Old Shuck

Good call on Gareth Bale, however, he is Welsh and has already played for Wales! I actually think that, whilst Ashley Cole is a great athlete, as a footballer, he isn''t as good as Wayne Bridge and its him I''d pick in my England XI, which, if everyone was fit and available, would be (4-3-1-2).... Carson Richards Terry Woodgate Bridge   Gerrard (I''m sorry if he doesn''t like it on the right but it gives a better balance in the middle and besides, he is great at bombing forward and inside from this position-also gets back quickly so play him to his strengths, the 3 man midfield also means he -and     isn''t confined to the touchline and has a bit of room inside and outside) Cole, J Barry   (another energetic player who can close down opposition players, but has a sweet left foot on him-this is not strictly, being a 3 man midfield, a left footed position, but, again, given the options, he has the range)   Rooney  (yep, bombing in and behind the front two in a "free" role and through the middle. Rooney, don''t you fucking dare go wide here, look for the ball and look to get it from the midfield)   Defoe Ashton (not a traditional "big man" a''la Heskey, but plenty strong enough and he and Defoe will create loads of chances between them)   Never an England team in a million years of course, and Richards/Bridge would have to work particularly hard but one built to take the game to the opposition rather than letting them sit back. *Owen is knackered so ta ta. *Would beg Scholes to come back as cover for Rooney in that same position. *Would expect Terry to get in the faces of the opposition and for Woodgate, much more of a footballer, to clear up behind him.        

I thought it was Lee Marshall that saved us from embarassment at that game in Cheltenham, celebrating in front of us as if we''d just won the FA Cup....? Or is it me?

Can only comment from the Saunders era onwards, although those achievements and signings cited by earlier Norwich Managers look ever impressive. John Bond is way up there for me, both as a Manager and how he changed our way of play from the efficient but somewhat dour Saunders time to a more pass and move game, utilising wingers, in particular, Jimmy Neighbour. Dave Jones (from Forest) was another Bond signing, a much under rated City centre back who had some injury worries whilst he was with us, else I think his flag would be flying a lot higher now. Boyer and McDougall, plus Martin Peters were also his signings. Kevin Reeves another-our first £1 Million sale! He also had a knack of plucking out unknowns who did well for us, short term, Roger Gibbins is one I remember getting a good few goals for us. He says now that he regrets leaving us for Man City. He isn''t the only one who has left Norwich to go onto -they hope- bigger and better things, many have tried, many of those may have felt that they were better off staying with us. That subject is almost worth a post on its own. Oh yes, I think John Bond bought in Viv Busby as well, also John Ryan-the latter, I think, one of our most under rated players ever.

Jewell is on stand-by for the Leeds job, if the Pearson headed takeover goes ahead in January, he will replace Wise.

I don''t care what many of the England players say about playing for England et al, their motiovation, for the very great majority of them is playing in the Champions League for their clubs and I bet most of them value doing that way above playing for their country. And I don''t blame them one bit! The clubs pay their wages and look out for them in every way they can, it is through playing for their clubs that they get exposure, both in the UK and worldwide, whilst also, playing for their clubs gives them a certain amount of protection and freedom from criticism-rightly or wrongly-that they may well get when playing for England. Look at Owen Hargreaves for one, when he came on as a sub in the last World Cup, many of the England fans booed him, the jeers were long and loud-now everyone is saying he should be a fixture alongside Gerrard, yet, if Hargreaves has a couple of bad games, the knives will be out again, the tolerance levels are far above what they are at club level. Same with Lampard-I laugh myself stupid reading letters on websites and other outlets calling him "over rated", how clueless can these ''correspondents'' be? If I was Lampard, I''d be tempted to do a Scholes/Carragher and quit international football, yet, if he did, those same fans who deride him would be the first to condemn the decision. My own passion for England''s football team has dropped like a stone over the last few years-give me a choice between Norwich winning vs Palace and England beating Israel, and its Norwich for the three points every time, no question. Ditto the end of the season-Norwich promoted or England Euro Champs-don''t be silly, again, Norwich for promotion every time. And I would consider most people to think exactly along those lines. Does that make me a "traitor"-not really,again, like many people, my loyalities lay with friends and family, my home village and my county, Norfolk, before anything on a national scale. Expect that makes me a ''little Norfolker''-well, so be it. What mystifies me about England is how the team defy all logic and refuse, or are incapable, of playing the game that they play, week in, week out, in the Premiership-(ie) fast, pressing, with pace and high energy, but, rather than that, seem to want to change to a slow, waiting game instead. Players seem frightened to make the braver of the two decisions open to them, a lot seem to prefer to pass the ball rather than try for goal, yet more simply cannot do what they do for their clubs in an England shirt, whilst many are given repeated chances to impress for England, long after a club site would have given up on them. It is, as has already been said, about mentality, approach and I have to say, their motivation. The most amusing thing of all is, that after all this huffing and puffing towards qualification, with its myriad bad results, performances, players played out of position and mystical recalls, if England DO qualify for the finals, the players and the same media that has slated them throughout will expect nothing more than victory at the tournament and list all the reasons why, thus reversing all of the reasons they are currently listing us, as to why we never will!

