6 out of 46 away games!!

[hopeful canary 0]

What is wrong with us away from home?

[The Original Yellow Fever 0]

Somebody on the phone in tonight stated that out of the last 46 league game played we have only won 6. I am probably not the only one shocked by these stats. The guy phoning in made real sense and hats off to him.

Something must be done before it''s too late!

[USAcanary 0]

I love it when the KTF keep saying that fans are upset over 1 or 2 results.

I dont want Worthy out because of 1 or 2 games.

We have a really small sqaud with a lack of quality coming through from the youth team.

I guess if we want quality youth players we need to bid  2 million to get them.

We need a whole shake up in our management.

[Mark Smith 0]

Not only that, but he mentioned that we''ve conceded 92 goals during those games. This is an absolutely abysmal statistic. I don''t know how anyone could justify that.

[sussexcanary 0]

They can''t (the KTF) there only defence is to have a go at us for whinging and not being proper fans.  We just want whats best for this club thats all.  If getting Worthy out makes me disloyal then great i can live with that. 

[charlies dad 0]

Its abysmal, shameful, disgraceful, disgusting. KTF.  

[blahblahblah 2]

It''s a poor record, but it''s as relevent as the number of previous wins for Oxford and Cambridge in the boat race.

Those 40+ away games represent a Premiership season where we did as most people expected, and a championship season where we underperformed.  Fair enough.  The manager was taken on on the understanding that he would be learning on the job.  Why throw away the benefits of his experience ?

But we''re not playing like we did last season, are we ?  So why bring last season up ?  It''s as much in the past as the Championship winning season is.

Stats that matter :

5th in the table after 7 games.  Most of us would have taken that at the start of August.  Only 3 points ahead of 17th though (Foghorn seems quiet at the moment so I''ll say it for him).

Current top scorer in the championship : Robert Earnshaw - 6 goals in 7 games.

13 goals scored, 10 against.  A suggestion there that we need to be more professional in closing games off, and in defence generally to compete.

3 wins, 2 draws, 2 defeats - again, an acceptable start.

Home results - W W W - Can''t say fairer than that.

Away results - L D L D. - Must try harder.

What these stats don''t show is the potential we can all see in the performcances (apart from at Coventry) to do better.  We could have come away from Leeds with at least a point, we should have beaten Southend.  On that basis we could / should be 2nd.  We weren''t showing this potential last season, and that''s why 6 away wins in 40+ is irrelevent, but this seasons away form is a subject for concern.

 

[alex_ncfc 662]

Christ! I am sick and tired of people making excuses for what can only be termed as our totally gutless and pathetic away form! Just because we were in the Premiership makes the fact that we didn''t win one single game away from home ok? Give me a break.

[koimatsuba 0]

[quote user="blahblahblah"]

It''s a poor record, but it''s as relevent as the number of previous wins for Oxford and Cambridge in the boat race.

Those 40+ away games represent a Premiership season where we did as most people expected, and a championship season where we underperformed.  Fair enough.  The manager was taken on on the understanding that he would be learning on the job.  Why throw away the benefits of his experience ?

But we''re not playing like we did last season, are we ?  So why bring last season up ?  It''s as much in the past as the Championship winning season is.

Stats that matter :

5th in the table after 7 games.  Most of us would have taken that at the start of August.  Only 3 points ahead of 17th though (Foghorn seems quiet at the moment so I''ll say it for him).

Current top scorer in the championship : Robert Earnshaw - 6 goals in 7 games.

13 goals scored, 10 against.  A suggestion there that we need to be more professional in closing games off, and in defence generally to compete.

3 wins, 2 draws, 2 defeats - again, an acceptable start.

Home results - W W W - Can''t say fairer than that.

Away results - L D L D. - Must try harder.

What these stats don''t show is the potential we can all see in the performcances (apart from at Coventry) to do better.  We could have come away from Leeds with at least a point, we should have beaten Southend.  On that basis we could / should be 2nd.  We weren''t showing this potential last season, and that''s why 6 away wins in 40+ is irrelevent, but this seasons away form is a subject for concern.

 

[/quote]

Spot on!!!!!

I''ve looked at the last 4 season tables. To Win the league you MUST win around 15-20 home games and you MUSt WIN around 10+ away games.

Last year we won 6 away

2004 - prem league 0 away

2003 - *** Champ year 10 away ***

2002 - Div1 year - 5 away

2001 - Div 1 year - 7 away - playoffs

IF we win 18-20 games at home and around 9-12 away we can win this league. BUT at present although we are playing well at tiomes we need to shut up shop at the back and give earnie some help upfront.

