FAO: Delia & Restuarant Bashers

[blahblahblah 2]

[quote user="Mr.Carrow"]With all that money supposedly coming from catering and the hotel can you please explain to me why, after three years of Sky money worth £32m, season-ticket sell-outs and player sales of £16m, we have a squad which cost less than £5m to assemble? Please don`t mention player wages as they have been much lower as a percentage of income since promotion than before it. And why do the board still tell us that all money recieved from selling players is re-invested in the team, when it obviously isn`t true?

Forget the platitudes, can anyone answer these two questions please? If the answer is "no" please try to have an unbiased think as to why not.[/quote]

First of all, I''d dispute your figures.  Fag-packet calculations of the highest order old bean, show your working please [:)].  By insisting that player wages are taken out of the equation, you''re denying 8 million per year (on average) over the period you''re talking about.  If we''re talking about a period of 3 years, that''s 24 million.  Does your 5 million to assemble the squad include non-disclosed transfer fees ?  What about associated costs ?  The simple fact is that you can''t begin to get close to the actual costs of running a Championship club by just looking at headline figures.However, I will agree with you that the balance appears to have slid in recent history away from the football - in common with a lot of other teams.  The money has been spent now, and now that it has been spent, it makes sense to try to get that money to make money.You talk about diverting "all non-essential funds into the team".  This, to my mind, opens up a massive can of worms.  Could you determine where the inefficiencies are, in the current setup, if there are any ?  Who would you put out of work to divert funds into the team ?  Could you guarantee that the people you let go weren''t actually making the club money ?  Would it cost you more in the short term to pay for the redundancies ?   Could the club afford this within current cash-flow ?  Would the securitisation company be happy with the closure of revenue-creating schemes, or would they re-consider their position on the current debt ?   If you follow the path that you suggest, you would be left with a large amount of tough choices.Are you willing to take the Turners at their word, with their remit to tighten things up on the business side so that there''s more funds available on the pitch ?  In the absense of anything else we can do, I think that''s the best any of us can hope for.

[Polar 0]

to be fair... if Delia managed to create a ground full of shopping outlets, food outlets and leisure facilities AND a successful team with exciting football. Norwich would be well placeds to be one of the better teams in the UK. at the moment though its not happening on the pitch where its needed. roll on janurary and if we have a good month then lala may just get away with her new restaurant.

[Paradox 0]

Mr Blackstock? Who is he Mello Yello?

I gather from following posts that he must be an employee. I can assure you that I am not ''Mr Blackstock'', in fact my name is Joe, grew up in Weston Longville, I live in hertford & work in a radio station in London.

It was just an opinion, believe it or not your average punter can come up with one here and there too.

I am lucky enough to have taken clients from the media world in london up to Delia''s restuarant every season for the last few years before watching a match & they have been hugely impressed.  I am told, and have first hand experience that delia''s restaurant is better than anything I or my colleagues have experienced at any Premier League grounds - (haven''t tried the emirates yet though).

Quite simply, any activity that provides NCFC with profit is worth doing isn''t it?

[Arthur Whittle 0]

[quote user="City1st"]" Now if you take the 10000 ''cretins'' away  "

And your evidence for this number, other than your usual over excited imagination.


[/quote]

Well you will see pretty soon, remember up until recently our gates where between 12-18000,i can bet my life that after this season, if we fail to progress on the pitch those figures will be the norm again.

[Mr.Carrow 378]

[quote user="blahblahblah"]

[quote user="Mr.Carrow"]With all that money supposedly coming from catering and the hotel can you please explain to me why, after three years of Sky money worth £32m, season-ticket sell-outs and player sales of £16m, we have a squad which cost less than £5m to assemble? Please don`t mention player wages as they have been much lower as a percentage of income since promotion than before it. And why do the board still tell us that all money recieved from selling players is re-invested in the team, when it obviously isn`t true?

