Worthy outers

[allways travelling 0]

Get a life and shut up he is not going anywhere and will be given quite rightly so until the end of the season to sort things out. we will then have the parachute money to start rebuilding again.mistakes have been made this season i think he would be the first to admit this.But he did not foresee the level of injuries we have got this season it would mess up most sides form.Theres no way we are relegation material especially when our players get there injuries cleared up.So all you worthy outers you just might as well get behind worthy and the team for the rest of the season and you never know we just might make the play offs with everybody behind the manager and the team.

[LinkNR9 0]

AT - Despite the likes of you and I being at opposite ends of the spectrum as regards support for Worthington, Do you really think that, by saying "shut up" to those of us who differ in opinion to you, we''re going to turn round and say, "OK, AT, we''ll get behind Worthington straight away"??!! "Reductio ad absurdum", as the saying goes. 

If Worthington stays, well, see you in Division One.  

[stan the man 0]

You are so naive. every club in the bottom half of the table is relegation material. When you are down the bottom you are not just relying on you getting a result, you have to pray that the other results go for you as well. Even last season, we had survival in our own hands and we couldn''t get the result we needed. And the way we are playing (for the last 18 games) we could quite possibly face the same situation at the end of this season. Worthy''s run of poor management you could say started after we won the championship. With playing players out of position, bad tactics. There has to be a time to call an end to it. And the time is now!!!!!!!!! unless you want to be always travelling to div1 grounds!!

[Rasputin was a C... 0]

I just had to give this thread a 5 star rating. I never knew you could write such beautiful material... nearly brought a tear to my eye.

[Blue Hater 0]

Nice to see you are still confident Mr. Worthington.It is you isnt it? I mean who else would believe such tosh!!!

[nolegs 0]

[quote]Get a life and shut up he is not going anywhere and will be given quite rightly so until the end of the season to sort things out. we will then have the parachute money to start rebuilding again.mista...[/quote]

Such eloquence surely can do nothing but enhance your argument and the opinions of posters reading it will come to their own conclusions about your mental capacity.

[First Wizard 0]

[quote]Get a life and shut up he is not going anywhere and will be given quite rightly so until the end of the season to sort things out. we will then have the parachute money to start rebuilding again.mista...[/quote]

One word...........drivel!.

[DumbleDelia is Magic 0]

I''m sorry AlLways travelling but I don''t agree with a word of that.  The amount of injuries we have had has not been that unbelievable.  Most teams would be able to cope with it because they would have the squads to compensate.  We don''t.  A lot of the players we do have on our boooks have woefully under performed this year.  This is down to management, motivation and tactics.  This is down to Nigel Worthington.  The sooner some fans get their head out of the sand the better. We are heading for league 1.  FACT. 

[TwoSheds 0]

Shut up? I dont think so WORTHLESS OUT AND OUT NOW!

[K S 0]

always travellin...........have another go at sarcasm, you know it makes sense. i am guessing that your post was a wind up, wasn''t it?

whilst agreeing, that it is not all worthys fault,i firmly believe that if he goes, his coaching staff should go as well, he must shoulder the blame. I presume he picks the team, tells them whereto play, he makes the unbelievable at times substitutions, and when we are ahead(not often this year), i presume it is he who gets the players to sit back behind the ball, thus inviting more pressure.

which injuries have affected the team? with the exception of saffri, i cant believe that those that are out (including mckenzie), are any better than those that are playing!

[Big Rob 0]

[quote]Get a life and shut up he is not going anywhere and will be given quite rightly so until the end of the season to sort things out. we will then have the parachute money to start rebuilding again.mista...[/quote]

Wow what an excellent post and so eloquently put too. Now go and put your Burberry hat on and go play with your Vauxhall Nova in the ‘Big W’ car park!

