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Shifty Sid

FAO: Delia & Restuarant Bashers

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For all those short-sighted people that are against the restuarants etc at Carrow Road, here are some small facts...1)  The kitchen refurbishment cost a mere £60,0002)  The annual turnover of Canary Catering is £4,000,0003)  This directly translates to £500,000 extra funds per year, for the transfer budget4)  Catering at NCFC is among the best in Europe (only bettered by Arsenal and Barcelona)Perhaps you''d still like to see the catering operation shutdown and the transfer budget slashed by half a million?  It''s not a distraction, it''s not an obsession by Delia.  It is a money-making initiative that''s doing very well and is the envy of a lot of other clubs.I don''t have the facts and figures for the hotel but I know it cost the club next to nothing and will potentially rake in a significant amount of money in the long-term.  Anyone with an ounce of business sense knows that new ventures don''t make millions from day one, these things take time.All I am saying is that a lot of people here are keen to criticise these things, but they don''t see the bigger picture.  I''m sure some will argue it''s merely Delia building up the infrastructure to boost the share value.  That''s her perogative.  She''s the one that waives £60,000 per year interest due on the loans she made to NCFC (loans which have no ''due'' date and which are for all intents and purposes, a gift).If you want her gone, then who''s going to come in.  As she has said herself, there is hardly a queue of people lining up waving big fat cheques.  If you think someone will come in and buy her out then contact them yourselves - I have written to several business people, Richard Branson included and the answer has always been the same - not interested!The board are not without their faults, but they have done some good for NCFC too.  In my opinion, all they have done wrong in the past 10 years is (a) to not remove Worthington soon enough and (B) to appoint a manager with no experience to replace him.  I think they have learnt from both these mistakes and have started to right a few wrongs.On the subject of Taylor - before people get carried away, lets see what January brings.  We couldn''t have bought him until January 1st in any event - and it was Birmingham City, not Taylor or Doncaster that prevented him re-signing on loan.Lets stop all the in-fighting and get behind the club and those that run it.  Now is not the time for replacing the board - leave that until May, when were safely in mid-table.  Even then, be careful what you wish for.  We wished for Worthington to be gone - and look what we got to replace him....

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With all that money supposedly coming from catering and the hotel can you please explain to me why, after three years of Sky money worth £32m, season-ticket sell-outs and player sales of £16m, we have a squad which cost less than £5m to assemble? Please don`t mention player wages as they have been much lower as a percentage of income since promotion than before it. And why do the board still tell us that all money recieved from selling players is re-invested in the team, when it obviously isn`t true?

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[quote user="Mr.Carrow"]With all that money supposedly coming from catering and the hotel can you please explain to me why, after three years of Sky money worth £32m, season-ticket sell-outs and player sales of £16m, we have a squad which cost less than £5m to assemble? Please don`t mention player wages as they have been much lower as a percentage of income since promotion than before it. And why do the board still tell us that all money recieved from selling players is re-invested in the team, when it obviously isn`t true?[/quote]

I second that Mr. Carrow.

I am however glad to see that we have a stream of income from off field activites but its only ever going to be a drop in the ocean.

Ipswich fans might be eating crap grub but they have had a £30 million debt written off and are looking forward to a £12 million lump sum for team building.

Our Owners and Board are playing a 20th Century game in being a well run little family club who take no risks and are grateful to remain as they are.

Meanwhile those with real ambition have realised that we are now in a different ballpark. The rewards for success are now greater than ever and show no sign of declining.

To be part of this new world only the rich need apply.

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[quote user="Shifty Sid"]  We wished for Worthington to be gone - and look what we got to replace him....
[/quote]

And who chose the fit and proper person to take over from Worthington?  This lot in charge spout "prudence with ambition" one minute, then recklessly gamble on an unproven coach as manager.  Join up that thinking for me if you will.

And arguing that "there''s nobody to come in" is not a valid excuse to continue with the status quo.  If it is, it''s the poorest of reasons.

So, in summary - more board apologist nonsense.