Injury free we can do it, also getting this away day blues out of our system for good!

Just take a look at the last few league tables for the last 5 years. There is no Man utd/chelsea/arsenal/liverpool/spurs in the top 5. Theres only two teams that pull away from the rest. The next 6 teams are all pretty close.

Anyway, SSDD.

Up the city, lets beat Cplace now AJ''s gone!

Roll on saturday.

Cheers all

[blahblahblah 2]

[quote user="alex_ncfc"]Christ! I am sick and tired of people making excuses for what can only be termed as our totally gutless and pathetic away form! Just because we were in the Premiership makes the fact that we didn''t win one single game away from home ok? Give me a break.[/quote]

That''s exactly my point thuogh Alex.  Our form in the premiership may have been gutless and pathetic, but it''s not current, so it''s irrelevant.  So let''s talk about this seasons'' away matches, eh ?

[alex_ncfc 662]

[quote user="blahblahblah"]

[quote user="alex_ncfc"]Christ! I am sick and tired of people making excuses for what can only be termed as our totally gutless and pathetic away form! Just because we were in the Premiership makes the fact that we didn''t win one single game away from home ok? Give me a break.[/quote]

That''s exactly my point thuogh Alex.  Our form in the premiership may have been gutless and pathetic, but it''s not current, so it''s irrelevant.  So let''s talk about this seasons'' away matches, eh ?

[/quote]

True, but there is yet to be any evidence on the away front that anything has changed. This is down to the manager, as our team now is completely different from the one that struggled away in the playoff season, and also the Premier season - other teams don''t seem to have a problem winning away games do they?

[blahblahblah 2]

[quote user="alex_ncfc"]True, but there is yet to be any evidence on the away front that anything has changed. This is down to the manager, as our team now is completely different from the one that struggled away in the playoff season, and also the Premier season - other teams don''t seem to have a problem winning away games do they?[/quote]

Statistically, I agree with you, we haven''t produced results this season.  I think that most people can see the potential in the side to do better away from home, that potential wasn''t there last season.

 

[my other team is england 0]

so blahblahblah thinks that previous seasons away records are irrelevent does he ? ok then how come that the four teams we have played away from home Leeds;Derby;Coventry and Southend have conceded a total of 32 goals this season and we have failed to score against 3 of them ! There are only 4 teams in the Championship who have conceded more than us so Earnshaw scoring 20 or so goals this season will count for diddley squat if we end up conceding 60 or so at the back which looks to be par for the course at the moment. and blahblahblah talks about our away form potential this season.Coventry are 12th Derby 15th Southend 16th and Leeds a heady 18th.Christ man we have yet to play anyone away from home who has got their season up and running.

[USAcanary 0]

[quote user="blahblahblah"]

[quote user="alex_ncfc"]True, but there is yet to be any evidence on the away front that anything has changed. This is down to the manager, as our team now is completely different from the one that struggled away in the playoff season, and also the Premier season - other teams don''t seem to have a problem winning away games do they?[/quote]

Statistically, I agree with you, we haven''t produced results this season.  I think that most people can see the potential in the side to do better away from home, that potential wasn''t there last season.[/quote]

How many times do you have to trot out short term results to cover up the big picture.

Earnie could score 30 goals but if we are losing 4-3 it doesnt mean much.

We drew against Southend because we lacked quality on the bench because Worthington had let 5 players go and only brought 1 in.

He had all summer yet left it late to put in bids.

Our youth set up has failed to bring through exciting youngsters, instead we bid 2 million for exciting youth players.

Why some of us are upset is because if we dont go up this year we will have wasted the para payments.

Doncaster admitted that THIS YEAR is critical because we will be forced to sell our best players if we dont win promotion.

Then we are left with average younger players with very little coming through to fill the gaps.

Worthys post match rambles are clueless, seriously even the most ardent KTF must be shaking their heads when he talks about "flick farts and fanny"

And then calls for "leadership on the pitch" while failing to bring on the club captain to bring that "very thing" to the pitch.

Maybe Henderson is our new leader.

 

[USAcanary 0]

[quote user="blahblahblah"]

[quote user="alex_ncfc"]Christ! I am sick and tired of people making excuses for what can only be termed as our totally gutless and pathetic away form! Just because we were in the Premiership makes the fact that we didn''t win one single game away from home ok? Give me a break.[/quote]

That''s exactly my point thuogh Alex.  Our form in the premiership may have been gutless and pathetic, but it''s not current, so it''s irrelevant.  So let''s talk about this seasons'' away matches, eh ?

