Lay Off Worthy!

[Evil Monkey 52]

I''m sorry, but I''ve bitten my tongue long enough, and I just have to say to all those Worthy-bashers out there: Please Stop!

What do you have against him, Nige, the man who led us from Div One strugglers to Premiership in four years?? Poor tactical decisions?? poor signings??

So what?!

Set the mistakes against the things he''s done right over the years - the shrewd signings, the great tactics during the promotion season - and there''s no contest.  Nigel is a good, young manager and deserves to stay at Norwich for a long time yet  Let''s examine that in more detail, eh?

Signings:

The Good - Hucks, Francis, Drury, Edworthy, Helveg, Leon, Svensson, Ward, Gallagher, Jonson, Charlton, Safri and, of course, Deano.  Add to that Jarrett, Louis-Jean and Thorne, and its a long list!

The Bad - Doherty

The Ugly - Oh wait, Doherty again...

On Loan:

The Good - Hucks, Crouch and Harper, just when we needed them.  Cooper, Bentley.

The Bad - Okay, so we''ve got a few in here (Southall, Hammond, Stuart), but they were all during desperate times, and none have led to full-time deals, so there is a God!

Tactics:

The Good - 4-3-3 during the promotion season! Leon, Svensson and Hucks up front together! Remember Walsall, remember Bradford? We tore them apart! Genius!

The Bad - The diamond formation... oops... But didn''t last long (mercifully) and was just another lesson in footballing life for our young manager.

Psychology:

None of the media blunders of other managers, none of the "big club" attitude.  Just quiet, and simple, and concentrates on the game that is football.

And remember his approach during the promotion season? Four months of being top and Nige saying "well, you never know what can happen, we won''t count our chickens", then suddenly, just before the Wigan game (I think it was), WHAM! "We''re going to go up, and we''re going up as champions!" Brilliant - caution suddenly tempered and the players given the confidence boost needed for the final push. To my mind, he waited until just the right moment.  Its hard to get a balance of confidence and arrogance, and I think that its a skill that Nige has!

In summary:

Breezes...

No, I could go on all day listing Nigel''s good points, but just a cursory glance at the lists above show that The Good far outweigh The Bad!

So, for the Worthy bashers - bring it on!!!

[Ken Aries 0]

Give yourself an A+, Evil Monkey. Very eloquently put and I agree with everything you''ve said. It''s easy to slip into a mindset where you start to criticise the manager, and begin to think that there''s a man out there who can do a better job than the present incumbent. All I can say is give Nigel and the team your whole-hearted support again this season, and then all being well we''ll see a repeat of that fantastic success in the 2003/4 season. It''s a certainty that whingeing and whining will get us nowhere.

[Dicky 0]

Good on you Evil - won''t stop the moaners and whingers still having a go at him at every opportunity.

......Worthy is our king....

[Rabbit 0]

yes i remember being at his 1st game on trial ( so to speak )boxing day, away at QPR.. what a game and we won 3-2, and at home to blackburn 1-1, he really did turn us around...

and then the bad old days were history...

so anybody who questions worthy has a short memory, or was just one of those so called people jumping on the wand wagon...

[Gentleman Jim 0]

[quote]I''m sorry, but I''ve bitten my tongue long enough, and I just have to say to all those Worthy-bashers out there: Please Stop! What do you have against him, Nige, the man who led us from Div One strugg...[/quote]

Well said Evil Monkey,

I agree with everything you say, but I''m afraid the posters you talk about are vendetta driven and will ignore your well constructed views I''m afraid.

 

[Evil Monkey 52]

Given that there have been a couple more anti-Worthy comments in the last few days, thought it would be best to resurrect this one... just so they can see the other side of the story....

[Trent Canary 0]

Monkey - Agree with everything, although there is one glaring omission. Trevor Benjamin! The thought of him in a Norwich shirt makes me cringe.

He has done really well for us, made some good signings, and has installed a team spirit to match any other team.

He could do with an extra post-match speech or two up his sleeve "I cant fault the work rate, commitment"  But other than that I cant fault the guy!

[First Wizard 0]

Whilst I''m prepared to admit that Nigel has done some sterling work for this club, you have to scratch your head, and ask why he went and wasted a hell of a lot of money on Helveg?.

Now, I was a Helveg fan, but after this latest episode of him going off to Germany (I shan''t even try and spell BM name) it does cast doubts over Worthy''s judgement of players.

Although, perhaps that says more about Thomas, then it does Nigel.      

[The Walrus<H5><IMG src="http:new.pinkun.comforumsimagesline.gif"><BR>In the Kingdom of the blind, the One-Eyed Man is King<BR><H5> 0]

Well said Evil Monkey. What people so often tend to forget, is the position the club was in before we had Worthy. If you had offered them Play-Off Final, Going up as Champions and a year in the Premiership within 4 years of having Cap''n Worthy at the helm, most of them would have sold an organ for that.

