Margaret Thatcher was a ..?

[cambridgeshire canary 6,754]

Seems this OAP has a strong answer for that question

https://metro.co.uk/2024/03/06/hunt-pensioner-defaced-margaret-thatcher-statue-slur-20414158/

[TheGunnShow 5,953]

Possibly the most polarising political figure the UK has had. I don't think Andrew Marr's coverage of her in A History of Modern Britain is a bad one, although some think it's a bit hagiographical.

[Nuff Said 5,147]

(Absolute banger BTW, ELO get nowhere near the appreciation they deserve)

Edited March 8 by Nuff Said

[Herman 9,795]

.. major reason why Britain is in a bit of a state. 

[littleyellowbirdie 2,562]

Hater's going to hate. Some day maybe somebody will p1ss on the OAP's grave.

Never understood why so many on the left take pride in behaving like low life.

Edit: I wonder if the silly cow realises that cleaning it up comes out of the council's budget?

Edited March 8 by littleyellowbirdie

[Naturalcynic 641]

7 hours ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

Hater's going to hate. Some day maybe somebody will p1ss on the OAP's grave.

Never understood why so many on the left take pride in behaving like low life.

Edit: I wonder if the silly cow realises that cleaning it up comes out of the council's budget?

I’ll always remember the footage of hate-filled leftists in Trafalgar Square celebrating her death.

[Herman 9,795]

11 minutes ago, Naturalcynic said:

I’ll always remember the footage of hate-filled leftists in Trafalgar Square celebrating her death.

It should be a national holiday. Every April we should set up bonfires and burn an effigy of her to ward off evil spirits. 

"Penny for the Thatch!!"😀

[Naturalcynic 641]

5 minutes ago, Herman said:

It should be a national holiday. Every April we should set up bonfires and burn an effigy of her to ward off evil spirits. 

"Penny for the Thatch!!"😀

The pixels in my comment about hate-filled leftists are barely dry, and up pops Herman.

[Worthy Nigelton 1,057]

18 hours ago, Herman said:

.. major reason why Britain is in a bit of a state. 

Major is an understatement. What she put in motion is probably 90% of our problems.

[Worthy Nigelton 1,057]

45 minutes ago, Naturalcynic said:

The pixels in my comment about hate-filled leftists are barely dry, and up pops Herman.

Snowflake.

[Mr Angry 1,569]

I didn't know that the word "Binner" had been designated as a swear word 🤣

[littleyellowbirdie 2,562]

I’d like to see all statues of Bevan demolished. He was the piece of sh1t that paved the way for this yobbish culture of the left.

[Herman 9,795]

3 minutes ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

I’d like to see all statues of Bevan demolished. He was the piece of sh1t that paved the way for this yobbish culture of the left.

[littleyellowbirdie 2,562]

12 minutes ago, Herman said:

That gif sums you up perfectly.

[Fen Canary 848]

Ideologue. Some of her reforms were necessary (as much as it pains me to say it being fairly left wing) but she went much further than was necessary. She was happy to throw entire towns on the scrap heap and destroy lives and entire industries in her faith that the market would fix everything. Unfortunately almost every leader we’ve had since seems to agree that their job is to stay as hands off as possible in a complete dereliction of responsibility.

Much like the communists who always claimed it wasn’t the system that was at fault, it’s just that it hasn’t been tried properly yet. Those of a neoliberal bent won’t admit that their ideology has caused numerous problems for society. They’re of the belief that if they just deregulate that but more, give more power to those at the top, chuck a bit more cheap labour into the mix then next time it will lead us to the utopia we were promised 

[dylanisabaddog 4,948]

9 hours ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

I’d like to see all statues of Bevan demolished. He was the piece of sh1t that paved the way for this yobbish culture of the left.

https://en.citizendium.org/wiki/Bullingdon_Club

[littleyellowbirdie 2,562]

10 hours ago, Fen Canary said:

Ideologue. Some of her reforms were necessary (as much as it pains me to say it being fairly left wing) but she went much further than was necessary. She was happy to throw entire towns on the scrap heap and destroy lives and entire industries in her faith that the market would fix everything. Unfortunately almost every leader we’ve had since seems to agree that their job is to stay as hands off as possible in a complete dereliction of responsibility.