 

 

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[quote user="Mr.Carrow"]With all that money supposedly coming from catering and the hotel can you please explain to me why, after three years of Sky money worth £32m, season-ticket sell-outs and player sales of £16m, we have a squad which cost less than £5m to assemble? Please don`t mention player wages as they have been much lower as a percentage of income since promotion than before it. And why do the board still tell us that all money recieved from selling players is re-invested in the team, when it obviously isn`t true?[/quote]

 

That question will never be answered.

Sometimes i wonder if the board even knows where the money has gone.

But cold hard facts do show that there has been next to no investment in the team considering the players that have come and gone.

And we made some good money on one or two, and even though the money was meant to be put back in the team, it wasnt.

We have a cheap squad at the moment, lets hope glen can get them looking more valuable than they are, because i dont see how money for transfers will be provided for unless we get some mug to buy some of our "stars".

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[quote user="Shifty Sid"]For all those short-sighted people that are against the restuarants etc at Carrow Road, here are some small facts...

1)  The kitchen refurbishment cost a mere £60,000
2)  The annual turnover of Canary Catering is £4,000,000
3)  This directly translates to £500,000 extra funds per year, for the transfer budget
4)  Catering at NCFC is among the best in Europe (only bettered by Arsenal and Barcelona)

[/quote]

 

and heres 1 great big fact for you... according to the annual accounts they DO NOT run at a profit....

explain that then

jas :)

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I second the opinion that the restaurant is fantastic & Delia has done a great job for the club in this respect. our facilities are the envy of many other clubs. So I do take issue with ''restaurant bashers'' too. So long as these keep making profit for the club, no matter how much, then that a positive contribution & should be welcomed. As should any partnerships, be they fuel, travel, bank accounts, etc.

But I do agree that, as fans, we have been also been misled with regards to player funds. Every time we sold an earnie, greeno, Dickson, safri, we were told that 100% of they cash was to go into the transfer budget - this did not happen. I would understand if they were just honest about as it is very clear that running a football club is a very difficult achievement if you are trying to make profit, but there have been many times where fans hopes have been raised, then this player budget has dissapeared, presumabley into the running costs of the club.

Anyway, in summary, lay off Delia & co for their work in the restaurants. Yep, they made a mistake by leaving worthy for too long & also appointing Grant. But Roeder appears a very good appointment & I hope that he is given decent funds to build his own team. Turners? Still confused as to what their contribution to the club has been???? 

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[quote user="Shifty Sid"]

3)  This directly translates to £500,000 extra funds per year, for the transfer budget
4)  Catering at NCFC is among the best in Europe (only bettered by Arsenal and Barcelona)

[/quote]

How much of the £500k (or is it £600k - difficult to tell with the graphs in the Accounts. Why can''t they produce figures instead of the graphs?) "profit" from the Catering side is generated by the matchday bar takings, i.e., not restaurant?

Secondly being third in terms of European catering means exactly what in terms of the football?

 

 

 

 

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[quote user="Shifty Sid"]For all those short-sighted people that are against the restuarants etc at Carrow Road, here are some small facts...

1)  The kitchen refurbishment cost a mere £60,000
2)  The annual turnover of Canary Catering is £4,000,000
3)  This directly translates to £500,000 extra funds per year, for the transfer budget
4)  Catering at NCFC is among the best in Europe (only bettered by Arsenal and Barcelona)

Perhaps you''d still like to see the catering operation shutdown and the transfer budget slashed by half a million?  It''s not a distraction, it''s not an obsession by Delia.  It is a money-making initiative that''s doing very well and is the envy of a lot of other clubs.

I don''t have the facts and figures for the hotel but I know it cost the club next to nothing and will potentially rake in a significant amount of money in the long-term.  Anyone with an ounce of business sense knows that new ventures don''t make millions from day one, these things take time.

All I am saying is that a lot of people here are keen to criticise these things, but they don''t see the bigger picture.  I''m sure some will argue it''s merely Delia building up the infrastructure to boost the share value.  That''s her perogative.  She''s the one that waives £60,000 per year interest due on the loans she made to NCFC (loans which have no ''due'' date and which are for all intents and purposes, a gift).

If you want her gone, then who''s going to come in.  As she has said herself, there is hardly a queue of people lining up waving big fat cheques.  If you think someone will come in and buy her out then contact them yourselves - I have written to several business people, Richard Branson included and the answer has always been the same - not interested!

