Why is Delia the scapegoat?

[Arthur Whittle 0]

[quote user="T"]...I do appreciate an intellectual debate with someone with a sense of humour but sometimes you just have to settle for someone who  is easy to wind up.[/quote]

Ahhh such wit, or at least half of it!

[T 190]

I did include Leeds and Leicester in the 18 which I think is valid long term but I also included the likes of PNE and Cardiff but not  Burnley so I  was stretching the point but not that far. I''d agree that financially we are a mid-table club who should be challenging for promotion in some years. Overall we have performed at the lower end of reasonable expectations for the last 3 seasons and ultimately it goes to the top  as they are responsible for appointing the manager. People do underestimate the impact of chance though as you can never be sure how managers or players will perform together e.g. the low rate of injuries when we got promoted. Also there is not a lot of difference between teams in the championship. So say the credit crunch had not hit when it did - the club had generated a few additional million from the land sale and the Turners had put another 2m in as planned - Roeder gets Iversen as planned and everything clicks then we may well having be pushing for a promotion place. You make your luck to some extent over the long term but people do underestimate that chance does play a big part especially when there is not a big difference between teams, jsut look at Watford, Soton, CP and Charlton or on the other end Hull who ferguson can not explain. Having said all that I would still like to see PC make a sensible offer to buy the shareholders out. 

[T 190]

...half wit as opposed too Whittless?

[Jim Smith 2,324]

In response to the original post i don''t think the vast, vast majority of fans hate Delia and MWJ built the fact is that she is the public face of the club and the board and therefore is naturally going to bear the brunt of any discontent. The fact is that also history has shown that Delia and MWJ have (rightly or wrongly dependent on your stance) a very strong belief that the direction they are taking the club at any given time is the correct direction and consequently their position often appears to become very entrenched when they are subjected to criticism. This in turn tends to lead to resentment growiong on both sides of the fence. We saw it during the growing clamour for Worthington to go and we are seeing it again now. I have always been of the view that worthy left at least a year later then he should have done (if not 2) and unfortunately I fear the same situation may be about to repeat itself with finding a new investor/owner to take over the club.

That for me is what primarily fuels criticism directed in Delia''s direction. On the face of it we had a fantastic opportunity to bring in a man with serious financial clout over the summer and we rejected it, seemingly without even meeting with him to enter into any serious discussions. Whatever your views on Cullum that is one hell of a gamble to take at a time when the club is struggling financially (through no partciluar fault of the board in my view) and cannot even afford to own half of its playing staff. We may never get an approach like that again (particularly with what has happened since in the finacial world). If they had serious talks with Cullum and they failed due to him being completely unreasonable then so be it - come out and tell us (I accept they can''t tell every detail) and I could live with that - who knows maybe they did have more meetings thatn is being let on. Its the fact that they have publically stated they did not even meet with him, put out a highly defensive statement about the cost of acquiring the club and this apparent stance at the moment that we are looking for investment but you come to us that I think makes people angry. Delia has also not helped herself with several ill advised quotes to the press such as the fact that she does not think the fans would ever forgive her if someone came forward with £20m to spend on the team and she turned him away. That quote came AFTER we now know PC had approached the club - what is that all about?

They have gambled that either Roeder will get us out of this hole with his loan army (not happening) or alternatively some more paletable individual may come along to "invest" in the club - that does not look much like happening either. At the end of the day the only people who can facilittate a takeover and Delia and MWJ and that is why they are always going to bear the brunt of fans frustrations. At the end of the day I think its sad as they have done a hell of a lot of good for our club and for that we should all be grateful. unfortunately that is in danger of being overshadowed should they oversee our relegation to the 3rd tier!

[T 190]

I would like to see PC takeover but unfortunately he did not make an offer to buy the existing shareholders out unless he has done so recently so there was no sensible offer to accept.

[alex_ncfc 662]

If you have to ask that question, Ellis, then you are quite clearly a k**b.

Seriously, how much longer are you going to defend her reign? Saved the club, my arse.

