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Tetteys Jig

Watford Away

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So as a nice little break to this talk of will/ should Hughton be given the boot, we actually have a game tomorrow!

What do people think we should do with the line up?

For me, I hope we can be bold and give debuts to the Murphy brothers, both of them and maybe even Carlton Morris. There''s no better time and they are hardly little boys any more. 18 years old they are ready to be exposed to the rigors of professional football. If they aren''t now i don''t know when they will be.

It''s fairly low pressure and we''re cr@p away from home anyway so why don''t we give it a go?

What about if they destroy Watford? Wouldn''t that be a nice headache to have as to whether we should include them against Stoke?

In the modern era of football, a lot of players particularly attacking ones reach their peak at around 23/24 so they need to be blooded early. It hasn''t done Zaha any harm or Raheem Sterling or even our very own Nathan Redmond.

If it goes wrong and they are out played, we know they are not ready and can send them out on loan to the lower leagues to man up a bit but if we don''t play them, we''ll never know.

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Finishing work early for this and it''ll be my first of the season so hopefully we can see an attacking line up whilst resting a few.

I would like to see how effective the diamond would be, and I think we should use this game to find out.

Ruddy

Whittaker Martin Bennett Olsson

Johnson

Snograss Redmond

Hoolahan/Elmander/Howson

Hooper RVW

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Ruddy

Martin

Turner

Bennett

Olsson

Fox

Fer

Murphy

Elmander

Murphy

Hooper

Martin there for experience, Olsson to get more games and try something new, Bennett and Turner to get used to each other as that will be the partnership for the next few PL games.

Fox, the latest to see who can successfully partner Fer after failed attempts by everyone else.

Fer because he''s a class act,

Murphy and Murphy to throw Watford into confusion. Our first team wingers are tired, angry and out of form and this will buck their ideas up a bit.

Elmander because he did well last round and needs the game time.

Hooper because he needs the game time and looked lively vs Villa. I''m interested to see how he''d work with Elmander too.

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It may be "only " a cup match, and there may be a temptation to include one or two more peripheral players. I think that this should be resisted largely. The team needs playing time together of the important players. They have still not learned how to supply RvW, and he has been trying to exist on scraps.

 

He and the team need to score some goals, to oil the mechanism and gain confidence. They will be up against a team determined to show well against a Premiership team, and we really can''t afford another reverse. There may be an argument for resting one or two players - is Snodgrass still apparently short on energy, has Redmond played too many in a short time? In the same way there is a case for playing Olsson, if fit, and giving Pilks a full run-out.

 

I would resist playing more peripheral players, - Fox, Ayala, Becchio, the Murphy brothers, on the principle that they "can''t be any worse" than the ones they replace. What does this do for regulars who are suffering a certain amount of doubt or discouragement? We need the best eleven to play, score and win. They need time together on the pitch, to promote the necessary melding and welding, and to practice playing in a way to produce good chances for the scorers.

 

We have said it nearly every game so far. This is the same - this is an important game!

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Fox and Ayala playing U-21''s today, so they''ll miss out. Josh Murphy in squad for tomorrow. Hooper to start.

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So when exactly will we get to see the Murphy brothers for the first time?

I saw an ''on this day'' thing on BBC saying in 1992, Beckham made his debut in the Carling cup today 21 years ago. He was 17 years old.

It''s about time we thrust a bit of pressure on them and this fixture is the best time for that. I also think psycologically, we should give them their debuts together. They have come this far together and following the exploits in the youth cup, we really should be giving them a go. It''s not like our current team are pulling up trees is it?

If we weigh it up the pros far outweigh the cons:

Pros:

Obstacle of first team debut out of the way.

Gives the fans a lift seeing two popular names on the teamsheet and may deflect some of the flak from the team.

Sticks a rod in the back of Snoddy, Redmond and Pilks with new competition.

Potentially found 2 cracking first team players.

Makes other teams sit up and take notice (both big clubs looking to buy, lower league clubs looking to loan and rivals scouting us for future fixtures).

Inspires other youth team players.

If the worst happens (we go down) theres potentially 2 wingers blooded and ready for regular action.

If they play amazing there''s potentially 2 wingers blooded and ready for regular premiership action.

Cons:

Could damage their confidence if they play rubbish.

Lost a chance for a first teamer to potentially gain some confidence, fitness, game time.

Potentially weaker against a very capable Watford side.

Now i don''t see them train every day, so i don''t exactly know where they are. The difference between league 2 level and premiership level is closer than some may think, but the objective is surely for them to be premiership level players so it''d be nice to see if they can hack it. 18 is not too young for a carling cup appearence.

