Delia and Micheal

[GMF 757]

[quote user="Mr.Carrow"]Why would the club put out a "hopelessly misleading" statement?  They didn`t have to say "In the case of someone seeking to take control of the club and at the same time invest £20m in the playing squad this would take a minimum of £56m" did they?  Is it the actions of a club openly seeking investment or stonewalling?[/quote]

I''ve given you my reasoning as to why, in my opinion, it''s hopelessly misleading, Mr C. You either agree it''s misleading, or you don''t? Are you seriously telling me that you believe the statement and the Club is worth a minimum of £56M and that you believe everything the Club puts out in an offical statement to be true? I can tell you, I certainly don''t!

Delia''s comments at the AGM, said that they had no offer for the Club, which, by implication, means an offer to purchase their shares, which is, of course, what many fans want. However, whilst the comments may be strictly true (if there was no offer for their shares) as PC''s subsequent comments confirmed, he wanted to buy new shares to inject new cash into the Club.

As I said at the time, I was indifferent to D&M selling up, not because I support their tenure, but an outright purchase of their shares wouldn''t be of any financial benefit to the Club. I also argued, for that very reason, that I''d rather PC purchased new shares, but recognised that the Authorised Share capital was insufficent for a £20M injection of new cash.

Am I happy they couldn''t work anything out? Of course not.

Do I think they were "stonewalling?" No.

Do I think the the likes of PC or D&M negotiate matters through the media? Don''t be so naive, of course they don''t! 

[Mr.Carrow 380]

[quote user="gazzathegreat"]Hi Mr Carrow, well what fond memories of your fanzine I have. I remember buying it on the bridge and reading it during the duller games. It was always full of amusing articles and I can confirm for Nutty, there was plenty of anti Chase material in there. Wish I''d kept them. As I remember (being pre internet) fanzines were the only alternative to the matchday programme. Especially enjoyed the away day travelogs!! By the way Mr Carrow were you also involved with "I can drive a tractor" or were they your bitter rivals?[/quote]

Thanks alot gazza, that`s good to know- you could well have bought the `zine off me as i was often stationed on the bridge.  Some of it seems a bit childish looking back, but it was good fun at the time and we regularly sold over 1000 out of crowds of about 14,000 so it couldn`t have been that bad.  We had a couple of good contributers whose humour tended towards surreal which made it for me, and we`re all still mates along with the Spud International and some of the Citizen boys.  Can`t really remember who did "I can drive a tractor"- i`ll ask about.  We didn`t get on very well with "Liverpool are on the telly again" i remember.....

I have to say most people have given up their s.tickets and are totally disillusioned, people with real passion seem totally outnumbered by the "Nice little Norwich, it`s the taking part that counts, what a lovely little club we have-shame about the team, we`re lucky to have a club, isn`t Delia and her restuarants wonderful?" brigade.  I was in the Jarrold for the must-win game against QPR last season and the people around me seemed to think i`d escaped from a loony asylum for roaring on the team in an absolutely vital game.....[:S]  I`m really not sure these people "get it".

[gazzathegreat 0]

Mr Carrow - re the South Stand. I went in there for one match last season to take someone who had never been to a game at City before and I couldn''t get two tickets together anywhere in the Barclay.

I made the first mistake of the afternoon by standing up when the players came out and then by singing OTBC! Well, I was gazed at with surprise and wonder. I joined in with whatever the Barclay was singing and was just openly stared at. A guy in front of me was reading a book, totally oblivious to the game and several were listening to R Norfolk on headphones. Why? You are there at the game? Er....

Strange isn''t it. Apparently some sections of the stand do have people who sing and want to sing, but not where I was that afternoon.

I bought all the fanzines at the time and although a lot of the content was a bit risque perhaps the sense of humour in similar desperate times was fantastic. I miss them.

[Mr.Carrow 380]

[quote user="GazzaTCC"]

[quote user="Mr.Carrow"]Why would the club put out a "hopelessly misleading" statement?  They didn`t have to say "In the case of someone seeking to take control of the club and at the same time invest £20m in the playing squad this would take a minimum of £56m" did they?  Is it the actions of a club openly seeking investment or stonewalling?[/quote]

I''ve given you my reasoning as to why, in my opinion, it''s hopelessly misleading, Mr C. You either agree it''s misleading, or you don''t? Are you seriously telling me that you believe the statement and the Club is worth a minimum of £56M and that you believe everything the Club puts out in an offical statement to be true? I can tell you, I certainly don''t!

Delia''s comments at the AGM, said that they had no offer for the Club, which, by implication, means an offer to purchase their shares, which is, of course, what many fans want. However, whilst the comments may be strictly true (if there was no offer for their shares) as PC''s subsequent comments confirmed, he wanted to buy new shares to inject new cash into the Club.

As I said at the time, I was indifferent to D&M selling up, not because I support their tenure, but an outright purchase of their shares wouldn''t be of any financial benefit to the Club. I also argued, for that very reason, that I''d rather PC purchased new shares, but recognised that the Authorised Share capital was insufficent for a £20M injection of new cash.

Am I happy they couldn''t work anything out? Of course not.

Do I think they were "stonewalling?" No.

Do I think the the likes of PC or D&M negotiate matters through the media? Don''t be so naive, of course they don''t! 

[/quote]

Gazza, i think you`re misunderstanding me.  Of course i think the statement is misleading but what i`m after is why you think they made it?  Why not a statement talking about open-minded discussions and a positive statement about how exciting it is to try and get Cullum on board?  As it happened Cullum came out in the press asking "Why won`t they talk to me?" a week or so after the statement was made, so do you think he was lying?  If not then why a misleading statement followed by no discussions or contact?  It was defensive stonewalling.

[ca 1]

[quote user="gazzathegreat"] several were listening to R Norfolk on headphones. Why? You are there at the game? Er.... Strange isn''t it. .[/quote]

Maybe they have Radio 5 on to hear all the other results coming through Gazza.