If our Board et al are failing and not offering us, the fans, a successful football team. then we are but one of about 87 other clubs in England whose fans could level the same accusations at their boards. Tottenham could finish 5th in the Prem this season and their fans would consider that as much a failure as some of ours would not winning the Championship this season. Yet fans of Charlton, Watford, Wolves, Sheffield United, Southampton, us...plus a few others, are all expecting the same things this season, if and when they fail to deliver, their boards are seen to have not suceeded, then the calls for swift change and new investment, players, whatever, will swarm all over their messageboards, just as this one in infested thus. Shouldn''t a successful football team be built on a successful business in the first place? Leeds had a great team for a couple of years, but the business behind it was shoddy and falling apart in every conceivable way. We seem to see having a successful team, big name players, and ambition to match as being a "right", so do all of those other teams mentioned. So its a competititve market out there and not so easy, therefore, to just think the club can decide "oh lets be successful" and for things to carry on from there. The Smith haters can rest assured that Delia Smith and Michael Wynn-Jones'' tenure of control at the club is drawing to a close, as it is, and further signs of that will be evident towards the end of this season, no matter what happens between now and then.  

No "Binner" taunts here Arthur. We do look negative at times, its almost as if we are playing a "don''t let them score/what we have, we hold" policy. I''d rather, to use a football cliche, let the opposition worry about us, rather than the other way round. Why be so cautious away from home? Surely when playing away from home, the pressure is on the opposition to dictate the game and come on to us, so why let them do just that, as we did with Preston and Hull? If PG can get the formation and game plan to take the game to the opposition, then, if we settle and get into ot quickly, the other team are going to feel unnerved, their game plan might have to be revised and its going to be their fans getting restless, not us watching 90 minutes of nervy football by a team that frequently looks as if its terrified of losing, rather than looking forward to winning. There are plenty of positives to have come out of the Summer and the first 4 games, but there is still that fear that we can''t perform away from home and that we won''t play the sort of positive game that we could expect, given the quality of players in this squad and what they are capable of. With respect to Hull, we shouldn''t be going there and looking to "grind" out a result, we should be seeing it as a guaranteed point and very very good chance of three. Ditto Preston now-look at how their season has started, that 0-0, which looked decent, seems a bit disappointing now! Watched Southampton vs Stoke on The Championship earlier and whilst its easy for TV to distort things, it looked a cracking game with two teams who weren''t afraid to use pace and to utlise that to attack and create chances. We might have beaten Southampton last Saturday but they look a decent team and they''ll be pulling away from us if they keep what they are doing up and we continue our way of playing-safety first-at the moment, especially away from home.  

