How many points do you think we need to get into Europe?

[BroadstairsR 2,273]

Well, come on let''s be ''aving you and let''s be positive now that we obviously can be. We are, after all, nearer a Europe qualifying spot than we are to a relegation place. Forget, neither, the Cup. This is becoming a magnificent bonus now, despite initial  reservations about a run being detrimental to league safety.

 

Unfotunately European qualification via the league is now confined to a select few and we are not in that selection. Unfortunatley a cup run to Wembley  is a bit of a long shot too. Or is it? We nearly made it once before.

 

We have a fine squad, managed by a fine manager and as I said in another post it won''t last forever. Let''s chase everything while we can. Grab the moment.

 

My glass, which is usually half empty, has been filling by the week and is now overspilling.  [:D][:D][:D] 

[Gingerpele 0]

I think we will beat Leicester in the cup, and then if we get a win and a draw out of Swansea, Man.U and Wigan before the quarters, I think Lambert will really go for it. His comments to the media, don''t tell the whole story, he may very well be saying safety is the key objective (which I think everyone agrees with) and he knows were not safe until its mathematically impossible. But he''s not stupid, he knows full well an FA Cup run doesn''t equal relegation, he knows that if we do get 3/4 points before the quarters, safety is all but guaranteed really, with the bottom 3/4 not showing any signs that they are going to pick up the consistency needed to win 12 more points than us.

I think an FA Cup final isn''t out of the question, it will be hard, especially if we have to face Spurs (Honestly, I think they are going to be the hardest opponents, Chelsea, Arsenal and Liverpool are probably easier to beat). If Spurs or Chelsea or Arsenal win the FA Cup (Think it also means Chelsea or which ever big team made it to League Cup final, winning that as well) , that means 7th place becomes a European spot, I do think that is out of reach. MoN has Sunderland playing great football, and wining lots. And I can''t see either Liverpool or Newcastle (as well as Sunderland) completely messing it up to fall out of the top 7.

If were getting into Europe, I reckon its via the FA Cup, which I think we have a half decent change of surprising everyone in.

[Row D Seat 7 0]

Hope we avoid Europa League. Don''t want anything to do with that competition.

[Ruddygore 0]

Since the question is how many points will we need I think this year for 5 place you would need possibly 65 points which means we would need to win at least 11 games of the final 14 we have.

I suspect my premise and my maths may also be faulty but its a big ask which even now I would not write off because I will be shot down. I will be shot down for saying this much anyway.

[Shack Attack 0]

[quote user="Row D Seat 7"]Hope we avoid Europa League. Don''t want anything to do with that competition.[/quote]

 

Seriously? Is European football beneath us now?

[BroadstairsR 2,273]

[quote user="Ruddygore"]Since the question is how many points will we need I think this year for 5 place you would need possibly 65 points which means we would need to win at least 11 games of the final 14 we have. I suspect my premise and my maths may also be faulty but its a big ask which even now I would not write off because I will be shot down. I will be shot down for saying this much anyway.[/quote]

 

Certainly not shooting you down Ruddy, but my O/P was slightly tongue in cheek and really in response to the "how many points do we need to avoid relegation" mentality.

 

There are eleven other clubs below us and it is the supporters of many of those who should be asking that last question rather than posters on here .Mathematically? Not yet, of course. Feasably? After Saturaday, NO.

 

Let''s look forward to the Cup.

[Bethnal Yellow and Green 2,424]

[quote user="Row D Seat 7"]Hope we avoid Europa League. Don''t want anything to do with that competition.[/quote]

Yeah! Let''s look forward to Norwich qualifying for the World Cup.

[Ruddygore 0]

Well BR we have 7 home games left.

Norwich v Man Utd

Norwich v Wigan

Norwich v Wolves

Norwich v Everton

Norwich v Man City

Norwich v Liverpool

Norwich v Aston Villa

7 Away games

Swansea v Norwich

Stoke v Norwich

Newcastle v Norwich

Fulham v Norwich

Tottenham v Norwich

Blackburn v Norwich

Arsenal v Norwich

There''s no doubt that we will avoid relegation, personally I feel anyone still worrying about this just likes to worry but I can see us winning potentially 4 home games and 3 away games 1 draw from the remaining so that is 54 points. Will that be enough for Europe? Not on the last 4 seasons records. Can we will eleven games?