The board are not without their faults, but they have done some good for NCFC too.  In my opinion, all they have done wrong in the past 10 years is (a) to not remove Worthington soon enough and (B) to appoint a manager with no experience to replace him.  I think they have learnt from both these mistakes and have started to right a few wrongs.

On the subject of Taylor - before people get carried away, lets see what January brings.  We couldn''t have bought him until January 1st in any event - and it was Birmingham City, not Taylor or Doncaster that prevented him re-signing on loan.

Lets stop all the in-fighting and get behind the club and those that run it.  Now is not the time for replacing the board - leave that until May, when were safely in mid-table.  Even then, be careful what you wish for.  We wished for Worthington to be gone - and look what we got to replace him....
[/quote]

Also, because od Delia and the first class facilities at Carrow Road much of the capital cooking equipment in all the kitchens was donated by the leading manufacturers in return for Carrow Road to be used a reference site for potential customers.

So while the figure stands at £60,000, the reality is they have got a facility that would cost at least double that.

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[quote user="the1englishman"]

That question will never be answered.

[/quote]By law its answered each year in the annual accounts. Take a look

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" ipswich fans might be eating crap grub but they have had a £30 million

debt written off and are looking forward to a £12 million lump sum for

team building."ABSOLUTE NONSENSE ! ! !Assuming the handover of the club goes ahead tonight, Ipswich Town FC will STILL owe £32m. MEI will also have the ability to help themselves to this as they see fit." which, while not extinguishing the club''s liability "The mythical lump sum of £12m amounts to mostly creative accounting to cover up the accumulated year on year losses.Of course the shysters down the A140 are going to put a ''positive'' spin on it, just as they did when they claimed that the building of the two stands have been fully costed, that the loan payments could be met outside of the Premiership and at the very AGM before they defaulted on (and robbed locals of ) millions they was no problem with the club''s finances. This is no more than a dressed up asset stripping exercise. The paupers have little or no choice in the matter. On another matter I have to sit close to one of these ''mouth frothers'' who at pretty regular intervals incants ''football must come first'', as if the mere saying of it will make everything right. No sense of irony that he says this whilst sitting in one of the new seats and happily dives out early to get grub at halftime. Maybe these cretins could break away like the AFC Wimbledon fans and find a ploughed field where barefoot players could kick around a bundle of rags whilst other gawp over the hedge bleating football must come first.

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[quote user="City1st"]" ipswich fans might be eating crap grub but they have had a £30 million debt written off and are looking forward to a £12 million lump sum for team building."

ABSOLUTE NONSENSE ! ! !

Assuming the handover of the club goes ahead tonight, Ipswich Town FC will STILL owe £32m. MEI will also have the ability to help themselves to this as they see fit.

" which, while not extinguishing the club''s liability "

The mythical lump sum of £12m amounts to mostly creative accounting to cover up the accumulated year on year losses.

Of course the shysters down the A140 are going to put a ''positive'' spin on it, just as they did when they claimed that the building of the two stands have been fully costed, that the loan payments could be met outside of the Premiership and at the very AGM before they defaulted on (and robbed locals of ) millions they was no problem with the club''s finances. This is no more than a dressed up asset stripping exercise. The paupers have little or no choice in the matter.

On another matter I have to sit close to one of these ''mouth frothers'' who at pretty regular intervals incants ''football must come first'', as if the mere saying of it will make everything right. No sense of irony that he says this whilst sitting in one of the new seats and happily dives out early to get grub at halftime.

Maybe these cretins could break away like the AFC Wimbledon fans and find a ploughed field where barefoot players could kick around a bundle of rags whilst other gawp over the hedge bleating football must come first.
[/quote]

May i just add the the very same ''cretins'' who say football must come first are the same people who are more and more peed off with the way things are going on field. Now if you take the 10000 ''cretins'' away who pay good money to watch ''Football'' i doubt the bars and restaurants will be making the very little profit they are currently making. Believe me when i say that catering often delievers big turn over and very little profit. Maybe if we invested in the much talked about academy we could produce players that would cover the catering side for at least 10 years!

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[quote user="Shifty Sid"]For all those short-sighted people that are against the restuarants etc at Carrow Road, here are some small facts...