Much like the communists who always claimed it wasn’t the system that was at fault, it’s just that it hasn’t been tried properly yet. Those of a neoliberal bent won’t admit that their ideology has caused numerous problems for society. They’re of the belief that if they just deregulate that but more, give more power to those at the top, chuck a bit more cheap labour into the mix then next time it will lead us to the utopia we were promised 

She was a front runner on environmental concern, making the first major UN speech on the subject. With hindsight, I speculate whether the environment might have been in the back of her mind over coal pit closures, especially given the way a lot of pits had concrete poured down them, killing the prospect of them reopening.

She was instrumental in bringing the cold war to a close. She brow beat Regan into getting off the fence and supporting us against Argentinan aggression in the Falklands. She wrote to the familiies, in a personal hand-written letter to every single family of soldiers lost in the Falklands.

There were bits of privatisation she wasn't as enthusiastic about. That's an area where I think the general thrust of the party had more to do with it than her personally.

And when her party no longer wanted her she left. Accusations of her being a 'fascist' seem somewhat laughable when you look at how the Blair government behaved regarding suppressing protest.

She was a decent, democratic politician who deserves respect. Those people who still foster so much spite and hatred towards her get no respect from me. Scum with no dignity or class.

Edited March 10 by littleyellowbirdie

[Daz Sparks 1,159]

11 hours ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

I’d like to see all statues of Bevan demolished. He was the piece of sh1t that paved the way for this yobbish culture of the left.

Can't think of a politician of any colour that deserves statue, so I'd agree with the first part of your statement. 

 

1 hour ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

She was a decent, democratic politician who deserves respect. Those people who still foster so much spite and hatred towards her get no respect from me. Scum with no dignity or class.

She thought herself that what she was doing was right, and once that had solidified in her head, wild horses wouldn't drag her off course, which for a leader, is not an ideal trait when held in that extreme. And as mentioned above, she was deeply polarising. 

Personally, I don't hate her, or respect her, she was right about the Falklands, she might have had minor influence over Reagan, but no more, she played bit a part in ending the cold war but there were other more dominating factors in that. 

However, it's quite obvious that you see her differently. So I'm expecting some kind of retort. Before you do, read the whole reply, and consider yours, we may disagree, but we don't have take that past anything other than debate. 

 

[TheGunnShow 5,953]

11 hours ago, Fen Canary said:

Ideologue. Some of her reforms were necessary (as much as it pains me to say it being fairly left wing) but she went much further than was necessary. She was happy to throw entire towns on the scrap heap and destroy lives and entire industries in her faith that the market would fix everything. Unfortunately almost every leader we’ve had since seems to agree that their job is to stay as hands off as possible in a complete dereliction of responsibility.

Much like the communists who always claimed it wasn’t the system that was at fault, it’s just that it hasn’t been tried properly yet. Those of a neoliberal bent won’t admit that their ideology has caused numerous problems for society. They’re of the belief that if they just deregulate that but more, give more power to those at the top, chuck a bit more cheap labour into the mix then next time it will lead us to the utopia we were promised 

Andrew Marr basically said similar - she had the right ideas but went too far with them. She didn't just grab opportunities, she choked them.

[littleyellowbirdie 2,562]

41 minutes ago, Daz Sparks said:

Can't think of a politician of any colour that deserves statue, so I'd agree with the first part of your statement. 

 

She thought herself that what she was doing was right, and once that had solidified in her head, wild horses wouldn't drag her off course, which for a leader, is not an ideal trait when held in that extreme. And as mentioned above, she was deeply polarising. 

Personally, I don't hate her, or respect her, she was right about the Falklands, she might have had minor influence over Reagan, but no more, she played bit a part in ending the cold war but there were other more dominating factors in that. 

However, it's quite obvious that you see her differently. So I'm expecting some kind of retort. Before you do, read the whole reply, and consider yours, we may disagree, but we don't have take that past anything other than debate. 

 

I wouldn't go that far in her favour. I agree that privatisation went too far and she went overboard towards the end, but it doesn't change the fact she was a politician with integrity and conviction, which makes it disgusting that anyone would desecrate a statue in her home town 11 years after she died of dementia, or that any low life would speak out in support of the pointless vandalism.