[corbs 0]

''Nice little Norwich, it`s the taking part that counts, what a lovely little club we have-shame about the team, we`re lucky to have a club, isn`t Delia and her restuarants wonderful?" brigade'' writes Mr Carrow. Everyone is entitled to his or her opinion. Personally I am totally tired of the '' we have to be in the premiership, such big crowds, just too nice, were so special cos we once beat B.Munich, she should take her pots and pans, infact anyone who doesn''t want her and MWJ hung from the nearest Lamp-post is an apologist'' brigade.

Well done HISTON!

Third Division South and lets not forget it!

   

[Jonncfc 28]

[quote user="corbs"]

''Nice little Norwich, it`s the taking part that counts, what a lovely little club we have-shame about the team, we`re lucky to have a club, isn`t Delia and her restuarants wonderful?" brigade'' writes Mr Carrow. Everyone is entitled to his or her opinion. Personally I am totally tired of the '' we have to be in the premiership, such big crowds, just too nice, were so special cos we once beat B.Munich, she should take her pots and pans, infact anyone who doesn''t want her and MWJ hung from the nearest Lamp-post is an apologist'' brigade.

Well done HISTON!

Third Division South and lets not forget it!

   

[/quote]

Just as well you think that because the 3rd division is exactly where we''re going to be next season!

[Mr.Carrow 380]

[quote user="corbs"]

''Nice little Norwich, it`s the taking part that counts, what a lovely little club we have-shame about the team, we`re lucky to have a club, isn`t Delia and her restuarants wonderful?" brigade'' writes Mr Carrow. Everyone is entitled to his or her opinion. Personally I am totally tired of the '' we have to be in the premiership, such big crowds, just too nice, were so special cos we once beat B.Munich, she should take her pots and pans, infact anyone who doesn''t want her and MWJ hung from the nearest Lamp-post is an apologist'' brigade.

Well done HISTON!

Third Division South and lets not forget it!

   

[/quote]

This message board is generally used by supporters rather than nuetral spectators corbs.  Maybe you`d feel more comfortable on the official site- they`ve just put up the pie fillings for the next home game apparently: turkey and stuffing!!  Mmmm!  Now that`s something to get excited about hey corbs?!  Enjoy- but be warned they can be a little hot for people with delicate dispositions.

[GMF 757]

[quote user="Mr.Carrow"][quote user="GazzaTCC"]

[quote user="Mr.Carrow"]Why would the club put out a "hopelessly misleading" statement?  They didn`t have to say "In the case of someone seeking to take control of the club and at the same time invest £20m in the playing squad this would take a minimum of £56m" did they?  Is it the actions of a club openly seeking investment or stonewalling?[/quote]

I''ve given you my reasoning as to why, in my opinion, it''s hopelessly misleading, Mr C. You either agree it''s misleading, or you don''t? Are you seriously telling me that you believe the statement and the Club is worth a minimum of £56M and that you believe everything the Club puts out in an offical statement to be true? I can tell you, I certainly don''t!

Delia''s comments at the AGM, said that they had no offer for the Club, which, by implication, means an offer to purchase their shares, which is, of course, what many fans want. However, whilst the comments may be strictly true (if there was no offer for their shares) as PC''s subsequent comments confirmed, he wanted to buy new shares to inject new cash into the Club.

As I said at the time, I was indifferent to D&M selling up, not because I support their tenure, but an outright purchase of their shares wouldn''t be of any financial benefit to the Club. I also argued, for that very reason, that I''d rather PC purchased new shares, but recognised that the Authorised Share capital was insufficent for a £20M injection of new cash.

Am I happy they couldn''t work anything out? Of course not.

Do I think they were "stonewalling?" No.

Do I think the the likes of PC or D&M negotiate matters through the media? Don''t be so naive, of course they don''t! 

[/quote]

Gazza, i think you`re misunderstanding me.  Of course i think the statement is misleading but what i`m after is why you think they made it?  Why not a statement talking about open-minded discussions and a positive statement about how exciting it is to try and get Cullum on board?  As it happened Cullum came out in the press asking "Why won`t they talk to me?" a week or so after the statement was made, so do you think he was lying?  If not then why a misleading statement followed by no discussions or contact?  It was defensive stonewalling.

[/quote]

I can''t second guess what they were thinking, Mr C, so I''m not going to comment further on it.

I''ve said I didn''t believe it and I''ve also said that I don''t think either of the parties were actually trying to negotiate via the media, it''s just not the way these things are done and it smacks of desperation on both sides. I''ve placed it in that context and I''m prepared to "let it go." However, it would seem that you''re not prepared to let it go and want to use it as a stick to "beat up" the Board at every opportunity.

PC is just as "guilty" of using the media card as the Club are and I''d much rather someone "cracked their heads together" and we got something sorted that was in the best interests of the Club.

A majority shareholding of 61% causes problems under the Corporate law of this Country irrespective of who the owner is and that is the fundemental problem we face. If you want to call it "stonewalling" so be.

[Barclay_Boy 0]

[quote user="gazzathegreat"]Hi Mr Carrow, well what fond memories of your fanzine I have. I remember buying it on the bridge and reading it during the duller games. It was always full of amusing articles and I can confirm for Nutty, there was plenty of anti Chase material in there. Wish I''d kept them. As I remember (being pre internet) fanzines were the only alternative to the matchday programme. Especially enjoyed the away day travelogs!! By the way Mr Carrow were you also involved with "I can drive a tractor" or were they your bitter rivals?[/quote]

ditto here Mr C, although there were several fanzines about at the time Ferry Cross The Wensum was by far the best amd they were not exactly pro Mr Chase as I recall! The trouble with Chase was that he rode his luck very hard, and when the conveyor belt of new talent ran out, then so did his luck.

[gazzathegreat 0]

Could be I suppose CA, but in the first half? Or is it to block out the singing from the away fans?

