More Unhappy away fans over ticket allocation

[morty 0]

If you have about 20 minutes of life to waste click on the link the OP posted.Its on the 7th page now and showing no sign of slowing!

[canary cherub 1]

[quote user="Rupethebear"]It''s the job of our ticket office to maximise the amout of bums on seats that generates our revenue. Clearly if a club doesn''t want their allocation then we can sell these to City fans but once they have ''handed them back'' they are ours to sell. I would say, as it was the biggest crowd of the season it was job done and probably the biggest ever ''City'' turnout in recent years!! I would end by saying I do feel sorry for any HUFC fans that failed to get in.[/quote]

That''s fine, provided the visiting club knows that our official away allocation of 2,000 doesn''t often apply in practice, so their fans might not get in without a ticket.  Clearly it''s then up to the visiting club to tell their fans. 

I''m not suggesting that we leave seats empty ''just in case'' - simply that as a new club in this league, with an unusual way of accommodating away fans (an expandable away section), we take the trouble to make it crystal clear to other clubs what the situation is so that their fans don''t travel hundreds of miles for nothing.

If you''re suggesting we keep it quiet so that more City fans can get it, I don''t agree.  The bigger the away following the better the atmosphere - yesterday may have been the biggest ever City turnout in recent years but it certainly wasn''t the loudest.

 

[Rupethebear 0]

We never had these problems in the Premier League as clubs know about the allocations and the fans don''t expect to turn up and get it without a ticket!

[canary cherub 1]

[quote user="Rupethebear"]We never had these problems in the Premier League as clubs know about the allocations and the fans don''t expect to turn up and get it without a ticket![/quote]

lol

different culture innit?

paying on the day seems to be the norm in this league

 

[Salford 0]

Our club is a different culture! I don''t know about you but I don''t plan to be hanging around in this league for too long. If away teams are unprofessional enough to assume away fans can get in then it is their own f**k up. I don''t think we are alone in having an "expandable" away section. In fact, every club is obliged to offer a percentage of the stadiums capacity to away fans.

[canary cherub 1]

[quote user="jammis"]

This is ridiculous. We offer the opposing club upto 2,000 tickets, it is then up to the club, be it Hartlepool, Brentford, Colchester or Southampton to decide how many of those 2,000 tickets they want.

It is then that clubs responsibility to advertise the tickets, sell the tickets and give any information about the tickets to their fans.

Hartlepool should have been the ''someone'' telling their fans what the deal was not us.

[/quote]

The match was effectively all-ticket.  Did Hartlepool know that?  If they didn''t, the number of tickets they ordered was based on the assumption that some of their fans would pay on the day.  Had they known what the situation was, they might have ordered more.

None of us knows whether Hartlepool were fully in the picture.  If they were, it was up to them to tell their fans well in advance.  But this has happened to several clubs now.  Without blaming anyone, if I were an administrator at Carrow Road, following this incident I would make it my job to ensure that every club in this league knows exactly what''s what, even if it means that in some cases I''m just telling them what they already know.

 

[yellow blood 0]

Hartlepool''s fault really...

 

http://www.hartlepoolunited.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10326~1943396,00.html

 

If you read this, you would think you could pay on the day.

[Suffolk exile 0]

You could pay on the day. But only a limited number available. As far as I''m concerned this link shows HUFC and NCFC have between them handled this badly - this link shows communication with away fans and clubs should be improved to prevent this. I''m with CC, fans travelling 12 wasted hours is not acceptable (however I believe it was Hartlepool fans who travelled to Charlton only to find out the game had been called off two days previously).

[canary cherub 1]

[quote user="yellow blood"]

Hartlepool''s fault really...

 

http://www.hartlepoolunited.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10326~1943396,00.html

 

If you read this, you would think you could pay on the day.

[/quote]

It depends on what Norwich told Hartlepool though doesn''t it?  Did we spell it out that the rest of the away allocation would be sold to home fans? 

But regardless of whose fault it was, it''s Norwich''s responsibility to make sure it doesn''t happen again.

