Ernie

Sorry if its been already mentioned, I know hes picked up yet another injury but how long is he likely to be out this time?

[quote user="GJP"][quote user="Ernie"][quote user="GJP"] [quote user="Ernie"]Out of interest I thought I would check out our players heights. Ruddy, Martin, Ayala, Whitbread, Tierney, Ward, Barnet, Bennet, Pilkington, Johnson, Morison, Holt, Wilbraham are all 6 foot plus.  Hoolahan is our shortest player at 5''7, followed by Jackson 5''8, Fox & Crofts 5''9, Surman & Bennett 5''10, Naughton, Vaughan & Dury 5''11 and I''m not sure about Howson. So more often than not we will have 7 or 8 6 footers playing, now I know it probably doesnt compare to say Stoke but I wouldnt say we were a particually short side.[/quote]   Is Tierney really 6 foot or 6 foot plus? Doesn''t look it. Not sure about Johnson either.   Pilks might be around 6 foot but he''s not that tall. Same with R Martin. Infact Grant Holt probably isn''t much more than 6 foot. [/quote] All of those players are quoted at 6ft according to our player profiles. [/quote] So is Korey Smith apparently.   Maybe those measurements are taken with their boots on and the studs add a bit extra. Or maybe they''re just taking a guess. [/quote]He''s quoted at 5''9 I think, maybe its like when I say I''m 6''5 oh no sorry its the other way round!

[quote user="The Pink''un Role Model"][quote user="Ernie"] [quote user="AJ"]As Ginge says, we hold the stat for the most headed goals, and are a major threat from set pieces. Not sure where you got this "myth" from![/quote] Lambert has said on occasion that we are not the biggest of teams. [/quote] That still doesn''t make us Short does it? [/quoteThats true, however as one poster has said we do seem to have signed "bigger" player more recently.  In the premier league its not just about technical ability but players really do have to be athletes as the game is player much faster and to be really effect you need to able to get up down the pitch, unless your a Scholes of course or you can afford to have others doing your running for you.

[quote user="GJP"] [quote user="Ernie"]Out of interest I thought I would check out our players heights. Ruddy, Martin, Ayala, Whitbread, Tierney, Ward, Barnet, Bennet, Pilkington, Johnson, Morison, Holt, Wilbraham are all 6 foot plus.  Hoolahan is our shortest player at 5''7, followed by Jackson 5''8, Fox & Crofts 5''9, Surman & Bennett 5''10, Naughton, Vaughan & Dury 5''11 and I''m not sure about Howson. So more often than not we will have 7 or 8 6 footers playing, now I know it probably doesnt compare to say Stoke but I wouldnt say we were a particually short side.[/quote]   Is Tierney really 6 foot or 6 foot plus? Doesn''t look it. Not sure about Johnson either.   Pilks might be around 6 foot but he''s not that tall. Same with R Martin. Infact Grant Holt probably isn''t much more than 6 foot. [/quote] All of those players are quoted at 6ft according to our player profiles.

[quote user="AJ"]As Ginge says, we hold the stat for the most headed goals, and are a major threat from set pieces. Not sure where you got this "myth" from![/quote] Lambert has said on occasion that we are not the biggest of teams.

Out of interest I thought I would check out our players heights. Ruddy, Martin, Ayala, Whitbread, Tierney, Ward, Barnet, Bennet, Pilkington, Johnson, Morison, Holt, Wilbraham are all 6 foot plus.  Hoolahan is our shortest player at 5''7, followed by Jackson 5''8, Fox & Crofts 5''9, Surman & Bennett 5''10, Naughton, Vaughan & Dury 5''11 and I''m not sure about Howson. So more often than not we will have 7 or 8 6 footers playing, now I know it probably doesnt compare to say Stoke but I wouldnt say we were a particually short side.