[Mister Chops 7]

[quote user="gazzathegreat"]Could be I suppose CA, but in the first half? Or is it to block out the singing from the away fans?[/quote]Lots of people around me listen to Radio Norfolk too... In these fast-changing times, I suppose it''s so they know which player passed/didn''t pass it to which player and which player fell over/conceded a foul/is the scapegoat of the day.

[gazzathegreat 0]

Careful Chops, you are getting dangerously close to those sheep comparisons.....I have to admit it takes a bit of concentration sometimes to tell who''s on the pitch, but surely that''s half the fun......

[Mr.Carrow 380]

[quote user="GazzaTCC"][quote user="Mr.Carrow"][quote user="GazzaTCC"]

[quote user="Mr.Carrow"]Why would the club put out a "hopelessly misleading" statement?  They didn`t have to say "In the case of someone seeking to take control of the club and at the same time invest £20m in the playing squad this would take a minimum of £56m" did they?  Is it the actions of a club openly seeking investment or stonewalling?[/quote]

I''ve given you my reasoning as to why, in my opinion, it''s hopelessly misleading, Mr C. You either agree it''s misleading, or you don''t? Are you seriously telling me that you believe the statement and the Club is worth a minimum of £56M and that you believe everything the Club puts out in an offical statement to be true? I can tell you, I certainly don''t!

Delia''s comments at the AGM, said that they had no offer for the Club, which, by implication, means an offer to purchase their shares, which is, of course, what many fans want. However, whilst the comments may be strictly true (if there was no offer for their shares) as PC''s subsequent comments confirmed, he wanted to buy new shares to inject new cash into the Club.

As I said at the time, I was indifferent to D&M selling up, not because I support their tenure, but an outright purchase of their shares wouldn''t be of any financial benefit to the Club. I also argued, for that very reason, that I''d rather PC purchased new shares, but recognised that the Authorised Share capital was insufficent for a £20M injection of new cash.

Am I happy they couldn''t work anything out? Of course not.

Do I think they were "stonewalling?" No.

Do I think the the likes of PC or D&M negotiate matters through the media? Don''t be so naive, of course they don''t! 

[/quote]

Gazza, i think you`re misunderstanding me.  Of course i think the statement is misleading but what i`m after is why you think they made it?  Why not a statement talking about open-minded discussions and a positive statement about how exciting it is to try and get Cullum on board?  As it happened Cullum came out in the press asking "Why won`t they talk to me?" a week or so after the statement was made, so do you think he was lying?  If not then why a misleading statement followed by no discussions or contact?  It was defensive stonewalling.

[/quote]

I can''t second guess what they were thinking, Mr C, so I''m not going to comment further on it.

I''ve said I didn''t believe it and I''ve also said that I don''t think either of the parties were actually trying to negotiate via the media, it''s just not the way these things are done and it smacks of desperation on both sides. I''ve placed it in that context and I''m prepared to "let it go." However, it would seem that you''re not prepared to let it go and want to use it as a stick to "beat up" the Board at every opportunity.

PC is just as "guilty" of using the media card as the Club are and I''d much rather someone "cracked their heads together" and we got something sorted that was in the best interests of the Club.

A majority shareholding of 61% causes problems under the Corporate law of this Country irrespective of who the owner is and that is the fundemental problem we face. If you want to call it "stonewalling" so be.

[/quote]

Gazza, a good friend of mine was rounded upon at last years AGM for having the temerity to ask about the boards strategy for attracting new investment- he was boo`d and sworn at by other shareholders and aggressively asked to "name names" by MWJ.  It also sparked the "no-one wants to invest in loss-making Champs clubs" and "If any idiot wants to invest they can have the club" statements.  Cullum going to the press exposed the board for what they are and yes, i want to "beat up" on them because i think their duplicity warrants it.  And let`s face it, had Cullum not gone to the press we`d be none the wiser and they`d be saying the same old bullturd wouldn`t they?

It seems for some people it`s ok for someone to lie and say "no-one`s interested in investing" but really terrible for someone to let it be known that they actually are.....Weird.

[nutty nigel 7,667]

[quote user="Mr.Carrow"]

Nutty, you could also find recent posts on here when i say that the board barely put a foot wrong until promotion, or older ones where i have a pop at people who call our CE "Doomcaster".  I was also there on the pitch at Crewe chanting "We love you Delia, we do" as she was "crowned" by big Ginge from Wisbech.  So what?  If you married what you thought was a wonderful, honest girl but decided to break it off after her third affair, how would you react to people saying you lacked integrity?  I have also never stated that all off-pitch spend is bad and believe that the Hotel deal is a good one.  However the word "Obsession" rarely has positive connotations does it?

Things change nutty- but you seem to be almost phobic about that particular word......  I had absolutely no doubt that after our parsimony in the Prem we would have a good warchest to have a real go for two seasons with the parachute payments but the team were asset-stripped and the warnings given out by those who could see what was coming were shouted down.

Yes you posted the thread nutty, but you STILL haven`t explained why you lied have you?  I mean, you can`t have protested against Chase but also not protested against Chase can you?

[/quote]

Mr Carrow - the thread you are referring to was called saucers of milk all round and was full of the usual drivel from the usual keyboard warriors who were making their usual claims that other fans sat on their hands with their heads in the sand while they were sitting on their hands with their heads in the sand themselves. The post was in reply to one from Greto Garbo who doesn’t want to be alone when he’s operating with you. Read the thread again. I closed the post by saying “So maybe Delia Smith is not an evil self centred thieving old witch lining her pockets at our expense just like just like Geoffrey Watling didn''t really rhyme with zigger”. Read the thread again. Does that explain “my lies”? If you want to call it lying then call it lying. I prefer to call it a post that showed that ultimately protesting had never got the protesters what they wanted.