Forget the platitudes, can anyone answer these two questions please? If the answer is "no" please try to have an unbiased think as to why not.[/quote]

First of all, I''d dispute your figures.  Fag-packet calculations of the highest order old bean, show your working please [:)].  By insisting that player wages are taken out of the equation, you''re denying 8 million per year (on average) over the period you''re talking about.  If we''re talking about a period of 3 years, that''s 24 million.  Does your 5 million to assemble the squad include non-disclosed transfer fees ?  What about associated costs ?  The simple fact is that you can''t begin to get close to the actual costs of running a Championship club by just looking at headline figures.

However, I will agree with you that the balance appears to have slid in recent history away from the football - in common with a lot of other teams.  The money has been spent now, and now that it has been spent, it makes sense to try to get that money to make money.

You talk about diverting "all non-essential funds into the team".  This, to my mind, opens up a massive can of worms.  Could you determine where the inefficiencies are, in the current setup, if there are any ?  Who would you put out of work to divert funds into the team ?  Could you guarantee that the people you let go weren''t actually making the club money ?  Would it cost you more in the short term to pay for the redundancies ?   Could the club afford this within current cash-flow ?  Would the securitisation company be happy with the closure of revenue-creating schemes, or would they re-consider their position on the current debt ?   If you follow the path that you suggest, you would be left with a large amount of tough choices.

Are you willing to take the Turners at their word, with their remit to tighten things up on the business side so that there''s more funds available on the pitch ?  In the absense of anything else we can do, I think that''s the best any of us can hope for.
[/quote]

If i have more time Blah i will post exact figures, but i can assure you that if you accept the figures stated in the accounts that i can back my argument up. I think what you have to bear in mind is that the figures quoted above are on top of "ordinary" income such as ticket sales, merchandise etc.

Also consider this. In  2002 the club made a profit of £500k on turnover of £15m with no major player sales,no sky money and lowish (£1.6m) spend on infrastructure. The player wage bill was £5.2m. In the last financial year the club barely turned a profit despite turnover of £23.8m, a profit of around £1m in the transfer market, much higher ticket receipts and player wages of £7.6m. In other words despite an £8.8m increase in turnover, spend on the team was only slightly higher than 5 years ago yet all that extra revenue was "used up" somehow.

 I don`t think anyone has fully got to grips with where all that extra revenue went, but £2.4m on infrastructure and a non-player wage bill of nearly £7m is part explanation. And i think it tends to indicate that all the other ventures the club have got involved in are costing the club millions rather than making it. Maybe the Turners` job is to sort out the mess?

[blahblahblah 2]

[quote]Also consider this. In  2002 the club made a

profit of £500k on turnover of £15m with no major player sales,no sky

money and lowish (£1.6m) spend on infrastructure. The player wage bill

was £5.2m. In the last financial year the club barely turned a profit

despite turnover of £23.8m, a profit of around £1m in the transfer

market, much higher ticket receipts and player wages of £7.6m. In other

words despite an £8.8m increase in turnover, spend on the team was only

slightly higher than 5 years ago yet all that extra revenue was "used

up" somehow.[/quote]It sounds to me like spending has been made this year to grow income in subsequent years.  For example, and I may be wrong here, but without the 1.2 million spent on that road they built, isn''t the land that they bought worthless ?  You could be right, and there could be a lot of "waste spending" going on, or it could be that the only way for the company to create the turnover they need to pay the wages is to spend money on the infrastructure.It would probably do NCFC a favour if the next round of TV money was lower than the last.  Sadly I can''t see it happening any time soon.

[Bill 1,788]

" Well you will see pretty soon "So the figure of 10,000 has no basis in fact, merely your conjection based on something that may or may not happen in the future ?Hardly a surprise in your case.

[Arthur Whittle 0]

[quote user="City1st"]" Well you will see pretty soon "

So the figure of 10,000 has no basis in fact, merely your conjection based on something that may or may not happen in the future ?

Hardly a surprise in your case.
[/quote]

Right then so you''re telling me we are going to get 25000 people in Div 1? God give me strenght!!

