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BobLoz3

Sutton's thoughts...

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6 minutes ago, BigFish said:

Next season? There may not be any professional football left to come back at all. How long without revenue will many of our clubs survive? One thing is likely is that there will be a lot of unemployed footballers on 1st July. City's prudent approach may well look a masterstroke.

In which case deciding whether to declare the season "null and void" is of little concern - the surviving clubs would reform a new league.

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2 minutes ago, Badger said:

In which case deciding whether to declare the season "null and void" is of little concern - the surviving clubs would reform a new league.

Very true

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5 hours ago, king canary said:

The biggest issue is the Villa game in hand- how do you square the idea fairness with a team being relegated with one less game played?

I maintain the most sensible suggestion is the one as in the Bundesliga- promote the top two, don't relegate anyone, 42 game season next year.

Could not agree more. While any team has a game in hand,as much as I would like Villa to be relegated, it simply is not fair. It just won’t happen.

the only fair way is, as you say the German way.

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5 hours ago, keelansgrandad said:

Another issue would be the availability of full squads for the teams. Should a team like us be without a full squad if they should resume the it would put us at a disadvantage.

As Ricardo says, the least complicated would be null and void. The lawyers would be recouping anyhting they lose over the next few weeks.

That’s tough luck though. If our players came down with ‘ordinary’ flu in the past, you can’t scrap the season or delay games.

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18 minutes ago, Bradwell canary said:

Could not agree more. While any team has a game in hand,as much as I would like Villa to be relegated, it simply is not fair. It just won’t happen.

the only fair way is, as you say the German way.

fair, in the sense that it is unworkable

It needs PL clubs to vote for 5 to be relegated in 2021

It requires the FL to either accept a rediced Championship. or ''fix; all the other leagues .....down to what level ?

Who is going to pay for the extra £200m needed by the two clubs promoted

This will be a decision taken by clubs who need to vote for it, and agreed by sponsors, ads .

To arbiterily have only two clubs benefit from this 'fix' is absurd

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A bit of slight over panicking going on here. We’re already seeing that the early figures of 3 per cent mortality rate were grossly exaggerated as more and more people are getting tested. With better statistics and measurements coming out all the time, we’re seeing the mortality rate slipping down to below a 1 per cent which is starting to get back to somewhere more comparable with “normal” flu.

The health minister today said it would be a “good result” if we keep the deaths from Coronavirus below 20,000 across the next twelve months. That many people (and more, sometimes nearer 30,000) die of “normal” flu on a fairly regular basis across what is an eight month flu season. 

Coronavirus is spreading much quicker than “normal” flu and we don’t have a vaccine, that’s why we and the rest of the world are bringing in measures as we are now.

But let’s not get carried away. The sort of measures we’re seeing now can’t go on much beyond the summer. The whole global economy would come to a halt and it would cause far, far more death and destruction if things are being closed and large gatherings stop happening. Next season might be delayed, but it isn’t going to be scrapped. It will start, people at risk will be told to stay away from games if they want, everyone else will continue with the same risks we’ve always had - if I went to a game three years ago and someone with a steaming cold or flu sneezed on me I’d probably be unwell for a week or two. Coronavirus is (for the overwhelming majority of people) no different to that. 

Talk of there being no professional football to return is ridiculous. 

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The action being taken at the moment is not one of reducing deaths, but of reducing the numbers who need treatment.

As blunt as it is a death is realtively low in the resources it uses. A severe case requires a bed etc. What is being done is merely a case of trying to level of the pressure on medical facilities. The NHS is slowly moving out of winter pressure whereby the elderly are in hospital in larger numbers.

I agree that this level of isolation will not be able to ne maintained for more than a month at the very most.

We should be looking at seeing how the 'winter pressure' can be better managed. Do the elderly need to be in hospital beds during the winter ? Is there not another place to treat them ?r

And how much of the austerity/cuts will now have an impact. They talk about kids being 'super spreaders' - have a read of this, quite alarming

https://www.theguardian.com/education/2020/mar/17/covid-19-reveals-the-alarming-truth-that-many-children-cant-wash-their-hands-at-school

 

 

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16 minutes ago, Bill said:

fair, in the sense that it is unworkable

It needs PL clubs to vote for 5 to be relegated in 2021

It requires the FL to either accept a rediced Championship. or ''fix; all the other leagues .....down to what level ?

