Derby Canary

[quote user="PurpleCanary"][quote user="hogesar"][quote user="Derby Canary"][quote user="hogesar"]When someone thinks we''re in our ''worst position for 50 years'' then you know they''re probably insane. Or a Derby fan.[/quote] Depends how you assess our current plight old chap. We have yet to prove that we have a side that can compete with Clubs even in the lower reaches of this division. We replace players with others that are not up to the job. We have an incompetent board (beyond dispute). Plus a manager that seems tactically incompetent and (incoherent). As far as our financial plight is concerned we are told the cupboard is bare! If you can remember a worse time than this I must be losing my memory![/quote]We look about as midtable as it is possible to look.Baring in mind the couple of season prior to, and the actual relegation to the third tier, I don''t think this is the worst situation the club has been in.I also disagree that the ''board'' are incompetent.[/quote]The board''s ability to act and to make the best decisions is constrained by their pauperism, but on balance - bearing that in mind - I think their record has been pretty decent. As far as managers are concerned, the one really inexuscusable decision was to keep Gunn on after relegation. You could argue about some of the other choices, and the timings of sackings, but you would struggle to get a consensus here on the latter. As for the former, it has to be borne in mind that we get to pick from the third tier of managers - not the dozen or so universal geniuses, not the up and comers who have already proved themselves in the Premier League, but the reliable old stagers (think Warnock or McCarthy), the old stagers who might be on the slide (think perhaps Pardew), the promising newcomers who have done well, but only with one club, and that down below, or the wild cards from overseas.This week I came across a revealing statistic on a Guardian Football Weekly. Manchester United have won the league a record 20 times, but only with three managers and one of those was in charge before world war one. After him Busby won it five times and Ferguson 13. In other words, every other Man Utd manager has failed. One of the biggest clubs in the world, able to have its pick of the best managers, with winning the league a realistic ambition (a bit akin to us getting promoted to the Premier League) has made failed choice after failed choice. [/quote] Not really so revealing Purple Canary if you consider that those two lads managed Man Utd for a combined total of some 51 years! The problem with NFC board is not that they are void of good intentions. It is more that they have not got the slightest clue when it comes to football knowledge/strategy and that they compound the problem by recruiting others (friends and relations)that are even worse! The best Managers in any industry are those that know when to call it a day....sadly that does not apply to Delia!

[quote user="nutty nigel"]The only progress I see is the progression from moaning about Neil to moaning about Farke. That after the progression from moaning about Hughton to moaning about Adams. And of course swinging from moaning about negative football to moaning about positive football and now moaning about negative football again.I liked how we played under Adams the Neil. Never made any secret of it either. I will now get used to this and whatever follows.[/quote] How refreshing to hear of your consistent delight at the performance of our Club when you inhabit the world of the fickle football fan Nutty. You don''t let the mere fact that the players decide on a game to game basis whether they can be bothered to turn up concern you! Why should they twice a week when only on a mere £20k pw or so? In this money driven game (as Mr Negative - quite the reverse of your goodself!) I''ll now make another prediction. David Wagner will not be in post at the end of the season, Big Sam has already ''set out his stall'' for the interview! Oh, I do wish I could be nice and positive like you!

[quote user="Feedthewolf"][quote user="Derby Canary"][quote user="hogesar"]When someone thinks we''re in our ''worst position for 50 years'' then you know they''re probably insane. Or a Derby fan.[/quote] Depends how you assess our current plight old chap. We have yet to prove that we have a side that can compete with Clubs even in the lower reaches of this division. We replace players with others that are not up to the job. We have an incompetent board (beyond dispute). Plus a manager that seems tactically incompetent and (incoherent). As far as our financial plight is concerned we are told the cupboard is bare! If you can remember a worse time than this I must be losing my memory![/quote]2008/9. Less than a decade ago.[/quote] ....and please enlighten me as to which aspect of our predicament was worse then than now!

[quote user="hogesar"]When someone thinks we''re in our ''worst position for 50 years'' then you know they''re probably insane. Or a Derby fan.[/quote] Depends how you assess our current plight old chap. We have yet to prove that we have a side that can compete with Clubs even in the lower reaches of this division. We replace players with others that are not up to the job. We have an incompetent board (beyond dispute). Plus a manager that seems tactically incompetent and (incoherent). As far as our financial plight is concerned we are told the cupboard is bare! If you can remember a worse time than this I must be losing my memory!

