All the usual hobby horses

[Beauseant 0]

Like everyone else the sacking of Gunny took me completely by surprise but when we all calm down and think about it, the only real issue is the timing.

Lovely guy that he is, Gunny after the Barnsley win, (which had more to do with Roeder''s departure than his caretakership) oversaw a pretty feeble surrender of our Championship status , punctuated by only a couple of outstanding displays at Brum and Wolves. The capitulation at Charlton and the debacle on Saturday will, I''m afraid, largely define his reign when we look back. My guess is that he was effectively gone after the Colchester game but was kept on while McNally made a few calls to check on the availability/ level of interest of other candidates. Of course, it may also be that  there is new investment which was contingent on a new manager. If so, all should become clear in the next few days.

Unfortunately, though, and in keeping with the way this forum is going, a time when we really need to pull together is being used as an opportunity to settle old scores. It saddens me to see people having a pop at Gunn himself, rather than his record and management,and no doubt Wiz won''t be able to resist a dig at Melissa, if he hasn''t had one already.The Board are inevitably going to be targetted, because most of us want to see Delia replaced, but think about it. Gunn was appointed by a kangaroo board which was barely quorate, and we have now got some new directors of substance. New players (not loans) have been brought in, but we have been humiliated by a team we would have looked down on until the last few years. It would have been very easy for the board to trot out the old cliches about new players needing time to gel and settle but they''ve actually grown a pair and taken decisive action for which they deserve some credit. How would we have felt if Gunny had stayed and we''d reverted to Colchester mode tomorrow and at Brentford? The board may have got it wrong again (only time, and the next appointment will tell) but at least this time they''ll have got it wrong for the right reasons.

[still holding out for new heroes 0]

Nail hit firmly on head...the one other point I''d make is Gunn actually put a decent squad together in the Summer, he never looked like he had the skills to motivate or coach it, get this appointment right and this could be looked back on as a significant turning point.

[Old Shuck 183]

Excellent post, Beauseant.McNally has clearly been given a remit, and told the way it is done, is down to him and him alone. That might not suit some (!) but you do wonder if he only accepted the role if he was given more or less free range, something I doubt Doncaster never had. That includes the management of the football side.I cannot or do not think, for one moment, that the new Manager will be Crook or Butterworth-hiring either of those two, after sacking Gunn, would seem counter productive and a little "same old, same old". Butterworth has coaching experience, but no evidence that he can bring about success as a Manager, ditto Crook.If rumours are true, Bothroyd was a possibility before Gunn, until some of the terms offered tripped that one up. I''d take him now and I hope he has already been approached.

[The Fish Seller 0]

The best comment on the situation by a Country mile and a fabulous quote to end with.[quote user="Beauseant"]

The board may have got it wrong again (only time, and the next appointment will tell) but at least this time they''ll have got it wrong for the right reasons.

[/quote]

[Dion Dublin=Legend 0]

[quote user="Beauseant"]

Like everyone else the sacking of Gunny took me completely by surprise but when we all calm down and think about it, the only real issue is the timing.

Lovely guy that he is, Gunny after the Barnsley win, (which had more to do with Roeder''s departure than his caretakership) oversaw a pretty feeble surrender of our Championship status , punctuated by only a couple of outstanding displays at Brum and Wolves. The capitulation at Charlton and the debacle on Saturday will, I''m afraid, largely define his reign when we look back. My guess is that he was effectively gone after the Colchester game but was kept on while McNally made a few calls to check on the availability/ level of interest of other candidates. Of course, it may also be that  there is new investment which was contingent on a new manager. If so, all should become clear in the next few days.

Unfortunately, though, and in keeping with the way this forum is going, a time when we really need to pull together is being used as an opportunity to settle old scores. It saddens me to see people having a pop at Gunn himself, rather than his record and management,and no doubt Wiz won''t be able to resist a dig at Melissa, if he hasn''t had one already.The Board are inevitably going to be targetted, because most of us want to see Delia replaced, but think about it. Gunn was appointed by a kangaroo board which was barely quorate, and we have now got some new directors of substance. New players (not loans) have been brought in, but we have been humiliated by a team we would have looked down on until the last few years. It would have been very easy for the board to trot out the old cliches about new players needing time to gel and settle but they''ve actually grown a pair and taken decisive action for which they deserve some credit. How would we have felt if Gunny had stayed and we''d reverted to Colchester mode tomorrow and at Brentford? The board may have got it wrong again (only time, and the next appointment will tell) but at least this time they''ll have got it wrong for the right reasons.

[/quote]

I''m sorry Beau, but I can''t give the board any credit.

You''re right that this mess was actually created when Gunn was officially appointed by Delia, MWJ, and Foulger before new appointments had been made at boardroom level. Arguably the most important decision any board of directors at a football club makes was settled without input from the new appointees, and from the start Gunn wasn''t guaranteed the full support of the board as most new managers would expect. This was absolute incompetence and it falls squarely and solely at the door of DS, MWJ and MF.

