maninyellowslacks

Yet again we are treated to an avalanche of excuses and reasons for our yet again dismal performance, first from the Worthless Wonder and then from the Doc with his ''this has got to stop now''. I am not having a go at the Doc here ( I am having a go at Worthless) but this is not a new situation we find ourselves in, this is our season. So rather than serving up this tired old crap again which we all know means nothing as we have consistently proved that nothing so far has changed or has been changed I would like to be bold enough to recommend a new and radical approach from Worthless Please inform us, the long suffering fans, in as many words as you like not what is wrong because strangely enough we all know that and some would say we see it better than you but, more importantly what you, the manager, are going to do about it. Yes that''s right, what is the plan.How are you intending to now turn us from an abysmal shower of no shows (excusing the first 15 minutes of course where yet again we could/should have won it but didn''t..yawn yawn) into the team we once were and should be. Don''t remind us of our failings and don''t fill the papers with what we should be doing tell us what we WILL be doing now to change this. It is not enough to say “All I can say is that I want a big response from the players against Leicester next weekend.” as remarkably you have said this before. And again remarkably here we are again. And on that note why don''t we try opening out the sentence a little as in “All I can say is that I want a big response from the players against Leicester next weekend or I will........................................” Maybe we could start this as a weekly competition where fans could have the opportunity to fill in the blanks and whoever comes up with the most likely to succeed could manage the team for the next game. It''s worth a shot. Stupid and ridiculous I know but strangely enough no more stupid or ridiculous than we have become, a few stray average performances aside of course  So Nige lets try something else for a change or if you don''t want to pass this onto Delia and then Delia ''lets try someone else for a change''   Worthy Out - If Not Why Not

Good effort, I would have more patience with a lot of the ''club'' reasoning if it were some months ago when we started being a bit rubbish, not now though when we have developed this to an almost expected performance. Confidence is a difficult thing but it works both ways, the players can give us more to sing about and we could do likewise, however it isn''t as though we boo or show dissaproval from the start of the game. We get behind our team from the off (BRIGHTON ASIDE) and it is when the performance remains low on the pitch that fans vent their anger and rightly so. This is an entertainment sport and we all sign up for it with our eyes wide open.

Easy, why don''t you sack him and then see if we get any better.   It could really work!

this truly is a valid point, and refusal of an opinion is fine but it cannot mean the opinion is not real for those that hold it. Insulting is a ridiculous method of argument and only  used by buffoons (only joking) I think people need to look past the division in the fan base due to differing opinions as we all want the same thing here regardless of the view or opinion you hold personally. This is about supporting the team, we all do that otherwise we would not follow Norwich City. That is basic fact so you then have to accept that we have different views on what should be done and how. There is no right or wrong with opinion. It is therefore incorrect to ridicule those who see things differently. It does seem though that few people have put forward a conclusive and factual argument for him staying, lots of reference to what he has done, the worthy out camp (me included) are mostly putting forward argument based on the here and now whilst accepting what he has achieved for us in the past. Big difference

It seems currently that there is a lot of he said/she said debate occuring on here and lots of attempts at rewording other peoples statements and opinions so I thought I would simplify my view of why Worthless should move on. Norwich City are currently CRAP. They have been for a long while, it didn''t just happen overnight. I make that statement as a fan of some 30 years who spent 6 of those never missing a game and without the commitments I currently have of kids,business etc I would still do so.I attend every home match and would do so regardless of the current incumbent. I have stuck with my club through good and bad and still my money goes through the turnstiles. The overall point in this is that we are a shadow of the team that we were even at the start of last season. When we staretd the prem campaign we matched some of the bigger teams at the start of the season and played excellent football. Now we get turned over for fun by pretty much anyone that fancies it. Where has the bite gone, we seem to lack everything and there will be a reason for that. Given the time that this has now gone on that reason can only sit at 1 door. If it is the players drop them,sell them,use a younger version from the academy set up. This does not happen. Had it happened I would have more patience with NW and be happy to see it through with him. But it hasn''t has it. The comments made by Mr Skipper are a side show, stupid in my opinion and shows as much knowledge of the world as your average politician but nevertheless a side show. THE ONLY REAL ISSUE HERE IS THAT WE ARE NO LONGER ANY GOOD. We have the players, some better than others, but they do not get used in the right way and some do not get used at all. So all you worthy fans 2 simple questions why have we become so inferior as a team? what HAS been done or IS being done to correct this?(Not could be done as enough time has passed now) NW is obviously a good man and I don''t hate the guy that is absolutely ridiculous but I have lost patience with him and the way in which he manages the team and what he has allowed it to become in too short a space of time. He has had long enough to correct it so time is up for me. Anyone?   