First started following Canaries in Sept 1961 (v Sunderland - Brian Clough was their centre forward). For a couple of years we had been second tier bottom half. We were full of honest types of the likes of Kennon/Ashman/McCrohan/Butler/Hill/Bryceland/Punton/Allcock etc etc. The game was exciting played with wingers/centre forward etc and headed goals were often a feature! Expressions of the likes of final third/second balls/in the hole/sitting/professional foul, were never used, at least not in this context! We enjoyed the games (mostly), we were entertained and often discussed the game on the way home instead of staring at a telephone screen for 95% of the time. We did not have Sporting Directors/coaches/dieticians/owners etc etc, the players were paid about twice what they would have earned in any other job and admission prices were affordable. We were not interested in statistics (again not in this context!) and could n''t care less re % possession, numbers of fouls, shots on target. All we were interested in was that we saw a good game and of course that we won! Tackles were made, bookings were few and sending offs almost unheard of. Over the past 50+ years we have generally occupied the same league position excepting of course a few highlights under Messrs Saunders/Bond/Walker/Lambert but those highlights were ''fleeting''and we soon adjusted back, to lower half of the second tier where we currently are. No amount of ''7 year plans'' etc etc have/or will make much difference and short of major shake up/investment the same will continue. Honesty is long gone and we just do not know what we are going to get from week to week. Reasonable one week, appalling the next, the quality of the opposition makes little difference. I truly believe that our Club is now in the worst position I have witnessed in the past 50+ years. Our Manager''s post match comments are almost incoherent and he appears completely out of his depth. Progress, my backside!

[quote user="Nuff Said"]Can I just shout "Huzzah!" for Indy Bones (although i think we know what Wiz would be saying if he were still here). Patiently and comprehensively shooting down (insert RVW joke to taste) those having tantrums like toddlers who can''t have ice cream RIGHT NOW!!![/quote] You can shout what you like Nuffsaid but facts will remain facts!

[quote user="Herman"]He''s had five games at our beloved club you whinging ghoul.[/quote] Old lad, it''s not the number of games they''ve had it''s the totally inept recruitment (so far) and the inability to demonstrate the slightest tactical nous!

[quote user="Indy_Bones"][quote user="Rogue Baboon"]To be fair the role he has here is a step up from his role at Huddersfield I believe. Hence he didn''t look at the respective positions of the clubs, he looked at it from a selfish, career-based, personal point of view (which is I am sure what most of us would do)[/quote]Exactly RB.I don''t think you''d find many people who would be willing to stick in a 30k a year job for a highly regarded company, if they could get a better role and a 150k salary at a somewhat less respected company (but who are still held in good regard) instead.Assuming Webber performs well here, there''s no reason why he can''t continue his personal progression and possibly even end up back at Liverpool at some time - but in a significantly more important role, with a significantly higher wages in the process...[/quote] From what I''ve seen of our Sporting Director and Head Coach so far there is only one way his/their career goes from here. How''s life in cloud cuckoo land?

[quote user="Duncan Edwards"]Or in RVW''s case, shank hopelessly into the stand. But Herman is right, Indy Bones you''re doing a sterling job fending off the assembled mongers-of-doom.[/quote] It''s ok as you put it ''fending off the mongers of doom'' on here. The trouble is though that the gradual spiral downward of our beloved Club over the past eighteen months only goes to confirm that the doom mongers have been absolutely right!

[quote user="Indy_Bones"][quote user="Derby Canary"]Don’t kid yourself that it was Webber that identified the players at Huddersfield it will have been Wagner just like it is Farke here. Webber would simply have dealt with the negotiation. The difference between the Huddersfield situation and the mess that we have is simply that the former is a competent Manager and the latter is utterly and totally out of his depth![/quote]Don''t kid yourself that it was Wagner and not Webber identifying the players.His role at Liverpool was director of academy recruitment, where he was VERY highly thought of by the likes of Comolli, he then moved from Liverpool to Wolves as head of recruitment, was then appointed by Huddersfield as head of football relations (which again involves recruitment), and now to us as sporting director (which guess what? involves recruitment).The real truth is that posters like you are just making $hit up in order to try and take a stick to the club, which is both pathetic and utterly sad, not to mention factually inaccurate.[/quote] Liverpool to Wolves to Huddersfield to Norwich? Whatever the role does n''t appear much like career progression to me! Anyway you keep believing all the way to L1. PS By the way unlike the other poster I DON''T think you make much sense!

Was n''t it a Grant H (or something) we signed last time we were in trouble?

[quote user="Indy_Bones"][quote user="Derby Canary"]I suspect Webber ''got lucky'' once in appointing the right man who almost certainly is the reason for Huddersfield''s success.[/quote]So he not only got lucky with the coach appointment, but with the majority of players he signed, who then not only got them promoted, but who have also helped them off to a great start in the PL.Surprised Webber isn''t living in Vegas if he''s that f**king lucky...[/quote] Don’t kid yourself that it was Webber that identified the players at Huddersfield it will have been Wagner just like it is Farke here. Webber would simply have dealt with the negotiation. The difference between the Huddersfield situation and the mess that we have is simply that the former is a competent Manager and the latter is utterly and totally out of his depth!