I''m no Gunn supporter as a manager: he just wasn''t up to it, although unlike some I still have great respect for him as a person and what he achieved at the club as a player. However, despite my reservations the facts right now are that the club gave him finances to sign 12 players, and a full pre-season to coach them. A new manager will obviously want to make changes, so this time (crucial in any season) now counts for nothing. The board should have waited at least another month (or one more unacceptable result) to see how things develop.

Ultimately this comes back to the fact that Delia, Michael Wynn Jones and Michael Foulger are not competent to run this football club, and if I take one consolation from this sorry state of affairs it''s that Gunn''s sacking has McNally''s fingerprints all over it (there''s no way this was a unanimous decision as has been stated - Delia''s response was to ''give Bryan a hug''). Hopefully we now have someone on the board who knows what needs to be done and isn''t afraid to stand his ground until he gets his way.

[Beauseant 0]

Dion, I don''t think we''re far apart on this. My "credit" is aimed at McNally and the new board members, as I agree that Delia left to her own devices would have reverted to the Mother Hen act that saw us saddled with Roeder for far too long.

[yellow hammer 0]

Gunn cared deeply and passionately for the club and stepped up to the plate in a time of crisis; and we should remember him for that. Unfortunately, despite all of his passion, results show he wasn''t up to the standard required for us to be a successful football team, and there was no choice but for him to go.

The same sentiments can be applied to a couple of the Directors.

[ncfcstar 292]

Absolutely brilliantly put mate, I was thinking about posting my own thoughts but I couldn''t have done any better than this. I agree wholeheartedly, and I think we both had reservations over Gunn''s ability as an actual manager.

The next man we bring in will define our future as a club, an ambitious appointment and we can look to the future with hope, anything else and I worry.

[Mello Yello 2,293]

[quote user="yellow hammer"]Gunn cared deeply and passionately for the club and stepped up to the plate in a time of crisis; and we should remember him for that. Unfortunately, despite all of his passion, results show he wasn''t up to the standard required for us to be a successful football team, and there was no choice but for him to go. The same sentiments can be applied to a couple of the Directors.[/quote]

A lovely bloke he is.....a football tactician and manager, he is not....

Until the Stowmarket Two say ''Ta Ta''......Things are still going to be a bit strained....

[Beauseant 0]

[quote user="ncfcstar"]Absolutely brilliantly put mate, I was thinking about posting my own thoughts but I couldn''t have done any better than this. I agree wholeheartedly, and I think we both had reservations over Gunn''s ability as an actual manager. The next man we bring in will define our future as a club, an ambitious appointment and we can look to the future with hope, anything else and I worry.[/quote]

 

Totally agree with that mate. If we end up with a cheap option then I think that its next stop administration, but I suspect that there''s already someone lined up. From what I understand the "dream team" has been unravelling for a while, with Butterworth taking training sessions and Chippy effectively managing the reserves. The stories of a dressing room bust up between the two at half time last week suggest that the undercurrent has now risen to the surface.

[Dion Dublin=Legend 0]

[quote user="Beauseant"]Dion, I don''t think we''re far apart on this. My "credit" is aimed at McNally and the new board members, as I agree that Delia left to her own devices would have reverted to the Mother Hen act that saw us saddled with Roeder for far too long.[/quote]

Fair point Beau, I agree we''re pretty much singing off the same hymn sheet. Who would you like to see here next? Coppell would be the dream appointment, but I have a canny feeling Robins could prove an astute move as well.

[Beauseant 0]

[quote user="Dion DublinLegend"]

[quote user="Beauseant"]Dion, I don''t think we''re far apart on this. My "credit" is aimed at McNally and the new board members, as I agree that Delia left to her own devices would have reverted to the Mother Hen act that saw us saddled with Roeder for far too long.[/quote]

Fair point Beau, I agree we''re pretty much singing off the same hymn sheet. Who would you like to see here next? Coppell would be the dream appointment, but I have a canny feeling Robins could prove an astute move as well.

[/quote]

 

 I don''t think Coppell would come, but if I''m honest, I''m not sure that he''s the right appointment anyway. I like the idea of Robins, given his time here and ability to work to a limited budget. The key thing is that whoever gets the job MUST have decent experience in the lower levels.

[peartreeproductions 0]

All well put, I have just posted something similar.  Today''s events are hardly surprising but by appointing Gunn before the board setting out a destiny of failure unless they brought in weak willed board members.

Timing though is less than ideal but may well turn out to be decisive moving forward.

As others have mentioned, I feel sorry for Gunny as I dont think he has been treated fairly in all of this in relation to the timing of his appointment and sacking.