using your argument as a base then no manager ever would be replaced as you should always take the rough with the smooth, but at what point does that rough patch become all there is. Do you then go forward with that same manager regardless? There are 3 options here keep NW and hope keep him allowing him to adapt the team and change the current form sack him No 1-finger in the wind time and not the way to runa ny business No 2- he has had more then enough time as this is not a recent dip in form, this has been the case for the whole season No3-my preferred choice as he has done all he can You also state that many of us would be unwilling to listen to advice-that is sheer arrogance. We can all learn all of the time and those who believe they can''t are the ones in most need.Also if we had been doing a job fine for 5 years and then stopped doing it well we would look at that as to why the change and react to our findings. NW isn''t doing that as we have continued in the same vein for the majority of the season so far. We obviously differ in our views but I do not see anything currently that I could view as hasty actions, more that an increasing number of fans are dissatisfied with the ongoing demise of their club and will not stand by and see this continue.

What a top post. Get that on a t-shirt

"As for the comment about people training well and then not playing well, there are any number of factors that could affect this. Pre-Match preparation. What are the players doing (or not doing) on the fri eve before the game. How are they warming up before the match bith mentally and pyysically. Are our scouts good enough when reporting back to NW about the next oppoents, and as a result is NW not planning the match day team accordingly? Is there a psychological element to the players performing either at home or away? Should the team travel to games on match days or the night before? What feedback are the captain and club captain giving NW? Are the players accepting responsibility for their own performances or letting NW take the flak?"   This is my point, it could be any of these things so what is our esteemed manager doing about it?and what has he done in the last 16 weeks minimum to affect the situation. The problems remain the same so it would appear that nothing as in absolutely nothing has changed. That indicates a manager who is not managing surely? We have changed some players for those of a similar or less ability, no real improvements yet still are suffering from the same issues,again this sits at Nigel''s door.

Blainsey You initially made an interesting point but possibly in slightly the wrong way as I think some people will have taken the use of the word ignorant indicating a lack of knowledge as a more general statement-these are emotive times currently I don''t agree with your point but I do understand it. I am not a coach and I lack proper experience in that field (literally), I have like a lot of others played football and have a good understanding of the game with no proffessional grounding of any sort. I am still qualified to debate as I am a fan andwe can only comment on what we know. I have a number of problems with NW but in relation to your points raised I would offer the following I can agree entirely and accept that we don''t know what goes on outside what we see on the pitch. We all read the opinions of others and the rumours but these are non factual in most cases. However I don''t understand, and maybe you can help me here, if the players are consistently performing in training yet not replicating this on the pitch why is this still happening a number of games later. NW and the board have stated this some time ago yet we still seem to have the same problem great training, poor performances. Surely as a coach you would try something new, someone new, different training regime. This appears not to be the case though as the same reasoning is still being given and this was wholly apparent in October.I also struggle to believe sometimes that NW sees what we see on the pitch, whilst we don''t know what he knows maybe he should take a little more time to understand what we see and the reasons that we question his ability, it is after all a 2 way thing. I am not inferring that we should pick the team as that is ridiculous but just that a little extra knowledge or understanding could work better both ways.   As I have stated on another post here I was at Man Utd and Newcastle cheering on my team but surely I am not fickle now because I believe that the manager is not doing what he should be with his team. I have never been a big NW fan as I think he has always had a negative approach to the game, ny opinion only of course, but I celebrtaed his success with everyone else. I also think that it is time for him to go. May not be entirely his fault but that is sometimes how it goes.  If Worthy turns this round and we go up again I will be chanting his name as loudly as I can, that is part of the emotion of the game we all love so much. And in truth that does make me hypocritical  maybe fickle, but that is how I do what I do. But I am a true fan and have been for most of my 39 years.We just all have different views. Great post though and get on here more often as debate rules.We may not agree but what a boring world if that ever happened. 