[quote user="norfolkngood"]people say its easy to replace Farke but it may well be Webber who is the problem ?? Huddersfield are doing fine without him They seemed to want Wagner more than webber why did he leave a team that was doing so well ?? the more i see the more i think it was Wagner at Huddersfield also why would we want to keep Webbers new set up if it is not working ? he got Huddersfield up ( or close before he left ) but lambert did the same for us and has not repeated it since so why do some think Webber is a God like figure all he has done so far is sold the family silver and bought cheaply which was needed to keep the club afloat if we do not go up he is working on a shoe string i admit but what has he done so far which is given anyone any hope ? so far himself and farke have got us playing with 70 % possession and losing 4-0 thats not going to get us up or any improvement[/quote] Exactly Norfolkngood! I suspect Webber ''got lucky'' once in appointing the right man who almost certainly is the reason for Huddersfield''s success. A little bit like we thought McNally was our saviour after he appointed Lambert. We know only too well what happened post PL! Unravelling this mess goes far beyond just replacing Farke!

Sadly it seems that Farke is a Webber puppet! He appears unwilling to admit that the personnel (recruited by Webber) are bang average and they (and he) are clearly not up to the job. Never mind patience, all the patience in the world will not bring this lot into the ''shape'' that will achieve this Club''s ambitions. We are in no better position (in fact worse) than under the stewardship of Alex Neil and now have such a complicated management set up that would be extortionately expensive to unravel. The fundamental problem with our Club is that we continue to have owners and a board that have not got a clue and despite all those that tell us how Delia saved our Club it is clear now that she will eventually leave it in a far worse state than she found it!

Wonderful to see Josh getting back to his best, which we all know to be very good indeed. I so hope that this is solely due to his desire to perform for City and nothing to do with being motivated by the sight of his twin brother''s payslip or a gee up from his agent (for the same reason). Cynical? Perhaps, but this is due to around 50 years of football (and footballers)! I personally believe that Josh is above all that. We shall see!

[quote user="Crabbycanary3"]He is right, but you might as well of changed the background of the advertising hoardings behind him, to more green and yellow, and you could have been transported back in time. I thought that he had learnt from his time here, painfully obvious, that he has not. I don''t care who the opposition is, you might think stuff like that, but under no circumstances, do you come out with such stuff. He has set a precedent for when Brighton play against similar top half teams (because they ALL have lots of money) during the rest of the season.[/quote] Chris Hughton is a genuinely nice bloke and a very talented coach but some time with Bill Shankly would have served him well. I remember Tommy Smith telling me that when Liverpool played in Spain in the then European Cup he wandered into the opposition dressing room to explain how his team were so ''up for it''. The Spanish side had not lost a game for two years! He then returned to Liverpool''s dressing room to explain how worried the Spanish team seemed. Mind games but you can imagine the result!

Brighton manager Chris Hughton: "It is disappointing but that is the QUALITY Manchester City have got and we know that. Nothing much changes in this world!

Mixed messages. We are told that unlike our ''colleagues'' south of the border we prudently inserted ''relegation clauses'' in players contracts. It is now suggested that Naismith is on £50k per week. Plus other players are on ''substantially more than average Champ pay''. How much would these persistent underperformers been on in the unlikely event that we had stayed up? Some of them apparently have decided not to train this week. Prudence? I think not!

[quote user="hogesar"]It''s probably best to give up whilst you''re behind.[/quote] Now that is what our Club has really been good at this season! Don''t tell me that is what the fans now do too!!

[quote user="Derby Canary"]Sorry.......forgot another one we messed up L Becchio![/quote] Oh and Gary Hooper!

Sorry.......forgot another one we messed up L Becchio!

[quote user="SwindonCanary"]I can come up with a lot bigger list of players that have left us and gone down in ability [/quote] Probable because like our Managers we''ve hung on to them too long and by the time we get rid they are ready for the knackers yard!

[quote user="westcoastcanary"]Worrying times? On the contrary, we are at last embarked on the regeneration of the club that should have been started at the end of the 2013-2014 season. Far from being consumed with worry, we''ve every reason to feel positive and look forward with relish to the forthcoming rebuild. It''s the ill-wishers on here who have real cause to worry and the appearance of all these daft threads tells me that the usual suspects like Derby and Highland know it all too well. [/quote] Where does this Club keep finding these Lemmings that keep believing that every change at the top is the start of the long awaited Renaissance. Reality is that the costs involved with this could finish the Club!

Guys Was Chris Hughton successful with us. Is he now? Did Jamie Cureton score goals for us (in two spells)? Did he at just about every other Club? Was Chris Martin a 25 goals a season striker with us? Is he now? Did Lafferty score goals at Int level. Did RVW score goals for fun pre Norwich? Is he again now? Did Redmond perform to his ability with us. Is he about to win a few England caps Before you tell me that Chris Martin had an attitude problem, if that was our ''red line'' most of the current shower would be gone! Stick to the facts Guys (rather than the abuse thatmaybe you are better at). They tend to speak for themselves!

[quote user="Herman"]Peter Crouch and Chris Martin were good when they were here.[/quote] But not scoring (or ever looked like he might) 25 goals a season as CM has subsequently done! If so good why did we give him away?