How easily we all forget.

[Evil Monkey 52]

[quote]Monkey - Agree with everything, although there is one glaring omission. Trevor Benjamin! The thought of him in a Norwich shirt makes me cringe. He has done really well for us, made some good signings...[/quote]

Crikey, I''d forgotten about him!! Wow, what a guy he was... he was our very own Brian Deane, heh!

Good point though, Wiz, though like you say I think it says more about Helweg than Nigel really, or possibly more about a certain Danish manager... I''d written all that before it was certain Thomas was off, and I''m disappointed to see him go personally...

[Trent Canary 0]

[quote]Whilst I''m prepared to admit that Nigel has done some sterling work for this club, you have to scratch your head, and ask why he went and wasted a hell of a lot of money on Helveg?. Now, I was a Helv...[/quote]

Wiz - I thought initially Helveg was a great signing. An international captain, tons of experience, what could go wrong?

I dont think any of us imagined he would be quite so bad. I guess Worthy''s judgement could be criticized over the fact Helveg didnt settle in, but again I dont think anyone figured he would be quite so bad. 

His wages are refutedly quite high, so Im glad we are rid of him. And as is said above at least it gets bloody Olsen off our backs!

[First Wizard 0]

[quote]Wiz - I thought initially Helveg was a great signing. An international captain, tons of experience, what could go wrong? I dont think any of us imagined he would be quite so bad. I guess Worthy''s ju...[/quote]

Get Olsen off our backs?, Trent my friend.

Don''t you believe it mate, the guy''s a 100% fully paid up loony!.   

[Karl Pilkington 0]

[quote]Whilst I''m prepared to admit that Nigel has done some sterling work for this club, you have to scratch your head, and ask why he went and wasted a hell of a lot of money on Helveg?. Now, I was a Helv...[/quote]

I think it is harsh to go all storm clouds for worthy on the basis of Thomas Helveg. Look at his CV. Played at the highest level for AC Milan and Inter. International captain. Played in World cups and Euro championships, and available for nothing. Most clubs would want to sign him. If you will critisise him for any signings, surely Emblen would be higher up the list??

Remember for every Cantona, theres a Taibi.

No manager gets it correct everytime.

[Dicky 0]

1st Wiz - waste money on Helveg? No fee in, £135K (plus another £35K after ten appearances) out!  How on earth do you make that us wasting money?

[breaker 0]

At least Nigel doesn''t buy players from the www.cheapforeignfootballerswholookbrilliantforonegamethenpackinplayingforthenextyear.com website like a certain Mr H.......

[First Wizard 0]

[quote]1st Wiz - waste money on Helveg? No fee in, £135K (plus another £35K after ten appearances) out! How on earth do you make that us wasting money?[/quote]

I think you''ll find Dicky, that he was one of our highest earners, so ergo, waste of money maybe?.

Mind you, I may be way off on that one.

If so, I''ll apologise in advance!.

[Trent Canary 0]

Ive heard figures of about 20K a week for Helvegs wages. Even if it was only 10K that means we paid him three times as much over the year as the fee we got for him.

With hindsight a waste of money, but I certainly wouldnt have predicted it.

[Ou Est Anselin? 0]

I don''t know how much Helveg was on in the Premiership, but I know that he was on 4.5K a week after relegation. With wages like that he would not have been too much of a drain for the forthcoming season. But, hes gone and good luck to him. He had a fair amount of quality and would have been a major asset in this division.

Now for Worthington to sign someone worthy (no pun intended) to fill his shoes. Taylor of Tranmere springs to mind...

[Mook 0]

I think this is a completely one sided, unbalanced and biased viewpoint.

Whilst I will agree that Nigel is a lot better than others we have had in recent history, you have pretty much listed everything he has ever done as a good point. That is nonsense. Whilst some of the things I am about to write may be harsh all listed together, i will play devil''s advocate and look on the bad side of everything.

Transfer dealings - Rivers (900k loss), Emblem (750k loss), Jonson (£1m plus loss - because he''s rubbish), Helveg (a LOT of wages lost), Doherty (750k unplayed on the bench), Heckingbottom (250k loss), Briggs (200k loss), I would go on if I had time to research and wasn''t relying on memory.

Transfer dealings, part ii - WHY BUY PLAYERS AND LEAVE THEM ON THE BENCH? In Helveg, Safri, Charlton, Doherty (wages alone) we put tons of cash down the drain whilst fielding a WEAKER side. Why?