See Mr Carrow, in one breath you tell me that this board have carried on making the same mistakes made by Chase. And yes there are a lot of similarities. But Chase ran the club in the same way for 10 years, 1985-95, and then this board from 1997 for another 11 years. What you are saying to me is that the policies were ok when we were at the top of the Premiership and in Europe under Big Bob but wrong when it all fell apart. And “we love you Delia in 2004” is replaced by “Delia Out” a couple of years later. Not because the policies changed but because team performance did. To coin a phrase used earlier that’s what I call “flip flopping at it’s best”

Now Mr Carrow, I’m not sure if the restaurants, hotel, south stand and all associated infrastructure and other off the pitch revenue streams are ultimately a good idea or not. But what I do know is that in the real world these projects, once started, have to be finished. The board, like you and many others who now critcise them, thought they were a good idea in 2003. Unlike you, and the others who have since changed their minds, they don’t have that luxury because in the real world things really happen. Stands and hotels really get built. Now yes, if they have messed up they should be accountable but I am not sure they have messed up. Other clubs still think we are ahead of the game you know. Just like you did in 2004. Other clubs know that in the absence of a sugar daddy they have to find other sources of revenue. The problem really is that while all this has been going on the football team has failed. Even now we are not getting the results on the pitch that the expenditure on the pitch warrants.

But anyway Mr “flip flop” Carrow.. Were you lying when you said “i believe City are already ahead of the game in this field with Delia`s catering enterprise, the planned new hotel” or were you lying when you said “I was part of the Chase out stuff and the reason for our problems is that we have continued with fat Bobs "infrastructure first" policy” Because you can’t think we are ahead of the game with Delia’s catering enterprise, the planned hotel and sing “we love you Delia” while at the same time believe the reason for our problems was continuing with Big Bobs "infrastructure first" policy can you? Or are you going to give that old “you got the wrong mr carrow” chestnut again.

Now about this Fanzine Ferry ‘Cross The Wensum, did you write in that? I wouldn’t be surprised if some of this forums contributors did. I see similarities sometimes, especially between Darth Chase and Darth Donkster. But I think maybe you just sold it on Carrow Bridge.. You know… like the kid who used to deliver “The Advertiser” on a Thursday after school.

Finally people with real passion still support the club. If you think giving up a season ticket and continual whingeing and wining on message boards is a display of passion then to coin another overused phrase from here “you must be deluded”.

 

[BlyBlyBabes 0]

[quote user="nutty nigel"][quote user="Mr.Carrow"]

Nutty, you could also find recent posts on here when i say that the board barely put a foot wrong until promotion, or older ones where i have a pop at people who call our CE "Doomcaster".  I was also there on the pitch at Crewe chanting "We love you Delia, we do" as she was "crowned" by big Ginge from Wisbech.  So what?  If you married what you thought was a wonderful, honest girl but decided to break it off after her third affair, how would you react to people saying you lacked integrity?  I have also never stated that all off-pitch spend is bad and believe that the Hotel deal is a good one.  However the word "Obsession" rarely has positive connotations does it?

Things change nutty- but you seem to be almost phobic about that particular word......  I had absolutely no doubt that after our parsimony in the Prem we would have a good warchest to have a real go for two seasons with the parachute payments but the team were asset-stripped and the warnings given out by those who could see what was coming were shouted down.

Yes you posted the thread nutty, but you STILL haven`t explained why you lied have you?  I mean, you can`t have protested against Chase but also not protested against Chase can you?

[/quote]

Mr Carrow - the thread you are referring to was called saucers of milk all round and was full of the usual drivel from the usual keyboard warriors who were making their usual claims that other fans sat on their hands with their heads in the sand while they were sitting on their hands with their heads in the sand themselves. The post was in reply to one from Greto Garbo who doesn’t want to be alone when he’s operating with you. Read the thread again. I closed the post by saying “So maybe Delia Smith is not an evil self centred thieving old witch lining her pockets at our expense just like just like Geoffrey Watling didn''t really rhyme with zigger”. Read the thread again. Does that explain “my lies”? If you want to call it lying then call it lying. I prefer to call it a post that showed that ultimately protesting had never got the protesters what they wanted.

See Mr Carrow, in one breath you tell me that this board have carried on making the same mistakes made by Chase. And yes there are a lot of similarities. But Chase ran the club in the same way for 10 years, 1985-95, and then this board from 1997 for another 11 years. What you are saying to me is that the policies were ok when we were at the top of the Premiership and in Europe under Big Bob but wrong when it all fell apart. And “we love you Delia in 2004” is replaced by “Delia Out” a couple of years later. Not because the policies changed but because team performance did. To coin a phrase used earlier that’s what I call “flip flopping at it’s best”

Now Mr Carrow, I’m not sure if the restaurants, hotel, south stand and all associated infrastructure and other off the pitch revenue streams are ultimately a good idea or not. But what I do know is that in the real world these projects, once started, have to be finished. The board, like you and many others who now critcise them, thought they were a good idea in 2003. Unlike you, and the others who have since changed their minds, they don’t have that luxury because in the real world things really happen. Stands and hotels really get built. Now yes, if they have messed up they should be accountable but I am not sure they have messed up. Other clubs still think we are ahead of the game you know. Just like you did in 2004. Other clubs know that in the absence of a sugar daddy they have to find other sources of revenue. The problem really is that while all this has been going on the football team has failed. Even now we are not getting the results on the pitch that the expenditure on the pitch warrants.

But anyway Mr “flip flop” Carrow.. Were you lying when you said “i believe City are already ahead of the game in this field with Delia`s catering enterprise, the planned new hotel” or were you lying when you said “I was part of the Chase out stuff and the reason for our problems is that we have continued with fat Bobs "infrastructure first" policy” Because you can’t think we are ahead of the game with Delia’s catering enterprise, the planned hotel and sing “we love you Delia” while at the same time believe the reason for our problems was continuing with Big Bobs "infrastructure first" policy can you? Or are you going to give that old “you got the wrong mr carrow” chestnut again.