[/quote]

LOL, Thats funny because when we had the debates about signing Sutton you kept trotting out his form last year in the 10 games he played.

Is that now irrelevant because its not current?

 

 

[Rossi 0]

blah x3, without wishing to go into a Meldrew moment, i have to say i cant believe your line on this one.

6 out of 46, failed to score in 23 of those - something the caller failed to mention, and we''ve scored less than a goal a game, some thing like 32.

and in the midst of all that evidence you use your own statistics to counter-argue, those being 7 games this season. Well i know what is more qulaitative and quantifiable, and it isnt yours.

you talk of encouraging performances and that is better than last season - you''d struggle not to find an improvement on last season.

let me put it this way. I''m not an ex-pro, but i do sit and watch things unfold in front of my eyes - trying to get my message on the field when they''ve all gone AWOL - it''s something I''ve done, more or less, for two seasons. Further to that, in all my born days, I''ve never seen a panel of judges hold up scorecards at the end of the game based upon encouarging performances. Jesus, we''re not at school anymore, we dont live in an environment wrapped in cotton wool where the taking part counts, and the onion who fell over in the 3 legged race and never finisged in still a winner.

The team that takes 3 points is the team that manges to score more than the other. Your comments remind me of Waghorn''s days in the prem when we couldn''t get on the team coach without giving 4 goals away - "We''ll survive if we keep playing football." Rubbish.

What last night emphasises is that it''s so long since we''ve been in that position that we forget to remember what to do.

 

[Getting off the fence 0]

[quote user="sussexcanary"]They can''t (the KTF) there only defence is to have a go at us for whinging and not being proper fans.  We just want whats best for this club thats all.  If getting Worthy out makes me disloyal then great i can live with that. [/quote]

Your admission of disloyalty is refreshingly honest, but I don''t think that it advances your cause particularly, whether or not you can live with it.

[USAcanary 0]

[quote user="Getting off the fence"]

[quote user="sussexcanary"]They can''t (the KTF) there only defence is to have a go at us for whinging and not being proper fans.  We just want whats best for this club thats all.  If getting Worthy out makes me disloyal then great i can live with that. [/quote]

Your admission of disloyalty is refreshingly honest, but I don''t think that it advances your cause particularly, whether or not you can live with it.

[/quote]

And you proved his point!

You moaned about him rather than addressing this thread which is about our terrible away form.

Why not actually try and look at the relevent points in the thread instead of ignoring them.

 

[blahblahblah 2]

Here''s the bit where we agree Rossi :

[quote]The team that takes 3 points is the team that manges to score more than the other. [/quote]

However, here -

[quote]6 out of 46, failed to score in 23 of those - something the caller failed to mention, and we''ve scored less than a goal a game, some thing like 32.[/quote]

It''s not relevant to now.  18 of those games were played in the Premiership, and while we could and should have got 2 or 3 away wins in that campaign, you''re deluding yourself to think we were capable of more.  Everyone accepts that last season was not good enough.  Which is why people should be concentrating on 2 draws and 2 losses this season away, which should have been 1 win, 2 draws, and 1 loss, and talking about what went wrong.

Football is a game of fine margins. I accept that we weren''t at the races while away from home last season, or in the Premiership season.  The difference between now and then is that we are getting extremely close to turning losses into draws, and draws into wins.  It''s the reason that we''re all so upset at drawing at Southend. 

I believe we will see more Leeds performances away than Coventry ones this season.  As Koimatsuba said, we need between 6 and 10 away wins this season to compete at the top.  Looking at the league table, I can see us winning 6 or 7 away this season, we won''t throw away every game against the likes of Colchester, Barnsley, or Hull.  If we can improve on 6 or 7 away wins then we have a chance of promotion.

 

[Baldyboy 0]

what you fail to say here blahx3 is that whilst we may see more leeds away than coventry away, the results left us with no bloody points each time so dont matter playing pretty football its results that count! its better to get an ugly 1-0 win than a pretty 1-0 defeat surely?

[blahblahblah 2]

And what I am repeatedly saying throughout this thread is by playing as we did against Leeds, we are closer to getting results than we have been in the last 2 years.  Obviously I''ll be a lot happier when we start to actually win away from home, as we all will be, but the margin of victory / defeat is becoming finer in our away games, and this is why I believe we have an outside chance of promotion this season.

