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ViewfromtheJarrold

Russell Martin - Rubbish!

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Can somebody please tell me how RM was voted Man of The Match yesterday - The guy is playing shockingly at the moment.

YES - He did score a wonder goal yesterday and for that I am grateful but his defending all season has been shocking!

The guy never gets his knees dirty.......He stands off and never makes an challenge until it is either too late and a cross/shot has been got off or he is forced to make a last ditch block when one was never needed.

He is not good enough to play in our team let alone captain our team.

He doesn''t lead on the pitch and seems to think that the occasional arm waving and chatting with the ref after he has given a decision shows his captaincy.

He is a liability and we will not get promoted with him in our team!!!

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Agreed - well done to him for his 200 appearances and his wonder goal yesterday but I can''t understand how he gets in the side let alone as captain.

Despite Whittaker''s limitations, I would always select him ahead of Martin at right back.

I thing if Russell has a place in the team then it should be at centre back.

Having said that, we have more than enough of those to not need to select him there either.

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he has had better and worse games than that for us;

the key point is the fact he is captain yet the back four look leaderless and appear to have no understanding about what each other do. We need a big character to pull it all together

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Played very well offensively yesterday, linked up really well with Redmond unlike Whittaker (however hard he tries) and scored a wonder goal. However I couldn''t get to the match yesterday so gave my ticket to a mate so had to watch it on a stream, therefore didn''t see his defensive positioning off camera.

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The fact of the matter is for the first goal yesterday he stood off his man and let him have an easy cross into the box. For the second he was one of a couple of players who let the man stand in the box unchallenged for a couple of seconds before inviting to shoot and score in bottom corner.

AND its not just this week its every week.

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not really defending martin here as his defensive play wasnt great, but it was turner that allowed the cross for the first (but agree it was slack defending) and while martin did start the ball watching for the second he moved to cover the overlap once howson went on ball watch - and was the one beaten for the shot.

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[quote user="A Load of Squit"][quote user="DDD In The Fine City"]He got voted man of the match by a bunch of overpaid vankers that were there on a jolly from Travis Perkins, the prat that picked him is my boss who is a plastic Liverpool fan that goes about every other season. Funny how they happily pay £3000+ for a day at the football to take a few customers yet won''t give us more than £10 a head for a staff Xmas party, if ever you want building materials use jewsons[/quote]

Sacked in the morning, you''re getting sacked in the morning!

[/quote]

I do hope so

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He''s not rubbish but he''s not good enough to be undroppable - which he clearly is.

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I''ve never rated Martin since he became captain. He was nowhere near good enough for us in the Premier League last season, always playing at CB when he''s clearly a FB.I was totally bemused when Adams made him captain, he''s not a leader at all, never communicates with the midfield from what I see. Howson or Ruddy would have been better choice.When we went 2-1 up yesterday, he was more interested in celebrating his goal than telling the team to settle down and get the job done. Also a little off of the point, but I reckon we need Ryan Bennett and Turner back as a CB pairing, they looked promising at the start of the season.

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And how he got the MOTM award was beyond me, he played a shocker. If I had to give it to anyone yesterday, I would have had to say Jerome, he looks like the only player giving 100%, constantly being a handful and getting under the skin of the opposition''s defenders.

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Living in Brighton, everyone seems to be Russ''s best mate…. He is a great orator and comes across well, but I just feel that he is a shocking defender. Backs off (Drury did this well - Martin doesnt) and in my view hides, putting pressure on the centre halves and midfielders. Sorry Russ, would like to like you as a player, but in my view you are our weak link.

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I''m really not a Russell Martin fan (I think a good 30% of my posts are criticising him and his performances) but I thought he played well yesterday. He was one of few players who showed any drive in the team and tried to wake up a very flat team performance with driving runs forward. He linked up well with Redmond and put decent crosses in the box that could have resulted in goals on another day.The goals conceded for me came down to poor goalkeeping for the first two, Ruddy with confidence and on form wouldn''t have let either of those rather average efforts in, and poor defending from Hooiveld who in fairness probably just isn''t match fit. Always interesting the way people view games differently I suppose.