[allways travelling 0]

[quote]I''m sorry AlLways travelling but I don''t agree with a word of that. The amount of injuries we have had has not been that unbelievable. Most teams would be able to cope with it because they would hav...[/quote]

Please look back at every match we have had this season and see how many times we have played the same eleven.You can not blame the manager for this.Leon has been a very big loss to us this season the workrate he puts in was the perfect foil for ashton who used to clear up all the bits they did have a good understanding man utd game one example.The other injuries we have suffered seem mainly to have been in the most inportant positon possible midfield what we call the engine room thus giving us little supply to ashton and co and also resulting in us trying to go long ball to much which is really not the norwich way.This also because we have been losing the ball has put The defence under to much pressure.The only thing i think worthy could have done better with is playing brennan and at times charlton in positions which was foreign to them.He in my opinion would have been better playing rossi jarvis a natural midfielder there.But ok its a mistake which i think he thought experience would be the better option.I think he may have learnt from this everybody makes mistakes so lets judge worthy at the end of the season when he has been given enough time.Because i think what he has given us in the past he deserves that much.

[rieg77 0]

[quote]I''m sorry AlLways travelling but I don''t agree with a word of that. The amount of injuries we have had has not been that unbelievable. Most teams would be able to cope with it because they would hav...[/quote]

Erm...perhaps you should put ours back in the sand. How come the players are beyond criticism?? In your eyes, they do no wrong?? If a player can''t get himself motivated to pull on the jersey then perhaps he should seek alternative employment.

Any your argument is that because you say its a fact we will be relegated that we should all jump on your band wagon??

So whats your plan?? Doesn''t seem like you have one that would actually work for a club like ours. If you have lets hear it. We sack Worthy, pay his contract off, then what. Most of the transfer kittys gone and we need a new manager. A decent one would probably want to bring in his own back room so we have to pay off the existing backroom staff and then offer attractive packages to the new manager and his staff. You''ve already said you think we need more/better players - how are we going to get them if we''ve no money. Perhaps you advocate selling the starts to ''improve'' the team. Perhaps you''re a believer in the mystical pool of quality freebies??

I want to hear your plan for our club. Surely you have one - you''re so vocal about wanting a change!!

Sack Worthy!!!........er........now what?? - Thats short sighted my friend!

[Ian 1,211]

[quote]Erm...perhaps you should put ours back in the sand. How come the players are beyond criticism?? In your eyes, they do no wrong?? If a player can''t get himself motivated to pull on the jersey then perh...[/quote]

Quite, but the majority of posters don''t seem to want to let sense get in the way of baying for blood.

Just out of interest, if the team did turn it around and start playing blinding football, and we did make it into the playoffs -- would people still want Worthington out? Alternatively, if Worthington was sacked, and Green/Ashton/Hucks/Safri went, and we still get relegated (a la Forest), would people still say sacking Worthington was the right thing to do?

[Regime Change 0]

Totally agree with you AT.

Worthy has made mistakes but the team has also been badly affected by factors outside of his control.

Unless he brain washes them, Worthy cannot ensure the player do exactly what he wants them to do, and one the biggest questions so far this season has got to be how professional has the players attitude been?

The Worthy Outers are entitled to their opinion but I have yet to see a sensible/realistic replacement suggested for the Post Worthy Era.

The Worthy Outers posts seem to increasingly consist of personal attacks aimed at either Worthy or the Board rather than constructively suggesting ways to move the club forward.

For those who think we are in such a bad position,perhaps a visit to Torquay Utd is in order.  Relegated from Division One last season, currently bottom of Division Two, but still supporting the club and its Manager.

[YankeeCanary 0]

[quote]Totally agree with you AT. Worthy has made mistakes but the team has also been badly affected by factors outside of his control. Unless he brain washes them, Worthy cannot ensure the player do exact...[/quote]

Scott, there have been many suggestions on replacements that make sense but, if you choose to rubbish all of them with carte blanche statements rather than debating the better ones then your input lacks credibility. Some posters do just bellow "Worthy Out!!" while input from other critics is well thought out and reasoned as opposed, again, to your carte blanche statements which puts everyone''s input into a category of "personal attacks". Unless you are prepared to debate those posters with better and constructive input ( even if you don''t agree with it ) you will never grow in your own ability to debate in a reasoned way.