[koimatsuba 0]

In the end lads we have to win away from home!!!

Perhaps getting another defender on loan will help us at the back?

Or are we always going to let a bucket load of goals in away from home?

Earnie top goal scorer with 6. Thanks God, cause without him we would be mid table of worse.

Anyway, What will be will be!

At least the next games at home against the old foe Palace. Without AJ surley we can win now?

IMO worthy doesn''t know how to play away from home. Its his main achilles heal and has been for 4-5 sesons. Lets hope Hunter can change that.

Cheers All.

(what a lift to the crowd Sutton would make for coming on as a sub for the last 20mins!!!!)

[blahblahblah 2]

[quote user="USAcanary"][quote user="blahblahblah"]

[quote user="alex_ncfc"]Christ! I am sick and tired of people making excuses for what can only be termed as our totally gutless and pathetic away form! Just because we were in the Premiership makes the fact that we didn''t win one single game away from home ok? Give me a break.[/quote]

That''s exactly my point thuogh Alex.  Our form in the premiership may have been gutless and pathetic, but it''s not current, so it''s irrelevant.  So let''s talk about this seasons'' away matches, eh ?

[/quote]

LOL, Thats funny because when we had the debates about signing Sutton you kept trotting out his form last year in the 10 games he played.

Is that now irrelevant because its not current?[/quote]

Good question.  It''s probably still relevent, because it relates to his most recent games.

It''s probably not as relevent as the huge, massive, canyon-sized gap between those games and now though.

LOL.

[Rossi 0]

i can agree to disagree blah x 3, but i''d argue that stats are important, the only thing that would not make them so is a change of manager, since the manager asked for us to be judges on his signings and his form.

interesting to see however that whilst hunter has been given all the plaudits for the good form, we hahvent yet decided to blame him for the away form!

you hint that we shouldnt count the prem season as it manipulates the figures in a negative direction - why shouldnt we use these figures  we''d gained promotion to that division on merit and we didnt play any other teams than everyother team in the division. What it does point out was that our ability to concede all too frequently, and fail to win away from home cost us survival. And that, my friend, is exactly why the figures are relevant. It cost us survival, and now it could cost us promotion. The financial implications of those two points are absolutely massive, and just cannot be ignored by any realist

[blahblahblah 2]

[quote]you hint that we shouldnt count the prem season as it manipulates the figures in a negative direction [/quote]

Actually, I hint that we shouldn''t count the prem season because it has no bearing upon now.  I am far more concerned with 2 points from 4 away games.

I want to know why we aren''t winning away games now, not why we didn''t beat Newcastle in August 2004.  I don''t believe the reasons for not beating Newcastle are the same as not beating Southend.

We are getting extremely close to being a very good side in this league, most people that watch the games can see the potential (Cov excluded).  And that is what the stats don''t show.

[mbncfc 1]

I think my memory serves me right...

Mike Walker.

First spell in charge we were the away day specialists. hammering sides for fun, whilst struggling at home to defeat sides.

Second spell? Much improved at home, but sincerely struggling on our travells...

Now, I realise this is a simplistic argument, that the teams/divisions/circumstances differ greatly. But I think it''s something that''s worth a mention.

Rossi touched on it. Is Hunter not a part of the away form struggles? Or does Worthy only let him input on home games (go on, take the bait... be irrational!). To think that our away form will certainly improve if Worthy left is a fair opinion, but a pretty large assumption . Plus you''re assuming that the home form would just stay the same?...

Personally, I always think 23 games is the first genuine time to see how we''re getting on - home and away - but then I''m just as impatient as everyone else! 

[my other team is england 0]

 Blahblahblah you keep banging on about Leeds away.Take a reality check old pal and study Leeds home form this season.3 defeats and 1 win in 4 games.Do i have to spell it out to you who they beat for that lone victory.You obvoiusly sing from the Doncaster/Munby/Ferrari hymn sheet where everything in the garden is rosey !

[blahblahblah 2]

[quote user="my other team is england"] Blahblahblah you keep banging on about Leeds away.Take a reality check old pal and study Leeds home form this season.3 defeats and 1 win in 4 games.Do i have to spell it out to you who they beat for that lone victory.You obvoiusly sing from the Doncaster/Munby/Ferrari hymn sheet where everything in the garden is rosey !
[/quote]

They started out well but the wheels fell off, it happens, look at Palace, 1 point in 12, and either of those teams could still go on a run and win promotion.  I''m more concerned that we didn''t beat Southend and Derby to be honest, we should have.