[BroadstairsR 2,273]

[quote user="Gingerpele"]I think we will beat Leicester in the cup, and then if we get a win and a draw out of Swansea, Man.U and Wigan before the quarters, I think Lambert will really go for it. His comments to the media, don''t tell the whole story, he may very well be saying safety is the key objective (which I think everyone agrees with) and he knows were not safe until its mathematically impossible. But he''s not stupid, he knows full well an FA Cup run doesn''t equal relegation, he knows that if we do get 3/4 points before the quarters, safety is all but guaranteed really, with the bottom 3/4 not showing any signs that they are going to pick up the consistency needed to win 12 more points than us. I think an FA Cup final isn''t out of the question, it will be hard, especially if we have to face Spurs (Honestly, I think they are going to be the hardest opponents, Chelsea, Arsenal and Liverpool are probably easier to beat). If Spurs or Chelsea or Arsenal win the FA Cup (Think it also means Chelsea or which ever big team made it to League Cup final, winning that as well) , that means 7th place becomes a European spot, I do think that is out of reach. MoN has Sunderland playing great football, and wining lots. And I can''t see either Liverpool or Newcastle (as well as Sunderland) completely messing it up to fall out of the top 7. If were getting into Europe, I reckon its via the FA Cup, which I think we have a half decent change of surprising everyone in.[/quote]

 

City v Tottenham final then. What a mouthwatering prospect. Back to the good old days.

[Row D Seat 7 0]

I don''t think it''s beneath us, but just ask Stoke, Birmingham, Spurs, Man Utd & City if they really wanted to be involved in that awful, boring, long competition? I think they would privately all say no.

Fulham had to start the season at the end of June because of that competition. It''s just a crap comp and I don''t want us to have that distraction. The FA & League cups are enough.

[. 0]

Paul Lambert must read this sort of jingoistic tripe and cry...........Get a grip FFS........

[BroadstairsR 2,273]

[quote user="Paul Cluckbert"]Paul Lambert must read this sort of jingoistic tripe and cry...........

Get a grip FFS........
[/quote]

 

"Jingoistic?  Lighten up Mr. Cluck. What''s nationalism got to do with mild fantasing about the football team you support?

[BroadstairsR 2,273]

[quote user="BroadstairsR"]

[quote user="Paul Cluckbert"]Paul Lambert must read this sort of jingoistic tripe and cry...........

Get a grip FFS........
[/quote]

 

"Jingoistic?  Lighten up Mr. Cluck. What''s nationalism got to do with mild fantasing about the football team you support?

[/quote]

 

I meant "fantasising." This is the only site I have ever used that doesn''t have an edit facility.

 

Have you stopped crying yet PC?

[GJL Mid-Norfolk Canary 2,035]

Anyone suggesting that they wouldn''t want us in the Europa league possibly wasn''t around during the UEFA cup run of ''93?

I''ve been watching Norwich for over 30 years and in all that time, this peiod was by far the best. There can''t be any greater experience in football than to travel and watch your team away in Europe. I''m just thankful that in my lifetime I was able to do it once (although it may have been more, no thanks to the fans of Liverpool FC), and watching us in the Olympic stadium, Munich and the San Siro are memories that will live with me for ever,

I would NEVER pass up an an opportunity to be able to do this again, however it came.

As I''ve said this happened once in our entire history, so we''re hardly in a position to choose if/how/when it ever came again?!

[PurpleCanary 6,378]

[quote user="Shack Attack"]

[quote user="Row D Seat 7"]Hope we avoid Europa League. Don''t want anything to do with that competition.[/quote]

 

Seriously? Is European football beneath us now?

[/quote]

 

No, it isn''t, Shack. But some of Stoke''s really bad results (losing 5-0 at Bolton!!!) have come on the Sunday after a Europa League game on the Thursday. And this is Stoke''s fourth consecutive season in the Premier League. The club has been able to build up a reasonable squad in that time.

 

As someone who went to Munich and Milan I would be all in favour of us qualifying for Europe (there might even be a game near my tax haven...) eventually but I don''t think it is overly cautious to doubt if we would be ready for such a grindingly long programme of travel and matches next season.

[JF 694]

I watched us play in the uefa cup and it was the best time of being a Norwich fan. Unfortunately the Europa league isn''t a patch on what the uefa cup was, The Champions league has devalued a once great competition. Would still love us to be in it though.

