Grant's Wrong

[Cantiaci Canary 558]

“If he doesn''t do that ... [stick to his work plan]... he won''t be going ... [to the Welsh squad]. I don''t care what anybody says, he will not be going" Peter Grant

This is ridiculous - and my complaint is targeted at Newcastle United also. Clubs may well pay their players a lot of money and then rightly feel frustrated if their player then gets injuried on international duty or doesn''t come back in the same condition that they left but when the country calls no club team should have the powers or the arrogance to take this attitude.

By all means have Earny''s best interests at heart but don''t threaten withdrawal.

If you don''t like losing players to international duty Mr Grant then it''s simple. Don''t sign any more international players and sell all the ones you have - or shut it.

 

[FilletTheFishWife . 0]

disagree. who pays the players wages. Who is most affected when a player gets injured on international duty? And lets face it who really cares more about international football than club football? I certainly don''t.

[Carlos Valderrama 0]

[quote user="Konstantin Pobedonostsev"]

“If he doesn''t do that ... [stick to his work plan]... he won''t be going ... [to the Welsh squad]. I don''t care what anybody says, he will not be going" Peter Grant

This is ridiculous - and my complaint is targeted at Newcastle United also. Clubs may well pay their players a lot of money and then rightly feel frustrated if their player then gets injuried on international duty or doesn''t come back in the same condition that they left but when the country calls no club team should have the powers or the arrogance to take this attitude.

By all means have Earny''s best interests at heart but don''t threaten withdrawal.

If you don''t like losing players to international duty Mr Grant then it''s simple. Don''t sign any more international players and sell all the ones you have - or shut it.

 

[/quote]

Utter rubbish. Most ridiculous post I haver read on this site, and that is saying something with the smudgers and clucks of this world about.

[Cantiaci Canary 558]

[quote user="FilletTheFishWife ."]disagree. who pays the players wages. Who is most affected when a player gets injured on international duty? And lets face it who really cares more about international football than club football? I certainly don''t.[/quote]

No I''m sorry but this is just not fair. This has been the way of things since the birth of football as a competitive sport. Football clubs cannot suddenly put pressure on international managers because there is more money around ... the goal-posts haven''t changed.

It doesn''t matter if clubs pay the wages, suffer most from injuries and that most people care more for the domestic game ..... this can of worms must not be prised open. What will be next? Football league managers deciding if international games/tournaments are important enough for their players to play in? Players only being allowed to play in the final stages of tournaments or not in consecutive matches?

Robert Earnshaw is a Welshman and if Wales calls Norwich must listen.

It is selfish to think otherwise. 

[FilletTheFishWife . 0]

it is not selfish at all. Its just a difference of opinion and my opinion is that i support Norwich City and care less about international football.

Robert Earnshaw may be a Welshman .......but he is also a very valuable player for Norwich City (in terms of team performances and finance) and that''s the priority for me.

[Syteanric 1]

Grant can only Withdraw Earnie form the New Zealand game.. as the game vs Czech rep is a qualifier he cant remove him form qualifying sqauds...

Club before country EVERY time.. if earnie played crap for us every week he wouldnt even get anywhere near the Welsh squad would he?

jas :)

[0ridgemanddMMyyyy0Falseen-USTrue 0]

Club first every time, Grant is absolutely right players don''t come back as fit as they go ie Saffri - even Worthington used to say that. Clubs should dictate what happens to their players especially when the player has been out injured for three months after all the club has planned the rehabilitation of the player why should   some other manager destroy that.

[Faded Jaded Semi Plastic SOB 1,036]

If it is club before country every time why have international teams at all?, or why do we not just have players who play for their country and nobody else, wouldn`t work would it!!, that is why clubs have to accept that if a player wants to represent their country (note wants to represent his country) then they should let them go. Jas taking your arguement to its logical conclusion if Ernie played crap every week then we would not have signed him would we?, when you sign an established international player you have to accept that he is likely to be called up to play for his country. I do not like it when one of our players come back from international duty injured, but I accept that it is an occupational hazard.

[Bigmarkcanary 0]

[quote user="ridgeman"]Club first every time, Grant is absolutely right players don''t come back as fit as they go ie Saffri - even Worthington used to say that. Clubs should dictate what happens to their players especially when the player has been out injured for three months after all the club has planned the rehabilitation of the player why should   some other manager destroy that.[/quote]

Yep, I agree with all of that and we need Earnie fit for the start of next season.