Smudger makes himself the prey and we all turn predator...still, rather predator than prey... So he''s versatile and Grant doesn''t know his "best position" -that makes him a bad signing? Look at Essian at Chelsea-plays centre midfield, sweeper, right back, centre back-I suspect Jose knows his best position (centre midfield) just as Grant and Murray know his best position (centre half) but it pays all clubs to have versatile players, common sense and a good indicator also, of how good a player is in that he can play in more than one position. Which begs the question, Smudger, how can a player who can play in more than one position be a worse player than one who can only fit into one? He''s a "free"-so that makes him a bad signing as well? Well, Chelsea again-Steve Sidwell, would you have been against us getting him as he was a free? Real Madrid got Steve McManaman on a free, FFS, if you were a Real fan would you have been posting on their website at the time that you didn''t want Liverpool cast-off''s? Otsemobor was a free, you want to run him out of town as well? Some of the best signings in football history have been free transfers! So we haven''t spent all of our money yet? You, therefore, I assume, on your pay day, spend every penny available and immediately? After all, can''t have the unfortunate Mrs Smudger going at you for not doing so can you, all that money still in the bank, ten days to the next payday, and you haven''t spent it all yet? Wheres your ambition man, wheres that new Lexus on the driveway, that swimming pool in the back garden? Perhaps we should only have bought players that actually cost us money this Summer? Maybe we oughtn''t to have any "in reserve" come January 1st? Maybe we shouldn''t have allocated some to pay off any debts? Maybe you know all about Ian Murray and will be proven right? And maybe not.    

All because we have it (according to your accounting), does that mean we have to spend it? We have until August 31st. And then theres January. And yes, it would be nice if some of the money that we had "floating around" would go towards debts and/or required commitments other than player sales, no lender is going to sit idly buy if we spend evey penny we make on new players.

Well said Hardhouse. I am glad we can all come on here and argue! Its entertaining and worth a read, and, if some people disagree with me and I disagree with others, then hey...what does it really matter, the thing is, its only a football board, and, as much as we can all get in the zone with opinions and counter opinions, its still not to be taken that seriously! Arthur, Smudger, Cluck at al have very strong views, and, with respect to them, I don''t agree or concur with some of them. But at least they have views and are not afraid to post them. So long may it all continue!  

Today has backed up what I have been missing for ages-talk about a road to Damascus moment-Smudger is a Binner, over here, on an eternal wind up, Christ, how I have fallen for it.....respect mate, but I''ve sussed you now and will, from now on, take everything you post with the revelation in mind.....

To be fair, Gerrard has spoken of Liverpool fans needing to be "patient" over the previous few seasons when Benitez was re-building the squad and getting lots of new players in. And they have been, even now, not all of them are saying they''ll win the Prem this season but are looking for improvement, every season, on the last. Which is a must for us. All of our new players are not going to click and become a fantastic footballing machine for a few games, problem is, if we are 10th-12th come October, the knives will be out.

[quote user="Smudger"]Surely the question should be who hasn''t????  [:D][/quote]   I have to say Smudger, funny AND probably true!!!

Sorry if it seems blinkered but its Norwich for me and then...well, thats it! I can''t whip up much interest or support for watching England nowadays, like some others on here that might be because I consider myself a Brancastrian and therefore Norfolk first and then English. Watching England is so predictable these days, same old media hype, players, performances, inquests, bla bla bla....I''ll follow England matches of course, but the result, good or bad, doesn''t affect my mood at all, and, given the choice -and I know lots will agree with me- if it came down to us getting promotion next season or England winning Euro 2008, then promotion for us every time, hell, if it was a choice between us winning at Preston on Saturday or England winning Euro 2008 AND the World Cup in 2010, then give me those three points at Deepdale! As for English clubs in Europe, no. They''re not in it for England, Britain, or the game in general, they''re in it for themselves. I''m not saying thats a bad thing, indeed, thats how it is-the prestige and rewards are theirs, as is the recognition that goes with it. I can''t dislike or even have no interest in Chelsea or Liverpool one week, then be sitting on the edge of my seat hoping that they beat Bayern Munich the next! I''ll watch the games but as a neutral, if they''re good games, great, you can appreciate the play, the players, all aspects of it without the trauma of supporting one or the other teams! I remember last season when the CCC etc started a week ahead of the Prem-on the opening Prem Saturday, when Football Focus came on, the presenter said, without a trace of irony, "...the football season starts today..." That said it all for me really. There is a fear that the top 4 clubs in the Prem will eventually up sticks and join a Euro Superleague if they don''t get things repeatedly their own way, I hope the PL and FA etc call their bluff one day and let them-I think they need the game in this country more than the game needs them, and a revamped Prem minus Liverpool, Arsenal, Chelsea and Man Utd might generate a whole lot more general interest and excitement than it does at the moment.

