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K Lo

Why do we so often lose to *** teams ??

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How does he not influence things once the game starts? He''s four yards away! That''s the problem, he''s not got the stature or the nouse to make that change from the sideline!

I''m a tad lost to what you''re debating Morty, the players and their standard are very good, their application and approach is appalling, I''m pretty sure you put this lot under better manager we would see an improvement.

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Problem is, whether we like it or not the modern footballers mentality is heavily influenced by the manager. Of course players have a responsibility but the modern game dictates that the manager has to get them up for the so called lesser games. He has been unable to do that for 18 months.

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Morty you''ve only posted about the players on this thread, saying their not tough enough for this league, as I said not good enough for the premiership so are they that bad?

You''ve not really said much else but been pi55y about me blaming the manager!

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[quote user="Indy"]How does he not influence things once the game starts? He''s four yards away! That''s the problem, he''s not got the stature or the nouse to make that change from the sideline!

I''m a tad lost to what you''re debating Morty, the players and their standard are very good, their application and approach is appalling, I''m pretty sure you put this lot under better manager we would see an improvement.[/quote]Frankly Indy, theres no point in debating this with you if the answer to everything is "Boooo Alex Neil is rubbish, sack him".

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[quote user="Indy"]Morty you''ve only posted about the players on this thread, saying their not tough enough for this league, as I said not good enough for the premiership so are they that bad?

You''ve not really said much else but been pi55y about me blaming the manager![/quote]Do you think our 2 centre backs, and central midfielders were good enough yesterday?

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[quote user="hogesar"]Problem is, whether we like it or not the modern footballers mentality is heavily influenced by the manager. Of course players have a responsibility but the modern game dictates that the manager has to get them up for the so called lesser games. He has been unable to do that for 18 months.[/quote]So how do you explain the decent run we put together recently?Are we back to the thing when Hughton was here where when we played well it was in spite of the manager?

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Nope Morty, I don''t think our entire squad has been good enough, what ever 11 starts, there''s a lack of leadership and heart, even with the recent run of good results, we still looked like a team of 11 players not a team, the Forrest game was for me a turning point, the one which I saw Howson and team take heart into that game.

Why we lose this one can only speculate, but the players haven''t performed as they should, the team look lacking in passion, fitness and understanding, the manager is clueless to changing it from the sideline and our board have had a number of high profile changes in the past 18 months.

Our club is vulnerable at this time as we can''t afford the big money player, we''ve spent our money and without promotion we will no doubt have to make massive rebuilding of this team in the summer. Would you like that under AN?

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[quote user="Indy"]Nope Morty, I don''t think our entire squad has been good enough, what ever 11 starts, there''s a lack of leadership and heart, even with the recent run of good results, we still looked like a team of 11 players not a team, the Forrest game was for me a turning point, the one which I saw Howson and team take heart into that game.

Why we lose this one can only speculate, but the players haven''t performed as they should, the team look lacking in passion, fitness and understanding, the manager is clueless to changing it from the sideline and our board have had a number of high profile changes in the past 18 months.

Our club is vulnerable at this time as we can''t afford the big money player, we''ve spent our money and without promotion we will no doubt have to make massive rebuilding of this team in the summer. Would you like that under AN?[/quote]See, once you think it through, there are several factors at play, not just the manager.I get what the board are trying to do, and they received praise from a lot of people for sticking by Alex Neil during the rough patch, obviously the board are looking at the bigger picture too.Whether Alex Neil is here in the summer, or not, is down to one thing, the bare minimum is getting into the play offs, anything less than that, and the board have a decision to make.

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Of course you''re right, it''s not just one thing but as manager, it''s his team his players and his job at the end of the day, I''m pretty sure if I''d performed offshore in my manager role like he has and said well they all have the qualifications to do the job it''s not my fault they can''t do their job I''d have been sacked!

I don''t think he will be sacked I believe this is just like the Worthy days, he''ll be given next season regardless of playoffs.

Why do you think our players don''t have the backbone to win these games on the road?

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[quote user="Indy"]Of course you''re right, it''s not just one thing but as manager, it''s his team his players and his job at the end of the day, I''m pretty sure if I''d performed offshore in my manager role like he has and said well they all have the qualifications to do the job it''s not my fault they can''t do their job I''d have been sacked!

I don''t think he will be sacked I believe this is just like the Worthy days, he''ll be given next season regardless of playoffs.

Why do you think our players don''t have the backbone to win these games on the road?[/quote]See you have strayed back to the "Its all the manager''s fault" thing again, haven''t you?I think a lot of the players we have fall into a very one dimensional bracket, and can only play one way, and we are sorely missing a few piano moving grafters.An example would be the Murphys, and this is no criticism of them, I could have chosen quite a few players, they are great at what they do, but will they buckle down and grind out a real gritty result, no, because they aren''t hose kind of players.And when you look at the performance yesterday, you realise that virtually none of our players are that type either. They may have the quality, but they don''t have the physical fight.

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Yes I am Morty, so if you see the issue why hasn''t this been addressed by AN? He''s had 4 transfer windows to make sure the likes of Johnson who he allowed to go were replaced?