Now about this Fanzine Ferry ‘Cross The Wensum, did you write in that? I wouldn’t be surprised if some of this forums contributors did. I see similarities sometimes, especially between Darth Chase and Darth Donkster. But I think maybe you just sold it on Carrow Bridge.. You know… like the kid who used to deliver “The Advertiser” on a Thursday after school.

Finally people with real passion still support the club. If you think giving up a season ticket and continual whingeing and wining on message boards is a display of passion then to coin another overused phrase from here “you must be deluded”.

[/quote]

And as the pressure mounts week by week the mask slips perceptibly further and further.

And the sight ain''t nice.

OTBC

 

[Mr.Carrow 380]

[quote user="nutty nigel"][quote user="Mr.Carrow"]

Nutty, you could also find recent posts on here when i say that the board barely put a foot wrong until promotion, or older ones where i have a pop at people who call our CE "Doomcaster".  I was also there on the pitch at Crewe chanting "We love you Delia, we do" as she was "crowned" by big Ginge from Wisbech.  So what?  If you married what you thought was a wonderful, honest girl but decided to break it off after her third affair, how would you react to people saying you lacked integrity?  I have also never stated that all off-pitch spend is bad and believe that the Hotel deal is a good one.  However the word "Obsession" rarely has positive connotations does it?

Things change nutty- but you seem to be almost phobic about that particular word......  I had absolutely no doubt that after our parsimony in the Prem we would have a good warchest to have a real go for two seasons with the parachute payments but the team were asset-stripped and the warnings given out by those who could see what was coming were shouted down.

Yes you posted the thread nutty, but you STILL haven`t explained why you lied have you?  I mean, you can`t have protested against Chase but also not protested against Chase can you?

[/quote]

Mr Carrow - the thread you are referring to was called saucers of milk all round and was full of the usual drivel from the usual keyboard warriors who were making their usual claims that other fans sat on their hands with their heads in the sand while they were sitting on their hands with their heads in the sand themselves. The post was in reply to one from Greto Garbo who doesn’t want to be alone when he’s operating with you. Read the thread again. I closed the post by saying “So maybe Delia Smith is not an evil self centred thieving old witch lining her pockets at our expense just like just like Geoffrey Watling didn''t really rhyme with zigger”. Read the thread again. Does that explain “my lies”? If you want to call it lying then call it lying. I prefer to call it a post that showed that ultimately protesting had never got the protesters what they wanted.

See Mr Carrow, in one breath you tell me that this board have carried on making the same mistakes made by Chase. And yes there are a lot of similarities. But Chase ran the club in the same way for 10 years, 1985-95, and then this board from 1997 for another 11 years. What you are saying to me is that the policies were ok when we were at the top of the Premiership and in Europe under Big Bob but wrong when it all fell apart. And “we love you Delia in 2004” is replaced by “Delia Out” a couple of years later. Not because the policies changed but because team performance did. To coin a phrase used earlier that’s what I call “flip flopping at it’s best”

Now Mr Carrow, I’m not sure if the restaurants, hotel, south stand and all associated infrastructure and other off the pitch revenue streams are ultimately a good idea or not. But what I do know is that in the real world these projects, once started, have to be finished. The board, like you and many others who now critcise them, thought they were a good idea in 2003. Unlike you, and the others who have since changed their minds, they don’t have that luxury because in the real world things really happen. Stands and hotels really get built. Now yes, if they have messed up they should be accountable but I am not sure they have messed up. Other clubs still think we are ahead of the game you know. Just like you did in 2004. Other clubs know that in the absence of a sugar daddy they have to find other sources of revenue. The problem really is that while all this has been going on the football team has failed. Even now we are not getting the results on the pitch that the expenditure on the pitch warrants.

But anyway Mr “flip flop” Carrow.. Were you lying when you said “i believe City are already ahead of the game in this field with Delia`s catering enterprise, the planned new hotel” or were you lying when you said “I was part of the Chase out stuff and the reason for our problems is that we have continued with fat Bobs "infrastructure first" policy” Because you can’t think we are ahead of the game with Delia’s catering enterprise, the planned hotel and sing “we love you Delia” while at the same time believe the reason for our problems was continuing with Big Bobs "infrastructure first" policy can you? Or are you going to give that old “you got the wrong mr carrow” chestnut again.

Now about this Fanzine Ferry ‘Cross The Wensum, did you write in that? I wouldn’t be surprised if some of this forums contributors did. I see similarities sometimes, especially between Darth Chase and Darth Donkster. But I think maybe you just sold it on Carrow Bridge.. You know… like the kid who used to deliver “The Advertiser” on a Thursday after school.

Finally people with real passion still support the club. If you think giving up a season ticket and continual whingeing and wining on message boards is a display of passion then to coin another overused phrase from here “you must be deluded”.

 

[/quote]

I swear you`ve had some training in politics nutty and i really can`t be bothered to go through it all in detail for someone as one-eyed and pig-headed as you.  I have stated time and again that i felt the board did a good job until promotion- without having the accounts until the share issues i had to take them on trust.  Everything since the failure to sign Crouch or Ashton at the start of the season has indicated to me that the team is now a sideline at CR whilst the focus is elsewhere (everyone knows the list by now.....).  We had a very good reason for struggling pre-promotion- the club really were skint and were doing well to afford a semi-competitive team.  We finished our £34m sky payments with a squad which cost the same as the one which took us up and i think that says it all.

If you think everyone loved Chase and there was no criticism of his policies when we were doing well then dream on......

As far as the "Ahead of the game" quote goes, lets have a link so we can put it in context.  I believe i was reacting to someone saying that any money spent on the team was too risky as it was based on "Belief and hope" and i pointed out that the revenue expected from catering etc. was also simply "Belief and hope".  I`m sure a man of your integrity wouldn`t stoop to twisting things that much......[:$]

As for the fanzine, yes i wrote some articles and did some of the cartoons but i guess you probably judge others by the way you`re prepared to behave yourself, so you`ll probably decide i`ve made that up.......

