should sign him if they want to get promoted"

You said: "you say he should be playing in the Championship"

I said: "I think you just made that up Morty"

You said: "you just posted that he should sign for Wigan"

Something is obviously getting lost in translation? 

[morty 0]

Yup, you have completely lost me.

[Rolf Harris 33]

Lambert opted for Ashley Westwood.

[Juggy 0]

[quote user="Hog"]Because he is seriously overrated, cost next to nothing from Colchester United and was hailed as a footballing messiah just because he could pass a ball. Doubt anyone would match his current wages so he is probably content to warm the occasional bench and play with the kids once in a while.[/quote]

Well perhaps when we sign another centre midfielder who can pass a ball we can forget about him. At the moment though we are being told that he is a Championship player. Not sure what it says about Alexander Tettey or Bradley Johnson, those two don''t offer much other than chasing the ball down and tackling.

So a player who can pass and create is substandard because he can''t tackle. But a player who can''t tackle is good enough despite not being able to pass or create? Fox doesn''t have enough about his game but Alexander Tettey does? 

That is Hughton mentality. The fans are judging a player like Hughton, based on a Hughton system. Then on the other hand they cry out for Lambert style attacking football, apparently not considering the fact that if Lambert came back tomorrow and had to pick an XI from Hughton''s team he would never in a million years play Tettey and Johnson on the same pitch at the same time unless he had to. 

[Yellow Wal 315]

When are people going to realise that if David Fox was as good as so many people keep making him out to be, he would have been transferred twenty times before now.

Yes he is useful .............. but not great. He is not a Premiership footballer (but still..... I didn''t think Aaron Wilbraham was either!).

[morty 0]

[quote user="Yellow Wall"]When are people going to realise that if David Fox was as good as so many people keep making him out to be, he would have been transferred twenty times before now.

Yes he is useful .............. but not great. He is not a Premiership footballer (but still..... I didn''t think Aaron Wilbraham was either!).[/quote]I can understand that people will have favourite players, and that they may be nostalgic about seasons gone by, when they were vital parts of the team.But there come a time where you have to be objective.Its pretty rare that a manager will leave a fantastic player out of the side, for no good reason.

[Juggy 0]

[quote user="Yellow Wall"]When are people going to realise that if David Fox was as good as so many people keep making him out to be, he would have been transferred twenty times before now.

Yes he is useful .............. but not great. He is not a Premiership footballer (but still..... I didn''t think Aaron Wilbraham was either!).[/quote]

How many "great" players and "Premiership footballers" do we really have in the middle of the park? None that are proven as such. Howson has potential but doesn''t very often show it, Fer is the obvious candidate to show his greatness. 

Tettey Premier League? No way. Johnson Premier League? Newly promoted team perhaps, but no rival is going to stump up £5m for him. 

If transfer listed tomorrow I wouldn''t expect Tettey and Johnson to get any better than a move to Wigan like Grant Holt, or a Reading or a Leicester or Nottm Forest. Perhaps Hull or Palace would have a punt.