[Bethnal Yellow and Green 2,424]

[quote user="PurpleCanary"][quote user="Shack Attack"]

[quote user="Row D Seat 7"]Hope we avoid Europa League. Don''t want anything to do with that competition.[/quote]

 

Seriously? Is European football beneath us now?

[/quote]

 

No, it isn''t, Shack. But some of Stoke''s really bad results (losing 5-0 at Bolton!!!) have come on the Sunday after a Europa League game on the Thursday. And this is Stoke''s fourth consecutive season in the Premier League. The club has been able to build up a reasonable squad in that time.

 

As someone who went to Munich and Milan I would be all in favour of us qualifying for Europe (there might even be a game near my tax haven...) eventually but I don''t think it is overly cautious to doubt if we would be ready for such a grindingly long programme of travel and matches next season.

[/quote]

Very valid points - but I would argue any team capable of getting to 5th/6th in the League is then fully capable of playing in Europe and not suffering relegation the following season. Being a losing FA Cup finalist is a riskier route as the team may not have the squad to cope (especially if they have a fairly easy cup run) but the added bonus of being in Europe is what allowed Stoke to add players such as Crouch and Palacios to their squad.

 

Would next season be too soon? Probably. But I don''t really think there is a chance of Norwich getting into Europe next season. These threads are purely fancyful. One of the things that annoys me most though are teams that fight all season to achieve a high league finish and European qualification and then play their reserves in Europe in the hope of being knocked out ASAP. Martin O''Neill was a prime example of this mentality - why bother being 6th or 7th in the League (as it was when he was at Villa) if you are just going to throw away the rewards of such a successful season?

[. 0]

[quote user="BroadstairsR"][quote user="BroadstairsR"]

[quote user="Paul Cluckbert"]Paul Lambert must read this sort of jingoistic tripe and cry...........Get a grip FFS........[/quote]

 

"Jingoistic?  Lighten up Mr. Cluck. What''s nationalism got to do with mild fantasing about the football team you support?

[/quote]

 

I meant "fantasising." This is the only site I have ever used that doesn''t have an edit facility.

 

Have you stopped crying yet PC?

[/quote]I don''t do spelling correction pettiness Broadstairs... that''s the domain of the desperate. My point is... let''s survive and consolidate before embarking on such over ridiculous over expectation.Personally I think where we are is remarkable enough for anyone.

[BarclayWazza 93]

[quote user="JF"]I watched us play in the uefa cup and it was the best time of being a Norwich fan. Unfortunately the Europa league isn''t a patch on what the uefa cup was, The Champions league has devalued a once great competition. Would still love us to be in it though.[/quote]

Spot on - in 93-94 our 3 games involved 2 of the biggest clubs in Europe and at that point we were only a couple of rounds from the final.  Middlesborough''s run to the final in 05-06 involved games against Skoda Xanthi, AZ, Litez Lovech, Dnipro Dnipropetrovsk, Grasshopper Zurich, Stuttgart, Roma, Basel, Steaua Bucharest and Sevilla.  So although I''d still love us to qualify (preferably from being a FA Cup Finalist) it would lack the romance that it did in 93-94 for me.

[PurpleCanary 6,378]

[quote user="Bethnal Yellow and Green"][quote user="PurpleCanary"][quote user="Shack Attack"]

[quote user="Row D Seat 7"]Hope we avoid Europa League. Don''t want anything to do with that competition.[/quote]

 

Seriously? Is European football beneath us now?

[/quote]

 

No, it isn''t, Shack. But some of Stoke''s really bad results (losing 5-0 at Bolton!!!) have come on the Sunday after a Europa League game on the Thursday. And this is Stoke''s fourth consecutive season in the Premier League. The club has been able to build up a reasonable squad in that time.

 

As someone who went to Munich and Milan I would be all in favour of us qualifying for Europe (there might even be a game near my tax haven...) eventually but I don''t think it is overly cautious to doubt if we would be ready for such a grindingly long programme of travel and matches next season.

[/quote]

Very valid points - but I would argue any team capable of getting to 5th/6th in the League is then fully capable of playing in Europe and not suffering relegation the following season. Being a losing FA Cup finalist is a riskier route as the team may not have the squad to cope (especially if they have a fairly easy cup run) but the added bonus of being in Europe is what allowed Stoke to add players such as Crouch and Palacios to their squad.

