Le Juge

[quote user="FilletTheFishWife ."]davenport didn''t impress me at all when he was here on loan. An improvement on Doherty maybe but not worth the extra wages. We could do better if we spent what is (or should be) left of the transfer fund wisely.[/quote]I agree, he looked ok. Nothing that great and would rather sign someone permanently than an over-rated defender on loan. I''d take him purely because we need extra defenders and he is better than Doc but wouldn''t be too happy about it.

I''m glad to see him back, think he''s a tidy footballer and worth a spot in the team and think 600k isn''t too bad of a price (a bit sickening considering we gave him away for free though) However, unless we sell a midfielder I can see there being a few disgruntled players. We have Safri, Brellier, Russell, Fotheringham, Smith, Lappin, Chadwick, Spillane, all of whom are viable options for central midfield. Safri, Brellier, Spillane could be considered the sitting midfielders with Russell, Fotheringham, Smith, Chadwick and Lappin the midfielders who push on. I suppose I could include Hughes in that but I''d rather put my boots on and play than put Hughes in central midfield (I could run around ineffectively giving the ball away and clapping a lot) Did well at RB but makes me cringe if I see him listed in midfield. I''m all for having competition for places and backups for injuries etc but I feel that all of the above players are there to play football, they''re not players who are going to be content at not getting picked and happy if they get a spot on the bench. They will all be trying to make the spot theirs which in theory is fantastic because it should spur them on to perform and have the nobody is safe mentality (unless you''re a defender, because we only have four of them) but in practice they are going to get mighty fed up with playing reserve football and watching from the stands.  Personally I think Russell and Brellier in central midfield together have the physical presence to bully other teams midfield and run the game (They are both strong and commited in tackles) and they have the ability to play football too when they can so purely on that basis they''d be my first choice two. Having said that, if we hadn''t signed midfielders I''d be complaining that we had no competition for places and whinging, fickle football fans aren''t we. All in all, good signing.

[quote user="jas the barclay king"][quote user="Marigold"] I think Greeno and Bellas deserve a massive cheer. They always gave their all for the cause and genuinely loved the club.   Now on to Ashton. All I have to say is think back to that second home game after relegation against Crewe. He did everything he could not to score. He even blazed a shot over the bar from 8 yards- 8 YARDS! I know they were the only club he''d played for and has fond memories of them but that didn''t stop Rooney scoring against Eeverton.   Didn''t Bellamy also score against us when he was at Newcastle? If so point proven.   [/quote] jamie cureton scored against last season too.. so what point is Belluz proving? jas :) [/quote]I thought his point was obvious? The fact that Bellers scored against us despite the fact he wanted Norwich to do well, opposed to Ashton trying not to score against Crewe when he was in his "Not Bothering" mode after relegation (Not that I can actually remember the Crewe game)

Bellamy definitely gets the biggest cheer, I''ve had a drink with him (well, I saw him in the pub and was already drunk so went upto him and started talking) It was in Norwich just before our Premiership campaign when he played for Newcastle - I think we played them third (or was it second?) in the league and he was telling me how much he loved Norwich as a club, place and the people. Was hoping we''d stay up and would try harder against any other struggling teams to try and keep us up. He bought me a drink and couldn''t have been nicer, humble or complimentary to Norwich. I know he has the reputation of being an arrogant, aggressive, nasty bloke and he probably is when in a sporting environment - he''s a competitor who hates to lose (on a team and personal level) but when I met him I don''t have anything at all bad to say about him apart from at the time he was in the pub with Titus Bramble and Kieran Dyer (I ignored them completely, pretending I didn''t know who they were) Green gets a cheer due to service and after that many years deserved a chance to move away to try and get success. I was going to say boo Ashton but I''ve changed my mind, I prefer the idea further up to just have silence because it will probably dent his ego more.

[quote user="jas the barclay king"] still not convinced.. its ok scoring against Tin pot sides in friendlies but its on august 11th when the fun starts again that he needs to get it done. Mark Libbra once scored vs Fakenham remember? we all had high hopes and look what happened! jas :) [/quote]What about his goals against Man City? (My memory is going, I think it was Man City - he came on at half time and was awesome!) I liked Libbra, inconsistant admittedly but definitely had talent.

I agree, I think he looks promising. It''s a squad game though, so between Cureton, Brown, Dave and Martin as our main four strikers we''ve got enough there to play well and score goals in all 46 games of the season. Brown probably wouldn''t be my first choice (assuming Dave settles) but he''d certainly play a good part of the season.

