Too Relient On Ashton?

[First Wizard 0]

Firstly I''m very pro Ashton okay, so don''t kick off!.

But, since all this speculation over him lark, rather than post, I''ve thought hard about it, and I would love your thoughts on this question:

Are we too relient on Dean Ashton?.

Would it not be better to cash in on him, and aquire 3 new quality players?.

Oops, thats two questions!.

I would love Deano''s goals to get us promoted, but is he a player we simply can''t afford in this division?.

Sorry, thats three questions now.

For myself, whilst I''m not too concered either way,  I''m leaning to the cashing in option more every day. After all we got promoted without him, and relegated with him!.

Or is that too harsh?.

Damn!, that four questions now!.

Your thoughts please.

[Citizen Journalist Foghorn 0]

yes wiz it would be goos to sell him and sign 3 quality players such as

Rasiak

Idiakiz

Halford

Jerome

Koumas

but will worthy do this, on current form I dont think so.

[macdougalls perm 0]

I agree that it could work both ways. His goals and all round hold up play are excellent (possibly invaluable) but it does make you wonder if the money that we might receive could be used to strengthen the squad as a whole - particularly the right side of midfield and obviously a striker (Jerome/Eastwood?). If we were offered £7-8m for him I do start to wonder whether he is a luxury that we can''t really afford (ie in terms of sacrificing any semblance of strength in depth). I''m totally undecided! Suppose I''ll just have to wait and see like everyone else. 

[MadDan 0]

I thought you said on saturday that he was off so isn''t the question academic.

Some who see your predictions and certainties as so much ill informed hogwash might suggest that we would not get 3 new quality players based on dividing Ashton''s salary up by three.

Any profit made on the sale of Ashton would almost certainly be taken up by the two extra salaries.

Back to you cauldron, methinks

[Citizen Journalist Foghorn 0]

and what is wrong with making a prediction?? There is a fair chance he will leave. Whats wrong with discussing what we might do with the money if he does leave.  Or whether it is a good time to sell him. Or whether with worthy in charge anytime is a good time to sell him.  Neil Adams still thinks he is 99% certain to leave - personally I hope not.  If we sell him and Jarrett,  I reckon there should be enough money in the pot for 3 players and salaries (I dread to think what JJ is on).

[0peteddMMyyyy0Falseen-USTrue 0]

If we''ve got an excellent striker but cannot play to his strengths would be prudent to cash in and let him play where he would be better employed.

With the £3m Worthy might be allowed we could strengthen in those areas Idiakez or a Koumas and on the right, can Worthy be trusted however ?  I think not.

Personally I wasn''t taken in by Saturday''s denial and feel Deano will go sooner rather than later.  Deano''s salary would pay for at least 3 non Prem players, must be on a fair screw £15k+.  Especially if we go for young, hungry players i.e. Danns or Halford.  Deano salary would be dwarfed by what Koumas would want however.  

I see Maddan is living up to his tag.  Although so me of Wiz 1''s posts are a little too tongue in cheek for the thin skinned you cannot argue with the fact Worthy must go and he will as he is now a lame duck manager with too many of the cogniscenti. 

[MadDan 0]

and what is wrong with making a prediction??

Everything when it is posted up as a certainty that is used as a basis for an unfounded attack upon the club. Try telling your the folks in your street that your neighbour will steal your car on on wednesday and what a terrible thief he is, not fit to live in the same street etc

"Whats wrong with discussing what we might do with the money if he does leave. "

No one has said there''s any thing wrong with ''if''. Nor is there anything wrong in a counter argument about how much money will be left over.

"Neil Adams still thinks he is 99% certain to leave."

Neil Adams was telling all and sundry that Ashton''s sale would be announced after the game on Satuarday. He knows nothing.

" If we sell him and Jarrett, "

Sell Jarrett ! ! ! He came here on a free as his wages were too high for most clubs. Why after drifting down to Plymouth would he suddenly become affordable. Have clubs now got money ? Has his contract been reduced ?