[Cantiaci Canary 558]

[quote user="Sons of Boadicea"]If it is club before country every time why have international teams at all?, or why do we not just have players who play for their country and nobody else, wouldn`t work would it!!, that is why clubs have to accept that if a player wants to represent their country (note wants to represent his country) then they should let them go. Jas taking your arguement to its logical conclusion if Ernie played crap every week then we would not have signed him would we?, when you sign an established international player you have to accept that he is likely to be called up to play for his country. I do not like it when one of our players come back from international duty injured, but I accept that it is an occupational hazard.[/quote]

 

Wow somebody speaking sense ... I was starting to feel like a voice in the wilderness! It''s not an issue of club over country - I am far more passionate about NCFC than England. 

If you own an international player you have to accept these problems. Earnshaw is Welsh - if Wales demand his services NCFC have no right to get involved. Too many people are too ''village focussed'' - It is NOT a club vs country issue.  

[Shack Attack 0]

Absolutely agree with the original poster. If Robert Earnshaw is fit to play for Wales then we have no right to attempt to stop him from doing so. Like you I''m far more passionate about Norwich than I am about England, but that''s not really the issue here.

If you think Grant''s wrong just wait until later this year when the bi-annual whingefest about the African Nations Cup begins, usually started by Sam Allardyce. Do Bolton not check player''s passports before they sign them?

[Carlos Valderrama 0]

[quote user="Konstantin Pobedonostsev"]

[quote user="Sons of Boadicea"]If it is club before country every time why have international teams at all?, or why do we not just have players who play for their country and nobody else, wouldn`t work would it!!, that is why clubs have to accept that if a player wants to represent their country (note wants to represent his country) then they should let them go. Jas taking your arguement to its logical conclusion if Ernie played crap every week then we would not have signed him would we?, when you sign an established international player you have to accept that he is likely to be called up to play for his country. I do not like it when one of our players come back from international duty injured, but I accept that it is an occupational hazard.[/quote]

 

Wow somebody speaking sense ... I was starting to feel like a voice in the wilderness! It''s not an issue of club over country - I am far more passionate about NCFC than England. 

If you own an international player you have to accept these problems. Earnshaw is Welsh - if Wales demand his services NCFC have no right to get involved. Too many people are too ''village focussed'' - It is NOT a club vs country issue.  

[/quote]

The point is that a fully fit Rob Earnshaw being called up for his country is no problem, what is a problem is that Rob Earnshaw is only just back from a serious injury.  If the player is not fit enough to feature for his club then he is not fit enough to feature for his country.  I am all for players representing their country, in fact I would encourage it.

The same point applies to Michael Owen.

Your points have been well put across but please justify why you think that Rob Earnshaw/Michael Owen should represent their country when they haven''t propoerly figured for there clubs since returning from injury.  Both players cost there clubs a significant amount of money, in transfer fees, wages, insurance and medical bills, the international setup doesn''t contribute to any of this...In this case tell me why the country should get all of the benfit without any of the risk.

This is a very serious issue, IF Earnshaw was to return with a recurrence of his injury it would have a catastrophic effect on our plans for next season.

[Faded Jaded Semi Plastic SOB 1,036]

Jimmy 500 - If Earnie is not fully fit why is he playing for us?, it cuts both ways, he is as likely to injured in the Championship as he is at international level (as has been proved by his long lay off).  I have no problem with Grant asking Wales to look after Earnie, and equally Wales could say the same thing to Grant.

[Citizen Journalist Foghorn 0]

If Erny is fit enough to be a sub for us then he is fit enough to be a sub for Wales.  All Grant is saying is that he should stick to whatever the special training regime he is currently on is.  I''m sure this happens reguarly with players returning from injury.  I just think it is probably just Grant talking too much as usual.

[Carlos Valderrama 0]

[quote user="Sons of Boadicea"]

Jimmy 500 - If Earnie is not fully fit why is he playing for us?, it cuts both ways, he is as likely to injured in the Championship as he is at international level (as has been proved by his long lay off).  I have no problem with Grant asking Wales to look after Earnie, and equally Wales could say the same thing to Grant.

[/quote]

But he isn''t really fit to play for us is he, a couple of substitute appearances for the last 20 doesn''t really qualify him as being fit enough for the rigours of internation football.