Who is going to pay for the extra £200m needed by the two clubs promoted

This will be a decision taken by clubs who need to vote for it, and agreed by sponsors, ads .

To arbiterily have only two clubs benefit from this 'fix' is absurd

It clearly isn't unworkable as it's what they are doing in Germany.

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6 hours ago, ricardo said:

The seaon cannot be finished, it is therefore nul and void.

Exactly this. The end. 

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Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, king canary said:

It clearly isn't unworkable as it's what they are doing in Germany.

Where’s the evidence of this KC? Last I can find online, is from yesterday where they just say they’re pushing back the suspension and are still hoping to finish the season.

And the Bundesliga chief exec made no mention of it in an interview today, instead he said (as far as I can tell and paraphrasing) that they were hoping to end the suspension ASAP and get back to playing.

Edited by Aggy

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16 minutes ago, Aggy said:

1 per cent which is starting to get back to somewhere more comparable with “normal” flu.

Even if it falls to 1% this is about 10 times more deadly than flu. The other issue is that we are not yet clear about how transmissible it is - I understand that it is more contagious than flu although I'm not sure whether this is due to the fact that there is no immunity or vaccine yet.

Of course at some stage life has to return to normal. Part of the current effort is about managing the number of cases so that the system does not become overloaded whilst we build capacity + the percentage of the community that has not had the disease reduces.

This will take time - in the meantime football clubs have no income from spectators and possibly from TV. If football survives totally intact it will because radical action is taken, not by denying the seriousness of the situation. 

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Watched “The Debate” on Sky yesterday where this was discussed.

without exception every one of the participants was adamant that the season had to be finished even though they all accepted that restarting could not start before October at the earliest. There was even talk of starting the new season in January 2021 with a 19 game season (10 at home and 9 away) which was proposed by the ex CEO of the EFL.

Speechless!

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2 hours ago, Aggy said:

That’s tough luck though. If our players came down with ‘ordinary’ flu in the past, you can’t scrap the season or delay games.

Will be bloody hard to field a team when they are all going to have to self isolate for 14 days...

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37 minutes ago, TIL 1010 said:

Anyway what about the thoughts of Chris Sutton ? 😜

Headed too many balls.

  • Haha 1

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Posted (edited)
38 minutes ago, JF said:

Will be bloody hard to field a team when they are all going to have to self isolate for 14 days...

That’s not going to be the case for ever though is it. And id imagine it’s already the case that, if one player in a squad gets normal flu, that player self isolates immediately to reduce the risk of passing it around to everyone. After a couple of months of the current containment strategy, people including footballers will go about their normal lives in the same way as usual.

2 hours ago, Badger said:

Even if it falls to 1% this is about 10 times more deadly than flu. The other issue is that we are not yet clear about how transmissible it is - I understand that it is more contagious than flu although I'm not sure whether this is due to the fact that there is no immunity or vaccine yet.

Of course at some stage life has to return to normal. Part of the current effort is about managing the number of cases so that the system does not become overloaded whilst we build capacity + the percentage of the community that has not had the disease reduces.

This will take time - in the meantime football clubs have no income from spectators and possibly from TV. If football survives totally intact it will because radical action is taken, not by denying the seriousness of the situation. 

Developing a vaccine and/or increased immunity will decrease the transmissibility significantly. Highly unlikely Coronavirus will be anywhere near as common or as deadly this time next year or the year after. 
Highly doubt Tv money won’t get paid for this season. Next season will start and teams will get usual TV money. There are around ten games of the season left. Half at home. So we’re talking about missing out on five home games. At the elite end, that is not going to be the difference between survival or going bust. The gate receipts are a small proportion of income for most premier league and even championship clubs. Even in league one and two, I’d expect a side who is currently run even half decently not to be massively affected by missing out on a handful of games of attendance receipts. There will be some in league 2 and maybe league 1 who are already struggling and this topples them, but they’d have to already be fairly precarious. One post above though referenced there being no football left!
 