[quote user="shefcanary"] [quote user="zak123"]Another thing that Fox does, once he passes the ball, he follows it. In theory it sounds like a bad idea, but if you watch, when he gets the ball back it''s always in a slightly more advanced position. He continues to do this until a good pass is open wide or further up the field for a full attack to start. Given his passing ability, this type of play is very Scholes.[/quote]   Spot on - never tries to do anything OTT immediately.   Gets the ball, plays a quick couple of passes, follows the ball as mentioned earlier in this thread, before trying to spot the killer pass.  Wes does similar but by dribbling with the ball, gets caught more often.  I think Fox is the person we need to build the team around.  He is also a key dead ball player as well - invariably causes mayhem when he takes our corners, before he came on yesterday our corners were p1ss poor.   [/quote] We definately need players like Fox in the side who have an eye for a pass, can put their foot on the ball when needed and link up play from the back to the front.  Without a Fox type player in the side to often we run out of ideas and just lump it forward. Ian Crook was brilliant at it, never the fastest but didnt need to be he could destroy teams with a single killer pass and seemed to have so much time on the ball as did Martin Peters, the sign of a quality player.

[quote user="Robert N. LiM"]Thanks Ernie, your post saved me typing a reply.[/quote] My pleasure

[quote user="shefcanary"][quote user="Ernie"][quote user="shefcanary"] I wouldn''t worry about the fact he was blooded yesterday too much.  He''ll be glad he got 75 minutes against the most physical side in the division .  Given the other thread discussion on here I''ll even risk saying that the main thing Lambert wanted out of yesterday''s game was to get Howson''s head right after such a long time out of football, ready for the final run in.  With more space in future games I can see him having a big influence on things and I''m looking forward to it.  Like others I think he has definitely been bought to replace Hoolahan.  Shame but that''s football - but at least we''ll have too attacking midfield options in future and Wes can still be an impact player from the bench.  [/quote]I could be wrong but didnt he play a holding midfield role or do you think Lambert would rather play him further forward ie: in a Hoolahan role?[/quote] From what I have read about his time at Leeds his best position was attacking midfielder.  Yesterday, he was playing a holding midfield role alongside Johnson.  In future would expect him to either line up alongside Fox in a 4-4-2 or at the tip of a diamond behind the strikers.  But sure Lambert knows betther than me - could even end up as that holding midfielder although that would be a surprise. [/quote]Lets all hope he turns out to be another quality signing by Lambert, personally I havent seen him play yet and he will need serveral games at least to get upto speed but no doubt has been brought for the future.  Although I love Hoolahan as a player he can get caught out in dangerous positions and his decision making re: Bolton can be off which as many suspect is why we have brought Howson, perhaps a younger better variation on playing that role.  That said Hoolahan on his day can of course be unplayable, its that consitency he can lack, which is why of course players that do have it cost the big bucks.

Writing was on the wall

[quote user="shefcanary"] I wouldn''t worry about the fact he was blooded yesterday too much.  He''ll be glad he got 75 minutes against the most physical side in the division .  Given the other thread discussion on here I''ll even risk saying that the main thing Lambert wanted out of yesterday''s game was to get Howson''s head right after such a long time out of football, ready for the final run in.  With more space in future games I can see him having a big influence on things and I''m looking forward to it.  Like others I think he has definitely been bought to replace Hoolahan.  Shame but that''s football - but at least we''ll have too attacking midfield options in future and Wes can still be an impact player from the bench.  [/quote]I could be wrong but didnt he play a holding midfield role or do you think Lambert would rather play him further forward ie: in a Hoolahan role?