[Bill 1,788]

" Right then so you''re telling me we are going to get 25000 people in Div 1? God give me strenght!! "Eh ?, where did I day that ? More made up stuff again, ArthurI should, maybe, ask for a dictionary when next  requesting something from the almighty

[Mello Yello 2,302]

[quote user="Mello Yello"]

[quote user="City1st"]" Now if you take the 10000 ''cretins'' away  "

And your evidence for this number, other than your usual over excited imagination.


[/quote]

To those folk who contribute to this forum, how many of you (including City1st)  will actually and honestly use ''Yellows'' on matchdays.......Or prefer to utilise alternative food venues - and socialise ''pre-and-post match'' in non-NCFC establishments?

Morrison''s and the Coach an'' Horses for me.

 

 

[/quote]

So, is there very few ''forum finance fingermice'' consuming grub in the NCFC ''nice nosh'' club restaurant''s - or won''t actually be sampling the burgers, steaks and fries, and quaffin'' frothing flagons of ale in ''Yellows'' then?.....[:|]

Wait for the old Brannigan''s site on Riverside, that''s soon to be opened as restaurants.......competition is everywhere.......Squares, Lloyd''s drinks, are competitively priced and VFM. Now, how''s the club going to attract the punter''s away from their usual somewhat cheaper "non-NCFC" watering holes and cheap feasting food outlets? I eagerly await, with ''Balti breath''.......

[Arthur Whittle 0]

[quote user="City1st"]" Right then so you''re telling me we are going to get 25000 people in Div 1?
God give me strenght!! "

Eh ?, where did I day that ?

More made up stuff again, Arthur

I should, maybe, ask for a dictionary when next  requesting something from the almighty





[/quote]

You are very good at picking up hypothetical things about my post but the simple facts are....No investment in team = crap football= smaller attendances= smaller profit for off field activity.......simple enough for you? Go on spin the doncaster way....Oh and enjoy the Burger, whats next BBQ''s on the car park? Keep it up mate, lovely hotel,wonderful Bars serving lovely vino,we can all get a little ''lets be avin you'' and get a room in the lovely concrete thing next to the Barclay...a perfect way to cheer yourself up after yet anougher s?@t performance where it counts!

[Mello Yello 2,302]

[quote user="Paradox"]

Mr Blackstock? Who is he Mello Yello?

I gather from following posts that he must be an employee. I can assure you that I am not ''Mr Blackstock'', in fact my name is Joe, grew up in Weston Longville, I live in hertford & work in a radio station in London.

It was just an opinion, believe it or not your average punter can come up with one here and there too.

I am lucky enough to have taken clients from the media world in london up to Delia''s restuarant every season for the last few years before watching a match & they have been hugely impressed.  I am told, and have first hand experience that delia''s restaurant is better than anything I or my colleagues have experienced at any Premier League grounds - (haven''t tried the emirates yet though).

Quite simply, any activity that provides NCFC with profit is worth doing isn''t it?

[/quote]

There''s profit in profiteroles, I will concur.........But, for the ''average fan'' who forks out £25+ quid for stadium access - to witness a platter of professional players ''perform''.....(and maybe also have a family to feed and refresh). I somehow don''t think that they''ll make a bee-line for Delia''s or the Top o'' the Terrace to seek sustenance. In my experience, one can see a plethora of people in club shirts and scarves, scoffin'' in outside bars, bazaars and the local large Supermarkets.......Now, why is that? And, why can''t the Marketeer''s of NCFC attract and provide an equivalent service to the larger supporting majority, who''s income certainly doesn''t surpass those that are able to enjoy those quality facilities.....     

I''m sure you wholeheartedly enjoy the occasional ''treat'' of corporate hospitality, and I''m pleased that you find the fare most excellent.......But, there are folk on a minimum wages or who aren''t so financially fortunate to be able to sample what''s on offer inside the Stadium''s ''lavish and lucrative'' restaurant''s.

Perhaps you can compare average salary in Hertford and ''The Smoke'' - to average salaries in Li''l ole Norfolk, and what the ''average'' NCFC supporter sacrifices - just to attend home games.....