Even talk of next season being scrapped is massively premature at the moment. Let’s see what happens by mid/end of April. My money is on things having plateaued (as seems to be the case in China where they’v snow shut all the emergency Coronavirus hospitals as there were only 11 new daily cases reported in the whole of a China earlier this week). Next season might be delayed slightly, but only if we finish this season over the summer.

Edited by Aggy

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2 hours ago, king canary said:

It clearly isn't unworkable as it's what they are doing in Germany.

It was merely a suggestion from Germany.

I expect all European Leagues will copy whatever UEFA come up with.

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46 minutes ago, JF said:

Will be bloody hard to field a team when they are all going to have to self isolate for 14 days...

It is the binners I am concerned about.

People are being advised to keep 6 feet away from others.

What on earth will poorman road look like with a few thousand fans scattered around a large stadium

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1 minute ago, Bill said:

It is the binners I am concerned about.

People are being advised to keep 6 feet away from others.

What on earth will poorman road look like with a few thousand fans scattered around a large stadium

I thought a photo of their stand was a government advert showing how far to stand apart.

  • Haha 1

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Posted (edited)

image.thumb.png.bd45662fc9dbf593f6e2c06fc732e4f5.png

 

"how many feet, is six feet ? '

Edited by Bill

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24 minutes ago, ricardo said:

They still don't seem to get it Bill

get what ?

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Null and void with no promotion will be the outcome.  Believe me.  Norwich get lucky at last by being promoted last season.

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I can't see the proposed Bundesliga approach being used. 

Promoting the top 2 teams in the championship (as it stands), is just as unfair as relegating the bottom 3 clubs in the league (as it stands). 

If I had to bet on it, the season will be completed later in the year. Next season will be delayed and all Cup competitions/play-offs sacrificed. 

It will be very, very interesting to see what that powers that be decide though. 

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The powers to be are the PL themselves. They will decide with a minimu 14 vote in favour of any change,

However that will be done under the permissiom of the government with neither side being able to force the other ie the PL cannot make the governmenet lift the 'ban' and the government cannot disctate....if... they lift the ban.

The idea of inviting two clubs from the Championship would not be practical on cost, contract and legal grounds.

The idea of playing the remaining games behind closed doors so as to finish the season would appear to have merit - if only to sort out what happens to the TV prize money.

Three ground three games on a Saturday would require another 10 similar days/nights and would seem the 'fairest' out of a very difficult situation.

It would save a fair bit of pollution - and cost for away fans. How that stacks up for STs, access to the games for those without relevant sibscription will have to be seen.

It could be done

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Do you think there is any chance of 14 clubs voting for that Bill?

Seems unlikely to me and would represent changing the rules part way through IMO and surely subject to legal challenge.

They seem prepared to fit anything up just to keep the money rolling in. To me this is not a good look in the present situation.

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47 minutes ago, ricardo said:

Do you think there is any chance of 14 clubs voting for that Bill?

Seems unlikely to me and would represent changing the rules part way through IMO and surely subject to legal challenge.

They seem prepared to fit anything up just to keep the money rolling in. To me this is not a good look in the present situation.

Nope as it would mean 5 being relegated next season - though at least some of the numpties finally grasp that it will be a decsion made by two thirds of the PL, if the season is allowed tp resume.

I spoke to a 'saggies' supporter earlier and he told me how the top club's in the Championship will be launching a legal challenge for £170m plus each if 3 do not go up. Yep, I can see the PL clubs voting at an EGM for something that could be challenged and lost in the courts.

So the impetus will be on trying to get the games played before 30th June.

Something not logistically impossible as there are enough grounds available, with theur being any need to be concerned about capacity.

It would mean teams playing one game at the week end and one mid week for a month solid.

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11 minutes ago, Bill said:

Something not logistically impossible as there are enough grounds available, with theur being any need to be concerned about capacity.

It would mean teams playing one game at the week end and one mid week for a month solid.

Then what happens if any team has an infection and has to self isolate?

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1 minute ago, ricardo said:

Then what happens if any team has an infection and has to self isolate?

The probability of that will be factored in when the decision is made whether to go ahead, or not

At this stage all that is being stated is based on the conditional... if....

If it is deemed ok to resume playing

This won't be known until at least the end of April. So these are merely continguency plans.

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