is your point that a previously successful manager should never be replaced or questioned over their abilities if things are not going well I was in the crowd that evening as I was in every game that got us there, I also celebrated every goal that Iwan scored for us but I am glad he doesn''t play for us anymore as he wouldn''t cut it (although with Thorne in the team I could be wrong). Obviously these are different scenarios but the point is similiar, that things change over time and for all he has done a large number of people are of the opinion that he can no longer do what he has in the past. What is exactly wrong with that, you may not agree and you may believe that he can do the job. Personally I do not and that does not make me a disloyal fan, it makes me a fan with an opinion different to yours. Disloyal would be no sell out crowds when the results are awful at home not having one of the largest bases of away fans when results are awful not waiting for over half the season to raise the negative feelings regarding the manager and team (remember this is not a recent dip in form) Whilst I don''t agree with you I do agree that your view can be different but I would warrant that we are both passionate and loyal fans 

If you cannot at least understand the views of objectors to your view or opinion you are stubborn and arrogant. Mr Skipper does not have to agree but he even fails to allow the view, this is complete arrogance and is a little concerning given the current plight of the club that he represents. I am worried that the board actually do have their collective head in the sand. 

They won''t have time as they are all too busy training

“What more can I say?” said Fleming. “We were rubbish.” Not exactly true is it Craig? The statement should actually be "What more can I say, we were rubbish AGAIN, having already been rubbish for most of the season" There that''s better already isn''t it. 

"but as a team the players didn''t carry out their jobs properly today" “We have had a few like this away from home this season and it''s up to me to try and sort it out and put things right.” Given The Worthless ones comments post match as detailed above it will be interesting to see what changes are made for the next game, if none are made as I suspect then he is full of the proverbial. If he is indeed a manager then he will drop the innefective and try something different. Worthless also said “You can take a horse to water - but you can''t force it to drink" If that were me I would try a different horse but the mighty one seems to carry on leading the same old horse to the water and then gets confused when it does not drink. For me that indicates the inability of the man.   Move on Worthless and thanks for what you did achieve-it was a blast

I WANT WORTHY OUT I WANT WORTHY OUT I WANT WORTHY OUT I WANT WORTHY OUT  

Well, that was a step in the right direction wasn''t it. At what point do our seemingly inept board understand that Worthless lacks the ability to do anything other than continue doing what he is currently doing - nothing.   This has gone on now for long enough and will obviously not change with that idiot of a man in charge. Thanks for all you did because you did some good but now you are no longer doing it so go. If the board cannot do what needs to be done then maybe they should also go and get someone in that can see the wood for the trees. WE ARE A HOPELESS CASE CURRENTLY AND HAVE NO SPINE OR DESIRE. Thanks for that.  

Norwich manager Nigel Worthington said: "It is a good point from the players'' point of the view because we worked the ball really well all game. Which game was that then? "If you''ve been in the game a long time like me you keep plugging away until the final minute. Trouble is you don''t start until the eightieth minute We were patient and we deserved a point." Excellent, proper attacking attitude "It was an injustice had we lost but I was delighted with the overall performance - it was a good result." It appeared most of the game we would lose (again) and you must surely be easily pleased and as for the result IT WAS HULL!! Delia, please please please get rid of this managerial buffoon, how anyone can comment as he has following another drab and dismal result is beyond me and it concerns me that you the board all appear more than happy with our lot. Where did passion and wanting to win go.