With respect to your comment on Torquay, what makes you think they continue to be supported? Attendance figures there are now down to barely over 2000 per game, which is a third of their capacity. Is this a standard you wish Norwich to aim for? 

[DumbleDelia is Magic 0]

[quote]Erm...perhaps you should put ours back in the sand. How come the players are beyond criticism?? In your eyes, they do no wrong?? If a player can''t get himself motivated to pull on the jersey then perh...[/quote]

Of course the players aren''t beyond criticism.  However, good players don''t become bad players over night.  Players like Green, Drury, Hucks and Deano who have done so well for us in the past few years, just aren''t performing.  As I say, they haven''t become bad players.  So why are they playing poorly?  The only reason can be the motivation and tactics they get from the management.  A new manager can invigorate a team and turn their performances around.  Look at West Brom last year under Robson, Palace two years ago under Dowie. 

Also, a big part of the reason we are in the predicament we are is because Nigel hasn''t strengthened with enough bodies and enough quality.  He had *£2M* to spend on Morrison.  He could have bought 3/4 midfielders for that! 

[allways travelling 0]

[quote]Of course the players aren''t beyond criticism. However, good players don''t become bad players over night. Players like Green, Drury, Hucks and Deano who have done so well for us in the past few year...[/quote]

That is the question.Players dont become bad players overnight the same applies to managers they dont become bad managers overnight. Worthy has been good in the past why cant he be good in the future. Time is needed as i have stressed more than once on here.You was behind worthy when things was going well why do you desert him now.You and a lot of the out brigade know full well we have been littered with injuries this year but instead of accepting this you rant on about its all worthys fault. How can it be ok we are 16th in the leauge so would sheff utd be if they had our injuries list.What we should all focus on is we might be perishley close to the bottom three but at the same time we are only 6 points of the top six. So lets not panic just yet give the once good manager time to redeem himself.

[DumbleDelia is Magic 0]

[quote]That is the question.Players dont become bad players overnight the same applies to managers they dont become bad managers overnight. Worthy has been good in the past why cant he be good in the future....[/quote]

You''re post is inaccurate in many ways there alLways.  Firstly, no managers don''t become bad managers over night.  However, over the past 2 seasons (last and this) Worthington has been poor.  His signings have been poor, his tactics have been poor and his substitutions have been poor.  I''ve said it many times but I''ll say it again;  If a player had consistantly under performed and played badly for 2 seasons, would he be in the first team?  No.  Would he still be at the club?  No.  Why does this not apply to managers then?

We have not been "littered with injuries" this season.  The only players we have missed from our first team is Saf and Leon.  2 long term injuries is very standard in football these days.  You say that if Sheff Utd had had the amount of injuries we have had, they would be near the bottom.  No they wouldn''t.  The reason is because they have a strength in depth.  They have quality players they can call on if they have injuries.  Nigel has made sure we can''t do this by not signing enough players

[Garlic Bread?! 0]

Completly agree with you AT - I, like many others, will still be chanting Worthingtons green army come next saturday.

[stan the man 0]

Always, you''re right Worthy hasn''t become a bad manager over night, he has been very poor for the past season and a half. Worhty Likes to sign players that can play in many positions known as "jack of all trades, master of none. Worthy seems to concentrate on fitness rather than skill i.e When Ashton came from Crewe he wasn''t the fittest of players but he could score goals, now under worthy for a year he looks painfully poor. Worthy doesn''t like big heads at his club, so where do you get arogance and flare from, that a team needs to win matches?. And as for tactics, some of Worthy''s have been pathetic. Midfield sitting to deep, playing players out of position.