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Holtcantshoot makes the point that we all see the game differently and I agree that is true. Having said that, I can''t for the life of me see how the first Brighton goal can be pinned on Ruddy. He''s not enjoying his best spell of form at present but don''t add to his woes unfairly.

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Whoscored.com match stats from yesterdays game as follows;

RM = 40 passes, 82.5% accuracy, both figs higher than any other defender.

RM = Key passes 1, equal to MO and better than the CB''s.

RM = Crosses 3 at 66.67% success rate, MO 7 at 14.29% success rate, CB''s zero.

RM = Long Ball 8 at 62.5% accuracy, MT 4 at 50% accuracy, JH 16 at 37.5% accuracy, MO 5 at 0.00% accuracy

Some season stats;

RM = Goals 2, equal 4th top scorer, assists 3 equal 2nd

Lambert selected him, Hughton selected him, Adams selects him, Strachan selects him.

He''ll do for me.

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He''s not rubbish, he''s on okay player at this level who occasionally has an outstanding game......just like every other member of our squad though unfortunately

Hopefully Vadis and Hooper turn out to be great this year because none of the other players who have played most of this season appear any better than mediocre Championship most of the time. How we survived so long in the Prem with this team is a mystery to me, for all his failings Hughton''s turgid approach is starting to make sense now.

We''ve wasted so much money since we got promoted.

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[quote user="Dicky"]Living in Brighton, everyone seems to be Russ''s best mate…. He is a great orator and comes across well, but I just feel that he is a shocking defender. Backs off (Drury did this well - Martin doesnt) and in my view hides, putting pressure on the centre halves and midfielders. Sorry Russ, would like to like you as a player, but in my view you are our weak link. [/quote]

I don''t know if he is a shocking defender but the Drury thing is a good point. Drury was very hard to beat and Martin isn''t so much. Wingers often go past him with ease and crosses get into the box quite easily too. It was a problem in the Prem and it''s a problem in the Champs. Martin was very good in this league under Lambert but then, as we all know, Lambert excelled at getting the best out of the players we had.

 

Unfortunately we haven''t got a defender who is really setting a high standard.

 

People put a lot of blame on Whittaker recently and before him Bassong yet they''re not in the team now and we''re still very ropey.

 

What''s a worry at the moment is that Turner is starting to look a bit dodgy and there have been times this season when he has looked like the only one who can defend. Without him on his game it''s going to be a struggle but then it shouldn''t always be on him to drag the defence through a game.

 

 

 

 

 

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Hi Bristolcanary,

Thanks, BTW, is that the ''Royal We''?

Funny isn''t it how those ''silly managers'' know nothing yet earn fortunes, yet all those who know better have to work for a living?

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[quote user="Ray"]Hi Bristolcanary,

Thanks, BTW, is that the ''Royal We''?

Funny isn''t it how those ''silly managers'' know nothing yet earn fortunes, yet all those who know better have to work for a living?[/quote]

Doesn''t mean that they are always right though. Sometimes an "outsider" can see the wood from the trees. As I say, him being a Brighton boy and knowing lots of people who know him I would love to rate him. Unfortunately I just don''t and I think he is the root of a lot of our defensive issues.

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Thing is with Russell Martin for me is that going forwards he is actually pretty decent. Infact it is his desire to get forward so much that causes a lot of our defensive problems. Redmond helped him out of a hole on numerous occasions on Saturday. I think People get carried away with his swashbuckling forward runs and in my view tend to ignore the defensive frailties because of thisI believe. He also comes across in the press well and is certainly quite articulate and he knows this and uses it to his advantage with a large segment of the supporters. It is certainly the reason he was given the captaincy because it certainly wasn''t for footballing or leadership on the pitch reasons!

You can prove a lot of things with stats if you find the right ones. Are there any about defensive tackles made, number of crosses stopped or intercepted, number of defensive headers won ??? Wonder how he does on these ? These are the ones in my view are more relevant to defenders. Passes made is so easy to misinterpret..if you actually watch the game and Martin specifically most of his passes are about 10 yards either sideways, backwards, or to some one under pressure.

