worthyout are so wrong

Rossi · July 24, 2006

Sorry guys, i think you''ve all lost the plot. here is why.

Last season you were spot on, i supported you, paid into the coffers and done what i could to help.

I didnt think your ceasefire was a good idea as it showed you were being influenced by other groups, but hey you''re a newly formed group.

The thing is times change, things change, and this summer has shown us certain things. The biggest thing is that this club is in deep do-do. We''re upto our eyes in the proverbial, and to blame all that on a one man witchunt (which it is now becoming) is reducing your appeal.

No one club gets itself in such a damn mess through a manager, maybe an owner, but not a manger.The whole notion of a change of manager will solve everything is now evidently wrong. There are far more changes required, but i guess it''s just easier to carry on with the bandwagon.

At the time i was sceptical of the name of the worthyout group, becasue it is a single minded task that you are undertaking and does not serve the future beyond Worthington.

Yes we;ve played bad football, and yes we''ve signed poor players. But having seen some of pre-season hoofball has definately disappeared. yes i recognise that it''s easier to pass the ball in a friendly against poor opposition, but its still a start. On the signing of players should we be looking at the scouting system or the personnel that paid the money and offered the contracts and paid the agents?

I''m not trying to support Worthy, but you guys have really got the blinkers on in your one man mission.

We, rather blatantly have no cash, despite the continual selling of the jewels (land, players and so on) our assets are rapidly diminishing. This is not the issue of the manager. Why on earth did we allow ourselves to spend all of our cash on one player (Earnie) unless our whole summer was based upon the sale of Greeno or Earnie? Lets face it, we would nt get a penny for most of the others.

Our coffers have swelled in recent seasons, yet we''re financially in a bigger mess with a bigger debt.

Sorry guys, but the buck doesnt stop with the manager, it stops with the board. I just don''t think you''ve got the balls to bark up that particular tree. The longer you go on the more you look like playground bullies, and in doing so the more likely you are to create appathy that goers against your cause.

I''m not saying Worthington is blameless, but you need to cast a wider net and take on other organisations such as the shareholders association and the trust. Why are they so quiet on matters involving the blatantly awful financial situation at the club? You need to open up more frontiers and demand explanations. Thats the only way you will continue to grow and critically increase your numbers.

momentum is critical and something that is incredibly hard to get once the wheels start rolling back down the hill.

Rudolph Hucker · July 24, 2006

At least Earnshaw is here and is an appreciating asset.

Worthy''s other signings have lost value like used cars and as for the fortune handed out to other Clubs through paying loan wages plus the money invested in an Academy which produces too little I am not surprised the Club has reined Worthington in.

There is money in the Club. We are not broke. It is just a case of housekeeping and Worthington to be told to get on with what he has.

IMO Worthington is a better manager put under constraint.

Carrow89 · July 24, 2006

" Why on earth did we allow ourselves to spend all of our cash on one player (Earnie) unless our whole summer was based upon the sale of Greeno or Earnie? " eh ! ! ! We are not in any do do. The club is probably in one of the healthiest positions it has been in some while. We actually have bought land rather than sell it. We''ve just spent nigh on £12m on ground developments. All payments are being met. It doesn''t mean complacency but it does mean we have to work that much harder to achieve that goal.

beelsie · July 24, 2006

At last a voice of reason. I have been saying this for two seasons now and as you say Worthy has not been perfect or blameless in any shape or form. Worthy has his hand only very gently on the tiller.

The people responsible for providing the money and direction are the board etc. If the protesters would only wake up and say unitedly to the board, come on let''s be aving you, back Worthy, as you are pretending to do, and the players as we want you to do, then we can get behind all at NCFC. Don''t use NW as the meat in the sandwich you lot, let''s hear you stand up and be counted.!!! In other word''s show us the fans, what you are worth, if you dare!!!!

Rossi · July 24, 2006

Hang on a flaming minute ralph

We have been told that there are a number of clubs in this league that we are unable to financially match.

