The first 12 games vs 20/21 and 18/19 and Smith's problem

[AJ 1,224]

3 hours ago, cambridgeshire canary said:

Amusing how Farke is viewed as this magical fantastic saviour who is a million times better than Smith by some on here and yet the facts are that

 

A- Smith did better in his breif time in the Prem with us than Farke did in his one and a quater seasons

B- Smith in his first season in the Championship with us at this point at the season has more points than this point in the season under Farke in Farkes two championship promotions with us

 

But of course, Smith puts his hands in his pockets, drinks tea from a mug and his football is slower so clearly Smith is the worse manager..

The fact is Farke did an outstanding job, so he earned the right to be a "magical fantastic saviour". Sometimes everything falls into place and it just works, it happened for Farke, it also happened for Lambert.

These things take time though, as alluded to by a few posters above, the first season under Farke was hardly Hollywood but he started to win the fans over, and I'm sure in time that'll happen with Dean. 

As I clearly said in my original post, Smith is doing a good job, which with the players at his disposal he should be. I just don't love him yet, but who knows, that might come in time. And as LCD said, unfortunately for Dean the goalposts have moved now, the 5 year plan or whatever it was has run its course and we're all just a bit tired of making it to the big time and then being utterly pants for 12 months. I really hope Dean can keep this up and have his chance to change that though.

Edited October 8, 2022 by AJ

[kirku 1,336]

43 minutes ago, Yellow Fever said:

The problem/ideology with Farkeball was simply we'll score more than you i.e. the opposition. We scored a lot and let a lot in in the Championship runs but it was exciting stuff.

In the Prem though it didn't work out so well as the teams generally were defensively much stronger/savvy and more clinical in attack. We rather let in a lot more goals than we scored - the opposite of the championship runs.

Dean is trying to sort that with the players available and so far so good. Well be better prepared next time if we get back to the EPL.

The stats in the OP show that we have conceded 2 more goals this season than at the same time in 20/21.

It was widely noted at the time that we had significantly tightened up the defensive side of the system that Farke had tried previously, and that the additions of Gibson and Skipp gave us a much more solid spine, with the expectation that this would translate better if we were to get promoted.

Didn't quite work out that way.

Edited October 8, 2022 by kirku

[kirku 1,336]

Great thread @Hank shoots Skyler 👏

[chicken 2,640]

4 hours ago, Michael Starr said:

The key factor here is that we've yet to face the top teams like Burnley, Watford and Sheff Utd. Instead, we've played some of the weaker teams in the league, including the bottom three of Coventry, West Brom and Huddersfield.

This is an odd observation. I say that because we don't know who "top teams" are this season, well, certainly not in the first 5-6 games at least. Reading are third but you don't consider them a top team despite their ability to get results and being tough to beat. Huddersfield got to the play-off final last season. Sheff Utd lost in their play-off leg to make it to the final. Few would have guessed on game day 4 that Huddersfield would be bottom 3 and still be bottom three 11-12games into the season. I suspect few would have predicted Shef Utd would be top.

Equally, Watford are 10th on 17points, 7 off automatic spots, one outside 6th. Burnley are 5th, on 19 points 5 off autos and 1pt above 7th. Watford are actually also only 7 points off West Brom who occupy 22nd and the top of the bottom three. West Brom were seen as a tough side to face at the start of the season. Equally, Bristol City had a very good run before playing us.

Who top sides are in the division can change week by week, who's sold, who's injured... Watford have struggled since selling a couple of their more talented players, quite possibly to financially be able to keep Sarr. 

[chicken 2,640]

40 minutes ago, AJ said:

As I clearly said in my original post, Smith is doing a good job, which with the players at his disposal he should be.

We really need to get rid of this mentality IMHO. No one has a god given right to be doing well, teams still have to perform. If you look at our squad now compared to promotion under Farke - you could argue a number of things that suggest the current squad is weaker, I really don't think we're clear head and shoulders above everyone else.

Cantwell and Buendia of that season... Buendia's best season for us IMHO. Beat any wide combination we have right now. Cantwell was showing signs of getting back to those sorts of levels before illness.

Skipp... with other options like Vrancic. As many stress, we haven't found an able replacement to Skipp. Normann and Gilmour arrived and were unable to replicate that midfield. PLM looked good at times but struggled to impact games more than Vrancic did. All three of those as well as Vrancic and Skipp are no longer with us. Nunez and Gibbs look good, full of potential and perhaps they'll reach those heights. Most would still take Skipp.

The defence is more or less the same, with the addition of Tomkinson and the loss of Zimmermann.

Throw into that all players we had back then and have retained are all two years older. Some now beyond 30, some well beyond 30.

Is there quality - yes, but you look at the squad. Hugill, Sinani and Hernandez were all but gone. Now they are important squad members again. This is not the easy coaching job people want it to be, it really isn't. 

Edited October 8, 2022 by chicken

[Hank shoots Skyler 2,094]

6 hours ago, chicken said:

We really need to get rid of this mentality IMHO. No one has a god given right to be doing well, teams still have to perform. If you look at our squad now compared to promotion under Farke - you could argue a number of things that suggest the current squad is weaker, I really don't think we're clear head and shoulders above everyone else.

Cantwell and Buendia of that season... Buendia's best season for us IMHO. Beat any wide combination we have right now. Cantwell was showing signs of getting back to those sorts of levels before illness.

Skipp... with other options like Vrancic. As many stress, we haven't found an able replacement to Skipp. Normann and Gilmour arrived and were unable to replicate that midfield. PLM looked good at times but struggled to impact games more than Vrancic did. All three of those as well as Vrancic and Skipp are no longer with us. Nunez and Gibbs look good, full of potential and perhaps they'll reach those heights. Most would still take Skipp.

The defence is more or less the same, with the addition of Tomkinson and the loss of Zimmermann.

Throw into that all players we had back then and have retained are all two years older. Some now beyond 30, some well beyond 30.

Is there quality - yes, but you look at the squad. Hugill, Sinani and Hernandez were all but gone. Now they are important squad members again. This is not the easy coaching job people want it to be, it really isn't. 

Yeah I think the 20/21 side was definitely a stronger one than this current one which I didn’t really factor in to the OP either. The record of a Buendia-less side under Farke was there for all to see in the champs and he really brought the best out of the players in and around him. Be interesting to have seen how Farke got players like Cantwell, Dowell and Pukki singing on their own this season were he still here. It does feel like we’ve not really got any of our attacking midfielders consistently firing yet this season. Ramsey the best of the bunch but still very inconsistent and in and out of games.