Look at Southampton, Ward-Prowse and Shaw play a handful of decent games and now they are suddenly both £20m players. We should take the plunge and see what happens. Our best players in the early 90''s came from our youth team like Sutton and Eadie.

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" There''s no better time and they are hardly little boys any more. 18

years old they are ready to be exposed to the rigors of professional

football. If they aren''t now i don''t know when they will be."

that is sillyall three should, and will, get the necessary experience out on loan at lower league clubsWatford away should see Hughton testing his tactics to see if they are at fault or it is the playersother than a few minor changes we should field the first choice players and see if they and/or the manger is up to itas in, if they can''t beat Watford then the problems suggested are more than a suggestion - they are problems

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The way i see it is that a youngster should make their debut at their ''parent club'' first, just a 1 off cup game or something, nothing like several games over a month or anything to damage their fitness.

Following the completion of this, they are either good enough for a squad role with the first team (messi, redmond, sterling are examples of this) or they are in need of some lower league minutes (Beckham, Terry, Wilshire). To be an attractive loan option for a lower league team, it''s better they have played some mens football before, even just 30 minutes to prove they can stand up to the big mans game.

Hopefully Josh gets on tonight and it''ll be a massive weight off his shoulders. Hell he might even do well and score! Then what?

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Anyone see Serge Gnabry play yesterday? 18 years old and looked good, got me thinking around the teams:

Arsenal - Gnabry

Cardiff - Declan John

Everton - Barkley

Fulham - Frei

Liverpool - Sterling

Man U - Januzaj

Newcastle - Campbell

Southampton - Ward Prowse, Shaw etc...

Swansea - Ben Davies

WBA - Behraino

West Ham - Morrison

Out of them, 17-20 year olds, none of them look out of place in the squads. It''s about time the murphys joined them in having at least played in the first team.

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[quote user="Jimmy Smith"]The way i see it is that a youngster should make their debut at their ''parent club'' first, just a 1 off cup game or something, nothing like several games over a month or anything to damage their fitness.

Following the completion of this, they are either good enough for a squad role with the first team (messi, redmond, sterling are examples of this) or they are in need of some lower league minutes (Beckham, Terry, Wilshire). To be an attractive loan option for a lower league team, it''s better they have played some mens football before, even just 30 minutes to prove they can stand up to the big mans game.

Hopefully Josh gets on tonight and it''ll be a massive weight off his shoulders. Hell he might even do well and score! Then what?[/quote]you get sillier by the minute"just a 1 off cup game or something"   and what would that something be, as there is only league games and even you can''t be daft enough to think that you judge how well a youth player is by trying him out in a PL gameas to the one off cup game then that will almost certainly be against a lower league team, which serves no purpose, as would one game - and if we go out after one round or two then what - the players development is put on hold until the next ''one off cup game'' ?the coaching staff are quite capable of knowing at what stage a youth player''s development is - without some absurd nonsense about putting him in the first team, likewise they will know which club he needs to go to to get experience and develop, the player doesn''t need 20 mins in the first team to ''up his value'' so to speak, in fact if that were the criteria then a bad 20 mins would mean that lower league clubs would not touch him

thankfully non of your bizarre nonsense is part of the club''s development and I trust a club who have just won the FA Youth Cup to know what they are doing rather than someone who doesn''t even know what days the club''s games are on

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No need to get personal.

The ''or something'' would be an appearance off the bench in a game already won/ lost. As i pointed out in another thread, Hooper should have been given a go vs Spurs at 2-0 down, it would have made him ready for starting vs Villa and we had nothing to lose bringing him on then as we were 2-0 down anyway.

As for the lower league team thing. He''d learn by playing the mans game with premiership class teammates. You have to start somewhere. Beckham as I pointed out played a cup game for Man U before his loan at Preston. I''m sure Everton wished they''d given Ruddy more of a chance now.

Do we wait until he''s 22 and then ship him out for £100k having never tried him?

A bad 20 minutes wouldn''t mean that at all, he''d just have to go back to the youth team and wait until he''s more ready for another crack. If he really is up to it and is mentally tough, this would be a blip and sooner rather than later, he''d produce a good performance for us. If that never came about then we''d know he''s not up to standard. Better to know sooner rather than messing around wrapping him up until he''s washed out and 22 with no first team chances to his name. No clubs will be risking taking a punt on him at the moment because there is no evidence as to how he''d react to men''s football.