   

[Mello Yello 2,302]

I don''t believe my above post was moderated for suggesting to an individual, to Google an above individual!...and some other inane and mildly inoffensive ''lighthearted'' and certainly not malicious stuff.

Who''s it moderating tonight then? Gareth Blackstock? Marco? Or Delia herself......

Y''know, some folk can get away with what they want.......and some folk can''t! PATHETIC!

''Favourites'' only, is it?

MODERATE THAT!......

[The Fish Seller 0]

[quote user="blahblahblah"]

[quote user="Mr.Carrow"]With all that money supposedly coming from catering and the hotel can you please explain to me why, after three years of Sky money worth £32m, season-ticket sell-outs and player sales of £16m, we have a squad which cost less than £5m to assemble? Please don`t mention player wages as they have been much lower as a percentage of income since promotion than before it. And why do the board still tell us that all money recieved from selling players is re-invested in the team, when it obviously isn`t true?

Forget the platitudes, can anyone answer these two questions please? If the answer is "no" please try to have an unbiased think as to why not.[/quote]

First of all, I''d dispute your figures.  Fag-packet calculations of the highest order old bean, show your working please [:)].  By insisting that player wages are taken out of the equation, you''re denying 8 million per year (on average) over the period you''re talking about.  If we''re talking about a period of 3 years, that''s 24 million.  Does your 5 million to assemble the squad include non-disclosed transfer fees ?  What about associated costs ?  The simple fact is that you can''t begin to get close to the actual costs of running a Championship club by just looking at headline figures.

[/quote]

According to these figures http://www.footballeconomy.com/stats2/eng_norwich.htm we''ve turned over £110,000,000 since promotion.

£8,000,000 a year (times three) and say £12,000,000 wages in the Prem year equates to a third of this amount. I think the point that is being made is that very little of the remaining £72,000,000 has found it''s way into the squad. Guess 150+ non playing staff don''t come cheap though.

 

[Big Down Under 0]

Blah Blah Blah - well said!Mello - you hit on some interesting points. The traditional fan is being priced out up and down the country. How many original Chelsea fans can afford the Stamford Bridge experience these days? This is why lots of clubs have lower gates now than a few years ago, lots of fans can''t afford it any more and/or just don''t relate to the egos of the players.I used to regularly attend Fulham as both normal fan and sponsor (I knew people at a company who was a sponsor, the office was mainly women, therefore frequently spare tickets). However ''nice'' it was to have a gin and tonic before the match and exchange pleasentaries with George Cohen, I much preferred to have a few pints in the nearest pub and grabbing a pie at half time. But surely at Norwich, we do cater for all pockets and tastes. Didn''t the board get criticised on here when it was announced our pies are the third best in Europe? But aren''t pies the traditional football food? They would be absolutely crazy to not try and maximise profit from the executive boxes, they exist at all football clubs, but as long as they cater to all spending levels and make a profit from it all, why the criticism?

[BlyBlyBabes 0]

It''s all a prawn sandwich thing really.

Seeing the figures in the accounts over the years, I doubt that Delia''s catering makes a real profit - that is, if it were to stand alone without any of the supportive club infrastructure and services.

And apart from anything else it''s a considerable distraction from the core football business for key investors and executive decisionmakers.

Help, help, we''re drowning in treacle pudding.

OTBC

 

[Mr.Carrow 378]

[quote user="blahblahblah"][quote]Also consider this. In  2002 the club made a profit of £500k on turnover of £15m with no major player sales,no sky money and lowish (£1.6m) spend on infrastructure. The player wage bill was £5.2m. In the last financial year the club barely turned a profit despite turnover of £23.8m, a profit of around £1m in the transfer market, much higher ticket receipts and player wages of £7.6m. In other words despite an £8.8m increase in turnover, spend on the team was only slightly higher than 5 years ago yet all that extra revenue was "used up" somehow.[/quote]

It sounds to me like spending has been made this year to grow income in subsequent years.  For example, and I may be wrong here, but without the 1.2 million spent on that road they built, isn''t the land that they bought worthless ?  You could be right, and there could be a lot of "waste spending" going on, or it could be that the only way for the company to create the turnover they need to pay the wages is to spend money on the infrastructure.