 

[ncfcstar 292]

I honestly can''t believe the fuss they have kicked up on their message board.I understand that League One and Two football is an entirely different animal to what we have been used to for good knows how long, probably since the move to all-seater stadia if we''re honest.  The problem is, there is no rule that states if you get relegated you have to bow down to the demands of fans from established League One and Two clubs and create an ''away end'' which always has tickets available.Yes it is a different culture down here, but the fans of opposing clubs should do a bit of research on us as well.  We are well known, or should be well known, for selling out our stadium week in, week out.  We have been doing that for the last 4-5 years, maybe longer in fact.  Consequently if we have the option of selling unused away tickets, then why not sell them to get a bum on a seat?Since the Jarrold has been built, in both the Champ and Prem we have not had issue with away fans turning up looking for tickets and being turned away, or at least it hasn''t been publicised.  There have been numerous matches where away tickets have either not been taken, or returned to the club in order for us to sell them to our own fans.  I can''t think of too many matches where the away section has been completely taken over.Clubs in the Prem and Champ all operate policies of changing the size of the away section, as do clubs in this league, Colchester of course spring to mind.  The blame can only be apportioned at Hartlepool in my opinion, and they should have made it abundantly clear to their fans that they had only taken the option of one block of the Jarrold.  At the end of the day, we offered them up to the maximum away capacity, and they knew they would never sell that amount of tickets, and they sensibly took the option they believed would be sold.  They should have then made it clear to fans of Hartlepool that they had taken the option of 450 tickets or whatever it is, and that LIMITED amounts of tickets which had remained unsold would be available on the day.  It is not down to NCFC to advertise that on our own website, the Hartlepool ticket office made the decision to only take a certain amount of tickets and they should have made it clear to their own fans.Because we can offer up to 2000 away tickets, does it mean that we have to leave it open for away fans until 3pm on a Saturday?  No of course it doesn''t, it would lose us vital revenue throughout the season, it would leave huge areas of the Jarrold completely empty, it would spoil the atmosphere, and it just wouldn''t make sense.  Yes if we had a 10,000 stadium, with a dedicated away end, then we would have no choice but to adopt a policy which fans seem to think should be the law in this league, but we don''t, we have a 26,000 stadium with a changeable away section, which could be filled by 26,000 Norwich fans quite easily.  Why change a policy that has existed quite comfortably since the Jarrold was built to accommodate a few fans who don''t realise that Carrow Road is not bloody Brisbane Road (etc etc.).By the way, I feel sorry for the fans who travelled and didn''t get in, but how they can apportion any blame at the door of NCFC is beyond me, Hartlepool got the tickets they asked for, and it should have been down to them to let their own fans know the situation.

[canary cherub 1]

[quote user="ncfcstar"]I honestly can''t believe the fuss they have kicked up on their message board.

I understand that League One and Two football is an entirely different animal to what we have been used to for good knows how long, probably since the move to all-seater stadia if we''re honest.  The problem is, there is no rule that states if you get relegated you have to bow down to the demands of fans from established League One and Two clubs and create an ''away end'' which always has tickets available.

By the way, I feel sorry for the fans who travelled and didn''t get in, but how they can apportion any blame at the door of NCFC is beyond me, Hartlepool got the tickets they asked for, and it should have been down to them to let their own fans know the situation.
[/quote]

As posted above, it''s not a case of turning CR into a stadium where away fans can pay on the day.  It''s a case of letting them know that if they turn up without a ticket they may not get in. 

It''s a simple communication problem.  Norwich have to spell it out to other clubs that we will sell the rest of the away allocation to home fans.  It is then up to the visiting club to a) tell their fans not to travel without a ticket and expect to get in, and b) order enough tickets to satisfy demand.  

It''s not the first time something like this has happened, so without blaming anyone there''s clearly a communication issue and Norwich need to make the situation clearer to stop it happening again.

I don''t agree that it''s up to the away fans to do research on CR, but even if they did they''d be none the wiser since there''s nothing on the NCFC website or anywhere else afaik about selling surplus away tickets to home fans.

