The Cass Review on Gender Dysphoria Treatment in Children

[littleyellowbirdie 2,560]

Two comments of particular interest to me in the report was the suggestion that rising gender dysphoria in children should be seen in the context of an overall rise in mental health problems in children, and also the weak evidence on which much gender dysphoria treatment of children has been based. Puberty blockers will no longer be prescribed apparently.

https://www.bbc.com/news/health-68770641

What do people think of the report and its findings?

Edited April 10 by littleyellowbirdie

[Fen Canary 847]

3 hours ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

Two comments of particular interest to me in the report was the suggestion that rising gender dysphoria in children should be seen in the context of an overall rise in mental health problems in children, and also the weak evidence on which much gender dysphoria treatment of children has been based. Puberty blockers will no longer be prescribed apparently.

https://www.bbc.com/news/health-68770641

What do people think of the report and its findings?

I think most people would have assumed that the findings were largely common sense, a child not yet deemed competent enough to have a pint or get a tattoo isn’t in a position to make a decision that may leave them infertile or require ongoing surgery.

Also that many children who claim gender dysphoria often have other underlying mental health issues such as autism which should be checked first before putting them into experimental puberty blockers.

Hopefully this kills it all stone dead. Many politicians and groups who were the loudest cheerleaders of giving these drugs to children (Streeting) are now backpedalling furiously and quietly forgetting their previous positions on the matter 

[Naturalcynic 641]

4 hours ago, Fen Canary said:

I think most people would have assumed that the findings were largely common sense, a child not yet deemed competent enough to have a pint or get a tattoo isn’t in a position to make a decision that may leave them infertile or require ongoing surgery.

Also that many children who claim gender dysphoria often have other underlying mental health issues such as autism which should be checked first before putting them into experimental puberty blockers.

Hopefully this kills it all stone dead. Many politicians and groups who were the loudest cheerleaders of giving these drugs to children (Streeting) are now backpedalling furiously and quietly forgetting their previous positions on the matter 

And this is why I, and presumably many others, have had profound misgivings about NCFC (and football in general) embracing such things as LGBTQ+ Pride month, rainbow laces etc because of the implicit requirement to unquestioningly accept, support and celebrate the whole trans agenda, despite the clear and obvious harm it can cause to highly impressionable and vulnerable youngsters.

Edited April 11 by Naturalcynic

[Herman 9,788]

34 minutes ago, Naturalcynic said:

And this is why I, and presumably many others, have had profound misgivings about NCFC (and football in general) embracing such things as LGBTQ+ Pride month, rainbow laces etc because of the implicit requirement to unquestioningly accept, support and celebrate the whole trans agenda, despite the clear and obvious harm it can cause to highly impressionable and vulnerable youngsters.

Yes, we all assumed that was the reason for your dislike of Pride and other inclusive initiatives. 👍

[Naturalcynic 641]

1 hour ago, Herman said:

Yes, we all assumed that was the reason for your dislike of Pride and other inclusive initiatives. 👍

You can assume whatever you want, sunshine, just as I could make assumptions about people who were seemingly very happy to march alongside Jew-hating, pro-Islamist, Hamas supporters.

Edited April 11 by Naturalcynic

[A Load of Squit 5,183]

11 hours ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

Two comments of particular interest to me in the report was the suggestion that rising gender dysphoria in children should be seen in the context of an overall rise in mental health problems in children, and also the weak evidence on which much gender dysphoria treatment of children has been based. Puberty blockers will no longer be prescribed apparently.

https://www.bbc.com/news/health-68770641

What do people think of the report and its findings?

The link says puberty blockers will no longer be routinely prescribed, clinical trials will continue.

 

 

[cambridgeshire canary 6,749]

So you're saying people who think they are the opposite gender and want to mutilate their body might be mentally ill?

 

Interesting. Not sure you could say the same if you were in Scotland with their new laws without ending up in jail mind..

Edited April 11 by cambridgeshire canary

[Naturalcynic 641]

1 hour ago, cambridgeshire canary said:

So you're saying people who think they are the opposite gender and want to mutilate their body might be mentally ill?

 

Interesting. Not sure you could say the same if you were in Scotland with their new laws without ending up in jail mind..

Yes, the report was perfectly timed to cause embarrassment for Yousaf, the SNP and the Greens in Scotland in their apparent ideological promotion of the trans agenda and their attempts to suppress any alternate dissenting views through the ridiculous hate crime act.

