The Positive Brexit Thread

[ricardo 7,396]

Quid over 1.25 to the dollar today. Many on here were predicting parity not so long back. 1.30 wouldn't  surprise me by summer.

 

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

2 hours ago, ricardo said:

We won't rejoin in your lifetime either and you probably have many more years than me.

The reward of Brexit is of course Brexit itself. The ultimate authority has now returned to where it always should be. Westminster.

Nothing to stop you League of European Empire Loyalists pushing for a rejoin, after all, its a free country.

I doubt we will rejoin in anyone's lifetime. This isn't Mike Walker coming back for a second stab at management. Its way to big. At the moment you are convinced its the right thing to do based on the only thing that is certain. That we are not subject to being overruled by other European countries. Even though we had a veto. Fair dues. 

I think its a calamity based on the notion that sovereignty is for the birds in reality. My main concern is for my family ongoing. I have Great Grandchildren now and I wonder what the future holds for them and the opportunities they don't have anymore.

Edited April 4, 2023 by keelansgrandad

[ricardo 7,396]

Just now, keelansgrandad said:

I doubt we will rejoin in anyone's lifetime. This isn't Mike Walker coming back for a second stab at management. Its way to big. At the moment you are convinced its the right thing to do based on the only thing that is certain. That we are not subject to being overruled by other European countries. Even though we had a veto. Fair dues. 

I think its a calamity based on the notion that sovereignty is for the birds in reality. My main concern is for my family ongoing. I have Great Grandchildren now and I wonder what the future holds for them and the opportunities they don't have anymore.

YF and others seem to think rejoin is just round the corner. Deluded in my opinion.

[benchwarmer 625]

3 hours ago, ricardo said:

We won't rejoin in your lifetime either and you probably have many more years than me.

The reward of Brexit is of course Brexit itself. The ultimate authority has now returned to where it always should be. Westminster.

 

So Westminster is responsible for the extra paperwork, time and expense involved in importing and exporting goods to and from the EU.  I didn't know.  I shall write to my MP and complain.  Thank you.

Edited April 4, 2023 by benchwarmer

[Herman 9,820]

Remain supporters want what is best for the country whereas leave supporters want what is best for themselves. This is one massive difference between us that will be very hard to solve. 

[ricardo 7,396]

1 minute ago, benchwarmer said:

So Westminster is responsible for the extra paperwork and expense involved in importing and exporting goods to and from the EU.  I didn't know.  I shall write to my MP and complain.  Thank you.

Thats what happens when you leave a trading bloc that wants to become a political union. No doubt many were happy to swallow that.

 

 

[ricardo 7,396]

1 minute ago, Herman said:

Remain supporters want what is best for the country whereas leave supporters want what is best for themselves. This is one massive difference between us that will be very hard to solve. 

You wanted whats best for your pocket but i don't  blame you for that. Some of us still believe  that what is best for the country is worth more than a few quid in your skyrocket.

[littleyellowbirdie 2,582]

45 minutes ago, keelansgrandad said:

You know them all do you? Who are the most people? People don't come on here because there is very little positive from Brexit. Ricardo thinks its sovereignty. Fair enough if that is the most important thing to people. To me its far from it.

Don't need to know them. The simple observation that there's only a tiny group of this forum that frequent this thread to reinforce each others skepticism says it all.

Most people is the majority of the country who Labour and the Conservatives are pitching their cases to, with debate about rejoining the EU nowhere to be seen.

[littleyellowbirdie 2,582]

2 hours ago, Yellow Fever said:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Opinion_polling_on_the_whether_the_United_Kingdom_should_rejoin_the_European_Union.svg

That's all very well on a poll asking if you'd rejoin if you could click your fingers and rewind to January 2015; When you factor in pissing off Canada, Australia, New Zealand, Japan, and the rest to rejoin an EU that will not be rolling out the red carpet for a country that caused so much upset and you realise this is pie in the sky.

[ricardo 7,396]

4 minutes ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

That's all very well on a poll asking if you'd rejoin if you could click your fingers and rewind to January 2015; When you factor in pissing off Canada, Australia, New Zealand, Japan, and the rest to rejoin an EU that will not be rolling out the red carpet for a country that caused so much upset and you realise this is pie in the sky.