 

[Jim Smith 2,317]

I agree with Canary Cherub on this one. There is a different culture for some of the smaller clubs in this division of turning up and payiong on the gate and whilst i think their clubs also have a responsibility to be advertising the point clearly we at least also need to be stressing more clearly to these clubs that they need to be telling their fans that they won''t be getting more than the amount initially agreed and if they leave it until the day there is a risk they won''t get in. The fact this has now happened for two games on the trot suggests there is a communications breakdown somewhere along the line. I would suggest that if hartlepool''s allocation was only 450 then both clubs should really have made the game all ticket and have no admission on the gate. I would have bought my ticket in advance so would not have happened to me but frankly i would be p**sed off if I travelled from hartlepool to Norwich thinking there was no issue with tickets and didn''t get in!

[Arthur Whittle 0]

Whatever happened to pay on the day??? There were only some games made all ticket, the others were pay on the day, and nobody was dissapointed.

Those of you who cant remember, the away section used to be split into2 sections. The 1st section, was where E block barclay is now, the 2nd section, was left empty, and opened on demand. Nobody ever had a problem with this, be it NCFC fans or opposition.

[Arthur Whittle 0]

The second section was where that eyesore hotel is now.

[Jim Smith 2,317]

[quote user="Arthur Whittle"]Whatever happened to pay on the day??? There were only some games made all ticket, the others were pay on the day, and nobody was dissapointed. Those of you who cant remember, the away section used to be split into2 sections. The 1st section, was where E block barclay is now, the 2nd section, was left empty, and opened on demand. Nobody ever had a problem with this, be it NCFC fans or opposition.[/quote]

 

Yes but the difference was we probably only sold the ground out once a season back in those days, if at all! I agree in an ideal world you would be able to pay on teh day and if we had an extra 5,000 seats I suspect you would still be able to but for the rest of this season its pretty clear that virtually every game is going to sell out for home fans so its just not practical.

[Arthur Whittle 0]

Well we did used to sell out for Chelsea, Spurs, Arsenal, Everton, Liverpool, and sometimes Southampton and QPR.

[morty 0]

We have shot ourselves in the foot with that hotel, with a decent corner infill we could have added a few thousand seats.Our only other, and much more expensive, alternative is to double tier the City stand which we really can''t afford, and I don''t think we''d fill enough right now to make it cost effective anyway.So we''re kinda stuck in the middle right now, if we get to the Champ theres going to be a lot of city fans disappointed as away clubs take much bigger allocations. 

[Shaun Tilly Lace 0]

Well two friends of mine - who are Hartlepool fans - had no trouble buying a pair of tickets. They queued for about 15 minutes at the away ticket sales windows at about 1.10 pm and walked away with two tickets. There were not many queueing at that time; the only reason they had to wait in line was that the sales staff could not find the tickets initially. I guess the disappointed Pools fans turned up a bit later.

[Canary Man of Kent 0]

http://www.hartlepoolunited.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10326~1951436,00.html

I must say, having read this I''m a bit disappointed in the conduct of NCFC, assuming that it''s all accurate.

[Canary_on_the Trent 0]

Not City''s fault in anyway.

If Hartlepool wanted more tickets they could have had more tickets but they didn''t ask for anymore and should have expected us to sell those they had not asked for.

I have never travelled to an away game without a ticket other than those games that are pay on the gate only and even in that case would think twice if the ground sold out every week.

 

[Essex_Canary 6]

[quote user="morty"]We have shot ourselves in the foot with that hotel, with a decent corner infill we could have added a few thousand seats.

Our only other, and much more expensive, alternative is to double tier the City stand which we really can''t afford, and I don''t think we''d fill enough right now to make it cost effective anyway.

So we''re kinda stuck in the middle right now, if we get to the Champ theres going to be a lot of city fans disappointed as away clubs take much bigger allocations.

 
[/quote]

 

The estimated cost per seat for new build stands is around £1000 per seat according to industry experts like Simon Inglis, a figure that is born out by the £8.5m for the 8,000 capacity Jarrold Stand. The corner infil between South Stand and the River End cost around £3.5m for 2,500 seats because obviously you can''t fit as many seats into a corner for the infrustructure costs compared to a straight stand.