 

Would next season be too soon? Probably. But I don''t really think there is a chance of Norwich getting into Europe next season. These threads are purely fancyful. One of the things that annoys me most though are teams that fight all season to achieve a high league finish and European qualification and then play their reserves in Europe in the hope of being knocked out ASAP. Martin O''Neill was a prime example of this mentality - why bother being 6th or 7th in the League (as it was when he was at Villa) if you are just going to throw away the rewards of such a successful season?

[/quote]

 

Bethnal, a very good point. And I stress I wouldn''t be making an anti-European argument if it was the old, sensible UEFA Cup. But the Europa League, frankly, is a bloated nonsense. And one that can, potentially, destabilise a season.

[Shyster 0]

[quote user="PurpleCanary"][quote user="Bethnal Yellow and Green"][quote user="PurpleCanary"][quote user="Shack Attack"]

[quote user="Row D Seat 7"]Hope we avoid Europa League. Don''t want anything to do with that competition.[/quote]

 

Seriously? Is European football beneath us now?

[/quote]

 

No, it isn''t, Shack. But some of Stoke''s really bad results (losing 5-0 at Bolton!!!) have come on the Sunday after a Europa League game on the Thursday. And this is Stoke''s fourth consecutive season in the Premier League. The club has been able to build up a reasonable squad in that time.

 

As someone who went to Munich and Milan I would be all in favour of us qualifying for Europe (there might even be a game near my tax haven...) eventually but I don''t think it is overly cautious to doubt if we would be ready for such a grindingly long programme of travel and matches next season.

[/quote]

Very valid points - but I would argue any team capable of getting to 5th/6th in the League is then fully capable of playing in Europe and not suffering relegation the following season. Being a losing FA Cup finalist is a riskier route as the team may not have the squad to cope (especially if they have a fairly easy cup run) but the added bonus of being in Europe is what allowed Stoke to add players such as Crouch and Palacios to their squad.

 

Would next season be too soon? Probably. But I don''t really think there is a chance of Norwich getting into Europe next season. These threads are purely fancyful. One of the things that annoys me most though are teams that fight all season to achieve a high league finish and European qualification and then play their reserves in Europe in the hope of being knocked out ASAP. Martin O''Neill was a prime example of this mentality - why bother being 6th or 7th in the League (as it was when he was at Villa) if you are just going to throw away the rewards of such a successful season?

[/quote]

 

Bethnal, a very good point. And I stress I wouldn''t be making an anti-European argument if it was the old, sensible UEFA Cup. But the Europa League, frankly, is a bloated nonsense. And one that can, potentially, destabilise a season.

[/quote]

Yeah, well there''s little chance of us qualifying for Europe via the League, so if we do happen to win the FA Cup (which many also disapprove of) I think we should forfeit our european place to a club with more ambitious fans [img]http://services.pinkun.com/forums/pinkun/cs/emoticons/emotion-4.gif[/img]It really is becoming increasingly difficult to understand the mindset of today''s average football fan.

[nutty nigel 7,902]

Spot on Shyster. The only lack of ambition these days is from those fans. Or maybe it could be called prudence with ambition???

 

 

[Shyster 0]

Although I do believe the current format of both European competitions is ridiculous.Bring back champions only qualification and the two-legged KO for both tournaments.

[Shyster 0]

[quote user="nutty nigel"]

Spot on Shyster. The only lack of ambition these days is from those fans. Or maybe it could be called prudence with ambition???

 

 

[/quote]

They can keep their prudence with ambition, Ed -- I''ll stick with my speculating to accumulate. It''s served me well thus far.

[. 0]

[quote user="Shyster"]Although I do believe the current format of both European competitions is ridiculous.Bring back champions only qualification and the two-legged KO for both tournaments.[/quote]It''s about money.... pure and simple.

[Shack Attack 0]

[quote user="PurpleCanary"]

No, it isn''t, Shack. But some of Stoke''s really bad results (losing 5-0 at Bolton!!!) have come on the Sunday after a Europa League game on the Thursday. And this is Stoke''s fourth consecutive season in the Premier League. The club has been able to build up a reasonable squad in that time.

 

As someone who went to Munich and Milan I would be all in favour of us qualifying for Europe (there might even be a game near my tax haven...) eventually but I don''t think it is overly cautious to doubt if we would be ready for such a grindingly long programme of travel and matches next season.