King Juan   Whilst I would agree that this board has a decidedly negative slant currently it is because of our current plight that this is so and people are frustrated at that position and the length of time that it appears to have continued. I think as fans we are patient as opposed to the teams that I detailed in my original post, we do not winge and moan immediately and I think have been longer in the acceptance of the failings that are now escalating than lots of other fans would be. It is true that the board (message) is full of negativity but that is because people see no light at the end of the tunnel and not because they are moaners. I would cite examples like Wolves,Sunderland and Villa where they constantly believe that their big club status means that they should be in the top league and maon constantly on every media you care to mention when this does not happen.Villa are always calling for the head of Doug Ellis yet have not suffered a real relegation issue in some time and I am sure that most fans would swop places with them to get premier status albeit mid table.  I would reiterate my original point regarding the fans that Delia and co have enjoyed a unique loyalty that I do not believe is readily represented elsewhere and I would hate to see this position change and I think it is fair to say that the current negativity aimed toward those responsible and it is at those responsible is fair and just.I think messrs Worthy and co have had a long time to change the attitude within the team and have failed to do so and that is because the players are wrong or the leaders are wrong. Some of the players have changed so maybe it is time to change other things.

Now before the Rankins and Wizards of you start foaming at the mouth, we should take stock of what''s happening. Whilst Worthy''s tactics and decisions have been dubious, we still cannot avoid the fact that we have had 88 injuries this season already. But there is more to it: Why have we had substantially more injuries than other teams? We have also had a ton of new players - not the ''same squad of last year'' that everyone keeps bleating on about. We lost players in key positions and Worthy/the board have pretty much failed to fill them. However, this coupled with injuries cannot make for a good, balanced side with balanced tactics. Worthy/the board has failed to fill them.Nobody else can do it so if they don''t that''s a bit of a problem.This is probably the only thing that I could accept in his defence but I am not convinced the players are the problem but that it is the way in which they are managed.  The Huckerby factor: he is only any good when his ten team mates are able to carry him. We weigh so much of our play on him that the rest of the team have to mop up behind him, and if that team is different every week, it aint going to happen. We have to accept this as part of the reason we haven''t done well this season.We know it, if worthy doesn''t then another negative point and if he does and doesn''t alter the play or team to balance this then another negative point. Finally, expectation. The crowd (yes, you and me) have had a tiny taster of success and we are desperate for more. Yet 18 months ago we were all saying we''d go straight back down. Granted, we didn''t expect what''s happened, but if we had been able to field pretty much the same team for the first 10 games, don''t you think our (the crowd) confidence would have pushed the new players on to gel? Instead, we''ve been moaning at them from day one. We have behaved like spoilt children.I cannot recall a game pre Luton that was in any way negatively supported (aside from the odd groan for a misplaced pass). Well above average crowds with vociferous support and excellent away following who support all through the game. If a team of professional players and manager in this league cannot get fired up on the level of support that they got before they started to dissapoint then they are in the wrong job. Spolit children are so as they demand what they can''t have and then react when they don''t get it.I want a team that plays like they mean it, win lose or draw. It is the performance that I demand NOT THE RESULT. When we played Chelsea in the cup here and held them that is what I want to see of my team for 90 minutes a week, we then lost 4-0 we still played well but they were better than us-simple. We have not lost to anyone better than us this season we have lost because we did not play as we should and that is different. I''ve always had my doubts about Worthy - I''m not sure he is tactically adept enough to take us any further, but we cannot deny that when he''s had the players he wants, we''ve done well. I hope he''s learnt lessons, as any newish manager should (and he is still fairly inexperienced in the broad scheme of things), such as not picking Gary Holt or getting over his obsession with defensive midfielders, and I hope the board has learnt its lessons (and they aren''t that experienced either) and will insist this summer that we strengthen the spine of the team - with a good defender, attacking midfielder and someone to play with Earnshaw.I would question whether he has learnt anything, his use of players out of position when others in position are available has not changed, his odd use of substitutions at times has not changed,not playing the best players because he doesn''t like them has not changed,style of play against the opposition does not often change and when it does not work that takes too long to change. Use of younger players no change there. Right now, we aren''t going up. Fine. Let''s accept that. There is no point in sacking Worthy right now, because no new manger would take us up this season either. Unless we suddenly find ourselves with a fully fit and gelling squad in the next few weeks that still show no signs of improvement by the end of the season, my thought would be to give him another season. Let him learn by his mistakes. It''s not like he can''t hear us telling him what they are. This would be fine if this were remotely possible but this is not a slight blip it is an absolutely disastrous season of vast under achievement. I do not think that any of the teams above us have a better team or better players on the whole but they have a team spirit that we have failed to show for most of the season.We must not forget as well that this is coupled with an under achieved season in the prem, some different players admittedly but a similiar approach to the play as determined by the manager. And let''s have a little more patience than singing ''Worthy out'' only seconds after a dubious goal has given the Binners the lead in a game with 10 mminutes left to play. If those who were singing that had devoted as much energy to roaring the team on, we might have at least got an equalizer. But no, the players looked like they wanted to get off the pitch as quickly as possible, and that is OUR FAULT.The players did not look like they wanted to be on the pitch full stop and the second dubious goal was on the cards from 10 minutes into the game as we, as a team, had no interest in attacking that game at all. We were spineless,lacked any creativity at all and failed to close down the opposition throughout. This is not down to the fans. If you want negative fans go to Villa, Boro, Newcastle,Blackburn,Sunderland,Wolves,Ipswich all known for getting at the team early on if not going their way or for expecting success as they are ''big club''.I think this club is fortunate to have the patience within the fans that they enjoy and that they do not reward this well enough.  

