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Rudolph Hucker

No Choice But To Back Alex Neil.

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It is unrealistic to expect Alex Neil to walk into Norwich City half way through a season with no Championship experience or knowledge of his squad of players and bring instant success.

He may do, but the odds are heavily stacked against him.

And equally as difficult is expecting a manager to manage players he didn''t himself assemble and one with some imbalances.

The January transfer window only adds to the difficulties with unsettled players and the usual difficulty to bring in good replacements.

The same can be said of the coaching staff.

We have to assume he is up to the job in which case he has to have time, in which case he will be given his real chance over the summer and next season.

But what Neil can do is to deal with attitude and application and I thought his comments were telling on that score. We hope he is a strong character, we sensed he might be and for that reason alone, supporters frustrated with the attitudes they have detected amongst their players, welcomed Neil like a new Messiah from the off.

It isn''t easy to put your finger on but I struggle to think of the last time I saw such a disconnect between Norwich players and supporters. Yes, we moan about the Board but we also know they have stumped up the cash and backed their managers. We complain about the managers but we also know they cannot cross the white line themselves. In particular, we saw Neil Adams as the closest thing to a fan in the manager''s seat and empathised with him as certain players showed him disrespect in various ways. I don''t know but suspect Adams burnt himself out trying to motivate these players.

The sense of all being in it together evaporated last season. You know, the feeling generated by Cambridge Utd fans watching the likes of Nelson and McGeehan striving to achieve or, dare I say it, the sense of teamwork generated Brentford on Saturday.

Some of our players have had the absolute temerity to argue on the pitch or on social media with fans. They don''t see this makes them the problem. On top of that, so called seasoned pro''s have failed to step forward to the extent we have no talisman on the pitch, no leaders, and that must extend to the dressing room.

No wonder Neil wouldn''t criticise the hapless Whittaker, who did as he has asked and gave it his best shot. I notice too he turned to O''Neill very early in his tenure, he is searching for people who will put a shift in and try to do their jobs.

Given time, if Neil is truly a hungry and ambitious young manager he will rid the Club of players who, as a bottom line, threaten his career as they ended Adams and stalled Hughton''s (remember the complacent statements around this time last year from the likes of Howson?)

We will most likely have to wait for this particular ship to be turned around. Forget automatic promotion, we may get a run in the play offs if we are lucky. Most likely we are looking at this league next season.

This brings the question of cash and that means wages. So, get good money for the likes of Olsson; let Redmond develop elsewhere - in fairness to him he will star in a team with two wingers as he won''t be doubled up on all the time. Move Ruddy on. Putting everything else aside he is doubtless on a lot of money and his performances for a long time have been sub-standard.

Other departures may take more time but we need a major rebuild of the squad. In the meantime I''d like to see Neil have the courage to play some younger players in the correct positions rather than his known triers out of position.

We now need some stability. This means the players have to know the present manager is going to be here longer than them and in a decision of him or them it is going to be them that go. Neil appears to be strong enough in this respect. I certainly like his honesty over the performance on Saturday.

I hope supporters will look at this bigger picture and back Neil because it is the character of the Club that needs to be reformed and he at least looks capable of doing that. He also needs to feel secure enough to make bold decisions like playing McGrandles instead of playing safer and putting in Whittaker; that comes from supporter backing.

For me, backing Alex Neil is now the only choice and that means taking a longer term view.

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A long 0ne RH, but I agree with the lot of it.We started the season expecting this squad of players to give us a quick exit from the Championship.We have to come to the conclusion that this now seems increasingly unlikely.We have no stability whatsoever. Managers come and go, coaching staff come and go etc. etc.We became a joke the day that awful McNally individual (whom I firmly bekieve is the artichect of our current malaise) decided to sack the Hoots and put a total rookie in charge of our survival requisites.Since then it has been a gradual, drip, drip decline.Now I envy, and would you believe, the Ipswich model. Decent manager at this level, given time and eventually success has come.McNally is my personal scapegoat.Yes, we have no choice but to get behind Alex Neil, but the omens are not particularly good.I just hope that he is a miracle man (there''s a chance because he stands no shite)For me, it''s McNasty out. I might be a loan voice but I will stick to this conviction.