[quote user="Smokebomb"][quote user="Ernie"] [quote user="Robert N. LiM"]Really interesting OP - those who are thoughtlessly rejecting RH''s arguments need to reconsider why you spend time on an internet message board. My thoughts: I am still really disappointed that we didn''t pick our strongest team against Leicester. We had a real shot at a Wembley appearance in a season where we are all but safe. Not to go for that was very disappointing. By not picking his strongest team (and you can argue round this any way you want, but he told Holt and Ruddy they didn''t even have to turn up to the ground), Lambert sent a message that he wasn''t really fussed whether we beat Leicester or not. And that ambivalence is always going to transmit to the players The other message it sent was that he felt we were still in a relegation battle. All the positivity of the Swansea win dissipated at a stroke. And for what? Keeping the players fresh for two games that were always going to be very hard to win anyway? I think Lambert made a mistake vs Leicester. For those who need it spelled out, that doesn''t mean I think he''s an idiot, or that he should resign. He''s our best manager of the last 25 years in my opinion. But I think he got it wrong vs Leicester, and the events of the last two weeks have not proved him right, Oh, and the reason we lost at Sunderland after the West Brom win is clearly Lambert''s unresolved Oedipal relationship with Martin O''Neill. We will never beat a MO''N team under Lambert until Lambert stops calling MO''N ''Gaffer''.[/quote] Agreed, in fact the OP beat me to this sort of post.  This is not Lambert bashing he is clearly the best manager we have had for some time but that doesnt mean he doesnt make mistakes.  The logic of resting key players for the Man u game made no sense to me and clearly sent out the wrong message. Against Stoke we should of played to our strenghts rather than just trying to nulify them. We could and should still be in the cup with something to really look forward to but unfortunately we are not.  Hopefully we can turn it around against Wigan who like to play which means we can get back to us playing the Norwich way and no its not a must win game but as the original poster said I do believe we have lost some momentum since the Leicester game. [/quote] It`s very reassuring to know that we have an expert panel at hand to advise Lambert on where he has been going wrong. The we "know it all after the event" posters who clearly know what our best team is and the best formation to beat any given team. These are the same guys that would have jumped on the band wagon after the team selection for say QPR away or WBA away, had we lost of course, been biding your time eh lads, enjoy your moment. [/quote] I think your post is very unfair. Lambert has got far more right than wrong and yes hindsight is a wonderful thing, but you will find that any fan that has played or watched footbal will have an opinion.  I didnt what us to try and play Stoke at there own game, of course I wanted us to win, but playing our way and if we had then lost so be it. As with the Leicester Lambert sent out the completely wrong message by his team selection resting players in my opinion needlessly and again if we sent out our strongest team and really went for it with conviction but still lost then at least than I would have no compliants.  You will notice that I have not moaned about our defeat against Man U, not because it was Man U but we played well, to our strenghts but in the end lost to the better side (taking the yellow and green classes off after we scored they had at least 2/3 clear cut chances).  I stand by all that I have said, no knee jerk reaction as the Leicester game still bugs me. Rant over.

[quote user="Robert N. LiM"]Really interesting OP - those who are thoughtlessly rejecting RH''s arguments need to reconsider why you spend time on an internet message board. My thoughts: I am still really disappointed that we didn''t pick our strongest team against Leicester. We had a real shot at a Wembley appearance in a season where we are all but safe. Not to go for that was very disappointing. By not picking his strongest team (and you can argue round this any way you want, but he told Holt and Ruddy they didn''t even have to turn up to the ground), Lambert sent a message that he wasn''t really fussed whether we beat Leicester or not. And that ambivalence is always going to transmit to the players The other message it sent was that he felt we were still in a relegation battle. All the positivity of the Swansea win dissipated at a stroke. And for what? Keeping the players fresh for two games that were always going to be very hard to win anyway? I think Lambert made a mistake vs Leicester. For those who need it spelled out, that doesn''t mean I think he''s an idiot, or that he should resign. He''s our best manager of the last 25 years in my opinion. But I think he got it wrong vs Leicester, and the events of the last two weeks have not proved him right, Oh, and the reason we lost at Sunderland after the West Brom win is clearly Lambert''s unresolved Oedipal relationship with Martin O''Neill. We will never beat a MO''N team under Lambert until Lambert stops calling MO''N ''Gaffer''.[/quote] Agreed, in fact the OP beat me to this sort of post.  This is not Lambert bashing he is clearly the best manager we have had for some time but that doesnt mean he doesnt make mistakes.  The logic of resting key players for the Man u game made no sense to me and clearly sent out the wrong message. Against Stoke we should of played to our strenghts rather than just trying to nulify them. We could and should still be in the cup with something to really look forward to but unfortunately we are not.  Hopefully we can turn it around against Wigan who like to play which means we can get back to us playing the Norwich way and no its not a must win game but as the original poster said I do believe we have lost some momentum since the Leicester game.

[quote user="AJ"]With how physical the game was at times, I couldn''t help but think it would have been nice to get the ball on the ground and play it through them like we did in the last half hour. Playing Howson today instead of Fox or Hoolahan seemed like a logical decision, but sadly the game didn''t turn out as planned. I agree we need to play Fox, he brings the best out of our squad and playing style the majority of the time.[/quote] Agreed, thats the thing with hind sight, its seems so obvious after the event.  However I still would like us to play our game rather than trying to combat the opposition all the time.  Attack is the greatest form of defence we need to play to our strenghts and let the opposition worry about us more.  Yes we do need to be tactically aware re: Swansea game but we still played the Norwich way, when we just set up to nullify the opposition we tend to lose our way a bit and more offen than not come unstuck.