With this in mind it would have cost around the same to match up at the Barclay End, whereas adding an additional 5,000 seats to the top of the city stand would probably work out at less that the £1k per seat cos half the structure already exists. So working on the basis that 5,000 seats at £4.5m or 2,500 seats at £3.5m the city stand is probably the best bet, especially given that the Hotel for no cost earns the club at least £200k per year from the joint venture, whilst helping to attract conference bookings within the stadium.

In an ideal world it would be nice to have a symetrical stadium where everything matched, but given we can''t afford that I''ll take the most amount of seats for the least amount of cash and a way of making money on not match days.

[batesout MOT 0]

[quote user="Essex_Canary"]

The estimated cost per seat for new build stands is around £1000 per seat according to industry experts like Simon Inglis, a figure that is born out by the £8.5m for the 8,000 capacity Jarrold Stand. The corner infil between South Stand and the River End cost around £3.5m for 2,500 seats because obviously you can''t fit as many seats into a corner for the infrustructure costs compared to a straight stand.

With this in mind it would have cost around the same to match up at the Barclay End, whereas adding an additional 5,000 seats to the top of the city stand would probably work out at less that the £1k per seat cos half the structure already exists. So working on the basis that 5,000 seats at £4.5m or 2,500 seats at £3.5m the city stand is probably the best bet, especially given that the Hotel for no cost earns the club at least £200k per year from the joint venture, whilst helping to attract conference bookings within the stadium.

In an ideal world it would be nice to have a symetrical stadium where everything matched, but given we can''t afford that I''ll take the most amount of seats for the least amount of cash and a way of making money on not match days.

[/quote]

Agreed. Corners always cost more per seat.

In terms of profitability, if the club is selling out every game, surely an increase in ticket price would maximise revenue.

[Suffolk exile 0]

Considering we have had issues before why did the ticket office not make it 100% crystal clear that this was their full and only allocation? Surely it is common practice to at least send a confirmation email after discussing these type of negotiations to ensure everything is understood? This can''t be the case or Hartlepool would not have put that article on their website. At best this is a case of poor communication by NCFC ticket office. At worst a total disregard for away fans to ensure maximum revenue from them.

[Tangible Fixed Assets anyone? 0]

[quote user="morty"]We have shot ourselves in the foot with that hotel, with a decent corner infill we could have added a few thousand seats.

 
[/quote]

1)Where do you think the money would have come from to build another corner stand?

2) If we had built another corner stand, how many seats do you think the plod would have allowed to be used?  I guess not many as there would have to be a gap between the home and away fans.

Answer - probably uneconomic to build a corner stand.

[Tangible Fixed Assets anyone? 0]

[quote user="SimonOTBC"]

http://www.hartlepoolunited.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10326~1951436,00.html

I must say, having read this I''m a bit disappointed in the conduct of NCFC, assuming that it''s all accurate.

[/quote]

IF that is accurate then given that there were empty seats within the ground and Hartlepool fans are hardly a riotus bunch then some effort should have been made to get them seated somewhere. Poor show. 

 

[Tangible Fixed Assets anyone? 0]

[quote user="morty"]We have shot ourselves in the foot with that hotel, with a decent corner infill we could have added a few thousand seats.

[/quote]

I think the Community stand holds about 1500M and as  I posted earlier I dont think Plod would have allowed 1500 in a Braclay - Jarrold stand corner to have been used.

[Suffolk exile 0]

Fans arguing for more money spent on infrastructure rather than the team. Didn''t think I''d hear that considering the Chase era isn''t exactly a million years ago.

[Tangible Fixed Assets anyone? 0]

[quote user="Suffolk exile"]Fans arguing for more money spent on infrastructure rather than the team. Didn''t think I''d hear that considering the Chase era isn''t exactly a million years ago.[/quote]

I''m not arguing for more money to be spent on infrastructure. You must be joking!

[ca 1]

Surely their website should have told their fans how many tickets were available, they knew how many they had sold from the 500 they requested over a month before the game.

[morty 0]

[quote user="cityangel"]Surely their website should have told their fans how many tickets were available, they knew how many they had sold from the 500 they requested over a month before the game.[/quote]Or if you plan on traveling hundreds of miles somewhere buy a ticket before you go.Its really not rocket science lol.