1)  The kitchen refurbishment cost a mere £60,000
2)  The annual turnover of Canary Catering is £4,000,000
3)  This directly translates to £500,000 extra funds per year, for the transfer budget
4)  Catering at NCFC is among the best in Europe (only bettered by Arsenal and Barcelona)

Perhaps you''d still like to see the catering operation shutdown and the transfer budget slashed by half a million?  It''s not a distraction, it''s not an obsession by Delia.  It is a money-making initiative that''s doing very well and is the envy of a lot of other clubs.

I don''t have the facts and figures for the hotel but I know it cost the club next to nothing and will potentially rake in a significant amount of money in the long-term.  Anyone with an ounce of business sense knows that new ventures don''t make millions from day one, these things take time.

All I am saying is that a lot of people here are keen to criticise these things, but they don''t see the bigger picture.  I''m sure some will argue it''s merely Delia building up the infrastructure to boost the share value.  That''s her perogative.  She''s the one that waives £60,000 per year interest due on the loans she made to NCFC (loans which have no ''due'' date and which are for all intents and purposes, a gift).

If you want her gone, then who''s going to come in.  As she has said herself, there is hardly a queue of people lining up waving big fat cheques.  If you think someone will come in and buy her out then contact them yourselves - I have written to several business people, Richard Branson included and the answer has always been the same - not interested!

The board are not without their faults, but they have done some good for NCFC too.  In my opinion, all they have done wrong in the past 10 years is (a) to not remove Worthington soon enough and (B) to appoint a manager with no experience to replace him.  I think they have learnt from both these mistakes and have started to right a few wrongs.

On the subject of Taylor - before people get carried away, lets see what January brings.  We couldn''t have bought him until January 1st in any event - and it was Birmingham City, not Taylor or Doncaster that prevented him re-signing on loan.

Lets stop all the in-fighting and get behind the club and those that run it.  Now is not the time for replacing the board - leave that until May, when were safely in mid-table.  Even then, be careful what you wish for.  We wished for Worthington to be gone - and look what we got to replace him....
[/quote]

Thankyou for that most informative post........Marco.[:|]

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[quote user="Paradox"]

I second the opinion that the restaurant is fantastic & Delia has done a great job for the club in this respect. our facilities are the envy of many other clubs. So I do take issue with ''restaurant bashers'' too. So long as these keep making profit for the club, no matter how much, then that a positive contribution & should be welcomed. As should any partnerships, be they fuel, travel, bank accounts, etc.

But I do agree that, as fans, we have been also been misled with regards to player funds. Every time we sold an earnie, greeno, Dickson, safri, we were told that 100% of they cash was to go into the transfer budget - this did not happen. I would understand if they were just honest about as it is very clear that running a football club is a very difficult achievement if you are trying to make profit, but there have been many times where fans hopes have been raised, then this player budget has dissapeared, presumabley into the running costs of the club.

Anyway, in summary, lay off Delia & co for their work in the restaurants. Yep, they made a mistake by leaving worthy for too long & also appointing Grant. But Roeder appears a very good appointment & I hope that he is given decent funds to build his own team. Turners? Still confused as to what their contribution to the club has been???? 

[/quote]

Delia, very much appreciates your support Mr Blackstock.[:|]

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[quote user="Mello Yello"]Delia, very much appreciates your support Mr Blackstock.[:|][/quote]

 

Now now Mello, surely not everyone who thinks that what the board do is a good thing is an employee ?  I mean, I know there''s a lot of staff there, but surely they''re doing their jobs, not posting on here all day ?

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" Now if you take the 10000 ''cretins'' away  "And your evidence for this number, other than your usual over excited imagination.

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[quote user="blahblahblah"]

[quote user="Mello Yello"]Delia, very much appreciates your support Mr Blackstock.[:|][/quote]

 

Now now Mello, surely not everyone who thinks that what the board do is a good thing is an employee ?  I mean, I know there''s a lot of staff there, but surely they''re doing their jobs, not posting on here all day ?

[/quote]

We are surrounded by club employee''s......I can hear their whisperings, their murmurings, their formation fingering of NCFC keyboard''s - and their plottings to belittle and suppress the anti-boardist battalion!