[quote user="Arthur Whittle"][quote user="Rudolph Hucker"] To begin with I will declare that I like Delia Smith. I have met her on occasions and despite her success she is as ordinary as the majority of us. She has been a supporter of Norwich City long before she and her husband took up controlling influence and if she has a fault it appears to be to let her heart rule her head on occasions. Delia has kept her head down for a long time now. We have more up front executive members at the Club and a manager who isn''t exactly a shrinking violet. So why oh why do the cowards and bullies on this board continue to insult and abuse this woman as if she were deliberately setting out to inflame them? She cannot help not being a mega-rich foreign investor with a dubious background and with what she is good at she has used to increase non-football earnings at the Club. Delia Smith is not a saint nor is she a sinner. She is criticised for her celebrity (although she does have a talent) and vilified for not being some sort of financial demi-god. Get over it and concentrate on the football will you. Or are some of you so sad and lacking you need to have a ''red top'' style go at someone well known in order to boost your own self esteem. [/quote] Complete drivel. This is a forum son for people to express there feelings. If you dont like it go to suffolk. [/quote] Arthur, though it may already have been said in the thread, surely Rudolf Hucker IS expressing his feelings? As you do. Which is what the site is all about. Are anti-Delia posts acceptable and there to be posted and made public but pro ones only worthy of a "complete drivel" comment?  

Poor old Delia-damned if she does, damned if she doesn''t and damned probably for the bridge collapse in the States and the latest foot and mouth outbreak-lets hope she doesn''t decide to clear off, as so many people have suggested, and calls in all  the £££ owing to her!

Think Granty will be focused on not conceding, and, with our new strikeforce still settling in, reckon this ones a 0-0 draw-and would be happy with that. But, as ob1 says, the performance aspect is crucial. I remember when we went up in 81-82, we lost the first game of the season to someone like Rotherham (people with better memories can expand on this, hopefully!) 4-0 and it should all have been doom and gloom, yet the Rotherham manager said, if we played as well all season, we''d go up-and we did. Similar to the play off season, lost 4-0 at Millwall and everyone was writing us off, it was so woeful (it was, anyone remember?) but we got to Cardiff. 10-12 games in, thats when things start to settle down and the "look" of the season is generally out there-though there are still exceptions, Sunderland last season being one.

Ta ta. Too little effort, too many agents it seems. Russell may not be as technically gifted a player but he won''t be injured as much, nor "go missing" in as many games, certainly won''t be on as high a wage and wants to play for us. No loss. But a pity.  

On the contrary Cluck, there are a fair few people I''d like to see depart Carrow Road still, but ND is most certainly not one of them. There aren''t many CE''s that make themselves as open and approachable as he does-not only in the Q & A sessions but also in replying to personal E Mails and inviting supporters to ring him if they want to discuss matters further. And, of course, for doing all of this, for increasing his profile, he gets more exposure and therefore more stick-perhaps, at times, he wishes he just hid in his office and kept thoroughly behind the scenes, not getting involved at all and just picked up his salary. Don''t you think some of us might actually be aware and realise that the club issues its fair share of smoke and spin? Of course it does, that sort of thing starts at Government level and works its way downwards as far as you''d like, it is prevalent anywhere and everywhere, hell, if and when couples lie or bend the truth with each other, thats smoke and spin as well-so you''d expect it at our level! You could further argue that Brown is little more than a smokscreen for the embarassing state of the country-so should he get the boot? Some of us hear the spin but choose to decide if it is or it isn''t and when to agree or not to agree with it, but you just have to accept its part of the game and will always be there, the club could implement your Utopian vision tomorrow -whatever that is-but there would still smoke and spin and there would still be people complaining about things, people, the way things are done. "...contrived spin and bullshit..." ? Whether or not it comes from ND is, of course, open to peoples own viewpoint, mine includes thinking that you are quite a master of it yourself, which brings to mind the saying involving the pot and the kettle!