The speculation around Ashton is fuelled by stupidity and ignorance. The idea that we are going to magicaly generate a £3m profit is absurd. All transfer fees are a figure quoted on all eventualities occurring. Look at the binmen''s sale of Wright to Arsenal. Was it £5m, was it £6m ? err no, it turned out to be £2m.

Any transfer of Ashton will be conditional. Are the club to speculate on whether he scores x number of goals, plays y number of games for his club and country and then borrow against that ?

The stupidity that compounds much of this ignorance is that it causes concern at the club with time and effort having to be taken up with dealing with these endless idiot queries.

The board and the club DON''T lack ambition, are working for the best interest of us all and do know what they are doing. Though listening to some of the half baked tosh on here sometimes you could be forgiven if they wondered why they bothered.

[First Wizard 0]

My prediction could still come true pal, don''t congratulate yourself yet.

Unless you were present and read Deano''s contract personally, like me, you are clueless to the actual monies involved.

I only suggested a topic, its you who have tried to corrupt the intentions of this thread.

And get personel as well.

Sad!.

[Citizen Journalist Foghorn 0]

and what is wrong with making a prediction??

Everything when it is posted up as a certainty that is used as a basis for an unfounded attack upon the club. Try telling your the folks in your street that your neighbour will steal your car on on wednesday and what a terrible thief he is, not fit to live in the same street etc

What are you talking about here??? Personally I have never once moaned about the club selling ashton - if we can make a decent profit and spend it wisely and he wishes to leave we have no choice.  Some fans feel the board should be turning down all bids - ala palace and johnson, that is there opinion and they have every right to it.  They feel the club is letting itself down if we let go of the best player we have had since bellamy.  I dont agree and would rather let a player who does not wanna be here go.

"Neil Adams still thinks he is 99% certain to leave."

Neil Adams was telling all and sundry that Ashton''s sale would be announced after the game on Satuarday. He knows nothing.

Neil Adams has his opinion as we have ours I am just saying many people near the club feel he will leave. As for saturday when they announced a press conference they were foolish - they created problems themselves.  NW should just have said it in his post match comments - which is actually what he did. this imaginary press conference was junk and should never have arisen.

" If we sell him and Jarrett, "

let him go on a free to plymouth freeing up his excessive wages is what i meant

The speculation around Ashton is fuelled by stupidity and ignorance. The idea that we are going to magicaly generate a £3m profit is absurd. All transfer fees are a figure quoted on all eventualities occurring. Look at the binmen''s sale of Wright to Arsenal. Was it £5m, was it £6m ? err no, it turned out to be £2m.

Any transfer of Ashton will be conditional. Are the club to speculate on whether he scores x number of goals, plays y number of games for his club and country and then borrow against that ?

The stupidity that compounds much of this ignorance is that it causes concern at the club with time and effort having to be taken up with dealing with these endless idiot queries.

The board and the club DON''T lack ambition, are working for the best interest of us all and do know what they are doing. Though listening to some of the half baked tosh on here sometimes you could be forgiven if they wondered why they bothered.

Im sorry at the moment from my perspective I see a lack of quality coming into the club.  I see hard workers and no creativity. It has taken one of the few creative players to get back in the side for us to acheive results.  I still see NO right midfielder, in fact i see no decent right side, all i see are player after player playing out of position there - does worthy hate right midfielders so much, him being a left back???.  I see poor tactics for the most part this season.  I see injuries keeping players out of the side which has actually benefited the team as replacements whom do not play normally do well!!  I have seen so many injuries to the midfield unyet a bright hungry young player has not been given a go - when he finally does , he impresses for 20 mins then has to wait until picked again but this time out of position.  I see good proffesionals allowed to leave the club for nothing, replaced by inferior versions, no doubt on more wages (speculation i no).  I fear Mcveigh will be gone in the summer, Ashton will be gone, Huckerby will be a year older and the team will be back to the mid table dross of ythe last few years Premiership money wasted.

[Northern Canary 0]

for some other teams it would be better to sell him and take the money. but there isnt enought evidence to suggest we would actually buy 3-5 quality players with the money.