In my view a very poor at doing the things we need our defenders to be doing at the moment - defend better.

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Defensive stats for Brighton game as requested;

Tackles = RM = 0, JH = 0, MT = 3, MO =2,

Interceptions = RM =4, JH = 5, MT = 3, MO = 1.

Blocked Shots = RM = 1, MT = 1, JH = 0, MO = 0.

Aerials Won = RM = 1, JH = 2, MO = 1, MT = 0,

Crosses stopped, no stats but I guess it''s difficult to count the number of times you actually stop a winger doing something by positioning, so he has to pass backwards, or similar.

So adding together the stats we have, the total ''stops'' are as follows; RM = 6, JH = 7, MT = 7, MO = 3.

Re the passing of RM, the fact that the ball is more often given to him for distrbution by definition means he is more likely to make more passes sideward or short, Taking the total passes by each defender (RM = 40, JH = 31, MO = 24, MT = 22) and then applying the total accurate long balls and crosses as a percentage, it can be calculated that 17.5% of RM''s passes are successful forward and/or attacking passes, MT = 9.1%, JH = 19.36%, MO = 4.17%.

So based on the above,

1) RM is given the ball more frequently than the other defenders, probably because amongst them he is considered the one most likely to be successful, the accuracy stats back this up

2) He performs his defencive duties as well if not better than the other defenders,

On top of that he is equal 4th top goal scorer and equal 2nd in assists, so perhaps a damn good job he does make forward runs and a point of interest, Redmond only made one more successful cross than RM and he had 9 attempts, RM had 3.

As I said previously, he''ll do for me.

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MT aerials won = 0 ???? What sort of stats are those ? Do you really believe Micheal Turner won no headers in the whole match against Brighton ?

If you want to rely on stats fine but as said previously you can position stats to support your argument either way i.e Russell Martin tackles made = 0. Pretty poor for a defender in my view (irrespective of the others ) Probably because he is nowhere near where he needs to be or because he is backing off so can''t make the tackle. I actually remember one last ditch tackle RM made in the first half where he got injured so again I wouldn''t rely on stats if I were you.

I prefer to watch the match and see the impact players have on the actual outcome of the result.

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Stats can be misleading and open to interpretation.   The stat I would like to see that would help is one they use in tennis -  "unforced errors". This alone would highlight errors better than perecntages.   An unforced error is one where the player has time to head, pass or control a ball without being immediately challenged.  Does this stat , a simple number, exist at football matches, because to my mind it would highlight misplaced passes and sloppy play better than myriads of percentages? 

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"Unforced errors" What on earth is the point of that?

If you are going to use stats to analyse a game you need to know which particular things you were weak and good at. "Unforced errors" means nothing.

You don''t need stats to analyse our feeble defence performance and poor corner kicks, back to basics is what we need. Let''s hope Phelan has the authority to shake it up.

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Our defence is poor and needs a back to basics approach particularly on the turnover. The set plays at corners are not being adhered to. This needs addressing throughout the team , in particular in the defensive midfield and tracking back to defend the counter. None of this falls at the feet of one individual. Imo Martin is an asset not a scapegoat.

Good luck Phelan!

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I cant say I think any of our players are rubbish;   some are better than others but to a man all are currently underperforming and making basic mistakes game in game out,  from keeper to striker.

 

 

This especially applies to the back 4 where all are making poor decisions,  getting out of position,  lacking committment and in dire need of organisation and leadership.   There isnt one of our defenders who are not capable of performing well at this level,  but they are not.

 

At right back martin is performing better than Whittaker,  but still making too many mistakes,  Turner has been a rock but his standards are falling to the lowest current quality over the last 3-5 games,  whether cuellar, hooiveld, bennett or iggy provide a better pair or are Turners best partner  is impossible to know as they havent made 10 appearances between them and Olsson is so out of form Garrido does deserve a start.

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