Tactics - What tactics? Defence on Green''s toes, line up with a confused 4-4-2, and "go out and play your game boys" ???? RUBBISH. What about man-markers on dangerous players, offside traps for lively strikers, exploiting other''s weaknesses to devastating affect with a couple of changes? No - we''re winning, bring on Holt, take off a striker or two and we''ll never concede! Yeah, right Nige. And what''s this with playing strikers as wingers? It hasn''t worked before (Rivers), It isn''t working now (Jonson) and don''t tell me Hendo or Jarvis will do any better!

Selection - Fleming. Holt. Edworthy. McKenzie on his own up front for 10 games. Mulryne over christmas. Jarvis wide right against Boro. Again, I would name more if I had more time to research it. And all this while Helveg, Safri, Charlton, Doherty, McVeigh warm the bench.

Youth policy - don''t train them well enough, then don''t play them, then we can release them and buy someone older, more expensive and who cares less. Top thinking Nige.

Scouting - Well, Scandinavia''s a big place I guess ...

Morale - We only ever buy good eggs. Or at least, they were SUPPOSED to be good eggs before NW manages to find a way to have a fight with them and then never pick them again.

I could go on, but I really have to do some work. As I say, I believe we could have done a lot worse than NW and am grateful for all he has done. But I think he is starting to believe his own hype, and I worry for next season if things don''t go our way.

[Dicky 0]

Mook - yeah, I really wish we were still struggling at the bottom of the 1st Div as we were when Worthy took over.  I really wish we hadn''t attracted players of the quality of Deano, Hucks etc.  I really wish we were nearly bankrupt like most other clubs in the Championship.  I really wish we played boring football....

I''ll have a pint of what he''s been drinking please barman!

[Mook 0]

Oh, that''s strange. Having re-read my post, I can''t find the bit where I said I would like to go back to the bottom of Div 1 and play unattractive football.

If you read the post properly, rather than looking on it as a threat to the happy-go-lucky everything''s alright brigade, you will see that I have said I thought the first post was thoroughly one-sided and I would play devil''s advocate. That''s all.

I am well aware that Worthy has done a great job with a struggling side, but turning that into future success needs a LOT of changes in the way we do things - NOT what I believe is pig-headedness verging on blind ignorance from Worthington. Scouting, training, tactics and youth policy all need a long, hard look and fast. If you can''t admit that, then you''ve got your eyes closed and your ears shut.

[Evil Monkey 52]

[quote]I think this is a completely one sided, unbalanced and biased viewpoint. Whilst I will agree that Nigel is a lot better than others we have had in recent history, you have pretty much listed everythi...[/quote]

I''m sorry, it was my post that was one-sided, unbalanced and biased?

Erm, okay......... I too was relying on memory and, to be perfectly frank, the bad points you listed, particularly in terms of signings, are up for debate.  The positives I''ve listed are not.  Unless anyone wants to suggest Deano was a bad signing....?

Quite pleased with the responses though, I did post it with the intention of seeing what the other side had to offer, and now that I see its not really anything concrete, I''m more than happy...

Anyway, one of the points I was making, in listing the mistakes Worthington had made, during my one-sided and unbalanced tirade, is that Nigel has learnt from these, and can only be a better manager for it.  A tough year''s worth of experience, and a better and stronger squad, and we''re in an even better position now than when we won Division One.

And I''d like to see someone argue with that...

[Dicky 0]

[quote]Oh, that''s strange. Having re-read my post, I can''t find the bit where I said I would like to go back to the bottom of Div 1 and play unattractive football. If you read the post properly, rather than...[/quote]

Worthy has taken us from First Div strugglers to what we have today.  Why oh why do so many posters feel the need to have a go at him at every opportunity. 

Mook, I didn''t realise that you were perfect in every way and have never made an error with the benefit of hindsight.  If not, how would you like every little thing that some people feel you have got wrong, brought up by some armchair critic.

We have a very loyal and successful manager.

Like a lot of things, some (I was going to say supporters, but that involves supporting the team/manager) people won''t realise what we have until we lose him.

[Mook 0]

Dicky, I supported Worthy and the team (including Rivers, Easton, Holt, Henderson, Svensson, Helveg etc etc that all those around me seemed to be shouting at) for four years solid, and always backed Worthy''s judgement.

I always put the "mistakes" down to him working in mysterious ways.

But last year I saw a lot of things that I wasn''t sure of. It will take a while to recover from the tube journey back after the Fulham game, with people looking at me as if I was a leper and losing the two goal advantage at Selhurst to name but two things.

I was not being an "armchair" critic, I was pointing out the the rose-tinted initial post had a flip side, and there are negative elements. To become better we need to address that negative side, and not just leave everything alone and pretend it''s working fine. As I say - Youth team, Coaching, tactics and scouting could all be improved and we will benefit as a team by addressing them now.