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[quote user="RUDOLPH HUCKER"]It is unrealistic to expect Alex Neil to walk into Norwich City half way through a season with no Championship experience or knowledge of his squad of players and bring instant success.

He may do, but the odds are heavily stacked against him.

And equally as difficult is expecting a manager to manage players he didn''t himself assemble and one with some imbalances.

The January transfer window only adds to the difficulties with unsettled players and the usual difficulty to bring in good replacements.

The same can be said of the coaching staff.

We have to assume he is up to the job in which case he has to have time, in which case he will be given his real chance over the summer and next season.

But what Neil can do is to deal with attitude and application and I thought his comments were telling on that score. We hope he is a strong character, we sensed he might be and for that reason alone, supporters frustrated with the attitudes they have detected amongst their players, welcomed Neil like a new Messiah from the off.

It isn''t easy to put your finger on but I struggle to think of the last time I saw such a disconnect between Norwich players and supporters. Yes, we moan about the Board but we also know they have stumped up the cash and backed their managers. We complain about the managers but we also know they cannot cross the white line themselves. In particular, we saw Neil Adams as the closest thing to a fan in the manager''s seat and empathised with him as certain players showed him disrespect in various ways. I don''t know but suspect Adams burnt himself out trying to motivate these players.

The sense of all being in it together evaporated last season. You know, the feeling generated by Cambridge Utd fans watching the likes of Nelson and McGeehan striving to achieve or, dare I say it, the sense of teamwork generated Brentford on Saturday.

Some of our players have had the absolute temerity to argue on the pitch or on social media with fans. They don''t see this makes them the problem. On top of that, so called seasoned pro''s have failed to step forward to the extent we have no talisman on the pitch, no leaders, and that must extend to the dressing room.

No wonder Neil wouldn''t criticise the hapless Whittaker, who did as he has asked and gave it his best shot. I notice too he turned to O''Neill very early in his tenure, he is searching for people who will put a shift in and try to do their jobs.

Given time, if Neil is truly a hungry and ambitious young manager he will rid the Club of players who, as a bottom line, threaten his career as they ended Adams and stalled Hughton''s (remember the complacent statements around this time last year from the likes of Howson?)

We will most likely have to wait for this particular ship to be turned around. Forget automatic promotion, we may get a run in the play offs if we are lucky. Most likely we are looking at this league next season.

This brings the question of cash and that means wages. So, get good money for the likes of Olsson; let Redmond develop elsewhere - in fairness to him he will star in a team with two wingers as he won''t be doubled up on all the time. Move Ruddy on. Putting everything else aside he is doubtless on a lot of money and his performances for a long time have been sub-standard.

Other departures may take more time but we need a major rebuild of the squad. In the meantime I''d like to see Neil have the courage to play some younger players in the correct positions rather than his known triers out of position.

We now need some stability. This means the players have to know the present manager is going to be here longer than them and in a decision of him or them it is going to be them that go. Neil appears to be strong enough in this respect. I certainly like his honesty over the performance on Saturday.

I hope supporters will look at this bigger picture and back Neil because it is the character of the Club that needs to be reformed and he at least looks capable of doing that. He also needs to feel secure enough to make bold decisions like playing McGrandles instead of playing safer and putting in Whittaker; that comes from supporter backing.

For me, backing Alex Neil is now the only choice and that means taking a longer term view.
[/quote]It is interesting how the consensus view on the squad seems to have changed - ie has been downgraded - during the season. If this more pessimistic analysis is correct then a couple of points come to mind.Firstly, that Adams. despite not being the outsider that was required, didn''t do such a bad job.Secondly, that the worst kind of appointment we could have made in the summer, or then a few weeks ago, would have been an "experienced" warhorse of the Warnock or Russell Slade variety. Someone who has knocked around the game just a bit too long.We needed, and need now, just the kind of ambitious young outsider Neil seems to be.