[/quote]

 

I see your point Purple but in football events sometimes have a funny way of making such planning pointless. Seven year plan anyone? It might be more prudent to wait until we are an ''established Premier League side'' (although I do wonder if such a thing will exist much longer outside of the top six) but will we be this close again? Will Paul Lambert be tempted away by a really big job sometime in the future and derail our progress? If we were to qualify through league position (seventh will get us there if Liverpool beat Cardiff in the League Cup final and two teams who have already qualified for Europe contest the FA Cup final) the extra prize money earned compared to finishing seventeenth should help bulk out the squad. We seem to have a decent sized squad anyway with players who many would not have expected to get a sniff of first team action (Drury, Wilbraham and Lappin) making a contribution which should bode well for those extra games. In all honesty I think seventh is probably beyond us but it''s fun to speculate. We could have really done with Senegal making it to the final of the African Cup of Nations to destabilise Newcastle and for Sunderland to have not appointed Martin O''Neill. But you never know.

 

I agree that the Europa League is a bloated mess and greatly devalued by the Champions League but it is still a chance to pit your wits against some big European sides. You might get a Lithuanian pub team and a Ukranian blind school in the group stages but there are still some big boys kicking about later on. Ajax or Benfica take your fancy? Manchester United [:D][:P] Personally I think they should get rid of the group stage, bring back the Cup Winners Cup and then offer a place to the winners of each in the next seasons Champions League. But maybe that is just me being nostalgic. I''d also quite like Liverpool to be playing in the USSR on a Wednesday night when I get home from school and for Diego Maradona to be on Sportsnight later in a Napoli shirt but it''s probably not going to happen.

 

[Rudolph Hucker 0]

I believe a second season in the EPL is likely to be tougher than the first and a prolonged Europa Cup campaign might be harmful to our remaining in the league; however, that might be as relevant as was Championship consolidation.

 

Of course, it isn''t going to happen and we need to manage our expectations to be fair to the manager, players and ourselves.

 

But we have enjoyed fantastic success this season. We have accumilated most of the points we need and remained in mid-table so long we have gained widespread respect. We have developed players into Premiership players and built our assett value. We continue to bring in young players with huge potential. Everything now is a bonus; every league position a beneficial cash input; every Cup progression additional revenue. We are quite simply in a position to enjoy it and in that situation anything is possible.

 

With so few EPL games it is great to have a big cup game on an otherwise blank weekend. If we can win it there is the lottery of the draw but a home game would give us three home games on the trot in March; the Cup bracketed by Wigan and Wolves while Newcastle (A) is rescheduled.  Who knows, this could be payback time for Sunderland? Whatever the opposition the reward is massive because the semi-final will see Norwich City play at Wembley. What a day out and what a prize - bigger than the final IMO because no one remembers the SF losers. Such a game would allow most of our supporters a day to remember.

 

This season is bubbling nicely and March could be the absolute key month. Just to fight for the top ten is a league within a league we should be enjoying and the game at Swansea this Saturday is another side-show to set the pulse racing.

 

Paul Lambert plays the right line but he is deeply ambitious and knows success equals income and allows him to feed his ambitions further; he and the players will be striving to acheive - enjoy the ride.

[Jonzey 0]

Let''s not get carried away perhaps, and have a quick reality check. We''re riding the crest of a wave right now, and it''s feeling good. So let''s just enjoy it without demanding more! Qualifying for Europe nowadays is the next echelon up, and we''re over achieving as it is. Anyway, the Europa League is quite possibly the most pointless, over inflated waste of time ever. Up to 21 games to win it?! Our early nineties UEFA Cup run was so great because it was knock out, competeing against some of the best teams in Europe. These days the best are almost all in the Champions League leaving only second level teams in the Europa League. It''s now where near as prestigious. As for the cup run meaning definite relegation? Since when? Show me a stat which prooves you will definitely perform worse in the league if you have a cup run then fine. Surely it''s great for morale, albeit worse for fatigue! Give me a cup run every time, they''re fantastic.

[Bryangunnshairline 0]

There is 3 ways we can enter this competition. Correct me if I''m wrong but I''ve only seen two mentioned . There is the fair play league which forgetting about the big boys is swansea top then us currently.