Edited April 11 by Naturalcynic

[Fen Canary 847]

4 hours ago, Herman said:

Yes, we all assumed that was the reason for your dislike of Pride and other inclusive initiatives. 👍

To many people associating the contentious trans issues with the gay rights movement did tarnish it somewhat, so pride was no longer just about battling homophobia (something that’s largely disappeared from most of society) but something that includes much more political questions about giving experimental drugs to children and allowing men into women single sex sports and spaces. When groups such as Stonewall were some of the trans issues loudest proponents, so much so that even gays and lesbians started to distance themselves from it and start groups such as the LGB alliance then I think it’s fair to say the pride had lost some of its original meaning 

[Fen Canary 847]

2 hours ago, A Load of Squit said:

The link says puberty blockers will no longer be routinely prescribed, clinical trials will continue.

 

 

Only under very strict guidelines though the same as any other experimental drug. It’s completely different to the situation before where Tavistock were handing them out willy nilly and not even keeping tabs on the result or who even kept taking them 

[Naturalcynic 641]

38 minutes ago, Fen Canary said:

Only under very strict guidelines though the same as any other experimental drug. It’s completely different to the situation before where Tavistock were handing them out willy nilly and not even keeping tabs on the result or who even kept taking them 

In preparation for nilly willy?

[littleyellowbirdie 2,560]

3 hours ago, A Load of Squit said:

The link says puberty blockers will no longer be routinely prescribed, clinical trials will continue.

 

 

Yup, which really begs the question how the hell the NHS got to the stage of routinely prescibing to children in the first place without clinical trials coupled with what has now been established to be very weak evidence on the whole subject. Absolutely irresponsible; negligent even.

Edited April 11 by littleyellowbirdie

[Yellow Fever 3,803]

Seems like a good report accepted by all - indicating how such services can be improved and where more follow-up is required.

As noted though - the whole rational (medical) debate is surrounded by toxicity and in my view really shouldn't be in the public arena at all if you want sensible answers. That's sad for all concerned.

 

[littleyellowbirdie 2,560]

20 minutes ago, Yellow Fever said:

Seems like a good report accepted by all - indicating how such services can be improved and where more follow-up is required.

As noted though - the whole rational (medical) debate is surrounded by toxicity and in my view really shouldn't be in the public arena at all if you want sensible answers. That's sad for all concerned.

 

It's worth bearing in mind that this atrocious situation where children were routinely dealt with with as much care as guinea pigs in a lab was caused by specialists proceeding as they thought best with no oversight.

It was very interesting to listen to some parents of children who'd expressed as transgender where neither the parents nor the GPs knew how to deal with it. But it's also of great interest that a number of psychotherapists interested in the subject have complained of being frozen out by the specialist in sex change surgery, while the report we've just had explicitly brought children's mental health into the wider question of why this situation has been allowed to get out of control.

This Guardian has actually been questioning the dramatic rise in gender dysphoria in girls especially of recent years. The report points to a correlation between social media use and severity of gender dysphoria. https://www.theguardian.com/society/2024/apr/10/what-cass-review-says-about-surge-in-children-seeking-gender-services As Cass points out, biology hasn't changed in the last few years, so something else has.

This subject pertains to all children and involves questions that impact all of society; the last place it belongs is purely in the domain of so-called experts whose competence beyond the technical application of their specialist skills is very much in the dock at present.

Edited April 11 by littleyellowbirdie

[Yellow Fever 3,803]

1 hour ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

It's worth bearing in mind that this atrocious situation where children were routinely dealt with with as much care as guinea pigs in a lab was caused by specialists proceeding as they thought best with no oversight.

It was very interesting to listen to some parents of children who'd expressed as transgender where neither the parents nor the GPs knew how to deal with it. But it's also of great interest that a number of psychotherapists interested in the subject have complained of being frozen out by the specialist in sex change surgery, while the report we've just had explicitly brought children's mental health into the wider question of why this situation has been allowed to get out of control.

This Guardian has actually been questioning the dramatic rise in gender dysphoria in girls especially of recent years. The report points to a correlation between social media use and severity of gender dysphoria. https://www.theguardian.com/society/2024/apr/10/what-cass-review-says-about-surge-in-children-seeking-gender-services As Cass points out, biology hasn't changed in the last few years, so something else has.