Cant see what all the fuss is about. I think he calls it as it is. Couldnt agree more about his comments about people harping on about where we have come from. We are where we are on merit and need to move forward as he suggested.

No I dont think so.  Stoke away is always going to be a tough game regardless of the last game or two, Norwich will want to win just the same as every Premier game they go into.  If we were down the bottom struggling for points then maybe, but were not and if anything we might be able to play with a bit more freedom?

Young was unfortunately never closed down and had all the time in the world to cross with Hoolahan letting Giggs past him to score.  Wilbraham was excellent.  Couldnt see the point of taking Jackson off for Wes though, it allowed Man U to push up and we dropped deeper and deeper.  Fantastic goal by Holt shame we couldnt hold on but in saying that they did miss some sitters.

[quote user="Wings of a Sparrow"]Simeon Jackson?[/quote] Sorry Simeon, my bad.

[quote user="GJL Mid-Norfolk Canary"] I think we actually may have had more internationals in our squad the last time we were in the Premiership?? Green,Ward,Gallacher,Helveg,Doherty,Francis,Holt,Safri,Johnson,Mulryne,McVeigh.....have I missed anyone? [/quote] Did Ward, Doherty, Francis and Holt ever get called up?  If so I must be having a senior moment!

[quote user="Mister Chops"][quote user="Ernie"]At present we already have Morrison, Crofts and Martin playing for their countries with players like Ruddy, Pilkington possibly Surman having the potential to step up. Hoolahan should have more caps and with young guns Rudd, Steer and Bennet its looks like Norwich could have the most international players playing for us than ever before in our history.  Good times.[/quote] That''s stretching it a bit, isn''t it?  A couple of welshmen - I could play for Wales - an honourary Scotsman, a one footed Irishman who''s been consistently overlooked by Trappatoni, and then some "possible" ones for the future including Ruddy, Rudd and Steer who all play in the same position... I''m all for the glass half full approach to life, but this is something else. [/quote] Yeah but did you notice I didnt throw Johnson or Whitbread into the mix!

Actually the best player I''ve ever seen play for Norwich who didnt ever get a call up was of course the Cat, Keelan, man he was goooood.

[quote user="Mister Chops"][quote user="Ernie"]At present we already have Morrison, Crofts and Martin playing for their countries with players like Ruddy, Pilkington possibly Surman having the potential to step up. Hoolahan should have more caps and with young guns Rudd, Steer and Bennet its looks like Norwich could have the most international players playing for us than ever before in our history.  Good times.[/quote] That''s stretching it a bit, isn''t it?  A couple of welshmen - I could play for Wales - an honourary Scotsman, a one footed Irishman who''s been consistently overlooked by Trappatoni, and then some "possible" ones for the future including Ruddy, Rudd and Steer who all play in the same position... I''m all for the glass half full approach to life, but this is something else. [/quote] Yeah I know, still what the hell.  Holt for England, now that would be something to get excited about!

At present we already have Morrison, Crofts and Martin playing for their countries with players like Ruddy, Pilkington possibly Surman having the potential to step up. Hoolahan should have more caps and with young guns Rudd, Steer and Bennet its looks like Norwich could have the most international players playing for us than ever before in our history.  Good times.

I think Lambert will start with Ward and Whitbread with Bennet on the bench, however if he gets the nod over Ward without having given him a fair crack of the whip after coming back from injury (regardless of the fee we paid for him) would seem a little harsh. Having said that its very positive for Lambert to have those kind of selection problems, long gone are the days where we would struggle for a decent 11, let alone who''d we put on the bench!

[quote user="Alan BowCLUCK"]Errr.... how about he''s not good enough? [/quote] I think thats a bit harsh considering who''s in front of him.  Hart is clearly no 1, but Green, Carson, Robinson as a number 2 I''m not totally convinced.  I think he needs to be given a chance as all the others have. Maybe if he played for a more fancied club he would be.