scapegoat

[jess 0]

too many people are placing too much blame on flem he was solid last nite and will inprove as the season goes on. Pathetic fans jeering him will only make his performences more jumpy. Hes obviously still shows the talent and ability to be in the side in training so be a true supporter and encourage him.

 

City 4 The Prem!!!!!!!!!!

[Evil Monkey 52]

The problem, Jess, is that NCFC fans are extremely fickle! Once we''ve decided we don''t like a player, that''s it, they''ve got no chance! Regardless of how well they play from thereonin, we watch their performance more closely than everyone else, and pick it apart with a fine tooth comb.  Some don''t even bother to watch him, they''ve already made their minds up!

I''ve been totally unimpressed with Doherty, myself, and am glad he has been dropped in favour of Shackell (who could easily turn out to be the best defender in this division, this year).  I try hard not to pick on The Doc, but after Saturday its difficult!

How many people on here have complained about Shacks'' rash challenge that led to his yellow card - he could easily have walked for that!  But we love Shackell, so we forget the errors.

We don''t love Flem (anymore), so we scrutinise him. But how often was he caught out of position during the Div 1 season, or backed off from a tackle?? Having watched the DVD recently, quite a few, but did we jeer and boo him then?? No, we voted him Player of the Season!

I''m all for bringing in a solid, young central defender, but whilst Flem plays like he did last night (a few errors aside), I''m happy for him to partner Shackell.

[jess 0]

Evil Monkey sounds like me and you are on the same wave lenghth. Its a shame that we as city fans can at times the best in the country then at others turn on our own players!!

[XXL16 0]

Flem did OK last season but the question we raised up was would he been rested not DROPPED, I mean, you know what I mean. Play more than 50 games a season would be, I had to say a bit too much to him...

[jobian 0]

we have an appalling habit of turning against our own players, and ruining already fragile confidence levels with booing and groaning. Strangely it seems it is the kind of player who is committed, gives 100% and shows loyalty who becomes ridiculed. Holt, Sutch, Flem, etc. These players are booed for not being up to the job, even though they give their all. When anybody dares to have a go at the flash, lazy players, there''s uproar, how dare we boo Francis, he scored seven goals last season, a similar thing with Mulryne when he wanted to leave a few years ago then changed his mind when nobody wanted him. I think all players should be given our full support except in situations a la Francis.

We''re two games into the season, we have 4-6 new players to settle into the side, we are yet to lose and are improving rapidly. Please reserve your hatred and hounding out of the club until we''ve played 10-15 games.

[Salopian 1]

Flem had a good season, 2003-04, although how far this was because of the presence of Malky, we don''t know.

What is sure is that he had a poor season in the Premiership, - not the only one to be out of his depth. What most critics are expressing is that so far his "nightmare" seems to be continuing - lack of pace, poor positioning and mis-timed (or absent) tackles. If things continue as they are for a few more games then we must consider someone else with Shackle.

[We need a Manager 0]

Maybe if Fleming was treated the same as other players and dropped after a poor performance the fans would lay off him a little. A post i saw on the wotb site the other night sums it up nicely somebody said if i won £200 million on the lottery and bought the club Terry,Ferdinand and Campbell what one of the three would you play with Fleming Nigel .

[Alex Harvey-Jones 0]

Defenders playing well or badly is not purely about ability, its also about understanding with their fellow defenders. Fleming and MacKay had great understanding and worked well together. I think Fleming and Shackell could form a good pairing but its going to take time for them to get the understanding that Fleming and MacKay had!

[LinkNR9 0]

The problem is, Evil Monkey, that Fleming is well past his sell-by date but Worthington won''t drop him, because he''s one of Worthy''s chosen few.

[Nick No 36 0]

Jess any sane, reasonably intelligent football fan would know that we did quite well against Crewe and it was an improvement to the first game.  The score could have been 6-1 but it wasn''t but we did create the chances which is good.  In the same way any sane, reasonably intelligent football fan would know that Flem played well.  He had a cracking first half and a solid second half.  It seems that some of our fans need a scapegoat and Flem seems to be it at the moment and if some people like ZippersLeftWhatever like to make disparaging remarks it doesn''t make it true.  When the team gel together and we start picking up some good results it will probably stop. I would like to think that these certain type of fans would then realise that it does no good whatsoever but unfortunately they will probably pick another player to try to strip of his confidence.

[ZLF 274]

[quote]Jess any sane, reasonably intelligent football fan would know that we did quite well against Crewe and it was an improvement to the first game. The score could have been 6-1 but it wasn''t but we did ...[/quote]

We all have a view and I acknowledge mine is tainted and people should read it as such.   Others bemoan scapegoating yet have Doc as their ''scapegoat'' and dont get half the grief (mostly justified) I have had this season.  

However it does not mean that I am not a sane reasonably intelligent football fan (it doesnt mean I am either) and I see no reason why this should undermine the players as they only get wholehearted and vocal support from me in the ground.   Hopefully they stick some of my comments on the wall, throw darts at them and gain a determination or motivation to prove me wrong but I very much doubt that the players read much of what is on here and even more doubt that they take a blind bit of notice of what I or any other poster on here thinks.  They are professionals and realise that they will have criticism at some stage in their career.

Even if we had won 6-1, the ease with which crewe dominated midfield in the first half is an issue and the number of chanes crewe had to win the game were numerous and without Greens fine form we could have been buried by half time as a result of poor positional defending. That is how I saw the game and my feeling is that unless these shortcomings are address we will struggle to get a  play off spot this season.   This squad and all us fans deserve that at least.

As for the crewe game there were two players worse than Flem and I posted as such, flem looks OK when he is there to challenge but, IMO, is too often out of position, flayling behind play, failing to read a threat or simply too slow to react - I saw these features again on Tues. Others feel he played well - we simply have a different opinion and I can live with that.  However any other defender demonstrating these features would have been dropped for another combination I think it is time someone else is given a go with shacks.   

If we do not make that sort of progress this season we will not have the likes of Shacks, Safri, Ashton & Green at the club as other sides will look to take them of our hands and they rightly looked to further their careers.  Without them we really will face an uphill battle to escape this alcatraz of a league.

Give us all a bit of respect - and I will try and do the same for Flem come sat at 5.   

FlippersZeftLoot or whatevermynameis.   

[Saint Canary 0]

[quote]The problem, Jess, is that NCFC fans are extremely fickle! Once we''ve decided we don''t like a player, that''s it, they''ve got no chance! Regardless of how well they play from thereonin, we watch their ...[/quote]

Surely though monkey if "Once we''ve decided we don''t like a player, that''s it, they''ve got no chance!" means we are the opposite of fickle?

Sorry couldn''t help myself but you are right though.  You take a player like Svensson who used to get get jeered quite a lot just because he was playing instead of Iwan.  People had decided after 2 games they didn''t like him and in some cases before he had even kicked a ball for City.

In the case of Flem, I don''t really think of people making him a scapegoat and blaming everything on him.  I think it''s merely a question of if we keep conceding sloppy goals will Fleming be held accountable by Worthy because he seems impervious to criticism.

[BedsCanary 0]

It''s not scapegoating. Craig Fleming was the by a long distance, the worst City player last season, yet he was and still is the first name on the team sheet.