Nutty, i can support a board which is straining every financial sinew to put the most competitive team on the pitch possible, but when a board gives up on the team in the most lucrative period in the clubs history there is no way i`m going to financially back their folly.  I outlined the perils of such an approach years ago and unfortunately i`ve been proved right.  And i get the feeling you may have a little problem with that.......[;)]

[nutty nigel 7,667]

[quote user="BlyBlyBabes"]

And as the pressure mounts week by week the mask slips perceptibly further and further.

And the sight ain''t nice.

OTBC

[/quote]

And with two defeats in a week the anti club celebrations become louder and more vile.

Week by week the mask slips perceptibly further and further as we see them for what they really are.

http://www.pinkun.com/cs/forums/1482402/ShowPost.aspx

They finally “got a room” [:O]

Did the check in as Mr & Mrs Smith[:^)]

Smudger and his Babes[W]

Was Smudger [:$] in the morning[+o(]

amantes sunt amentes [:''(]

 

[Mello Yello 2,315]

[quote user="nutty nigel"][quote user="BlyBlyBabes"]

And as the pressure mounts week by week the mask slips perceptibly further and further.

And the sight ain''t nice.

OTBC

[/quote]

And with two defeats in a week the anti club celebrations become louder and more vile.

Week by week the mask slips perceptibly further and further as we see them for what they really are.

http://www.pinkun.com/cs/forums/1482402/ShowPost.aspx

They finally “got a room” [:O]

Did the check in as Mr & Mrs Smith[:^)]

Smudger and his Babes[W]

Was Smudger [:$] in the morning[+o(]

amantes sunt amentes [:''(]

 

[/quote]

"Yap!....Yap! Yap! Yap![&] Went the the little Directionless and Chief Exec''s lapdog......"Good boy, here''s a juicy bone......Shove it up your one-eye you good ickle doggy - and you can pretend it''s your spine!.....

[nutty nigel 7,667]

Mr Carrow - It was you who came here trying to discredit me and calling me a liar. I am just returning the favour if you like. You took my post on that thread out of context.

I was simply pointing out that despite the fact that you publicly state that you believe this board have failed by carrying on with Big Bobs infrastructure first policy but you were behind them and supporting them for doing just that in better days.

Here is your link (mind you, you produced nothing when you continually accused me of lying).

http://new.pinkun.com/cs/forums/341777/ShowPost.aspx

It had nothing to do with players, so once again you try to discredit me accusing me of twisting things and questioning my integrity. It was a serious thread about what posters would do to secure the long term future of Norwich City. You and others who have since changed their minds were quite happy to spend money on catering and hotels to secure that future. So were you lying then Mr Carrow or are you lying now?

If you continue to make personal attacks on my integrity and continue to accuse me of lying then I will persue this in the same way with you.

I''m not asking you to support the board, I''m not asking you to support the team. I don''t care if you never go again or if you go every week. But what I am asking is that you stop criticising those who still go, who still support the club, because in my book, supporting the club in adversity is a greater show of passion than walking away and whingeing and whining on here.

 

[nutty nigel 7,667]

[quote user="Mello Yello"][quote user="nutty nigel"][quote user="BlyBlyBabes"]

And as the pressure mounts week by week the mask slips perceptibly further and further.

And the sight ain''t nice.

OTBC

[/quote]

And with two defeats in a week the anti club celebrations become louder and more vile.

Week by week the mask slips perceptibly further and further as we see them for what they really are.

http://www.pinkun.com/cs/forums/1482402/ShowPost.aspx

They finally “got a room” [:O]

Did the check in as Mr & Mrs Smith[:^)]

Smudger and his Babes[W]

Was Smudger [:$] in the morning[+o(]

amantes sunt amentes [:''(]

 

[/quote]

"Yap!....Yap! Yap! Yap![&] Went the the little Directionless and Chief Exec''s lapdog......"Good boy, here''s a juicy bone......Shove it up your one-eye you good ickle doggy - and you can pretend it''s your spine!.....

[/quote]

Still operating alone with Mr Carrow I see Greto Garbo...

Practice saying this stuff in the mirror first, maybe then you will find the backbone to come out from behind your keyboard [:|]

 

[Mello Yello 2,315]

[quote user="nutty nigel"][quote user="Mello Yello"][quote user="nutty nigel"][quote user="BlyBlyBabes"]

And as the pressure mounts week by week the mask slips perceptibly further and further.

And the sight ain''t nice.

OTBC

[/quote]

And with two defeats in a week the anti club celebrations become louder and more vile.

Week by week the mask slips perceptibly further and further as we see them for what they really are.

http://www.pinkun.com/cs/forums/1482402/ShowPost.aspx

They finally “got a room” [:O]

Did the check in as Mr & Mrs Smith[:^)]

Smudger and his Babes[W]

Was Smudger [:$] in the morning[+o(]

amantes sunt amentes [:''(]

 

[/quote]

"Yap!....Yap! Yap! Yap![&] Went the the little Directionless and Chief Exec''s lapdog......"Good boy, here''s a juicy bone......Shove it up your one-eye you good ickle doggy - and you can pretend it''s your spine!.....

[/quote]

Still operating alone with Mr Carrow I see Greto Garbo...

Practice saying this stuff in the mirror first, maybe then you will find the backbone to come out from behind your keyboard [:|]

 

[/quote]

fLOP! 

[BlyBlyBabes 0]

[quote user="nutty nigel"][quote user="BlyBlyBabes"]

And as the pressure mounts week by week the mask slips perceptibly further and further.

And the sight ain''t nice.

OTBC

[/quote]

And with two defeats in a week the anti club celebrations become louder and more vile.

