Hard men

[TheGunnShow 5,940]

3 minutes ago, Google Bot said:

Trouble is it's become normal for an attacking player to hook their leg into the defending player and it's accepted as being a skill, even when laying on the floor for minutes afterwards.  As a result the game is becoming more similar to first downs as you'd get in the NFL.

For me, it's this level of 'cheating' that needs to be eradicated, but first it needs to be called out for what it is.  But perhaps i'm in the minority?

The harder judgement calls will always exist.  It's these lower hanging fruits which we should be picking off though.

I do agree that attacking players look for contact where there wouldn't be any, or exaggerate what comes in but this buttresses my point that the rewards of getting such a play to stick during the game outweigh the drawbacks of getting caught during the same game. Which, for me at least, is the sign that such penalties to the defending team are too stringent. There's part of me thinking not just of scrapping penalty kicks, but render all free-kicks indirect to boot so there's less chance of playing for direct free-kicks in dangerous areas.

Basically, don't assume that every bit of contact is a foul - players can naturally come together and even knock each other over without it necessarily being a foul. And there have been loads of straight red cards where my first thought has been "if that's how IFAB want the FIFA Laws to be interpreted then the game has gone". In the professional arena, you can't miss a full-blooded tackle nowadays without being potentially on the block for a red card and that's an travesty.

Yet, at least from my experience, one of the most reliable things that can get a crowd going is a thunderous, but accurate tackle. Rarely see those nowadays.

[Sheva 123]

The biggest difference between players of the 70’s and now is this;

70’ s wanted to stay on their feet, Georgie Best as  the prime example, nowadays they can’t fall over quick enough- Jack Greelish style.

70’s player never showed that they were hurt,  ‘stitch me up and put me back on’ Terry Butcher style.

Norwich had the hardest of hard men in Duncan Forbes, but even the winger Keith Robson loved a tackle and famously went after Tommy Smith throughout one match!

 

 

[Google Bot 3,278]

6 minutes ago, TheGunnShow said:

There's part of me thinking not just of scrapping penalty kicks, but render all free-kicks indirect to boot so there's less chance of playing for direct free-kicks in dangerous areas.

That's a problem in itself as you're eradicating two compelling elements of the game because of the level of cheating/play acting that's been allowed to become the norm.

And it's not just offensively, look how Hanley cheats attackers by falling over at the slightest of touch in defensive positions.  I personally find it awful to see grown men playing in this way.

[TheGunnShow 5,940]

1 minute ago, Google Bot said:

That's a problem in itself as you're eradicating two compelling elements of the game because of the level of cheating/play acting that's been allowed to become the norm.

And it's not just offensively, look how Hanley cheats attackers by falling over at the slightest of touch in defensive positions.  I personally find it awful to see grown men playing in this way.

By allowing more physical contact to take place, I could easily say I'm bringing at least one of the most entertaining aspects of the game back in. And whilst I accept the point that it's not just offensively, the basic premise always remains, that being the risk of being penalised mid-game is hugely outweighed by the benefits gained mid-game and IMO this is what's in dire need of remedy.

Being less finicky on contact all around would stop Hanley's brand of shenanigans as much as it would the attacking divers.

[Google Bot 3,278]

35 minutes ago, TheGunnShow said:

By allowing more physical contact to take place, I could easily say I'm bringing at least one of the most entertaining aspects of the game back in.

The trouble is we got to this point through extreme levels of play acting where officials had no option but to stop play, and now it's stuck.  By that I mean players feigning head/leg injuries screaming in pain, falling down while 'accidentally' falling on top of the ball etc.

This will exist whether you allow more or less physical contact.

The only way is to address it, and if that has to be retrospectively as refs are unable to make the call mid-game, and VAR don't want to touch it.  Then so be it.

[TheGunnShow 5,940]

5 minutes ago, Google Bot said:

The trouble is we got to this point through extreme levels of play acting where officials had no option but to stop play, and now it's stuck.  By that I mean players feigning head/leg injuries screaming in pain, falling down while 'accidentally' falling on top of the ball etc.

This will exist whether you allow more or less physical contact.

The only way is to address it, and if that has to be retrospectively as refs are unable to make the call mid-game, and VAR don't want to touch it.  Then so be it.

Retrospective punishment could be one tool as part of a solution, but it's nowhere near a panacea. But if we take cases like someone pretending to be injured, then maybe it needs referees to just keep playing and if a goal is conceded as the "injured" player wasn't at the races, sooner rather than later, players might make more of an effort to stay on their feet.

It's that basic premise again - the risk/downside of being caught during the game is massively outweighed by the benefits of pulling off the act in question. If referees were suddenly told to ignore all players staying down for reasons they consider dubious and this started hurting the teams doing the cheating, it might make plenty of them stop.

(It might not, but heck, I think it's worth a go).

[Google Bot 3,278]

59 minutes ago, TheGunnShow said:

But if we take cases like someone pretending to be injured, then maybe it needs referees to just keep playing and if a goal is conceded as the "injured" player wasn't at the races, sooner rather than later, players might make more of an effort to stay on their feet.

I'd much prefer that approach, but there would probably be some legal action should anyone be genuinely injured?  It's back to that same judgement call on whether they're faking it or not isn't it.  That's the sticking point.

The only saving grace is that you do become used to it, and it's only when you watch older matches that you realise how different the game is.  But also, on the flipside of that the level of athleticism and skill amongst players is of a much higher average nowadays.

[Yobocop 1,099]

On 20/03/2024 at 19:08, cambridgeshire canary said:

Got worried for a minute thinking you'd found my search history..

Genuinely the funniest thing you’ve ever said on here 

[BroadstairsR 2,173]

A funny story told by Jimmy Geaves about the first time he came up against Leeds player Norman "Break Yer Legs" Hunter.

"It was in the first few minutes of the game and he came into me with such a crunching tackle that I didn't know what had hit me."

When asked if Hunter said anything just after it happened, Greaves replied, "I dunno, I was siting in the third row of the stands at the time."

JG was a hard nut too.

Today's prima donnas are such finely tuned thoroughbreds that they wouldn't have lasted five minutes in those days.

Edited March 22 by BroadstairsR

[Well b back 3,208]

On 21/03/2024 at 05:38, canarycop said:

The rules to book a player for diving have been around for ages. The fact refs don't is another story. They are allowing players to cheat yet book someone for taking their shirt off celebrating a goal. Until refs grow a pair nothing will change

The rules around retrospective action have also been around for a while, yet Johnny Howson completely escaped action for cheating, that ultimately won his team a game and could cost us a place in the playoffs.