[Beauseant 0]

[quote user="Jim Smith"]

In response to the original post i don''t think the vast, vast majority of fans hate Delia and MWJ built the fact is that she is the public face of the club and the board and therefore is naturally going to bear the brunt of any discontent. The fact is that also history has shown that Delia and MWJ have (rightly or wrongly dependent on your stance) a very strong belief that the direction they are taking the club at any given time is the correct direction and consequently their position often appears to become very entrenched when they are subjected to criticism. This in turn tends to lead to resentment growiong on both sides of the fence. We saw it during the growing clamour for Worthington to go and we are seeing it again now. I have always been of the view that worthy left at least a year later then he should have done (if not 2) and unfortunately I fear the same situation may be about to repeat itself with finding a new investor/owner to take over the club.

That for me is what primarily fuels criticism directed in Delia''s direction. On the face of it we had a fantastic opportunity to bring in a man with serious financial clout over the summer and we rejected it, seemingly without even meeting with him to enter into any serious discussions. Whatever your views on Cullum that is one hell of a gamble to take at a time when the club is struggling financially (through no partciluar fault of the board in my view) and cannot even afford to own half of its playing staff. We may never get an approach like that again (particularly with what has happened since in the finacial world). If they had serious talks with Cullum and they failed due to him being completely unreasonable then so be it - come out and tell us (I accept they can''t tell every detail) and I could live with that - who knows maybe they did have more meetings thatn is being let on. Its the fact that they have publically stated they did not even meet with him, put out a highly defensive statement about the cost of acquiring the club and this apparent stance at the moment that we are looking for investment but you come to us that I think makes people angry. Delia has also not helped herself with several ill advised quotes to the press such as the fact that she does not think the fans would ever forgive her if someone came forward with £20m to spend on the team and she turned him away. That quote came AFTER we now know PC had approached the club - what is that all about?

They have gambled that either Roeder will get us out of this hole with his loan army (not happening) or alternatively some more paletable individual may come along to "invest" in the club - that does not look much like happening either. At the end of the day the only people who can facilittate a takeover and Delia and MWJ and that is why they are always going to bear the brunt of fans frustrations. At the end of the day I think its sad as they have done a hell of a lot of good for our club and for that we should all be grateful. unfortunately that is in danger of being overshadowed should they oversee our relegation to the 3rd tier!

[/quote]

 

Good post, Jim. I certainly don''t hate Delia and appreciate what she has done for the club,but nevertheless feel that she has taken it as far as she can.She has made a lot of ill advised statements and been completely outmanouevred by Peter Cullum''s publicity machine.As you rightly say, the board has done itself no favours by being so secretive about the original Cullum offer.Having a fair bit of experience of Cullum''s business I suspect it had lots of strings attached and may even have been structured in such a way to ensure rejection,but by not exposing this they have lost the moral high ground completely and now run the serious risk of becoming hated by an increasing number of fans,which,in my view, would be very sad.

 

[Jim Smith 2,324]

[quote user="T"]I would like to see PC takeover but unfortunately he did not make an offer to buy the existing shareholders out unless he has done so recently so there was no sensible offer to accept.[/quote]

I agree there was fault on both sides and for it to be resolved both need to swallow some pride and get round the table. It is not as simplistic though as saying "he did not make an offer." He probably did not make an offer because he was told to get lost straight away and (from the outsiders perspective) his approach was met with hostility. That to me does not sit easily with a  club "actively seeking investment." At the evry least i would expect them to have all sat round over one of Delia''s special recipes with a couple of bottles of wine and tried to make it work!