Some players can up their game when brought up a level, until you try this, you never know. As i said, i don''t watch him train every week, but i''d hope we have the odd youth team player pushing for a chance in the first team given the metrics I have to measure on (our success vs other youth teams and the players from them teams who now play first team football). It appears we do given Murphy''s involvement in the squad.

The way some of our youth player have stagnated recently is disappointing, Joe Lewis, Rudd, Steer, K Smith, Adeyemi etc. it''s about time we gave them more exposure earlier on, part of that is putting on a senior Norwich shirt for the first time.

Hopefully Murphy will come on tomorrow night and shut you up with a good performance.

We are playing Tuesday night, then again on Sunday what are you on about?

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We should play our best available team, if the manager knows what that is, and try to get a good confidence boosting result.

Forget about bringing youngsters through ATM, we need to re-establish confidence in the team, an attribute which currently is woefully lacking

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Murphy might be the answer to getting that confidence back. He might unlock the defence and set Hooper up to score or get on the end of a ''wayward'' Johnson pass. We don''t know how good he''ll be until we try him. He could be the next Bellamy, he could be the next Ryan Jarvis.

I''d also put Redmond in our strongest team but I feel he needs a rest for Sunday as he''s only young and was flagging versus Villa on Saturday

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"We don''t know how good he''ll be until we try him"but those in charge and running the coaching system do know

"As i said, i don''t watch him train every week,"which rather sums it up

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Do you watch him every week City 1st or are you just a self opinionated troll.

How often are you up at Colney, do you know Ricky, do you speak to the coaches, do you really know about developing young players?

MMMM?

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[quote user="Doctorsleep"]Do you watch him every week City 1st or are you just a self opinionated troll.

How often are you up at Colney, do you know Ricky, do you speak to the coaches, do you really know about developing young players?

MMMM?[/quote]When it comes to the canaries what City 1st doesn''t know ain''t worth knowing and he''ll make sure that everyone knows that.

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[quote user="Doctorsleep"]We should play our best available team, if the manager knows what that is, and try to get a good confidence boosting result. Forget about bringing youngsters through ATM, we need to re-establish confidence in the team, an attribute which currently is woefully lacking[/quote]

Precisely. From Hughton''s viewpoint he desperately needs this win. If things go wrong the fans will not accept some lame excuse.

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I would of liked to have seen Fox and Ayala in the squad for the Watford game, but as they played for the U21''s today that appears unlikely.

I guess if it was up to me, assuming these two were out of the squad, I would go with the following:

Bunn, Whittaker, Martin, Bennett, Olsson, Pilkington, Tettey, Johnson, Murphy, Howson, Hooper

Subs: Nash, Turner, Fer, Redmond, Hoolahan, Elmander, Becchio

Might be harsh to drop Snodgrass, but glad to hear Josh Murphy might get a chance to show what he''s about

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I''m going tomorrow so we''re bound to be rubbish.

Hope Hooper scores a couple, would like to see Pilks for 90 mins as well. And focus on attacking down his wing, we haven''t done that since Lambert left.

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When it comes to the canaries what City 1st doesn''t know ain''t worth knowing and he''ll make sure that everyone knows that.

I presume you mean what City 1st does know ain''t worth knowing.

If this is not the case then I presume he knows a great deal! which is good, shame he is such a twat towards other posters.

If he is a sage perhaps he could temper his style and actually assist the debate rather than trying, unsuccessfully, to demean everyone else.

It is such a waste, but presumable he has some sort of character disorder.

Maybe he should take my advice and help things along, a bit like Ricardo does!

Nobody likes a Dick Nose City 1st!

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and you waited all these years to join the forum and post thatI do hope I haven''t been winding you up before this ............................ have I ?as some might wonder at how much you know,given that you only joined a couple of days ago

or perhaps you are from suffolk ........................ they aren''t too bright either

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[quote user="City1st"]"We don''t know how good he''ll be until we try him"but those in charge and running the coaching system do know

"As i said, i don''t watch him train every week,"which rather sums it up[/quote]

The coaches don''t know actually, because it''s impossible to tell how he''ll adapt to a proper competitive game of football. Ability wise they might know, but not how he''ll react mentally. Hell the likes of Kaka should have set the world alight on paper at Real Madrid but truth is he didn''t because he just didn''t fit their system. Coach all you like out of them, but at the end of the day that isn''t everything, try and dispute that then!

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I can confirm Josh Murphy is definitely starting tomorrow night barring any last minute changes of heart from cautious Chrissy

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