It would probably do NCFC a favour if the next round of TV money was lower than the last.  Sadly I can''t see it happening any time soon.
[/quote]

That is basically the crux of my argument Blah. Don`t forget that there were 5 years between the figures quoted above when spend on infrastructure was massively higher. The club still have £3m in short-term loans to pay for land and the infill due by the end of next year-i do hope all the board supporters will be dipping into their pockets to pay it off, otherwise it will be the team which will suffer yet again. We`ve already made this mistake once under Chase and yet Norwich fans have been quite content to watch history repeat itself. Have you heard about the plans for a new multi-storey car-park? What will it be next? The team have come a poor second to infrastructure for years and we have gone from being a regular in the top league to struggling to stay in the second league. Time for a change of focus perhaps??

[blahblahblah 2]

[quote]The team have come a poor second to infrastructure for years and we

have gone from being a regular in the top league to struggling to stay

in the second league. Time for a change of focus perhaps??[/quote]The key to this is basically an ideological question : Do you want NCFC to try to operate independently of TV money ?   To put it another way, if you are given a sunflower seed, do you eat it or plant it ?  Most of our competitors live hand to mouth, running themselves into the ground, and then abusing the administration rules that exist only in football to avoid their responsibilities.  The board took the seeds from the Sky money and are attempting to grow a crop.  The only problem is that teams that get relegated are given more sunflowers than we can grow, and also live hand-to-mouth.   Even if I don''t agree with all the spending, I can see what they''re trying to do, and to an extent nobody would mind that much, if key players had been brought in at key moments, if Worthington had gone sooner (with hindsight), if Grant hadn''t imploded.If you have a firm with a turnover of, say,  50 million per year, it should be a lot easier to find 10 or 15 million for one departments'' wages than if you have a firm with a turnover of 15 million.  Once you get there, you can compete for the best talent available at this level.  I''m guessing that this is the goal for the board.[quote]Have you heard about the plans for a new multi-storey car-park? What will it be next?[/quote]  I hadn''t heard about plans for that, but I''m not surprised.  Parking around that end of the city is atrocious, especially on match days, and after the initial expenditure it could be a good earner for the club.  I wonder how much the car park by the riverside development makes its'' owners per year.  I bet they covered their costs within 2 years and are making a nice profit now.

[FilletTheFishWife . 0]

[quote user="Big Down Under"]Blah Blah Blah - well said!

Mello - you hit on some interesting points. The traditional fan is being priced out up and down the country. How many original Chelsea fans can afford the Stamford Bridge experience these days? This is why lots of clubs have lower gates now than a few years ago, lots of fans can''t afford it any more and/or just don''t relate to the egos of the players.

I used to regularly attend Fulham as both normal fan and sponsor (I knew people at a company who was a sponsor, the office was mainly women, therefore frequently spare tickets). However ''nice'' it was to have a gin and tonic before the match and exchange pleasentaries with George Cohen, I much preferred to have a few pints in the nearest pub and grabbing a pie at half time.

But surely at Norwich, we do cater for all pockets and tastes. Didn''t the board get criticised on here when it was announced our pies are the third best in Europe? But aren''t pies the traditional football food? They would be absolutely crazy to not try and maximise profit from the executive boxes, they exist at all football clubs, but as long as they cater to all spending levels and make a profit from it all, why the criticism?
[/quote]

 

.....and yet there were those who suggested we almost volunteer a 20% hike in season ticket prices in the naive hope that the extra income would be invested in the playing squad.

[Mr.Carrow 378]

[quote user="blahblahblah"][quote]The team have come a poor second to infrastructure for years and we have gone from being a regular in the top league to struggling to stay in the second league. Time for a change of focus perhaps??[/quote]

The key to this is basically an ideological question : Do you want NCFC to try to operate independently of TV money ?   To put it another way, if you are given a sunflower seed, do you eat it or plant it ?  Most of our competitors live hand to mouth, running themselves into the ground, and then abusing the administration rules that exist only in football to avoid their responsibilities.  The board took the seeds from the Sky money and are attempting to grow a crop.  The only problem is that teams that get relegated are given more sunflowers than we can grow, and also live hand-to-mouth.   Even if I don''t agree with all the spending, I can see what they''re trying to do, and to an extent nobody would mind that much, if key players had been brought in at key moments, if Worthington had gone sooner (with hindsight), if Grant hadn''t imploded.

