Norfolk born James Dyson, a generous man

[DraytonBoy 167]

Bus drivers only get £12 an hour which given they have 50 people's lives in their hands for several hours a day seems wrong. 

[Naturalcynic 682]

8 hours ago, By Hook or Ian crook said:

Let me put it to you like this. a teacher has a bad lesson no one dies, A nurse or dr has a bad diagnosis maybe one person dies as a result. If a train driver has a bad day at work you’ll have hundreds of dead people. Yes they may be less qualified than a dr but they also have a lot more proportional responsibility while they do their day to day job. In my view the greater the inherent risk and the larger the responsibility the greater the pay should be as compensation for the burden of that risk. 
 

I also find it strange that people take the option that others a paid too much rather than the lower ones not being paid enough. 

Wow, I’ll mention that to the surgeon when my life is next in his hands.

[TheGunnShow 6,080]

8 hours ago, By Hook or Ian crook said:

Let me put it to you like this. a teacher has a bad lesson no one dies, A nurse or dr has a bad diagnosis maybe one person dies as a result. If a train driver has a bad day at work you’ll have hundreds of dead people. Yes they may be less qualified than a dr but they also have a lot more proportional responsibility while they do their day to day job. In my view the greater the inherent risk and the larger the responsibility the greater the pay should be as compensation for the burden of that risk. 
 

I also find it strange that people take the option that others a paid too much rather than the lower ones not being paid enough. 

Exactly this. This is why I find it bemusing that your average working person may be unhappy that the minimum wage goes up. They're not overpaid, you're underpaid. When less-qualified folk get a pay rise I think "excellent, they might be able to live a little bit now". This is the toxic fruit of the notion behind a "meritocracy", a word which was originally coined as a dystopia and then someone perverted the meaning over time to make it seem a noble state of affairs.

I am hard-pushed to think of a more pervasive form of entitlement than paying people an insufficient amount of money to live reasonably well just because you are an "entrepreneur" or run a business, but ho-hum. 

But yes, anything that distracts the common man to kick down instead of up...

EDIT: Remember this above everything else: a minimum wage is in place as some unscrupulous sorts would pay you even less if they could get away with it.

Edited November 28, 2023 by TheGunnShow

[Faded Jaded Semi Plastic SOB 1,046]

4 hours ago, DraytonBoy said:

Bus drivers only get £12 an hour which given they have 50 people's lives in their hands for several hours a day seems wrong. 

True, some train drivers have the lives of 500/600 people a time in their hands at speeds of up to 125mph..........

[Robert N. LiM 4,651]

11 hours ago, By Hook or Ian crook said:

I also find it strange that people take the option that others a paid too much rather than the lower ones not being paid enough. 

Encouraging people to think like this is the entire raison d'être of the Sun and the Mail and the whole right-wing media ecosystem.

[essex canary 515]

3 hours ago, Naturalcynic said:

Wow, I’ll mention that to the surgeon when my life is next in his hands.

I think @By Hook or Ian crook may have gone a little over the top there. I would still pay a Brain Surgeon more than a Train Driver. He still has a point though.

[Faded Jaded Semi Plastic SOB 1,046]

4 hours ago, Naturalcynic said:

Wow, I’ll mention that to the surgeon when my life is next in his hands.

I see some Consultants are going to be getting a 20% pay rise, this after the Government imposed a 5% pay rise on Nurses, you might want to also have a chat with the Nurses before you go under the knife.........

[The Real Buh 3,492]

There’s literally no reason trains shouldn’t be fully automated. It’s 2023.

[BurwellCanary 219]

16 minutes ago, The Real Buh said:

There’s literally no reason trains shouldn’t be fully automated. It’s 2023.

As a frequent user of the Docklands Light Railway I can say that it works very well

[TheGunnShow 6,080]

1 hour ago, Robert N. LiM said:

Encouraging people to think like this is the entire raison d'être of the Sun and the Mail and the whole right-wing media ecosystem.

Yep, all they encourage is kicking down instead of really questioning those who have power.

[Faded Jaded Semi Plastic SOB 1,046]

26 minutes ago, The Real Buh said:

There’s literally no reason trains shouldn’t be fully automated. It’s 2023.

They are already here, at the moment they only operate at low speeds, but I can see the day when high speed trains will be driverless. It will be interesting to see what the AI/technology alternative to the "dead mans handle" is and after watching the Terminator films can we really trust the machines? (Smiley Face)..........