Worthless post match comments "It takes strong people, strong minds to come through and I will stand tall. "Everyone has a goal in life and mine is to win games for Norwich and to be here for a long time."   Is this idiot for real.

It is difficult to know what to say after that total and utter shambles of a game, did our idiot and inept manager even tell the players that this was a derby game today. No passion, no creativity,no team work,no midfield and no idea. That man must leave our club now as this is beyond a joke. When packing your bags Worthless take those 2 idiot midfielders with you.  (On a slight positive note well done to Greeno for the dummy goal kick it made us laugh)

Well if everyone is doing it I am back from a bit of an exile as business keeps me away from the message board, never the games though. I have posted on here before as yellaman and bushy but always have trouble after a while getting back on so got bored and re registered. I think post Ashton it is now time for a team effort in an over the trenches mentality to start doing what we should have done more convincingly last season and play like we mean it and want to win. We as fans do not expect to win and nor do we believe that we should win as but what we do require is that all the players who wear the shirt do so with pride and play with passion, something that is a little lacking of late. I think Worthy has run his course and should be replaced as he seems to lack options and inventiveness. He has done well for the club but I honestly believe that his negative aspects now outweigh the positives. I would struggle to name an immediate replacement but that is not a basis for leaving things alone. Well if nothing else we can look forward to the scum and maybe we can raise our game for that one.  

I initially thought that this would be another rant at money but what a great and well thought out post, makes a great deal of sense as well. Maybe he was the negative effect that was there with the team as all the time that we were informed that training was fine and there were no behind the scenes rifts the team still did not cut it on the park. I liked the player and wish him all the luck at West Ham as he has got a quality that seems to be lacking in a lot of forwards, maybe he will do it for England one day  

He must go, he is a nice guy but it is now time. We are lacking in everything now and the time has come for the board to do what they should have done some weeks ago.   There is obviously no way that this can change with Worthy as manager as we have been here before.   Come on Delia and co do the right thing before the blame starts to shift above the manager

"I think the lads let their heads drop after the second goal. Up to half-time it was hard work and Luton took full advantage. "The second half we played very well and showed character, but we have to learn to start taking our chances. "We had five or six chances and could have been two up before they scored."   Oh that''s ok then Nigel, there was us all thinking that we were unable to play together for more than 15 minutes and hadn''t yet beaten a team this season that are actaully any good.   Another fine result to chalk up on the mediocre league table with a manager who is adept at taking a team of skilful and gifted players and allowing/making(you can decide) them play like an average sunday league side (no offence sunday players)  Nigel some questions How much longer will we be searching for character?When will we start playing well in the first half?When will we start taking our chances?Why weren''t we 2 up before they scored?Why are you under no pressure when your record so far this season (don''t start me on last season) is abismal?Can I play on Saturday?, I can work hard, play anywhere and don''t really mind losing as I will try hardHe must go now - like him or not this is getting worse. Please allow us to be rescued from this football nightmare   At least we are not binners