If you have a firm with a turnover of, say,  50 million per year, it should be a lot easier to find 10 or 15 million for one departments'' wages than if you have a firm with a turnover of 15 million.  Once you get there, you can compete for the best talent available at this level.  I''m guessing that this is the goal for the board.

[quote]Have you heard about the plans for a new multi-storey car-park? What will it be next?[/quote] 

I hadn''t heard about plans for that, but I''m not surprised.  Parking around that end of the city is atrocious, especially on match days, and after the initial expenditure it could be a good earner for the club.  I wonder how much the car park by the riverside development makes its'' owners per year.  I bet they covered their costs within 2 years and are making a nice profit now.
[/quote]

This is basically the same argument as those who defend the Chase regime use-look at the great facilities and profit on the land he bought, conveniently forgetting that the money spent nearly sent the club to the wall and consigned it to the second division for nine years just as the sky millions started to be pumped into the Prem. Was it worth it? Hardly.

I would say we are now in a similar position with £3million of short-term debts to pay for infrastructure due by the end of next year whilst trying to stave off relegation to the old third division. Alot of the revenue from the off-pitch stuff is closely linked to the performance of the team. Will the infill/restuarants/executive boxes be full if we are relegated or continue in the bottom half of this league for the next few years? Will there be a buyer for the land with the current economic uncertainty? I`m sure we`ve been through all this before.....

The attitude seems to be never gamble on the pitch but gamble massively off it. It failed once under Chase and it ain`t going too well at the moment is it? Change of approach required?

[Paradox 0]

Chill Mello.

I think you have missed the point.

Firstly, I only told you where I live & what I do, as you wrongly accused me of being Mr Blackstock (???!!)

Secondly, comparing salaries of workers in Norfolk to London is relative. Bearing in mind house prices, living costs, etc, I don''t think that a local NCFC supporter necesserily has much more personal disposable income. Then there is the cost of travelling back to home games every other week.

Then you ask about the majority of fans wanting & only being able to afford pints, pies & chips. Correct me if I am wrong, but are not not bars all over the ground that do just this? Also, there is also riverside, which has bars a plenty. Delia''s restaurant is sold out every matchday and makes profit for the club. How can any activity that makes profit for the club be a bad thing?

Speaking of chips, I think I can see something yellow, crispy & made of potato on your shoulder.

[Mello Yello 2,302]

[quote user="Paradox"]

Chill Mello.

I think you have missed the point.

Firstly, I only told you where I live & what I do, as you wrongly accused me of being Mr Blackstock (???!!)

Secondly, comparing salaries of workers in Norfolk to London is relative. Bearing in mind house prices, living costs, etc, I don''t think that a local NCFC supporter necesserily has much more personal disposable income. Then there is the cost of travelling back to home games every other week.

Then you ask about the majority of fans wanting & only being able to afford pints, pies & chips. Correct me if I am wrong, but are not not bars all over the ground that do just this? Also, there is also riverside, which has bars a plenty. Delia''s restaurant is sold out every matchday and makes profit for the club. How can any activity that makes profit for the club be a bad thing?

Speaking of chips, I think I can see something yellow, crispy & made of potato on your shoulder.

[/quote]

Speaking of chips, I think I can see something yellow, crispy & made of potato on your shoulder. "Yes, and I''d rather you didn''t rest your starchy greasy head on my shoulder, thanks very much."

No chip on my shoulder Parrotbox, me ole Pedigree Chum.........although, I do possess a large cod-piece.