Some other posters have said would it be right to sack Worthy (which i am for). I ask them this, Was it right to sack Hamilton!!!!. This will be another step for norwich city.

[JP 0]

[quote]Get a life and shut up he is not going anywhere and will be given quite rightly so until the end of the season to sort things out. we will then have the parachute money to start rebuilding again.mista...[/quote]

...given till the end of the season, (what are you no!?), No chance!

[Swarney 0]

Sticks and stones!

AT has an opinion, why cant he have that opinion? I''m not saying i agree or disagree. But this message board is getting stupid, with the abuse posters are getting for having views. Rather than some constructive response, some of the replies (not all) are just nasty. Fine he wants worthy to stay, it may not be what others think but leave the cheap one liners and abuse on the playground.  We are all passionate about our club, its why we use this message board, but some of the posters (some of the better posters) have disappeared in the last few months which is a great shame. Oh well....

[Mook 0]

Ah, the wonderful sound of a nail being hit squarely on the head.

Well done, DD.

[0ridgemanddMMyyyy0Falseen-USTrue 0]

I agree with DD it was Worthington that got us relegated last season with over cautios tactics and poor use of the players available to him. Lets not forget Saffri wasn''t good enough until Holt was injured. I am not of the opinion he is a good manager and not certain the coaching staff are adequate for this division.

Can a player play badly for two seasons and retain his place yes under NW.

As for injuries we dont have that many but we started with a woefully thin squad and before we rue missing McKenzie lets not forget he was poor before his injury a willing worker but not putting away many chances with many passes going astray.

We have not really passed the ball well with the present management team rather relying on the high ball, we do not make use of set pieces, we are caught offside far to often, we defend far to deep and have done so ever since NW took over.

Perhaps a new face could encourage us to do the simple things like passing the ball on the ground, moving into space, look along the line before doing the headless chicken run and then we could start to enjoy our football again.

PS how much will a season ticket for DIV 1 cost.

 

[allways travelling 0]

[quote]You''re post is inaccurate in many ways there alLways. Firstly, no managers don''t become bad managers over night. However, over the past 2 seasons (last and this) Worthington has been poor. His sign...[/quote]

When i said about injuries littered i agree saf and leon seem to have been long term. but when you look back hughes has not been in that much in two games then out marneythe same now long term. you have to look back at how many times in all the games we have played this season have we had the same eleven hardly any games how can we blame worthy for that.

the two long term leon and saf are two very inportant players to have missing the same as arsenal when henry doesnt play.

How do we know its worthys fault with regard to signings some he has tried but could not get others possibly we dont know who but possibly wouldnt come.

luck i feel this season has had a large part to play it is fact no matter which way you look at it bad luck coupled with injuries will affect any sides form.

Last season we didnt spend big we all thought if we survived we would be suprised. if we had beaten fulham he would have been thre greatest manager of all time at norwich and everyone would be singing his praises. but he lost that game and everyone says he is a crap manager its a very thin line it could also be the next six or seven games could change our season we might just have recovered you never no in football.

[gazzathegreat 0]

Always

I think by now you know my opinion on Nigel.  DD and others have made the case for injuries etc, I just want to concentrate on how we play.  Yes, I accept and agree that we had a good season in the play off year, over achieving if you like and only lost on penalties (fact) and because of a bizarre substitution (some''s opinion).  The following season was much like this, a bit of a hangover and we missed the playoffs.  The championship season we had the luck of the Irish for most of it, a consistent team (not too many injuries) but we did win a lot of games in which one incident turned the match.  I am sorry Always, as much as I enjoyed that season, particulary watching Hucks, we still didn''t concentrate on building a solid and creative midfield, we still relied on defending too deep and our whole ethos was not, and is still not playing football in the Norwich way.  Maybe you are not old enough to remember football under John Bond, Ken Brown, Dave Stringer and Mike Walker, but I am and that is how we should be playing. 