[essex canary 515]

32 minutes ago, The Real Buh said:

There’s literally no reason trains shouldn’t be fully automated. It’s 2023.

Perhaps cars could be as well. Unfortunately though the scientists seem to have worked out that however much you programme them things could go wrong. Would you like to be on a jet with auto-pilot only? Good luck.

[nutty nigel 7,656]

What we need is something like a pandemic to hit. Where we can the true value of the people who try to keep us safe and well. I'm sure if that happened there'd be a realisation that some sort of reset is needed...

[TheGunnShow 6,080]

1 minute ago, nutty nigel said:

What we need is something like a pandemic to hit. Where we can the true value of the people who try to keep us safe and well. I'm sure if that happened there'd be a realisation that some sort of reset is needed...

Then all that would happen would be clapping. Symbolic gestures for the symbol-minded.

[nutty nigel 7,656]

1 minute ago, TheGunnShow said:

Then all that would happen would be clapping. Symbolic gestures for the symbol-minded.

Bashing those pots and pans would also come in handy for those who need a drum while watching their streams...

[The Real Buh 3,492]

29 minutes ago, essex canary said:

Perhaps cars could be as well. Unfortunately though the scientists seem to have worked out that however much you programme them things could go wrong. Would you like to be on a jet with auto-pilot only? Good luck.

Cars are a lot more complex to automate than trains. 

Trains are already automated in a large degree and can 100% be fully automated 

You don’t need a bloke called Dave to press the green button.

Edited November 28, 2023 by The Real Buh

[essex canary 515]

29 minutes ago, nutty nigel said:

Bashing those pots and pans would also come in handy for those who need a drum while watching their streams...

As an enthusiast for the old guard creating the atmosphere doubtless you have submitted your application to be the substitute drummer?

[Faded Jaded Semi Plastic SOB 1,046]

1 minute ago, The Real Buh said:

Cars are a lot more complex to automate than trains. 

Trains are already automated in a large degree and can 100% be automated 

You don’t need a bloke called Dave to press the green button.

Do not disagree with you, but having ridden in the cab of a mainline train for about 80 miles or so I can assure you driving a train is more than pressing a button. The automated train will have to be able to react appropriately to each signal it approaches whilst travelling at high speed, which mean all trains/tracks will have to be fitted with the appropriate train protection system, my understanding is at the moment all trains/tracks are fitted with train protection systems  but this is speed limited, so we will need enhanced train protection on the fast lines before driverless trains on those routes are a reality, not sure how long that will take or at what cost, humans might still work out safer and more cost effective...........

[nutty nigel 7,656]

27 minutes ago, essex canary said:

As an enthusiast for the old guard creating the atmosphere doubtless you have submitted your application to be the substitute drummer?

No. I don't need a drum. Anyway, I can't access that red seat in the gangway at the top of block E. That's why I no longer stand there.

While we're doing Q&A...

Why do you no longer sit with the other ADs in the 1500 quid area? And what's your advantage in getting concessions in Block M?

[essex canary 515]

2 hours ago, nutty nigel said:

No. I don't need a drum. Anyway, I can't access that red seat in the gangway at the top of block E. That's why I no longer stand there.

While we're doing Q&A...

Why do you no longer sit with the other ADs in the 1500 quid area? And what's your advantage in getting concessions in Block M?

Just when I was looking forward to the encounter with you and Mr. Portsmouth, you let me down.

Do you really think I was going to pay that mob £1500 for my wife to take my late friends seat in that stuffed shirt area when they weren't banking the money previously anyway? I may have been facing a divorce if I did as my wife, like me,much prefers real fans. Much better to buy a Sky Sports subscription so I can watch tonight's match after I get home from Cambridge United and Ryan Bennett's latest exploits. 

[nutty nigel 7,656]

22 minutes ago, essex canary said:

Just when I was looking forward to the encounter with you and Mr. Portsmouth, you let me down.

Do you really think I was going to pay that mob £1500 for my wife to take my late friends seat in that stuffed shirt area when they weren't banking the money previously anyway? I may have been facing a divorce if I did as my wife, like me,much prefers real fans. Much better to buy a Sky Sports subscription so I can watch tonight's match after I get home from Cambridge United and Ryan Bennett's latest exploits. 