If like you say he''s got too many weak spines players who are one dimensional, who''s to blame?

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[quote user="Indy"]Yes I am Morty, so if you see the issue why hasn''t this been addressed by AN? He''s had 4 transfer windows to make sure the likes of Johnson who he allowed to go were replaced?

If like you say he''s got too many weak spines players who are one dimensional, who''s to blame?[/quote]The crux of the issue is the point I made earlier Indy, we rarely know what division we are going to be in from one season to the next.I assume you recognise that some players are suited to either the Championship, some are more suited to the Premiership, and some can adapt to both.Should we have bought Championship players last January, preparing for relegation? Should we have not sold Bradley, for the same reason? He would have had limited game time in the Premiership, and would have just taken up a space in the 25 man squad.We were not able to shift a lot of players, post relegation, mainly due to contracts and wages, so they went with the plan of trying to retain our quality players and hope it worked out. Which really was the only plan available.And the issues of physicality have been partly addressed in the last window.

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To be fair again, with a little more foresight Bradders would have played quite a bit that prem season when you consider the amount we ended up seeing Gary O''Neil.

Look, it''s hardly all ANs fault but enough of it is and this championship suited players card is a bit weak.

If that were the case then why spend 8 million on Pritchard in the summer?? Why not get a couple of ''grafters'' as it''s been said.

I think if you get this squad psychologically up and ready for every game they will win 8-9/10.

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[quote user="hogesar"]To be fair again, with a little more foresight Bradders would have played quite a bit that prem season when you consider the amount we ended up seeing Gary O''Neil.

Look, it''s hardly all ANs fault but enough of it is and this championship suited players card is a bit weak.

If that were the case then why spend 8 million on Pritchard in the summer?? Why not get a couple of ''grafters'' as it''s been said.

I think if you get this squad psychologically up and ready for every game they will win 8-9/10.[/quote]Every single person was happy with the money we got for Bradley, and as much as we all loved him, I''m pretty sure most saw the sense in it.We spent the money on Pritchard with one eye on getting promoted, are you saying we should have bought players with one eye on not getting promoted? See the dilemma?We actually do have players that could have made the difference yesterday in Dorrans and Naismith, if both had been fit and firing on all cylinders all season, they could have given us a different dimension, and a different option for games such as yesterday.Psychologically the players know their own limitations and skillsets, you can tell a Murphy (and this is no sleight on either) "Go and get stuck in lad, show me your war face" and it just won''t happen, neither are that type of player. When the balance of the squad was talked about earlier in the season I don''t think it was just about numbers of players in certain positions, it was about the qualities those players hold.A joey Barton would have been handy yesterday.

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We spent 80% of our summer budget fingers crossing wed get promoted? Despite what some on here think we ain''t quite that naive.

The reality is the management and coaches clearly didn''t think we needed reinforced physical grafters to get up this season. They made that decision and it appears to have been the wrong one.

We decided to buy Pritchard. He''s a good player. But if the squad was truly as unbalanced and unprepared for the battle of the championship then the guys that watch them train and interact on a daily basis had to spot this before the window. There''s no point AN bringing it up now.

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[quote user="hogesar"]We spent 80% of our summer budget fingers crossing wed get promoted? Despite what some on here think we ain''t quite that naive.

The reality is the management and coaches clearly didn''t think we needed reinforced physical grafters to get up this season.
They made that decision and it appears to have been the wrong one.

We decided to buy Pritchard. He''s a good player. But if the squad was truly as unbalanced and unprepared for the battle of the championship then the guys that watch them train and interact on a daily basis had to spot this before the window. There''s no point AN bringing it up now.[/quote]Whilst I think you''re probably right, it was made based on the fact we actually have a lot of players that are used to this division, so it wasn''t that off the wall.But it still goes back to the points I have already raised. Okay, instead of Pritchard we buy a couple of Championship cloggers, what do we do with them once we''re promoted? We basically end up in the same position we find ourselves in now where we have squad members on high wages that aren''t suited for where we are at any given time, and all because we are currently yoyoing between divisions.Its easy if you have the money, and it will be interesting to see what happens when Newcastle are promoted, and how many of their current squad will still be there in the Premiership.I''m not saying mistakes haven''t been made, but they certainly haven''t all been made by the manager.

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The reasons are many fold.Basically we''re not good enough, nor consistent enough.An ageing squad, resulting in poorer fitness than some other teams.I believe there are some big egos as well.There seems to be a lack of togetherness amongst the players and an inept manger doesn''t help.

I was at the game yesterday, thanks to some corporate hospitality from Burtons sponsors, Pirelli tyres.After the game myself and work colleague stood by the team bus as the players wandered out, looking very glum and sheepish.We were surprised that about 50% of the players collected there bags etc from the bus and wandered off to the carpark andappeared to head off to the four corners of the country, no sticking together on the bus for the journey home etc.All came across as rather strange, no real team spirit as I''ve seen in the past.I gave up waiting for the manager to appear, I wanted to ask some questions about where do we go from here?Was also noticeable that a suitcase with the words ''Neil'' stamped on it, was also left on the pathway, presumably awaiting collection.If anybody from Burton FC is reading this, can I say well done, great club, fans and facilities, apart from the result we had a very good day out, thank you. Hope you stay up this season.