[Daz Sparks 1,159]

1 minute ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

but it doesn't change the fact she was a politician with integrity and conviction,

I don't disagree with this, her conviction especially, but isn't this what we should be expecting of our political leaders?

 

4 minutes ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

or that any low life would speak out in support of the pointless vandalism.

I do not condone vandalism. In fact I read earlier this week that the Captain Mainwaring statue had to be repaired after it was vandalised, totally mindless.

My footnote on this goes back to how polarising a figure she was, in life and death.

[Worthy Nigelton 1,057]

2 hours ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

She was a front runner on environmental concern, making the first major UN speech on the subject. With hindsight, I speculate whether the environment might have been in the back of her mind over coal pit closures, especially given the way a lot of pits had concrete poured down them, killing the prospect of them reopening.

She was instrumental in bringing the cold war to a close. She brow beat Regan into getting off the fence and supporting us against Argentinan aggression in the Falklands. She wrote to the familiies, in a personal hand-written letter to every single family of soldiers lost in the Falklands.

There were bits of privatisation she wasn't as enthusiastic about. That's an area where I think the general thrust of the party had more to do with it than her personally.

And when her party no longer wanted her she left. Accusations of her being a 'fascist' seem somewhat laughable when you look at how the Blair government behaved regarding suppressing protest.

She was a decent, democratic politician who deserves respect. Those people who still foster so much spite and hatred towards her get no respect from me. Scum with no dignity or class.

That's a hell of a take.

[sonyc 5,539]

48 minutes ago, Daz Sparks said:

I don't disagree with this, her conviction especially, but isn't this what we should be expecting of our political leaders?

 

I do not condone vandalism. In fact I read earlier this week that the Captain Mainwaring statue had to be repaired after it was vandalised, totally mindless.

My footnote on this goes back to how polarising a figure she was, in life and death.

I think the vandalism of statues is mindless too and a bit pathetic. Statues relate to the past, literally, immortalising a person in stone or whatever. And the past has all kinds of different contexts that it's impossible to compare. All you can do is observe and learn.

Some vandalism like that of Isis bombing historic sites of ancient Persia is horrific to give a rather dramatic comparison. Also last week with the recent example of the woman cutting up an oil painting and spraying it red. Sad and pathetic whatever the oil painting represented.

As for the old woman, she can do what she wants but she will have to pay for it in one way or another. What's important is that people have a right to protest. But there's still.sometimes consequences. If you don't have liberty to do stuff like that you risk society becoming totalitarian.

It's ironic that the values and integrity of Thatcher are quite missing in the current regime. I'm with Fen overall in his take about her. She was divisive (and didn't need to be) and set herself up to be confrontational. Her St Francis of Assisi speech when elected was ironic but perhaps somewhere in her mind she thought she meant it...but then people often don't mean what they say ...or even say what they mean.

[TheGunnShow 5,953]

I would agree with an argument on the lines that Thatcher was the last of the visionaries that became PM, as after that we basically had middle managers. She basically wanted people to be solidly invested in their communities (hence so many share options/right to buy, etc) with solid money behind them, considering her family upbringing as a grocer's daughter.

The problem economically was that her policies tended to foster the polar opposite, including liberalisation of the banking sector.

[PurpleCanary 5,570]

3 hours ago, TheGunnShow said:

Andrew Marr basically said similar - she had the right ideas but went too far with them. She didn't just grab opportunities, she choked them.

Selling off council houses was not a good idea she took to an extreme. It was - as predicted at the time - an entirely bad idea, based on using greed to win votes and ignoring the disastrous long-term consequences.

[Mr Angry 1,569]

14 minutes ago, TheGunnShow said:

I would agree with an argument on the lines that Thatcher was the last of the visionaries that became PM, as after that we basically had middle managers. She basically wanted people to be solidly invested in their communities (hence so many share options/right to buy, etc) with solid money behind them, considering her family upbringing as a grocer's daughter.

The problem economically was that her policies tended to foster the polar opposite, including liberalisation of the banking sector.

Try telling that to the communities around the mines that she closed!

[TheGunnShow 5,953]

Just now, Mr Angry said:

Try telling that to the communities around the mines that she closed!

Hence my comment at the end that economically, her policies fostered the opposite. I merely used the liberalisation of the banking sector as one example.