Of course I don’t think that. I’m just not sure your motivation for getting concessions in Block M. 

[essex canary 515]

3 minutes ago, nutty nigel said:

Of course I don’t think that. I’m just not sure your motivation for getting concessions in Block M. 

I needed to get some value for my investment and to sit with my missus  even though I was scuppered in my inclusion enterprise for a younger person.

Perhaps you will ask the general Block M concession question on Thursday? That will help put the skids under them following the OSP discussion. Might as well add Blocks K&L too.

 

[nutty nigel 7,656]

11 minutes ago, essex canary said:

I needed to get some value for my investment and to sit with my missus  even though I was scuppered in my inclusion enterprise for a younger person.

Perhaps you will ask the general Block M concession question on Thursday? That will help put the skids under them following the OSP discussion. Might as well add Blocks K&L too.

 

No. I'm not fighting your crusades. I had to move because those were the rules if I wanted the concession. There's not too much difference. You don't get any sort of padded seat out in the rain. I was grateful that they found me a seat when I could no longer access my 'seat' at the back of Block E.

 

[By Hook or Ian crook 925]

8 hours ago, essex canary said:

I think @By Hook or Ian crook may have gone a little over the top there. I would still pay a Brain Surgeon more than a Train Driver. He still has a point though.

A brain surgeon should absolutely get paid more than a train driver due to their level of skill and expertise. 60k a year though for a person tasked with ensuring the safe transport of goods and hundreds of people seems a fair amount for my money. Given that if anything goes wrong people die and if you survive chances are you’ll be in deep trouble. The shortage of HGV drivers has pushed their salary up to an average of nearly 50k a year although most do work 50-60 hours a week. I think many would moan at that wage yet wouldn’t want to be putting those hours in either. 

Edited November 28, 2023 by By Hook or Ian crook

[essex canary 515]

18 hours ago, nutty nigel said:

No. I'm not fighting your crusades. I had to move because those were the rules if I wanted the concession. There's not too much difference. You don't get any sort of padded seat out in the rain. I was grateful that they found me a seat when I could no longer access my 'seat' at the back of Block E.

 

Perhaps best to try the over 75's one then. Something like first we spend £50 million more on Wages than Brentford and fail then our ED earning nearly £500,000 per year wishes to rob 1,400 pensioners of £50,000.

[nutty nigel 7,656]

3 hours ago, essex canary said:

Perhaps best to try the over 75's one then. Something like first we spend £50 million more on Wages than Brentford and fail then our ED earning nearly £500,000 per year wishes to rob 1,400 pensioners of £50,000.

No. I'm not fighting your battles. You are beyond ridiculous. Did you see in my post where I was grateful for my treatment by our club? Grateful that they make it possible for me to continually go to games? I'd much prefer to be in the Barclay but my issues are not their fault. Is that something you've never felt? 

[Sufyellow 242]

On 28/11/2023 at 07:14, Naturalcynic said:

Wow, I’ll mention that to the surgeon when my life is next in his hands.

How good would he be doing it out in a field with no hospital plus no technology? We all have a role to play

[Sufyellow 242]

On 27/11/2023 at 23:11, By Hook or Ian crook said:

Let me put it to you like this. a teacher has a bad lesson no one dies, A nurse or dr has a bad diagnosis maybe one person dies as a result. If a train driver has a bad day at work you’ll have hundreds of dead people. Yes they may be less qualified than a dr but they also have a lot more proportional responsibility while they do their day to day job. In my view the greater the inherent risk and the larger the responsibility the greater the pay should be as compensation for the burden of that risk. 
 

I also find it strange that people take the option that others a paid too much rather than the lower ones not being paid enough. 

Your train driver isn't  any good if your signal person is a sleep or the people fitting the track mess up , or if the train is faulty,  are all these people on more than  the train driver?

[By Hook or Ian crook 925]

10 hours ago, Sufyellow said:

Your train driver isn't  any good if your signal person is a sleep or the people fitting the track mess up , or if the train is faulty,  are all these people on more than  the train driver?

Why do they have to be on more? If your theory is they are all as important as each other why can’t they all just be on equal? 

[Sufyellow 242]

16 hours ago, By Hook or Ian crook said:

Why do they have to be on more? If your theory is they are all as important as each other why can’t they all just be on equal? 

They don't,  it's a silly comparison in the first place . Unfortunately the world doesn't make us all financially equal.