Russell Martin - Rubbish!

[Ray 111]

Judge,

You called for the defensive stats, and I quote, "You can prove a lot of things with stats if you find the right ones. Are there any about defensive tackles made, number of crosses stopped or intercepted, number of defensive headers won ??? Wonder how he does on these ?"

Your last question, "Wonder how he does on these?" was answered, however it appears you didn''t like the answer, well why would you, as your opinion (which proves you right, well to you anyway) is that RM is not a good defender.

IMO the stats show he is probably one of our best defenders and my opinion, of course, proves me right to me. I think he is, Adams thinks he is, Hughton thought he was, Lambert thought he was and Strachan thinks he is and we all regularly see/saw him in action.

Re the stats and their validity, the come from a very respected site, I cannot recall whether MT won any headers, I do recall JH winning a few, also the fact that RM made 0 tackles doesn''t surpirse me when I take into account the 4 interceptions, a stat that I believe shows his positioning allows him to intercept rather than commit himself to a tackle, the the last ditch tackle you mentioned was probably recorded as an interception. IMO tackling is a last resort, if you commit to a tackle and lose it then you leave the rest of the defence wide open.

I too prefer to watch the game live and see the impact the players have, and being 4th top scorer and 2nd in assists tell me he has quite an impact.

I guess we need to agree to disagree.

[hogesar 9,674]

It''s a weird time to be pinning performance related comments at Martin.

Many players have underperformed including Whittaker - to a standard lower than RM.

If it were a pure thread about his captaincy - then there''s more room for debate as he''s been the leader of an underperforming team. But his own performances have neither been spectacular or particularly bad.

[Rich T The Biscuit 562]

I''ll openly admit to not being a fan, I think he''s at best a good defender but that''s where it ends for me. The problem that we have and that he has is that football develops each season and team structure, playing styles and performances changes season after season and therefore the players that maybe looked good previously don''t look as good now if the style of play differs. I''d put Martin in this category.

There is no doubting that the has had some good games for us and the goal he scored at the weekend was a cracker, one in a million and the next time he tries it will end up in the top tier, as it would any other player so that''s not a dig at him.

He''s more solid than quality, he was caught out on Saturday with at least 1 if not 2 of the goals and it''s this side of his game that has suffered, is this down to confidence, different style or getting older who knows, but for me right back is an area we need to improve.

This might sound weird but when I take my seat week in week out I have started to watch the style that other teams play, mainly because watching us has been largely frustrating...but if was fascinated by watching the Brighton right back play, Bruno Salter, absolute quality and I thought was probably their best player. When they had the ball he was on the touchline and further forward than the winger, which was clear for his goal, when they didn''t have the ball he was a right back, that''s the kind of full backs we need.

Thanks for your commitment and passion for 200 games but the team needs refreshing and he''s not the only one that needs replacing.

[The Judge 0]

Ray,

You are a scholar and a gentleman ! As you say we will agree to disagree. It nice to be able to have a difference of opinion without resulting to unnecessary insults as is the default with a number of others on here......

[Ray 111]

Thank you Judge, I appreciate your comments and right back at you.

Cheers

Ray