This subject pertains to all children and involves questions that impact all of society; the last place it belongs is purely in the domain of so-called experts whose competence beyond the technical application of their specialist skills is very much in the dock at present.

Here's the final report.

https://cass.independent-review.uk/home/publications/final-report/

Started 4 years ago. It broadly seems as if the professions (NHS England) are doing what you'd expect - investigating given the rise in cases and sorting out best practise. As they state recently its a lot more birth girls than boys.  

The point is as per the report "The strengths and weaknesses of the evidence base on the care of children and young people are often misrepresented and overstated, both in scientific publications and social debate." You can see it happening here already with entrenched views!

So we need to take the 'heat' out of the debate and certainly remove those with shouty preconceived ideas to see what is happening if we are to move forward. I note also that they are increasing provision of such services.

Really not much more to be said which is why everybody I think welcomes the academic report. 

[Foxy2600 304]

The NHS was never set up to provide this kind of service. Aneurin Bevan must be spinning in his grave! That and a certain agenda being spun by the academic world.

[A Load of Squit 5,183]

2 hours ago, Foxy2600 said:

The NHS was never set up to provide this kind of service. Aneurin Bevan must be spinning in his grave! That and a certain agenda being spun by the academic world.

Bevan would've seen people as individuals and wanted the best care for them based on their personal experiences.

Not even the apparently enlightened principle of the 'greatest good for the greatest number' can excuse indifference to individual suffering. There is no test for progress other than its impact on the individual.

[littleyellowbirdie 2,560]

2 hours ago, A Load of Squit said:

Bevan would've seen people as individuals and wanted the best care for them based on their personal experiences.

Not even the apparently enlightened principle of the 'greatest good for the greatest number' can excuse indifference to individual suffering. There is no test for progress other than its impact on the individual.

 

I'm sure she'd love to know what good you think was done to her.

[A Load of Squit 5,183]

3 minutes ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

 

I'm sure she'd love to know what good you think was done to her.

You're bat sh!t mental.

[Fen Canary 847]

3 hours ago, A Load of Squit said:

Bevan would've seen people as individuals and wanted the best care for them based on their personal experiences.

Not even the apparently enlightened principle of the 'greatest good for the greatest number' can excuse indifference to individual suffering. There is no test for progress other than its impact on the individual.

I’d have thought he’d have also expected doctors to abide by the first do no harm principle as well. Giving experimental drugs and major surgery to autistic teenagers and those with psychological issues would go against that in most people’s views

[littleyellowbirdie 2,560]

1 hour ago, A Load of Squit said:

You're bat sh!t mental.

How exactly? She was a patient at the Tavistock who presented with gender dysphoria as a child. They decided she was right, physically transitioned her, and it turned out to the be the wrong thing, leaving her irreversibly changed with only more surgery and more hormones to try and undo the damage caused by unnecessary elective surgery instead of proper psychological support.

If you don't see what's wrong there then it's you who's 'batsh*t mental'.

Edited April 11 by littleyellowbirdie

[A Load of Squit 5,183]

10 hours ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

How exactly? She was a patient at the Tavistock who presented with gender dysphoria as a child. They decided she was right, physically transitioned her, and it turned out to the be the wrong thing, leaving her irreversibly changed with only more surgery and more hormones to try and undo the damage caused by unnecessary elective surgery instead of proper psychological support.

If you don't see what's wrong there then it's you who's 'batsh*t mental'.

A very good example of the toxicity that Cass highlighted.

[Naturalcynic 641]

8 minutes ago, A Load of Squit said:

A very good example of the toxicity that Cass highlighted.

What utter cobblers.  You’re simply trying to deny the truth which is how we ended up in this sad situation in the first place.

[littleyellowbirdie 2,560]

27 minutes ago, A Load of Squit said:

A very good example of the toxicity that Cass highlighted.

No. A very good example of the toxicity that Cass highlighted is you jumping in out of the blue with 'you're batsh*t mental' with no accompanying points at all. What you've called toxicity there is a reasonable response that happens to have your own original bit of toxicity thrown back at you.

 

Edited April 12 by littleyellowbirdie

[Nik Vawn 130]

This is where we end up when people are frightened of expressing an opinion or raising concerns which are contrary to the prevailing dogma within an organisation.  It's of particular concern within a health setting where decision are supposed to be evidence based.