[quote user="ob1"] "You have to support your team and believe in them, otherwise what''s the point turning up?" "You turn up, thinking of the win and encouraging the players to prove you right" Good points, and I understand what you are saying, but I disagree. Yes, I do believe in them, yes, I believe they can win *any* game; that is not down to the support I hold for them tho, it''s football after all, and any team can win any game... one of the reasons it''s so popular, but personally speaking I have very real expectations of what my teams are likely to achieve - especially in cup/ knockout competitions - especially England in a major tournament!! Just because you don''t think it''s likely that your team won''t win, doesn''t mean you don''t think it''s possible for a miracle to happen - I always think a miracle can happen, even if I don''t expect it (if I did expect it - it wouldn''t be a miracle!!) - and thats what you hope, pray and support for! For example, Norwich vs Chelsea away from home, last season - did you honestly expect City to win? If you think "yes", I hate to say, you are a bit stupid, mate!! Next time we play someone like that, I want you around for a bet or two! [:)] City had no chance really, but I still bought a ticket and went to the game and supported, hoped, pray, shouted, screamed that Huckerby would pull some magic out the bag and we''d win - THATs what footie is all about! Games like the Middlesborough game... 7 minutes from time and they go 4-1... no I didn''t expect a point, I went mental when they proved me wrong! If you have the expectation of always winning - you can only ever be disappointed. If you have realistic expectations you can never be disappointed, and every now and again, very, very pleasantly suprised! [:)] [/quote]You completely mis-understand me. I never expect them to win (apart from if they play teams from lower leagues in the cup and we all know how well we normally get on then!) Games against Chelsea etc I am a realist and think the chances of us winning are slim but as soon as the whistle blows I change and start believing we''re going to do it, I think a nervous pessimistic crowd transfers itself into the players. I think today is the day the miracle happens and we get a win . When the full time whistle happens and we enevitably don''t I''m back to my old self thinking oh well next time we''ll ''ave ''em. I''m the same when I play sports, if my football team is playing a team who won all their games, in the lead up I probably don''t fancy our chances much but as soon as the whistle goes you have to believe you can win. In that situation I certainly wouldn''t fancy having people watching me who were all negative, I''d rather have people on the sidelines thinking I''m going to do it as it gives me more confidence to go out there and do it. Ah well, each to their own I suppose.

[quote user="thenut"] Yea get him in he gets awesome on football manger lol. as does another chelsea youthy Ben Sahar. [/quote]In my game Harry Worley became better than Mancienne. By the age of 24 he was England Captain! That was a one off, Mancienne is usually brilliant! I think Mancienne seems a good one for the future but at this moment in time we need an older, more experienced player. I''d sacrifice a small amount of ability to bring in a leader and an organiser, someone who can get our defence playing as a single unit. Not a bad idea to get him in as cover but even though he has undoubted potential, we need an experienced pro (unusual for me to say that, I don''t normally like seeing us buy what could be considered as ''older'' players)

It may well be misplaced but it''s part of football - I go into every season in the Championship thinking this time we''ll win it (I was right once in the past few years!) and that we can stay up in when in the Prem. I believe England will win the World Cup/Europeans before every tournament - it''s part of football in my opinion. You have to support your team and believe in them, otherwise what''s the point turning up? If 25,000 people turn up thinking the players are going to lose, it doesn''t give them any confidence and they probably will lose. You turn up, thinking of the win and encouraging the players to prove you right (with the occasional abusive rant when a player makes a stupid mistake!) It may be misplaced but for me it''s what makes football great, the thought of winning and anticipation of seeing it actually happen. Some people use football as a means to get themselves in a state, shout, swear, moan and generally be a complete (Insert Swear Word)  because it''s sort of accepted to be abusive to anything football related whereas you can''t walk around the street being like that to people without getting a good beating. Others probably use the fact that many people love football to go on internet message boards and constantly type messages that antagonise, provoke and annoy supporters of that club just to get a reaction.

[quote user="NCFC Episode 1 - Cureton - The Prodigal Returns"] 2. We have a manager who I think cares passionately about this club and works hard to bring players in and hasnt buried his head in the sand when we have lost our best players! He has done something about it and brought new ones in! [/quote]More to the point he seems able to spot a good player at a bargain price (Lappin) or free (Brellier). Who needs to splash the cash if you can get Lappin, Brellier, Gilks and Ostembor for a grand total of 75k (excluding agents fees and signing on fee''s) All four of those are worthy of a spot in a Championship winning squad (emphasis on the word squad) You still need to spend to get players in but I can''t believe people moan when we get a player for free! If I went out for a meal - I''d come away happier if I got free food that was nice than I would be if I''d had to pay an arm and a leg for very nice food!

[quote user="Rustyboy"] Marshall, Gilks, Gallacher, Arnold and Lewis (I think I have put them in a possible playing order) Why does a club like ours need five goalkeepers when we do not have the same cover in defence and midfield? We do not even play enough reserve games to keep them match fit during the season. I know Lewis could go out on loan but can still not understand why we have so many keepers. Isn’t there an emergency loan thing that allows you to loan a keeper outside the transfer window if all yours get injured? [/quote]I think the pecking order is more realistically Marshall, Gilks, Lewis, Gallagher, Arnold. I''m sure if he could PG would offload Gallagher as soon as possible. Good shot stopper (mostly) - little else. I think we have that many due to the fact Gallagher clearly wasn''t good enough for what Grant wants (top 6) and so he brought in two replacements. I wouldn''t expect to see Gallagher ever play for Norwich in another competitive game excluding freak emergencies where the three others ahead of him are unavailable. I''d expect Gallagher to go as soon as possible and Lewis loaned out to League 1 side (maybe Championship but probably pushing it due to lack of experience - not doubting ability though) with an option to recall him in emergencies. With Arnold and Gilks sharing reserve team football (assuming Gilks is on the bench pretty much every game)  

From a financial point of view the money assured the players didn''t have to be sold. It didn''t guarentee the players wouldn''t want to leave and/or didn''t magically remove any buy out clauses they may have already had. If Earnshaw, Safri or Etuhu didn''t want to leave they''d still be Norwich players (and at the time of writing Safri and Etuhu technically are unless I missed the announcement) Financially they didn''t have to be sold, it didn''t take personal preferences or contractual obligations into consideration. Story seems accurate to me.