Are there any terms likely to be on offer that we wouldn't laugh at?

[Yellow Fever 3,818]

5 minutes ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

That's all very well on a poll asking if you'd rejoin if you could click your fingers and rewind to January 2015; When you factor in pissing off Canada, Australia, New Zealand, Japan, and the rest to rejoin an EU that will not be rolling out the red carpet for a country that caused so much upset and you realise this is pie in the sky.

That's entirely your opinion.

The EU would of course be delighted - they've even as much said so. Return of the prodigal son and all that.

I've always said give it ten years - same as the 'Commonwealth'  but less now. It only us older generation that really ever voted for it en-masse for reasons which look well frankly quite quaint. As to how we 're-join' - that's open to debate - small steps  - SM and so on as the EU itself will of changed... Poland far more dominant even adding perhaps Ukraine, Moldova, Georgia etc.

What I do know is that you can't stop the tide of history and the modern joined up world. People have such larger horizons and the youngsters even more so - they feel and indeed are European! Hen nights in Prague etc. It's only a question of when and this hiccup will be consigned to history.

[Herman 9,820]

Wanting to remain was never about money for me personally as I didn’t think it would affect me or work financially wise (got that wrong). It was always about what was best for the country as a whole. The pros of membership far outweighed the cons. 

I also looked at who was on the Leave leadership. That rang alarm bells straight away. And so it should have for any sensible person. 

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

48 minutes ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

Don't need to know them. The simple observation that there's only a tiny group of this forum that frequent this thread to reinforce each others skepticism says it all.

Most people is the majority of the country who Labour and the Conservatives are pitching their cases to, with debate about rejoining the EU nowhere to be seen.

Nobody is banging on about rejoining. For the last time, the thread is about Positive Brexit. And there is very little positive since 2016. If you can't discuss the points without banging on about rejoining then don't bother to post. Start a threadof your own. You are hijacking this one.

[How I Wrote Elastic Man 1,189]

On 15/02/2023 at 19:59, How I Wrote Elastic Man said:

I guess as the EU have got involved it shows some virtue on their part 

As for Sweden, if I  was being charitable I would suggest that they purely looked at the paperwork and had overlooked the humane situation of the case. Uncharitably, they may just have been officious árseholes

Nordic countries have a reputation for being progressive, but errors of judgement, or fúck ups, as I prefer to call them, are made

Like Iceland kicking out a disabled guy . We let him back in, as the story demonstrates, but it should never have happened 

Family fighting to prevent deportation

Hopefully Brussels will lean on the Sweden and help stop the deportation 

[littleyellowbirdie 2,582]

1 hour ago, keelansgrandad said:

Nobody is banging on about rejoining. For the last time, the thread is about Positive Brexit.

Not sure a whole 24 hours of no comments on the 'when will the UK rejoin the EU thread?' , mostly kept going by the same little club as this one, justifies that comment quite yet.

Edited April 4, 2023 by littleyellowbirdie

[littleyellowbirdie 2,582]

2 hours ago, Yellow Fever said:

That's entirely your opinion.

The EU would of course be delighted - they've even as much said so. Return of the prodigal son and all that.

I've always said give it ten years - same as the 'Commonwealth'  but less now. It only us older generation that really ever voted for it en-masse for reasons which look well frankly quite quaint. As to how we 're-join' - that's open to debate - small steps  - SM and so on as the EU itself will of changed... Poland far more dominant even adding perhaps Ukraine, Moldova, Georgia etc.

What I do know is that you can't stop the tide of history and the modern joined up world. People have such larger horizons and the youngsters even more so - they feel and indeed are European! Hen nights in Prague etc. It's only a question of when and this hiccup will be consigned to history.

It's very strange because I sometimes think we're on the same page but not.

You're right about the tide of history. Asia continues to grow while Europe's influence wanes.

If what you mean by 're-join' with the quotation marks, is we're going to build back a lot of the bells and whistles of the EU like freedom of movement, then I think you're right, but like I said it's going to be through working with Japan building stronger integration between Europe and other middle power liberal democracies around the world for which CPTPP is an ideal starting point for a framework beyond the WTO.

