Corona Virus main thread

[Bill 1,788]

1 minute ago, Rock The Boat said:

I find it a little bit odd that those who were complaining that the first lockdown in March was implemented too late are now complaining that this lockdown is too early. 

It is almost like there is some agenda here 

but not on your part....... eh, hand crank ?

[ricardo 7,395]

40 minutes ago, Herman said:

What about clarity and planning? 

The virus doesn't  require planning consent.

[Rock The Boat 1,332]

2 hours ago, Aggy said:

Twitter by and large would agree with you there. Johnson’s video message a few hours earlier, then drop it by twitter at 2130, run away stick your fingers in your ears, see how it all plays out and then retrospectively blame anyone who ignored your 2 hours notice (or confirm your quick action saved lives if nothing kicks off, despite the fact numbers were on the down in most - albeit not all - of these areas anyway). Classic Boris and co.

I wonder if people in the London Blitz used to complain about air raid alarms going off in the middle of the night and disturbing their sleep?

[Bill 1,788]

1 minute ago, Rock The Boat said:

I wonder if people in the London Blitz used to complain about air raid alarms going off in the middle of the night and disturbing their sleep?

err, yes they did

have a read up on Mass Observation reports taken at that time

[Rock The Boat 1,332]

2 hours ago, sonyc said:

As intimated this is the reaction from lots of people from the community I live in. 

The new measures affect everybody in that community regardless of their religion, income, social status or whatever. But it seems as though some people want to be divisive rather than inclusive. Surprising, when on the other hand they complain that covid affects some ethnic groups more than others. It is almost as though there is some underlying agenda going on here. 

[Bill 1,788]

2 minutes ago, Rock The Boat said:

The new measures affect everybody in that community regardless of their religion, income, social status or whatever. But it seems as though some people want to be divisive rather than inclusive. Surprising, when on the other hand they complain that covid affects some ethnic groups more than others. It is almost as though there is some underlying agenda going on here. 

your usual racism, perhaps ?

[BigFish 1,987]

1 minute ago, Rock The Boat said:

The new measures affect everybody in that community regardless of their religion, income, social status or whatever. But it seems as though some people want to be divisive rather than inclusive. Surprising, when on the other hand they complain that covid affects some ethnic groups more than others. It is almost as though there is some underlying agenda going on here. 

Looks a valid point to me. Clearly there is an underlying agenda here-one that wants to close down scrutiny and challenge of what is failing strategy in England. Who would have thought it?

[ricardo 7,395]

Andy Burnham was clear that it was about restricting households mixing. The recent charts showing where the peak infections are occuring speak for themselves.

[Rock The Boat 1,332]

52 minutes ago, sonyc said:

Imagine you've just bought all your Christmas presents Ricardo and spent a bit on food and planned all your family arrangements. Then be told on the night before, you can't.

Middle England would be in uproar!

Then, perhaps for some Asian people, living 'up north'....ahhhh  f*ck it, let's announce it at 9.30pm the night before for a midnight start.

By the way, I don't expect many people living in Norfolk understand the enormity of this, because it's not part of their life. I'm saying this to excuse people because it's difficult to understand (and have lived up this way for 40 plus years and still I'm learning). It's not a message that has been planned or thought about, no sensitivity for constituents / voters. So much could have been done to prepare people. You don't make such a decision within an hour, you get the data to evidence it before. You don't make a decision affecting so many and make a decree with effect in 2.5 hours!

Just imagine if it was the whole of Norfolk in the last few hours of Christmas Eve. That is all I ask for the perspective in this announcement. 

 

This is a ridiculously emotional response to a serious problem. During the spring lockdown tens of thousands passed away, some through covid others through natural causes and accidents. Yet the families of the bereaved were unable even.to hold funeral services for their loved ones. Spouses of those who had spent a lifetime together were unable to spend their last moments together. The response of middle England was one of great sadness but acceptance. But somehow you think Muslims not getting their Christmas presents is more important than what the country went.through in March?

[Rock The Boat 1,332]

12 minutes ago, Bill said:

your usual racism, perhaps ?

Why do you bring race into a subject that affects everybody without reference to their income, social status, ancestral heritage. As I said, some.people want to be divisive instead of inclusive. You among them. 