Do you actually attend many NCFC games on a frequent basis, and do you ever venture into the riverside or ''external'' watering holes and ''local'' food outlets? The quality, quantity and prices are considerably much cheaper, than what one purchases/consumes inside the Stadium. How much for a bottle of beer in the Jarrold concourse! And if you are at the rear of the waiting hordes......well, one may go without. Of course the restaurant''s in the stadium are busy, the majority of diners come with the match day corporate package and many others are regular patrons who can afford the menu and prefer to not rub shoulders with chavs, oiks and the great unwashed........And the millions made from these most exquisite refreshment venues (and by the kind donation from the Majorette Shareholder) - are ploughed wholeheartedly into purchasing football''s finest for NCFC an'' all that. The names of these ''brillo ball skilled dazzlers'', are all printed on the back of the match-day programme. All of ''em......a future sell on asset and pure gems.

I also accept and am  fully aware and conversant with the common fact, that any activity that makes profit for the club cannot be a bad thing......But, does road-tax always go back into the roads?..... 

We are so very fortunate to have a Celebrideee chef as an Icon, so that she can promote the dining facilities on the back of her good name. I am also cheered by the fact that you think that Norfolk wages are ''on par'' and just as competitive, as those from ''The Smoke'' and Hertfordshire......Can you hazard a guess how many of the Stadium surrounding trendy apartamentos, are actually occupied by the local populace - that leap weekdays in the morn on a chuffa puffa to Liverpool Street to work in a factory, a retail outlet or a building site etc?   

Is that a Cuckoo on your shoulder?

Shall we carry on......or leave it at that?[O] 

 

 

  

[BlyBlyBabes 0]

[quote user="Paradox"]

Chill Mello.

I think you have missed the point.

Firstly, I only told you where I live & what I do, as you wrongly accused me of being Mr Blackstock (???!!)

Secondly, comparing salaries of workers in Norfolk to London is relative. Bearing in mind house prices, living costs, etc, I don''t think that a local NCFC supporter necesserily has much more personal disposable income. Then there is the cost of travelling back to home games every other week.

Then you ask about the majority of fans wanting & only being able to afford pints, pies & chips. Correct me if I am wrong, but are not not bars all over the ground that do just this? Also, there is also riverside, which has bars a plenty. Delia''s restaurant is sold out every matchday and makes profit for the club. How can any activity that makes profit for the club be a bad thing?

Speaking of chips, I think I can see something yellow, crispy & made of potato on your shoulder.

[/quote]

Where is there one scintilla of evidence that Delia''s restaurant makes a real profit for the club? And please don''t go off track by regaling us with the catering ''profit''.

By the way, did you know that some people are so well-balanced they have a chip on each shoulder?

OTBC

 

 

[Big Down Under 0]

This is basically the same argument as those who defend the Chase

regime use-look at the great facilities and profit on the land he

bought, conveniently forgetting that the money spent nearly sent the

club to the wall and consigned it to the second division for nine

years just as the sky millions started to be pumped into the Prem. Was

it worth it? Hardly.

I would say we are now in a similar position with £3million of

short-term debts to pay for infrastructure due by the end of next year

whilst trying to stave off relegation to the old third division. Alot

of the revenue from the off-pitch stuff is closely linked to the

performance of the team. Will the infill/restuarants/executive boxes be

full if we are relegated or continue in the bottom half of this league

for the next few years? Will there be a buyer for the land with the

current economic uncertainty? I`m sure we`ve been through all this

before.....

The attitude seems to be never gamble on the pitch but gamble

massively off it. It failed once under Chase and it ain`t going too

well at the moment is it? Change of approach required?

Chase dismantled a team to pay for off pitch activities at a time when it wasn''t necessary, and when it was obvious that staying in the Premiership would provide greater returns. In doing so he ruined the best chance we had of gaining the Premiership riches. The current board are trying to maximise revenue with a long term view, at a time when mere survival is at stake in a hugely inflated market.

I don''t believe you really think ''investing'' in players carries the same risk as investing in bricks and mortar. Despite economic ups and downs property prices on average double every every 7 years.