Edited April 4, 2023 by littleyellowbirdie

[Well b back 3,274]

4 hours ago, ricardo said:

Quid over 1.25 to the dollar today. Many on here were predicting parity not so long back. 1.30 wouldn't  surprise me by summer.

 

Your original post said the markets had recovered and interest rates were on their way down to. 
You will have little yellow birdie calling you out soon.

[Well b back 3,274]

2 hours ago, How I Wrote Elastic Man said:

Family fighting to prevent deportation

Hopefully Brussels will lean on the Sweden and help stop the deportation 

Looks like me might be throwing out migrants as well, although I accept they are not European.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-65182440

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

2 hours ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

Not sure a whole 24 hours of no comments on the 'when will the UK rejoin the EU thread?' , mostly kept going by the same little club as this one, justifies that comment quite yet.

Its a different thread with the appropriate title. So why do you keep posting on this one.

[littleyellowbirdie 2,582]

7 hours ago, Yellow Fever said:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Opinion_polling_on_the_whether_the_United_Kingdom_should_rejoin_the_European_Union.svg

 

5 hours ago, Yellow Fever said:

That's entirely your opinion.

The EU would of course be delighted - they've even as much said so. Return of the prodigal son and all that.

I've always said give it ten years - same as the 'Commonwealth'  but less now. It only us older generation that really ever voted for it en-masse for reasons which look well frankly quite quaint. As to how we 're-join' - that's open to debate - small steps  - SM and so on as the EU itself will of changed... Poland far more dominant even adding perhaps Ukraine, Moldova, Georgia etc.

What I do know is that you can't stop the tide of history and the modern joined up world. People have such larger horizons and the youngsters even more so - they feel and indeed are European! Hen nights in Prague etc. It's only a question of when and this hiccup will be consigned to history.

 

5 hours ago, keelansgrandad said:

Nobody is banging on about rejoining. For the last time, the thread is about Positive Brexit. And there is very little positive since 2016. If you can't discuss the points without banging on about rejoining then don't bother to post. Start a threadof your own. You are hijacking this one.

Hmmm. What was that, KG?

[Yellow Fever 3,818]

10 hours ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

 

 

Hmmm. What was that, KG?

That was in response to Ricado's absolutist view. The graph I didn't even comment upon as it was self explanatory. 

 

[littleyellowbirdie 2,582]

Just now, Yellow Fever said:

That was in response to Ricado's absolutist view. The graph I didn't even comment upon as it was self explanatory. 

 

Sorry; it wasn't a dig. Couldn't have been worst timed for KG is all. 🙂

I agree with Ricardo that it's hard to conceive of us ditching existing commitments for a process of rejoining the EU where no assurances can be given before the negotiation process, especially when the known economic benefit from rejoining will be  5% of GDP; a couple of years after the transition period has finished, we've achieved ab bit over 1% of GDP from Australia, New Zealand, and Canada. There's probably opportunity to tweak the rollover FTAs to concede protections with other EU countries in mind for better access to those markets for us.

On the political side, a lot of progress has been made on Canada/EU free movement, so there's clearly good prospects to restore free movement once the asylum dispute is settled.

 

 

[How I Wrote Elastic Man 1,189]

12 hours ago, Well b back said:

Looks like me might be throwing out migrants as well, although I accept they are not European.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-65182440

Shameful way to treat people 😡

[A Load of Squit 5,213]

13 hours ago, Well b back said:

Looks like me might be throwing out migrants as well, although I accept they are not European.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-65182440

Where's Dame Joanna Lumley?

[littleyellowbirdie 2,582]

3 minutes ago, A Load of Squit said:

Where's Dame Joanna Lumley?

Probably in France. She has a place in Lot et Garonne.

[Herman 9,820]

As it's a nice sunny day how about we rejoin the EU?! 

[NFN FC 1,123]

11 minutes ago, Herman said:

As it's a nice sunny day how about we rejoin the EU?! 

And federate the whole lot. Become a powerhouse to take on China and the US

[nevermind, neoliberalism has had it 159]

18 hours ago, ricardo said:

Thats what happens when you leave a trading bloc that wants to become a political union. No doubt many were happy to swallow that.