Worthy has run out of time, ideas and now his reliance on playing old favourites (as Flem last year and Holt) didn''t help to keep us up, now his aversion to getting cover for Francis, not making plans for cover for Safri, who he knew would be absent for a large period and his buying of Ashton, a real gem of a footballer, who he has turned into a journeyman targetman has contributed to where we are now. 

Added to the obvious lack of motivation the players are receiving it all goes to show why we are where we are.  I don''t think he can turn it around and that is sad.  I wish I believed he could.

[allways travelling 0]

[quote]Always I think by now you know my opinion on Nigel. DD and others have made the case for injuries etc, I just want to concentrate on how we play. Yes, I accept and agree that we had a good season i...[/quote]

I take on board lots of your comments and its nice not to get abused from someone who is of the worthy out brigade.I allways think a good indication of how well the manager has been doing is allways seen by the level of support he has been getting.Now if he was that poorer manager it does not reflect in the crowd attendances. As we all know we have in the main over the last few years since worthy has been at the helm had sell outs week in week out and season tickets have become goldust. When was the lasttime you can remember a two thousand waiting limit at norwich just to get on the list. Now all the worthy out brigade need to take this on board and realise how well worthy has done thats proof enough.This is why i am strongly against turfing him out at the first sign of real problems at the club. He  has earnt the chance in my opinion to be given untill the end of this season to turn it around.Just heard the good news we now have etutu on board from preston lets keep our fingers crossed he stays injury free and we start climbing the table again.

[silver fox 0]

[quote]I take on board lots of your comments and its nice not to get abused from someone who is of the worthy out brigade.I allways think a good indication of how well the manager has been doing is allways s...[/quote]

AT, injuries didn''t seem to cause Wolves a problem last weekend when both their main strikers were out.  Do you blame injuries for losing to Stoke, QPR, Luton, Watford, Sheff Wed?  Three of those teams were playing 2 divisions below us last season.

If you genuinely believe in the way that Worthy gets us to play then fair dues, but I personally think he is very limited in his ideas and predictable with his tactics, and as a result he has made it easy for any decent opposition manager to play against us.

Hopefully you are right and he will pull us through, but at the moment we are very close to the botttom three, and traditionally it is hard to stay up once you are in that position.  I for one will always support Norwich because they are my team, but it is a long way back if you suffer double relegation.

[gazzathegreat 0]

[quote]I take on board lots of your comments and its nice not to get abused from someone who is of the worthy out brigade.I allways think a good indication of how well the manager has been doing is allways s...[/quote]

Always, thanks for your reply, and I am not going to personally abuse anyone, because we are discussing NCFC, not each other on this board.

It''s a shame you didn''t answer my points, but never mind, I will comment on yours.

Crowds- yes, we are getting big crowds, which have built up since the play off season.  Due to work and personal reasons I had renewed my season ticket after a couple of season''s lapses in the play off year (not trouble at all getting a couple).  Then they became like gold dust, due to the play offs!  The rest is history.  Yes, there are people on the w list, but also I know personally of people who aren''t going to renew next year, and of those who have come off that list due to this season''s form.

As for big crowds in the past, they were much bigger in the 70s and 80s, when there were standing terrraces (and less to do with your spare time maybe!), also more relevant maybe is under our best ever spell 92/93 we were getting 14-16,000.  The ground was not full all the time then, or the next season.  Of course over the past few years we have added capacity, and since the Premiership and Sky it is obvious more people have become interested in football, more people have moved into our area etc, there are lots of reasons.

You also have to look at what is happening to our away support.  It is going to go down dramatically if the present run continues.  People I have seen at away games for the past 10 years and more are just so fed up with both the standard of football on show and the attitude of the board towards Worthy etc they are going to vote with their feet.

In my view Worthy has not just got it wrong this season, but last as well and several of the little niggles throughout his entire tenire have now come home to roost.  I, like everyone else want him to turn it around, where you and I differ Always, is I fear he can''t, which is why I think we need a change of management.