Yes some of the investments will suffer if we get relegated. However so far the board have had enough money to invest in the club to reverse our fortunes - Roeder isn''t cheap, neitehr are loans. Roeder states he has money to spend in Jan. One thing that WILL damage the revenue from the corporate hospitality / restaurant is the loss of Delia, she is a great PR tool for them both, that reaches far outside any football zone of influence.

Come on Mr Carrow you can do better than this!

[Mr.Carrow 378]

It would be difficult to do any worse than that Big Down Under. If you honestly believe all that nonsense then maybe we should call it a day.

We have already made a massive profit in the transfer market this year (again) and a small proportion of this has paid for Roeder and the loans, the rest, despite the claims it would all be re-invested, has largely been allocated to cover running costs judging by Doncasters` statement on the matter. So what will ride to the clubs rescue in the next few years BDU? Do we realistically have any players left of any real value? What we have is one big illiquid asset which is a parcel of land (not yet fully paid for) which we cannot easily flog off to the highest bidder like Ashton, Green etc. Even if you believe there will be a buyer in the current economic turmoil it`s likely to be a complicated, drawn out affair. I hope that the likes of you are ready to dig deep if there is no buyer.

[Scottlarock 3]

I''m not ''against'' the catering at Carrow Rd. I mean i don''t want them banned obviously :-). However Delias Canary Catering would not exist without the stadium/club footing the bill for rent and subsidising wages (staff have matchday roles as well as non match days). If the catering operation stood alone it would fold. It isn''t a catering operation, it''s facility catering - no more, no less. The supposed increase in trade over the last few years has NOTHING to do with the perception of quality or improvement of the offer. It''s because of the increase in prosperity of the City and the explosion of businesses and residences RIGHT NEXT to the stadium. The other thing to note is that although the turnover has increased to 4mill there is a residual amount of trade there anyway - Canary catering runs the stadium on non match days, there are plenty functions that have no catering whatsoever but the turnover goes onto the ''catering''. Smokey mirror stuff :-)   I worked for the the pre Delia catering team at the end of the nineties - when Gordon Bennett was CEO and Doomcaster was floating around in the background. Rioch and Hamilton were in charge. It''s great now, we actually have someone who works for the club who actually knows about Football - Glenn Roeder. There hasn''t been one since Rioch.

[Paradox 0]

Good banter Mello. Like it & fair points all round.

Happy Christmas!!!!

[Bill 1,788]

" those who defend the Chase

regime "Yes what a naughty man. We were playing in Europe,  appearing in FA Cup finals and finishing 3rd in the Ptremiership before he turned up.

[Bigmarkcanary 0]

[quote user="City1st"]" those who defend the Chase regime "

Yes what a naughty man. We were playing in Europe,  appearing in FA Cup finals and finishing 3rd in the Ptremiership before he turned up.
[/quote]

Two out of the three things that you mention are indeed correct, but I don''t recall any FA Cup finals. Milk Cup final yes, but not FA Cup City1st.

[Big Down Under 0]

[quote user="Mr.Carrow"]

It would be difficult to do any worse than that Big Down Under. If you honestly believe all that nonsense then maybe we should call it a day.

We have already made a massive profit in the transfer market this year (again) and a small proportion of this has paid for Roeder and the loans, the rest, despite the claims it would all be re-invested, has largely been allocated to cover running costs judging by Doncasters` statement on the matter. So what will ride to the clubs rescue in the next few years BDU? Do we realistically have any players left of any real value? What we have is one big illiquid asset which is a parcel of land (not yet fully paid for) which we cannot easily flog off to the highest bidder like Ashton, Green etc. Even if you believe there will be a buyer in the current economic turmoil it`s likely to be a complicated, drawn out affair. I hope that the likes of you are ready to dig deep if there is no buyer.

[/quote]If you can''t actually argue any specific points successfully then yes you should call it a day. We don''t need a white knight investor. We are in our current predicament (league table wise) because of a disaster of a manager. We now have a good manager (agree best since Rioch, mayber better than him too) who openly states we have a budget to spend. Why the hysteria from some quarters? Things are looking up.