 

 

political union is already here. just look at the arm twisting that is going on. Biden says and Westminster/ the Eu jumps to it. Little bowler hats will not destroy the GFA, Germany will dance to the tune of bubbling gas from NS2, and Scotland's plan for Independence will be filibustered at every corner. we are told to go to war in Europe whilst Blinken Biden and the EU are nodding and spending mega billions on more arms. There is nobody who can claim sovereignty, we are America's a..e wipe, as is the EU. Porr Finland has just given up to the pressures of propaganda and little us are farting at China, like a ****su trying to mount a great dane.

[Yellow Fever 3,818]

1 hour ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

Sorry; it wasn't a dig. Couldn't have been worst timed for KG is all. 🙂

I agree with Ricardo that it's hard to conceive of us ditching existing commitments for a process of rejoining the EU where no assurances can be given before the negotiation process, especially when the known economic benefit from rejoining will be  5% of GDP; a couple of years after the transition period has finished, we've achieved ab bit over 1% of GDP from Australia, New Zealand, and Canada. There's probably opportunity to tweak the rollover FTAs to concede protections with other EU countries in mind for better access to those markets for us.

On the political side, a lot of progress has been made on Canada/EU free movement, so there's clearly good prospects to restore free movement once the asylum dispute is settled.

 

 

I rather suspect that if we wanted to 'rejoin' the EU would probably allow us back on similar terms to what we left. After all its win-win for somewhat wiser parties although don't leave it too long.

Oddly - makes me laugh when some say there would be lots of problems with in re-joining (a known system) - as if the Leavers had scooby of the problems in leaving in the first place - they clearly had no plan whatsoever and signed a blank cheque! Best ignored.

However - despite those polls indicating a near or actual supermajority to return its too soon. But clearly the public at large are currently well ahead of the politicians but give it another election cycle - a 6% reduction in standard of living as forecast and the issue will become very  live again.  

 

[littleyellowbirdie 2,582]

50 minutes ago, Yellow Fever said:

I rather suspect that if we wanted to 'rejoin' the EU would probably allow us back on similar terms to what we left. After all its win-win for somewhat wiser parties although don't leave it too long.

Oddly - makes me laugh when some say there would be lots of problems with in re-joining (a known system) - as if the Leavers had scooby of the problems in leaving in the first place - they clearly had no plan whatsoever and signed a blank cheque! Best ignored.

However - despite those polls indicating a near or actual supermajority to return its too soon. But clearly the public at large are currently well ahead of the politicians but give it another election cycle - a 6% reduction in standard of living as forecast and the issue will become very  live again.  

 

I used to be in an EU federalist group on facebook while campaigning between 2016 and 2019 before I decided I'd had enough of facebook last year. I got to know some of them quite well. A common theme, in accordance with the chap up the road who worked with Macron was irritation with UK 'cherry-picking' as they put it.

We got the opt-out from the Euro because we were a barrier to the majority of countries moving forward with the Euro project. How Thatcher successfully negotiated our rebates I've never really understood.

With CPTPP we were the first candidate country; the CPTPP nations were very keen not to be seen to be allowing us  carve outs as a precedent for further candidates down the line.

We would be starting from scratch with the EU from the position of any other candidate country. Offering the Euro opt out and rebates in accession negotiations would be anathema to the EU27 and would be the wrong signal for other prospective EU candidates. If the UK can get opt outs, why can't they?

Layered on that is the relationships with other countries that would be damaged in reversing course. You personally deal with Japan massively. How do you think they'd react to the UK turning their backs on the commitments we've made to promoting the most important element of Japan's foreign policy in Asia Pacific? If the EU then accepts us back, what damage does that do between the EU and Japan?

The most damaging thing about Brexit in business terms was uncertainty. Now we're past the exit stage and the UK is being seen to reinsert itself into globalisation in a structured way, we're on course for rebuilding.

From the EU's perspective, it's great if the UK continues to tear itself apart over the rights and wrongs of leaving 7 years after the original referendum and two years after the end of the transition period, but from the UK's perspective it's only negative to keep the Brexit argument alive when it's a fait accompli. That's why it's only some journos and no mainstream politicians still pushing this argument.

Edited April 5, 2023 by littleyellowbirdie