I agree with Indy. I bet if we announced we were selling Doc as well for a million the same people would still start going mad. Instead of thinking thank god some mug was willing to pay that for him! I think Etuhu and Safri are good players but they don''t always play well (or at all in Safri''s case) and to get out of this league you need good players playing consistantly opposed to better players who turn up half the time. We may not be able to replace the presence of Etuhu but if we got a solid player who was almost as good and turned up every game I''d be more than happy and would improve the team. On his day he can be immense, off his day he can be as effective as a fat bloke sitting in a deck chair in the centre circle watching the game go by (I''m sure some games we should have charged him for watching the game rather than paying his wages) If it turns out we sell Saf and Etuhu and we don''t get any replacements for them what-so-ever and no centre back (which we all know we still need) then I''ll be angry and tearing my hair out with the rest of you. Untill then, I''ll sit and wait for the Transfer Window to close before I start stamping my feet and screaming. 

If Etuhu and Safri are both sold as many believe and we don''t get in any replacements (I think and hope we will) who would you play in central midfield? I''m going to assume everyone will pick Brellier as the defensive midfielder (correct me if you believe otherwise) who would you have as his partner in central midfield? Personally, I''d go for Lappin, I think he can provide a decent defensive cover to not isolate Brellier (who seems competant going forward too) and has a range of passing and think he could create quite a bit. Don''t get me wrong I don''t think it''s good enough to not buy any central midfielders and think they''re a must but assuming we don''t I think Lappin could do a decent job there - I think he''d be a better option than Fotheringham. Any opinions?

Great post, think it''s spot on.

I agree so much as Hucks can''t play a traditional left winger role but he can''t play a traditional striker role either. He simply does not fit into any formation properly. He''s a good player and I''d like him in the team but you have to try and accomodate him somewhere else which is a big downside. It''s the age old hucks debate that everyone has had over and over and I''m just grateful I''m not the one who has to try and solve it.   The one thing I will say now though, is that if people put two or three players on Hucks on the left, they would be punished because that would more than likely leave Chadwick room on the right and he''s a very good player.

[quote user="Fellas"]Too be honest, Safri is one of my favourite players (when he actually plays for us), and so i would rather him stay, but the likelyhood that he will start more than 20 games this season is very unlikely. I''d say £1.5 million is still too little for a player of his quality, in comparison to the ridiculously over priced koumas at £5.3 million! Safri is definately half as good as him and in my opinion worth around £2 million in his skill wise (he''s certainly a permiership player imo). However in terms of building a squad i''d rather see £2 million than have safri, as long as we buy midfield and defensive cover which is needed. That should really mean (with £2million, let alone the other money we have been told we have to use in the transfer market) we could get a top defender, a top right back and a squad midfielder. [/quote] It doesn''t work like that, values of players aren''t proportional to ability - a small increase in ability can yield a large increase in sales. Footballers generally are on a similar level, so even a relatively small increase in ability can give large increases in bids or are we saying someone rated at 30 million would be 20 times better than Saf? (assuming he goes for 1.5, which I don''t think many people will pay for him)   Put it this way, if you had 1.5mil would you buy Safri with it? As much as I like him I''d spend it on other player(s).

The season we won the league, we had Gary Holt, a strong, three lunged runner who ran the attackers of the oposition into dead ends and covered for Huckerby and Damien Francis a box to box, big strong, athletic player. Neither of them were particularly good passers (and I am being very kind to holt by calling him a ''not particularly good passer'') Ok so we had Mulryne who could pass (like a crab) but he was more of a bit part player, a luxury we didn''t really have to afford (Fotheringham anyone?) For the past however many years we may have the reputation of a passing team in the same way that Jordan has the reputation for being good looking. We may have been in the past but we certainly aren''t anymore.

Think he''s quality and would like him to stay ideally but a year left on contract, big earner (I would assume), international duties, fitness issues, ramadan etc etc. If they offer us 500k tell them thanks but no thanks, 1 million or more and you have to be looking at it seriously and 1.5 and it''s in my opinion not much of a decision to make other than saying thank you very much youseff and I hope you''re happy in the rest of your career.

Top - aim for that and if we miss and come second I''d settle for it! Realistically depending on factors like injuries, form, gelling the team, future transfers (in and out) I can''t comment properly but I''m certainly looking for playoffs but you can''t make an informed decision until August 31 at the very earliest as then you''ll have your squad and can see how the players have started to play together - but even then you can''t account for form or injuries. All in all, I''m optimistically on the fence.