[Green and Yellow 0]

[quote user="ellis206"]I''m interested to know why everyone hates Delia so much even though she has pumped £12 million of her own money into the club, attends every home and away game, and even gave up her career as a tv chef to concentrate on Norwich City, I know we aren''t performing as we should at the moment (away from home anyway) but I want to know why its Delia who gets blamed for everything and not our actual chairman who will have a lot more say in what happens in the club than Delia Smith, surely Roger Munby will make the final decisions on everything that happens, so is it because Delia is a woman? (as MWJ''s doesn''t get the same abuse) or is it because she is a celebrity? I''m not looking to have an argument with anyone I just want to know why people  hate her and not Munby?
[/quote]

Delai has done sweet FA. All the loans are secured against the training facility at Colney. Don''t ever believe anything other than that she is a hard nosed business person. Also when  NCFC were promoted too the Premiership you couldn''t keep her out of the press. So she now has to take the rough with the smooth. 

[Green and Yellow 0]

[quote user="T"]...I do appreciate an intellectual debate with someone with a sense of humour but sometimes you just have to settle for someone who  is easy to wind up.[/quote]

Is your middle name Dick?.

[Mello Yello 2,297]

No hate directed at Delia from me......But, I do think it''s time she fell on her egg whisk.....

It just can''t go on, we''re deteriorating rapidly both as a team, club and as a business. We have to halt the slide sooner than later.

[T 190]

Based on the reports from both sides he offered to inject 20m of new equity in return for control but made no offer for the existing shares  - anyone with any sense would politely tell the person to get lost as the existing shareholders would be left with their wealth trapped as a worthless minority interest with no control over the money they had invested, Normally when you take control of a business you buy the existing shareholders out - the minimum price being the 16m of net assest on the balance sheet which the Board asked for. Whilst I understand what PC was doing it was a very cheeky offer done in a cheeky manner to say the least and that is putting it politely. Hopefully he has or will come back with sensible offer which is worth discussing.

[Jim Smith 2,324]

[quote user="T"]

Based on the reports from both sides he offered to inject 20m of new equity in return for control but made no offer for the existing shares  - anyone with any sense would politely tell the person to get lost as the existing shareholders would be left with their wealth trapped as a worthless minority interest with no control over the money they had invested, Normally when you take control of a business you buy the existing shareholders out - the minimum price being the 16m of net assest on the balance sheet which the Board asked for. Whilst I understand what PC was doing it was a very cheeky offer done in a cheeky manner to say the least and that is putting it politely. Hopefully he has or will come back with sensible offer which is worth discussing.

[/quote]

Yes hopefully he will. I have never said they should have accepted his offer and have always held the view that Delia and MWJ should receive a fair amount for their shares. I guess the question is was he told "get lost" or was he told "if thats your offer get lost but if you are prepared to offer a reasonable amount for our shares then lets talk." Whichever it was though from where I am sitting if nothing happens by January we are in serious trouble this season and perhaps therefore a bit of pride needs to be swallowed on both sides to get talks going again.

[T 190]

[quote user="Mello Yello"]

No hate directed at Delia from me......But, I do think it''s time she fell on her egg whisk.....

It just can''t go on, we''re deteriorating rapidly both as a team, club and as a business. We have to halt the slide sooner than later.

[/quote]

 

Agreed and I think they also agree so hopefully the current sale process results in a sensible offer although it will be difficult as there are a few but only a few pepole with the means and the  inclination to buy a championship club.

[T 190]

I doubt if PC is too senstive and Mumby publicly and deliberately left the door open. The sensible thing for the Board to do is have auction process which is the standard process which they sound as if they are doing and then go back to PC when they have something to negotiate. PC knows he is one of very few people with the necessary wealth or interest whilst on the other side the Board know that if PC really wants to buy a football club then NCFC is the one he wants. 

[macdougalls perm 0]

[quote user="thecanaryfan wants the board out"]

Because on 28 Feb 2005 she embarrassed herself and made a mockery of the club.

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=Z_8JLkwzpd0

Oh and she rejected an investment offer of £20m at a time when the club was on its knees.

[/quote]

I don''t hate her but I do want her out and for us to get new investment in the club.

We definitely need a change at the top but I feel like this because of the state the club has been allowed to get into, absolutely nothing to do with this incident!

I think I am almost unique, on this board anyway, in having found the whole thing pretty hilarious and still do.

 

[arrdee 2]

No you are not alone Mac , I do as well.