[lucky green trainers 0]

its clear crewe were reliant on deano, they''ve nose-dived since and destined for league 1.on the basis of saturdays display versus west ham, without deano or hucks we lacked any kind of credible goal threat and were reduced to hoofs into the box.  once such hoof lead to a penalty ''gift'' that only served to flatter us. we were mcveigh looked lively, but he carried no goal threat without deano, hucks or midfield support play of safs & robbo.IMO worthy''s don''t sell policy unless a silly offer is made is the correct one.   

[a1canary 0]

I''m becoming one for comparisons! They are usually disected to the ''nth

degree and i''m told they''re way out, but all the same, here''s another

one, which i agree is very fanciful but i cling to it the event that DA

departs us!!

Rooney and Everton. Remember before he left, the speculation reached

fever pitch as to where he would go, and everyone was convinced that a

Rooney-less Everton would be relegation fodder.

It had become evident that he was bigger than the club, that he was too

big a fish for the Goodison pond, and that everyone else was having to

operate in his shadow. Which can''t have been helpful to the fish. I

mean, how can they get to their food when there''s this big monster in

the way?

So once Rooney-fish had gone, suddenly there was room in the pond for the others to thrive!

And against all odds, they finished in the champions pond. But

admittedly got devoured! But you see the point, Deano''s departure could

be cathartic for us and may allow the likes of Jarrett-fish to flourish

when he might previously have been a little star struck.

I don''t want to accept that he''s too big for us but i fear this is the

case. We landed a whopper last January and our net''s not big enough to

hold it. This is fun! O.k, i''ll stop now! [*-)]

[Citizen Journalist Foghorn 0]

a1 I cant agree about Jarrett, he was at wigan an average championship performer. And at us that is all he will be.

If Paul Jewell *Really* wanted to keep him that much he would have done. Im sure he is a decent proffesional so he would have liked him in the squad but nothing special, similar realyy to Andy Hughes and Steve Coppell - they had no need to sell but couldnt turn down £550,000 for one of his lesser players.

I wish some posters would get a sense of reality on the ability levels of some of our newer players. JJ is never going to be a star, he is going to be what he is an average mid table championship player whom unfortunatly for him is going to be compared to Francis whom *is* a better footballer.

[Big A 0]

its a great question wiz and one i think the board are probably spending a long time thinking over at the moment.

The question/ problem is can we actually get the players we want with

the money we get from Ashton?  If we were able to get Jerome from

Cardiff i think it would lighten the blow somewhat but how much would

he cost...£3m?.....and would he want to come to us (i don''t think so).

The trouble with our situation now is that we have no appeal to pull in

players of a quality that will improve our starting lineup. 

Spending money on QUALITY £2-3m players is VERY difficult...... put

another way, spending £7m on a proven goalscorer is far less of a risk

than spending  3x £2-3m on some fringe premiership players or

young  championship players.

For the sake of the future of the club i think we stick with ashton,

although his value now might be high, his value to us if/ when we are

back in the premiership is much higher.

There is sooooooo much uncertainty that i really don''t envy the board at the moment.

[Citizen Journalist Foghorn 0]

[quote user="Big A"]its a great question wiz and one i think the board are probably spending a long time thinking over at the moment.

The question/ problem is can we actually get the players we want with the money we get from Ashton?  If we were able to get Jerome from Cardiff i think it would lighten the blow somewhat but how much would he cost...£3m?.....and would he want to come to us (i don''t think so).

The trouble with our situation now is that we have no appeal to pull in players of a quality that will improve our starting lineup.  Spending money on QUALITY £2-3m players is VERY difficult...... put another way, spending £7m on a proven goalscorer is far less of a risk than spending  3x £2-3m on some fringe premiership players or young  championship players.

For the sake of the future of the club i think we stick with ashton, although his value now might be high, his value to us if/ when we are back in the premiership is much higher.

There is sooooooo much uncertainty that i really don''t envy the board at the moment.
[/quote]

Buying guaranteed championship quality means spending about a million on a player. As for improving the starting lineup - Just buy a decent right sided player for a start!!!!  Right back or midfield.  in fact any player will improve our right midfield - even a free!!!