The DONKSTER DRONES are on the march!....Right here! Right NOW!....."Pfraap" "Guff" "Pfaaart" "Pump"........"Can''t you smell ''em!?" [:|]

 

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[quote user="City1st"]" Now if you take the 10000 ''cretins'' away  "

And your evidence for this number, other than your usual over excited imagination.


[/quote]

To those folk who contribute to this forum, how many of you (including City1st)  will actually and honestly use ''Yellows'' on matchdays.......Or prefer to utilise alternative food venues - and socialise ''pre-and-post match'' in non-NCFC establishments?

Morrison''s and the Coach an'' Horses for me.

 

 

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Regardless on what peoples'' views on this are, it is an informative and interesting post from Shifty Sid about the numbers on the NCFC catering. Thanks, Tim

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[quote user="jas the barclay king"]

and heres 1 great big fact for you... according to the annual accounts they DO NOT run at a profit....

explain that then

jas :)

[/quote]

Perhaps you would like to explain.

Oh you can''t as you are talking out of your Royal Barclay Ass.

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Three cardinal principles of business are being missed here.

(a) Concentrate on the core business to avoid the dispersal of investible funds and executive talent.

(b) Pump up cash flow from the core business.

(c) Make the core business attractive to additional investment.

Can anybody truthfully say, hand on heart, that City boards over the past 11 years have adhered to these principles?

My contention is that rhey have not and therefore stand guilty as charged.

OTBC

 

 

 

 

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[quote user="Shifty Sid"]
As she has said herself, there is hardly a queue of people lining up waving big fat cheques.  [/quote]

No, but if we feed up David Strihavka, you never know.

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[quote user="Mr.Carrow"]With all that money supposedly coming from catering and the hotel can you please explain to me why, after three years of Sky money worth £32m, season-ticket sell-outs and player sales of £16m, we have a squad which cost less than £5m to assemble? Please don`t mention player wages as they have been much lower as a percentage of income since promotion than before it. And why do the board still tell us that all money recieved from selling players is re-invested in the team, when it obviously isn`t true?[/quote]

Forget the platitudes, can anyone answer these two questions please? If the answer is "no" please try to have an unbiased think as to why not.

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[quote user="T07"][quote user="the1englishman"]

That question will never be answered.

[/quote]

By law its answered each year in the annual accounts. Take a look
[/quote]

To quote an accountant friend of mine: "I can make a set of accounts paint whatever picture they want to paint.....".

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[quote user="Mello Yello"][quote user="blahblahblah"]

[quote user="Mello Yello"]Delia, very much appreciates your support Mr Blackstock.[:|][/quote]

 

Now now Mello, surely not everyone who thinks that what the board do is a good thing is an employee ?  I mean, I know there''s a lot of staff there, but surely they''re doing their jobs, not posting on here all day ?

[/quote]

We are surrounded by club employee''s......I can hear their whisperings, their murmurings, their formation fingering of NCFC keyboard''s - and their plottings to belittle and suppress the anti-boardist battalion!

The DONKSTER DRONES are on the march!....Right here! Right NOW!....."Pfraap" "Guff" "Pfaaart" "Pump"........"Can''t you smell ''em!?" [:|]

 

[/quote]I assumed that was the drains, but I''m not lighting any matches, just in case...

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[quote user="Big Ginge"][quote user="jas the barclay king"]

and heres 1 great big fact for you... according to the annual accounts they DO NOT run at a profit....

explain that then

jas :)

[/quote]

Perhaps you would like to explain.

Oh you can''t as you are talking out of your Royal Barclay Ass.

[/quote]

 

Are you the "Big Ginge" who works in the catering department at FCR?

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[quote user="Mr.Carrow"][quote user="T07"][quote user="the1englishman"]

That question will never be answered.

[/quote]

By law its answered each year in the annual accounts. Take a look
[/quote]

To quote an accountant friend of mine: "I can make a set of accounts paint whatever picture they want to paint.....".

[/quote]

Exactly, Mr. Carrow. That is why the debate will go on ad infinitum - but please keep your end up, healthy debate is vital for those of who are unpersuaded (but persuadable).

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