Would that be Leeds who are still up to their eyes in it? Derby who can pay £1m for a player with banks knocking on their door, Plymouth, Wolves Brighton Sheff Wed who havent got a pot to pee in? Coventry who cant afford their own ground, binners down the road, cardiff, stoke all massively in debt, new boys colchester and southend who are obviously rolling in money, Luton with their poxy stadium capacity, not forgetting Burnley of course, the mighty cash rich Burnley.

It''s pathetic.We are one season behind Wolves.

Do we have aspirations or not? Little old Norwich mentality again. Last season we were not good enough and the squad has not been strengthened. Many other teams, such as coventry, are taking a punt due to TV rights being £30m min for the following Prem season. We cant do a coventry because a share issue would not be taken up

Are we gonna get promoted? Are we heck as like. If we dont get promoted the wheels will seriously fall off the wagon, players like Earnie will be sold to the highest bidder - how else can we cope with a £6m drop in income year on year.

The implications in season ticket sales alone if we have a bad season is massive - all revenue lost.

Wake up and smell the coffee. Healthiest position for some time? So why has our debt increased from £18 to £20m? If you think thats healthy I hate to see your diet.

Charlie · July 24, 2006

The club have taken our debt from 8 million to 20 million in 2 years! HOW?

Why spend entire 3.5 million on ONE player when we could have built half the team with that (Nicholls, Halford and Howard would still leave about 800k spare and we could have got rid of Hughes as well!) Much as I love Earnie it was a panic buy but Im afraid and dont get me started on why we loaned Rehmann and JJ!

Saint Canary · July 24, 2006

[quote user="ROSSI 46"]

We, rather blatantly have no cash, despite the continual selling of the jewels (land, players and so on) our assets are rapidly diminishing. This is not the issue of the manager. Why on earth did we allow ourselves to spend all of our cash on one player (Earnie) unless our whole summer was based upon the sale of Greeno or Earnie? Lets face it, we would nt get a penny for most of the others.

Our coffers have swelled in recent seasons, yet we''re financially in a bigger mess with a bigger debt.

[/quote]

Bigger Debt, yes. Bigger mess, no. I thought some of the increase in debt was undertaken to restructure it and make it more manageable. As Ralph points out - we have been buying land and anybody who understands L&P will know that this will be a sound investment. We have spent money on the ground which needed doing plus we have spent (in city''s terms) a lot of money on players.

From my point of view I see it as so in regards to transfers - Worthy has had his cake and eaten it and now wants another. You ask why he was allowed to spend "all our cash on one player"? Probably because he told the board that''s all he needed. No doubt he sold them the idea of Earnshaw playing alongside Thorne - a big man, little man partnership that had been fantastic at Cardiff. On that information the board allowed him to spend the Ashton money. Now though he wants a new big man up front because Thorne is not up to it and and the board are quite rightly not prepared to spend big money on yet another striker. Worthy has spent close to £8m on transfer fees for strikers in the last 3 seasons without accounting for signing on fees and wages and we have a total of seven strikers in the squad. Despite that he still does not have two strikers of an ilk that he feels are a) good enough or b) complement each other.

From what I can see the board are taking the opinion that Worthy is going to have do some hard work this season and they are not prepared to let him try and spend his way out of trouble. He wants to play with a tall striker? Then give Jarvis a go he is over 6ft tall and has been rotting in the reserves for far too long anyway. I think that is what the board want him to do - he has already got the most expensive squad in our history.

ca · July 24, 2006

Great post Rossi, maybe we''ll agree more this year and even if we don''t we still seem to respect each others opinion.

£20m in debt which could be £25m by May, no wating list for season tickets now, no faith in the board, no faith in the Manager, players getting frustrated, where will it all end.

Whats happened to our club, how far will Delia let it sink and where is Delia, has she left the country.

I''d like a fans forum with the board so they can explain the money situation to us, spell out their ambitiions for our club and tell us how long they plan to give Worthy, thats the least we deserve.

Hairy Canary · July 24, 2006

I think thats pretty much right Saint.

The board are having to budget for next year now. After all any players we sign now, and many we already have, will have their wages paid for out of next years income. How long are Etuhu''s and Hughes contracts for example?