Week by week the mask slips perceptibly further and further as we see them for what they really are.

http://www.pinkun.com/cs/forums/1482402/ShowPost.aspx

They finally “got a room” [:O]

Did the check in as Mr & Mrs Smith[:^)]

Smudger and his Babes[W]

Was Smudger [:$] in the morning[+o(]

amantes sunt amentes [:''(]

[/quote]

I posted some facts about City''s position - as below:

29/11/2008, 6:35 PM
BlyBlyBabes Joined on 31/10/2003 Posts 3,937	Cheer up you lot - we''re only 9 pts off the playoffs.
	Although 21 off automatic promotion 3 off relegation After 14 years OTBC Ken Nethercott/Sandy Kennon; Bryan Thurlow, Ron Ashman; Roy McCrohan, Barry Butler, Matt Crowe; Errol Crossan, Terry Allcock, Terry Bly, Jimmy Hill, Bobby Brennan And you call that vile? Loud? And anti-club? And then descend to nastiness. As I said before, as the pressure mounts, the mask slips further - and the sight ain''t pleasant. The club needs hard, sharp, focussed leadership and support - not sycophancy. Dear oh dear. OTBC

 

[Mr.Carrow 380]

[quote user="nutty nigel"]

Mr Carrow - It was you who came here trying to discredit me and calling me a liar. I am just returning the favour if you like. You took my post on that thread out of context.

I was simply pointing out that despite the fact that you publicly state that you believe this board have failed by carrying on with Big Bobs infrastructure first policy but you were behind them and supporting them for doing just that in better days.

Here is your link (mind you, you produced nothing when you continually accused me of lying).

http://new.pinkun.com/cs/forums/341777/ShowPost.aspx

It had nothing to do with players, so once again you try to discredit me accusing me of twisting things and questioning my integrity. It was a serious thread about what posters would do to secure the long term future of Norwich City. You and others who have since changed their minds were quite happy to spend money on catering and hotels to secure that future. So were you lying then Mr Carrow or are you lying now?

If you continue to make personal attacks on my integrity and continue to accuse me of lying then I will persue this in the same way with you.

I''m not asking you to support the board, I''m not asking you to support the team. I don''t care if you never go again or if you go every week. But what I am asking is that you stop criticising those who still go, who still support the club, because in my book, supporting the club in adversity is a greater show of passion than walking away and whingeing and whining on here.

 

[/quote]

Nutty, i called you a liar because, ummm, you lied.  Only in nutty`s fantasy world can saying "I took part in the Chase out protests" and "I did not take part in the Chase out protests" both be true.  Still great entertainment as ever nutty [Y] [:D].

If the above quote is the best you can come up with by trawling through old posts like a sad anorak then i think it strengthens my case rather than weakens it.  The statement is essentially nuetral ("Expected revenues from these schemes are based on BELIEF and HOPE are they not?") and i have since had far more access to far more information to come to a more informed conclusion.  I live and learn nutty whereas you decide on an opinion and rigidly stick to it even as it becomes ludicrous.

TBH i`m finding your puerile insults and vulgar talk about various people being in close proximity to my backside both worrying and wearying.  And then you go and lecture people on "getting personal"......10 out of 10- superb!!  I wonder how you got your nickname.....?

[nutty nigel 7,667]

Yes but it was the private celebration after the opening post wasn''t it Bly. You always come crowing on this board after a bad result just like your room mate Smudger.

http://www.pinkun.com/cs/forums/1482402/ShowPost.aspx

What gives you so much satisfaction about those facts that you posted that you need to celebrate them?

 

[nutty nigel 7,667]

[quote user="Mr.Carrow"]

Nutty, i called you a liar because, ummm, you lied.  Only in nutty`s fantasy world can saying "I took part in the Chase out protests" and "I did not take part in the Chase out protests" both be true.  Still great entertainment as ever nutty [Y] [:D].

If the above quote is the best you can come up with by trawling through old posts like a sad anorak then i think it strengthens my case rather than weakens it.  The statement is essentially nuetral ("Expected revenues from these schemes are based on BELIEF and HOPE are they not?") and i have since had far more access to far more information to come to a more informed conclusion.  I live and learn nutty whereas you decide on an opinion and rigidly stick to it even as it becomes ludicrous.

TBH i`m finding your puerile insults and vulgar talk about various people being in close proximity to my backside both worrying and wearying.  And then you go and lecture people on "getting personal"......10 out of 10- superb!!  I wonder how you got your nickname.....?

[/quote]

The statement is only essentially neutral if you weren''t already of the opinion that investment in off the field activities was the problem with the previous board that controlled the club. But you won''t have that will you. Because in your crazy world Mr Carrow has to be right even when he''s wrong and what he say''s has to be right regardless of the facts. And passionate supporters whinge and whine on here while withdrawing support from the team. Just to prove a point. Well Mr Carrow, you will never shift me from my view that the team, the manager, the board and the fans are on the same side and that Norwich City Football Club is bigger than any part of it.

Now yes fans can change their minds and use hindsight. Yes they can hold those that are in control of the club responsible even if they agreed with the decisions at the time they were made. Of course we can Mr Carrow, because if we suggest build a hotel or a corner infill it doesn''t get built does it?

Unfortunately, between the time when you flip-flopped from being anti to neutral to anti again the projects actually happened. It''s the real world and no telling me I''m nutty, or calling me a liar, or puerile or vulgar will change it.

 

[Mello Yello 2,315]

[quote user="nutty nigel"][quote user="Mr.Carrow"]

Nutty, i called you a liar because, ummm, you lied.  Only in nutty`s fantasy world can saying "I took part in the Chase out protests" and "I did not take part in the Chase out protests" both be true.  Still great entertainment as ever nutty [Y] [:D].

If the above quote is the best you can come up with by trawling through old posts like a sad anorak then i think it strengthens my case rather than weakens it.  The statement is essentially nuetral ("Expected revenues from these schemes are based on BELIEF and HOPE are they not?") and i have since had far more access to far more information to come to a more informed conclusion.  I live and learn nutty whereas you decide on an opinion and rigidly stick to it even as it becomes ludicrous.