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Just listen to the comments the manager comes out with before games like yesterday and look at his selections and is it any wonder the team think they can coast after a couple of decent results and have turned the corner. Fact is that as soon as we let our standards slip this season we get caught out but instead of sending them out there pumped up he talked about how knackered they were, how we need to get this one out the way do they can have 7 days rest and then rested our best player. He may come out with hollow words about not taking teams lightly but it''s clear to me that he and the players do and it tends to bite us on the backside.

Our recent reversion to hoofball also means we are not exerting any degree of control over games, even against poor sides and are thus always liable to ship a goal given our incompetent centre backs who get split open by one long ball down the channels.

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Ps ask yourself what are the strengths of this team and what really is our style of play?

We may look down on them but there are teams in this league who win games because they play to their strengths, are either hugely organised or wok their socks off or both. Or perhaps are excellent at set pieces.

We don''t seem to fall into any category other than we have a few individuals who on their day the other teams can''t really cope with and who regularly turn it on at Carrie Road. Other than sending them out and hoping that quality gets us through what is the plan? I don''t think our manager/coaches add anything at all to the equation as opposed to say a Warnock who seems to forge teams that perform well above the sum of their parts.

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Yeaterday we spent quite a bit of the game launching high balls up and over to Jerome, without a great deal of success due to close marking by the Burton defender.Why, after going 2-1 down didn''t we bring Lafferty on so that we had 2 big front men, I''m sure they would have been knock downs for one or other to feed off, but no, we wait until 85th minute before bringing Laffs on.I know fans will say Laffs isn''t the answer, but with 2 up front we could have had a bit more luck and worried there defence a bit more.Simplistic I know, but nothing else was working.

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[quote user="Les"]Yeaterday we spent quite a bit of the game launching high balls up and over to Jerome, without a great deal of success due to close marking by the Burton defender.Why, after going 2-1 down didn''t we bring Lafferty on so that we had 2 big front men, I''m sure they would have been knock downs for one or other to feed off, but no, we wait until 85th minute before bringing Laffs on.I know fans will say Laffs isn''t the answer, but with 2 up front we could have had a bit more luck and worried there defence a bit more.Simplistic I know, but nothing else was working.[/quote]Lafferty is turd.4-4-2 isn''t necessarily more positive than, say, 4-5-1. And the amount of goals we score from midfield kind of bears that out.

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I''m not saying Warnock would be right for us (we should be playing a pass and move type of game) but look at his record last season with Rotherham and this season with Cardiff. Top notch and with nothing like the resources Neil has.

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We didn''t spend the money we got for BJ on Pritchard! Unless of course it had been sitting in the bank for a year? Johnson left last season Pritchard joined this season but hey Morty let''s not let facts get in the way of you having a go at fans with a valid point yet again!

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[quote user="Baldyboy"]We didn''t spend the money we got for BJ on Pritchard! Unless of course it had been sitting in the bank for a year? Johnson left last season Pritchard joined this season but hey Morty let''s not let facts get in the way of you having a go at fans with a valid point yet again![/quote]

Point out where I said we spent the Bradley money on Pritchard?And point out where I am having a go at anyone?Until you popped in, everyone is quite happily debating football points.

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Completely agree with all your points Morty re Lafferty and 4-4-2 but I think the point is we were playing so direct it would have made sense to have another striker up front in that scenario. We basically bypassed the best part of our squad on Saturday...the 3 behind the striker.

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Morty your words were as follows:

hogesar wrote:

To be fair again, with a little more foresight Bradders would have played quite a bit that prem season when you consider the amount we ended up seeing Gary O''Neil. Look, it''s hardly all ANs fault but enough of it is and this championship suited players card is a bit weak. If that were the case then why spend 8 million on Pritchard in the summer?? Why not get a couple of ''grafters'' as it''s been said. I think if you get this squad psychologically up and ready for every game they will win 8-9/10.

Every single person was happy with the money we got for Bradley, and as much as we all loved him, I''m pretty sure most saw the sense in it.

We spent the money on Pritchard with one eye on getting promoted, are you saying we should have bought players with one eye on not getting promoted? See the dilemma?

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[quote user="Baldyboy"]Morty your words were as follows:

hogesar wrote:

To be fair again, with a little more foresight Bradders would have played quite a bit that prem season when you consider the amount we ended up seeing Gary O''Neil. Look, it''s hardly all ANs fault but enough of it is and this championship suited players card is a bit weak. If that were the case then why spend 8 million on Pritchard in the summer?? Why not get a couple of ''grafters'' as it''s been said. I think if you get this squad psychologically up and ready for every game they will win 8-9/10.

Every single person was happy with the money we got for Bradley, and as much as we all loved him, I''m pretty sure most saw the sense in it.

We spent the money on Pritchard with one eye on getting promoted, are you saying we should have bought players with one eye on not getting promoted? See the dilemma?[/quote]Yes they are two totally seperate points. Hence the gap between them.

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