With that in mind it is obvious that if we do not go up we are going to have a massively reduced income streem next year. The parascute money will be gone and season tickets are likely to reduce. It''s no good buying players now and then finding we can''t afford them next year, then we really would be in the do-do. I have a horrible feeling that if we don''t go up it will be good-bye to the better players next year.

The board gave Worthington his chance last year and he spent it on loans and average runners. Many of the contracts handed out were surprisingly long ones and now we are stuck unless we off-load. My guess is he''s been told, you bought this lot now make the best of it because next year will be hard enough as it is.

Carrow89 · July 24, 2006

Odd how basic mathematics seem to baffle some folk. O

We incurred debts of £8m. In order to built the new south stand and the infill we borrowed £12m.

This is what about 95% of the adult population do when purchasing a house, a car or in the old days when it was called hire purchase. The payments are spread over fixed period rather than in one go.

Ergo the parachute payments have been evened out over a period of more than two years to ensure we don''t have some enormous spending spree that cannot be afforded a year later.

Even odder still is that someone quotes clubs such as Wolves who have followed the same mad, Ipswich style recklessness and are now paying for it - literally.

What I suspect lies at the heart of all this bleating is not so much any mismanagement by the board but a failure by a few newbies to accept the grim realities of football.

Rossi · July 24, 2006

[quote user="Ralph Wright"]Odd how basic mathematics seem to baffle some folk. O We incurred debts of £8m. In order to built the new south stand and the infill we borrowed £12m. This is what about 95% of the adult population do when purchasing a house, a car or in the old days when it was called hire purchase. The payments are spread over fixed period rather than in one go. Ergo the parachute payments have been evened out over a period of more than two years to ensure we don''t have some enormous spending spree that cannot be afforded a year later. Even odder still is that someone quotes clubs such as Wolves who have followed the same mad, Ipswich style recklessness and are now paying for it - literally. What I suspect lies at the heart of all this bleating is not so much any mismanagement by the board but a failure by a few newbies to accept the grim realities of football.[/quote]

Ralph, i respectfully suggest you are looking tthe wrong way through the telescope.

In your terms may i suggest the following.

Ordinary folk buy a house that is just manageable on their income stream.

They love their house, but things start to change.They extend to bring in lodgers (new stand) for more income.Variables start to rise. The bills go up. The tax man decides to take a bigger slice of the pie (for this example we''ll call agents the tax man) Then they lose their lodgers (season ticket holders) and start scratching their heads. Fortunately they''ve been riding on a property wave and they can re-structure their debts, but the amount repaid increases of the longer term. They need to replenish their furniture (players) but unfortunately they place orders with companies that do not provide what it says on the tin and there is no refund available. They cant live without furniture, so they use some of their old stuff to make do, and again buy more. Again their debt increases so they sell off part of their land to someone else (hotel) Things are getting tight and their cash flow begins to suffer once they''ve paid the bills. They can survive, but they cant invest in their home or its contents. They start paying bills as late as possible, some too late (Share dividends) Other problems start to emerge, it appears that the income that allowed them to restructure their debts is only guaranteed for 2 years and they are already one year in. One years time, unless reveue sources are increased considerably, and they will have to start pawning the furniture to keep repayments up.

Sound familiar Ralph? Seems maths does not equal simple planning. You are talking about now. I am talking about failure to be promoted or in this case failure to significantly increase revenue streams.

We are in a downward spiral and people should be held accountable. None of this spin stuff, just blatant and honest facts.

You mention mad scum and wolves - do you mean spending money on players that end up costing a fortune for no return (or very little) and building a new stand? Pot, Kettle Black.

We need a Manager · July 24, 2006

We go to football to watch a decent football team , not look at a piece of land , some people just cannot grasp that .

Saint Canary · July 24, 2006

[quote user="We need a Manager"]We go to football to watch a decent football team , not look at a piece of land , some people just cannot grasp that .[/quote]

What''s the pitch if it is not a piece of land?

What some people cannot grasp is that based on ticket sales alone this club is cannot compete in the Premier League in terms of potential revenue - we need as many ways of making money as possible. It''s just the way that football is going and it means that clubs need to look beyond conventional revenue streams.

nh_ncfc · July 24, 2006