TBH i`m finding your puerile insults and vulgar talk about various people being in close proximity to my backside both worrying and wearying.  And then you go and lecture people on "getting personal"......10 out of 10- superb!!  I wonder how you got your nickname.....?

[/quote]

The statement is only essentially neutral if you weren''t already of the opinion that investment in off the field activities was the problem with the previous board that controlled the club. But you won''t have that will you. Because in your crazy world Mr Carrow has to be right even when he''s wrong and what he say''s has to be right regardless of the facts. And passionate supporters whinge and whine on here while withdrawing support from the team. Just to prove a point. Well Mr Carrow, you will never shift me from my view that the team, the manager, the board and the fans are on the same side and that Norwich City Football Club is bigger than any part of it.

Now yes fans can change their minds and use hindsight. Yes they can hold those that are in control of the club responsible even if they agreed with the decisions at the time they were made. Of course we can Mr Carrow, because if we suggest build a hotel or a corner infill it doesn''t get built does it?

Unfortunately, between the time when you flip-flopped from being anti to neutral to anti again the projects actually happened. It''s the real world and no telling me I''m nutty, or calling me a liar, or puerile or vulgar will change it.

[/quote]

Did you protest against Chase.....though?[:|]......

"Walkies!"[&]

[Smudger 0]

[quote user="nutty nigel"]

Yes but it was the private celebration after the opening post wasn''t it Bly. You always come crowing on this board after a bad result just like your room mate Smudger.

http://www.pinkun.com/cs/forums/1482402/ShowPost.aspx

What gives you so much satisfaction about those facts that you posted that you need to celebrate them?

 

[/quote]

Just as you keep crowing about results which will see us in to another nice 19th place finish or worse still relegated??? [8-)] [:$]

[BlyBlyBabes 0]

[quote user="nutty nigel"]

Yes but it was the private celebration after the opening post wasn''t it Bly. You always come crowing on this board after a bad result just like your room mate Smudger.

http://www.pinkun.com/cs/forums/1482402/ShowPost.aspx

What gives you so much satisfaction about those facts that you posted that you need to celebrate them?

[/quote]

Dear oh dear.

I''d far rather be a proud 59er than a bitter apologist for the past 14 years fixated on minor celebrity, zigger zagger, tans, militants, lies, crowing and rectums.

Dear oh dear.

The sight gets worse almost by the day.

You evidently need some therapy. Here:

OTBC

[Mr.Carrow 380]

[quote user="nutty nigel"][quote user="Mr.Carrow"]

Nutty, i called you a liar because, ummm, you lied.  Only in nutty`s fantasy world can saying "I took part in the Chase out protests" and "I did not take part in the Chase out protests" both be true.  Still great entertainment as ever nutty [Y] [:D].

If the above quote is the best you can come up with by trawling through old posts like a sad anorak then i think it strengthens my case rather than weakens it.  The statement is essentially nuetral ("Expected revenues from these schemes are based on BELIEF and HOPE are they not?") and i have since had far more access to far more information to come to a more informed conclusion.  I live and learn nutty whereas you decide on an opinion and rigidly stick to it even as it becomes ludicrous.

TBH i`m finding your puerile insults and vulgar talk about various people being in close proximity to my backside both worrying and wearying.  And then you go and lecture people on "getting personal"......10 out of 10- superb!!  I wonder how you got your nickname.....?

[/quote]

The statement is only essentially neutral if you weren''t already of the opinion that investment in off the field activities was the problem with the previous board that controlled the club. But you won''t have that will you. Because in your crazy world Mr Carrow has to be right even when he''s wrong and what he say''s has to be right regardless of the facts. And passionate supporters whinge and whine on here while withdrawing support from the team. Just to prove a point. Well Mr Carrow, you will never shift me from my view that the team, the manager, the board and the fans are on the same side and that Norwich City Football Club is bigger than any part of it.

Now yes fans can change their minds and use hindsight. Yes they can hold those that are in control of the club responsible even if they agreed with the decisions at the time they were made. Of course we can Mr Carrow, because if we suggest build a hotel or a corner infill it doesn''t get built does it?

Unfortunately, between the time when you flip-flopped from being anti to neutral to anti again the projects actually happened. It''s the real world and no telling me I''m nutty, or calling me a liar, or puerile or vulgar will change it.

 

[/quote]

Nutty, one of the reasons why i accuse you of lack of integrity is you are quite happy to twist other peoples arguments and present them as something totally different.  You know i have never said "all off-pitch spend is bad" and have defended the Hotel and accepted that the Jarrold was necessary.  Not everything Chase threw money at was bad but he definately put infrastructure before the team and i`ve heard plenty of whispers as to why.  The current board did not do that until `02-`03 so fair enough, when i said "The current board continued the Chase`s policy`s" it was badly worded- after an encouraging hiatus they repeated his mistakes and even admitted to an "obsession".  We finished our parachute payments with a squad which cost less than what we received for selling just one player and were frequently regaled with "All money received for transfers is available to be re-invested in the squad".......

"The real problem is that the club is asset-rich but cash-poor",  a quote by the real saviour of the club which should haunt those who failed to learn the lessons of our recent past and those who tried to shout down those who saw the problems coming.  I believe G.Bennett described the club as "All fur coat but no knickers"- another quote which still applies- but it might be my memory playing up.

Yes, in the real world the projects got built and we recently had Munby telling us their policy`s have been "So successful for the last 12 years".  No sign of any recognition that they`ve had the club on the wrong path in the last four years, so i assume no change in approach.  You obviously don`t think fan pressure has any effect (despite evidence to the contrary with Chase), but don`t you think we have a duty to at least TRY to get out of this downward spiral by putting pressure on the policies (and personel) at the top?  If not, more of the same IMO.  Enjoy.....