Also, if he is injured playing in the Championship then that is our problem and part and parcel of the game, if he is injured playing for wales then it is still our problem cause the FA of wales just sends a crock back and leaves us to pick up the tab.

If we are gonna have a serious stab at this league next year then we either need A. the money from his transfer or B. the goals he will undoubtedly score, if he gets crocked playing a meaningless friendly he isn''t ready for we will have neither.

As I said before, if he is fully fit then no problem, but he isn''t fully fit and that is a problem.

[Faded Jaded Semi Plastic SOB 1,036]

Jimmy - I think we ar sort of agreeing in as much as I think Grant was right in asking Wales to look after Earnie and the fact the we need a fit Earnie for next year either to sell or score goals, so why risk him now when we are safe?. We knew that Earnie was an established international player when we signed him and we knew he was likely to be called up and of course all of this ignores the feelings of the man himself, what right do any of us have in telling earnie he should not play for Wales?

[Carlos Valderrama 0]

[quote user="Sons of Boadicea"]Jimmy - I think we ar sort of agreeing in as much as I think Grant was right in asking Wales to look after Earnie and the fact the we need a fit Earnie for next year either to sell or score goals, so why risk him now when we are safe?. We knew that Earnie was an established international player when we signed him and we knew he was likely to be called up and of course all of this ignores the feelings of the man himself, what right do any of us have in telling earnie he should not play for Wales?[/quote]

Agreed, he is international quality and we know that, and Wales will probably take great care with him.  I am not suggesting that we ask him to withdraw as I am sure being asked to play for your country is the pinnacle of anyones career.  What I am saying, English FA included is do they really need to take him (Owen/Earnie) for a meaningless friendly?

The club v country row is very much alive, I believe that if national associations need to be a bit more respectful when it came to calling up injured/not fully fit players.  Surely they have other options, it''s not like it really matters at the end of the day.

My advice to both associations, leave them alone for the friendly so they can get fully fit and the clubs would then have no problems with the player going when it really matters.

[Faded Jaded Semi Plastic SOB 1,036]

Jimmy 500 - Totally agree regarding friendlies.

[Cantiaci Canary 558]

"please justify why you think that Rob Earnshaw/Michael Owen should represent their country when they haven''t propoerly figured for there clubs since returning from injury" 

" What I am saying, English FA included is do they really need to take him (Owen/Earnie) for a meaningless friendly?"

Jimmy500

Whether I feel if Earny is fit enough to play or not is irrelevant. It is down to the Welsh set up to decide - not me or PG. I would not want Earny to play 90 minutes but as desperate as Wales are to play him I am 100% certian that they will listen to what he and the Norwich/Welsh medical teams have to say and make the right choice.

Norwich City own Robert Earnshaw for domestic competitions they have no remit concerning international appearances. 

NCFC can''t threaten to withdraw Earnshaw''s passport if he says he is going on holiday to Colombia in the summer because it is more dangerous there than Great Yarmouth.

NCFC can''t threaten to take away Earnshaw''s driving license if he buys a MacLaren because he might crash it and hurt himself ...

NCFC can''t threaten to withdraw Earnshaw from Welsh duty if he is called up. 

[Carlos Valderrama 0]

No they can''t stop him from going to Colombia on holiday, but they can advise against it.  No they can''t stop him from buying a Maclaren but they could stop him buying a motorbike.  And no they can''t threaten to withdraw him from the wales squad, but they could advise against it.

If you were in Earnshaw''s shoes would you risk aggravating what was a serious injury by playing for your country in a meaningless game when not fully fit, or would you concentrate on getting fully fit and back to peak performance for the following euro qualifier?

The simple fact is that Earnshaw is not fit enough for international duty, why take him when he probably isn''t fit enough to play.  We pay his wages and his medical bills, he belongs to us and quite frankly if I was PG I wouldn''t let him go.

And finally, is Colombia really more dangerous than Yarmouth?  Sometimes I am not so sure.........

[Cantiaci Canary 558]

Jimmy500 "And no they can''t threaten to withdraw him from the wales squad, but they could advise against it"

But Grant is threatening to withdraw him rather than just advising him ...  "he won''t be going. I don''t care what anybody says, he will not be going if"

THIS is precisely why I have been so passionate on this topic. If PG was merely threatening to ''advise'' I would have no problem.