You can always trust Cluck to drag the positive vibe of the thread down! And, as the new players and the new team will probably need time to "gel" this season, there will be criticism after 10-12 games if we''re mid-table, which I suspect we will be. Still, after Keane took over at Sunderland last season, they were fairly mediocre for a while, then, as his new players settled they went, over the season, from bottom to top. Think we''ll improve as the season goes on, certainly don''t think we''ll be top after 5-10 games, but, come Easter we should be there and ready for a good push for top 6, preferably already there and looking set to stay. Though people will say a play off place is "failure" I''m sure of it!

I think theres been a fair bit of action to be fair-Marshall, Gilks, Otsembor, Brellier, Cureton and big Dave in permanently, Smith on loan-so thats six signings plus a loan, a tad busier than we were last season when all we got were "we''re making calls". But agree that it would be good to see a central defender come in, suspect there are names in the hat and calls have gone out, but, as Geeza said, we''re in Holland at the moment, so things won''t have been happening much whilst all that has been going on. Darren Kenton would be a good signing IMHO as a central defender (his best position) and, with talk of Daryl Russell being another player we''ve supposedly made an enquiry about, I''d welcome both those old Canaries back again. Would think someone else will come in within next week-10 days with perhaps another loan player before the end of the deadline.

Chhers Mr Carrow-I thought we were covered by our "mortgage" loan but suspected that, as our expenses still seem to esceed our income, they may have been other or increased debts to take into account. I guess if NCFC had a Virgin Plus account they could pay off their regular monthly payment-"plus a little bit more" and lessen the debt and the time it needs to be paid! Its boring, I know, wanting the club to focus on reducing debt and to manage that £15 Million but essential that no-one loses awareness that we still have that (relative) millstone. The Turner''s have announced that they want to look into that sort of thing and I find that reassuring, particularly if, as seems certain, they also want to develop and push the football side more alongside it.

Don''t you think that some of this "pot" might have gone onto paying off some debt? Or aren''t we bothering to do that with any profits that we make from player sales, or whatever? I think maybe a few people who we owe money to might be a little aggreived if we had this £7 million and then spent it all without giving them some! I presume everyone on here, when they get their monthly salaries spends it all on holidays, fast cars, wine, women and song? Never mind the mortgage or rent, bills, council tax etc? The clubs the same-it does have other things to worry about that cost money, not just buying players!    

Shyster, you''ve saved me starting a thread on the very same subject! EVERY season it seems we go into with players struggling-they always seem to be "little knocks" or "niggles" but in may cases, they seem to keep players out for an eternity, I wonder how many first teamers are going to be missing come Preston?? At the moment it seems we''ll go into that game minus Smith, Huckerby & Brellier at the very least-how encouraging is that? PG has gone on about how tough the training is and how the standards of fitness are expected to be high-surely there comes a time when a player is so fit, so finely tuned that, like a high performance car, the slightest little irritation can cause no end of problems. You think back to the season when Liverpool played 55-60 games in total with 14, 15 players, that was a time when the players weren''t so obsessed with being athletes and more concerned with being footballers. The concept in the game today that the players should be athletes first and footballers second does, I think, have a lot to do with the numerous injuries that abound nowadays, and expecially with us where such a high demand is made -and shouted from the rooftops- of physical fitness and "hard work".

Yes, good idea-why not a statue? Admittedly, its a bit of a football fashion now, but it is a good indicator of a clubs character and way too recognise a player who has contributed greatness to that club. Would be a good focal/meeting point as well, how easy and unique to say "I''ll meet you by Keelan''s statue at 2"? This club has rightly honoured a great ''off the field'' man in Sir Geoffrey, now what about doing the same for KK? Is it true that he offered to do a little bit of work with Robert Green on a "freelance" basis but Worthingon wouldn''t have anything to do with it or him?