[Rock The Boat 1,332]

22 minutes ago, Bill said:

err, yes they did

have a read up on Mass Observation reports taken at that time

Relatives of yours perhaps?

[Bill 1,788]

3 minutes ago, Rock The Boat said:

This is a ridiculously emotional response to a serious problem.

During the spring lockdown tens of thousands passed away, some through covid others through natural causes and accidents. Yet the families of the bereaved were unable even.to hold funeral services for their loved ones. Spouses of those who had spent a lifetime together were unable to spend their last moments together. The response of middle England was one of great sadness but acceptance. But somehow you think Muslims not getting their Christmas presents is more important than what the country went.through in March?

Good to see you warning us all in advance about the content of your post

......which as no racist undertones, whatsoever.................................. absolutely none

[Bill 1,788]

1 minute ago, Rock The Boat said:

Relatives of yours perhaps?

No

having traced my family tree I can confidently state that none of them were reports

[Bill 1,788]

3 minutes ago, Rock The Boat said:

Why do you bring race into a subject that affects everybody without reference to their income, social status, ancestral heritage. As I said, some.people want to be divisive instead of inclusive. You among them. 

your words

" But somehow you think Muslims"

[ricardo 7,395]

1 hour ago, sonyc said:

Imagine you've just bought all your Christmas presents Ricardo and spent a bit on food and planned all your family arrangements. Then be told on the night before, you can't. 

 

Personally I would be unhappy but upon reflection I would prefer not being dead before 12th night.

[Rock The Boat 1,332]

15 minutes ago, BigFish said:

Looks a valid point to me. Clearly there is an underlying agenda here-one that wants to close down scrutiny and challenge of what is failing strategy in England. Who would have thought it?

You were one of the people who back in the springtime complained that lockdown should have come.sooner in order to save lives. Now the authorities are moving more swiftly, you are complaining about that. It's a case of whatever happens, moaners are gonna moan. 

[Rock The Boat 1,332]

5 minutes ago, Bill said:

your words

" But somehow you think Muslims"

It is a response to Sonyc who brought up the subject of Muslims. Why did you not comment on the racial nature of Sonyc's post?

[sonyc 5,518]

I am unhappy about how this been handled and have posted my thoughts and feelings. And I know some people will not agree with them. It's not the message, it's not the decision (it's the right one I am sure), it's nothing to do with lockdowns or death rates. It's about being more sensitive as a government (couldn't care less if Labour or a Tory one, couldn't give a t*ss). What might have happened is a national debate on the restrictions and clampdown at least a week before, asking people to be vigilant, guiding them not to visit families etc. It needed a press release at the least.

If folk don't think a message within 2.5 hours of it coming into place then that's the way it is. I realise quite clearly my annoyance or views of the matter are irrelevant!

Edited July 31, 2020 by sonyc

[BigFish 1,987]

Just now, Rock The Boat said:

You were one of the people who back in the springtime complained that lockdown should have come.sooner in order to save lives. Now the authorities are moving more swiftly, you are complaining about that. It's a case of whatever happens, moaners are gonna moan. 

Sigh.....

Yes, it is pretty much accepted now that lock down should have happened earlier and this would have saved thousands of lives, reduced the peak and speeded the recovery. The criticism is this is a kneejerk reaction without strategic intent, badly communicated. It is almost as if the government is trying to cover up the lack of a working track and trace system and the disappearance of a "world leading" app.

The problem is not religious gatherings in the North West. The problem is the tracing system is finding barely half of all contacts in the region. It is government failure you are attempting to cover with your desparate whataboutery.

[sonyc 5,518]

4 minutes ago, Rock The Boat said:

It is a response to Sonyc who brought up the subject of Muslims. Why did you not comment on the racial nature of Sonyc's post?

I believe it is related to Eid RTB. I might be wrong but that is my belief. And other posters are open to the same interpretation.

[Bill 1,788]

Just now, Rock The Boat said:

It is a response to Sonyc who brought up the subject of Muslims. Why did you not comment on the racial nature of Sonyc's post?

Because I did not perceive it as racist, unlike your guff

And I am rather surprised to see you bothering with my posts when a day or so you were demanding that I be banned from here

Perhaps you could now hand over to hand crank, or maybe even BB (or ben10)

hoping the weather in Rennes is fine

ta ta by old bigot

 

[Rock The Boat 1,332]

21 minutes ago, sonyc said:

I am unhappy about how this been handled and have posted my thoughts and feelings. And I know some people will not agree with them. It's not the message, it's not the decision (it's the right one I am sure), it's nothing to do with lockdowns or death rates. It's about being more sensitive as a government (couldn't care less if Labour or a Tory one, couldn't give a t*ss). What might have happened is a national debate on the restrictions and clampdown at least a week before, asking people to be vigilant, guiding them not to visit families etc. It needed a press release at the least.

If folk don't think a message within 2.5 hours of it coming into place then that's the way it is. I realise quite clearly my annoyance or views of the matter are irrelevant!

Well you can imagine the outcome if we had a national debate a week before deciding to implement.clampdown measures. 

Do you think we should have had a week's debate before lockdown in March?

Should there have been a week's debate before clampdown.in Leicester?

[Rock The Boat 1,332]

23 minutes ago, Bill said:

Because I did not perceive it as racist, unlike your guff

And I am rather surprised to see you bothering with my posts when a day or so you were demanding that I be banned from here

Perhaps you could now hand over to hand crank, or maybe even BB (or ben10)

hoping the weather in Rennes is fine

ta ta by old bigot

 

Just a thought. If you seriously think I am also VW, BB, Ben10, Bagster, Nightfly, Lady Jane Grey et al, why did you only block RTB and not all those accounts?

[Barbe bleu 826]

When RTB and Bill get stuckk into each other its probably time we all lockdown for a short while

[Barbe bleu 826]

31 minutes ago, sonyc said:

I believe it is related to Eid RTB. I might be wrong but that is my belief. And other posters are open to the same interpretation.

I am inclined to agree.  

I suspect that the data came late in the day and that more notice would have been given had someone not realised that party time for the virus was in less than 24 hours.

 It was eid this time but the same could apply to any occasion where indoor multi generation family meetings were likely 

[Barbe bleu 826]

1 hour ago, Rock The Boat said:

I find it a little bit odd that those who were complaining that the first lockdown in March was implemented too late are now complaining that this lockdown is too early. 

It is almost like there is some agenda here 

Well of course some posters have an agenda!  

Thing is, you are one of them!

 

[sonyc 5,518]

9 minutes ago, Rock The Boat said:

Well you can imagine the outcome if we had a national debate a week before deciding to implement.clampdown measures. 

Do you think we should have had a week's debate before lockdown in March?

Should there have been a week's debate before clampdown.in Leicester?

There was debate wasn't there about lockdown (even on here!) and the timing? And Leicester was mentioned many times before their lockdown came into force? So I don't follow your questions.

I believe to do so would have been politically too sensitive for the government given the religious nature. It would have evoked a huge reaction. Just my view RTB.

You obviously are right behind the way this has been done so I don't think there is much room left in this debate. I see lots of people are talking about it nationally (looking through comments by all.kinds of people including Starmer) so I don't feel in the minority on this one (and I'm used to feeling so).

[sonyc 5,518]

4 minutes ago, Barbe bleu said:

I am inclined to agree.  

I suspect that the data came late in the day and that more notice would have been given had someone not realised that party time for the virus was in less than 24 hours.

 It was eid this time but the same could apply to any occasion where indoor multi generation family meetings were likely 

And they would be quite right. The celebrations are significant occasions. But, hardly something they won't have known about weeks and even months ago. They will have known the date of Eid within a tolerance of 6 to 12 hours months in advance.

[Barbe bleu 826]

9 minutes ago, sonyc said:

And they would be quite right. The celebrations are significant occasions. But, hardly something they won't have known about weeks and even months ago. They will have known the date of Eid within a tolerance of 6 to 12 hours months in advance.

Well yes but you don't stop major events without good data. The question is when did this come in? 

[sonyc 5,518]

2 minutes ago, Barbe bleu said:

Well yes but you don't stop major events without good data. The question is when did this come in? 

Seemingly hours before the tweeted decision? If not, then you prepare people beforehand. You don't wait until the 11th hour. 

I guess I'm old fashioned BB. 

Time for me to move on from this issue (and maybe thread too I think for a wee while....give folk a rest 😆 ....as well as a chance to concentrate on other stuff)