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No, I don''t think you are the lone voice Broadstairs. Mr Neil is probably McNally''s last throw of the dice for me. I''ve given him the benefit of the doubt for a long time because of the good things he has achieved, but we seem to be sneaking backwards, slowly but surely.Great OP by the way Rudolph. Restores a bit of faith....

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Great OP, but this has the feeling of all talk at the mo....the truth will be this coming Saturday on the pitch!

I can''t see this as anything more than a steep learning for Neil and should a club like ours really be the training base for a young inexperienced manager?

Hell I''m behind him when it comes to the games, but just have huge doubts in his ability, he''s got no real experience for this level.

Heck a lot of you guys talk of shipping out Murphy to gain experience at lower levels to learn the game, why should that be different to a young manager?

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Seriously its the first time I''ve been in favour of a quick exit for a manager. Nothing was right about Saturday. In fact I think its worse than just a bad day. The team looked like they had had the stuffing knocked out of them from the kick off.

I think the reason could be the last few games they thought they had clicked as a team.m Players were being played to their strength for once and not asked to do alien jobs. It was working, we were scoring goals and winning matches.

Suddenly they are back with a manager that has a fixed idea and asks the players to play their un-natural game, it wasn''t working. Did he change the system at any point? No. We have been here before recently it didn''t work and the football was awful.

Honestly McNally should be on the phone begging Phelan and Adams to return. This is the highest position Alex Neil will ever take Norwich too.

If it continues like this despite the season ticket I can find better things to do on a Saturday afternoon, I don''t think I can go through the crap manager thing yet again. Saturday was way beyond poor, clueless. Players normally want to do well for a new manager, I think he has lost the dressing room already.

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noeyedear wrote the following post at 26/01/2015 11:43 AM:

Seriously its the first time I''ve been in favour of a quick exit for a manager. Nothing was right about Saturday. In fact I think its worse than just a bad day. The team looked like they had had the stuffing knocked out of them from the kick off.

I think the reason could be the last few games they thought they had clicked as a team.m Players were being played to their strength for once and not asked to do alien jobs. It was working, we were scoring goals and winning matches.

Suddenly they are back with a manager that has a fixed idea and asks the players to play their un-natural game, it wasn''t working. Did he change the system at any point? No. We have been here before recently it didn''t work and the football was awful.

Honestly McNally should be on the phone begging Phelan and Adams to return. This is the highest position Alex Neil will ever take Norwich too.

If it continues like this despite the season ticket I can find better things to do on a Saturday afternoon, I don''t think I can go through the *** manager thing yet again. Saturday was way beyond poor, clueless. Players normally want to do well for a new manager, I think he has lost the dressing room already.

The unfortunate thing is that I feel myself agreeing with much of your post.

I don''t want to, I want to be positive and give the manager a fair crack of the whip but, as you said, so much of Saturday seemed wrong, even the post-match interview.

I won''t go as far as wanting a quick exit but I would hope that the board would act sooner rather than later this time if things were not going well.

The appointment has, without doubt, been a massive gamble. Sometimes when you play the odds you get a very good return but not always.

I feel it will be a very difficult match for the manager on Saturday. I hope he comes through it successfully and hope that all my worries are unfounded.

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There is no way the manager wanted to the team to play so that in just the 20th min, not chasing the game, we have possession 25 yards from goal and 3 of his 5 defensive players, 7 players in total, are ahead of the ball.

That is reckless and unprofessional.

Olsson, BJ and Martin were all so far forward that when whits lost possession we only had two defenders. Fine in the 89th minute - but at 0-0???

If BJ (the deep one i the 4141) stays disciplined he covers the break and slows it down, if either Olsson or Martin stays back the cbs can address the break more effectively. Either way their chance to score from a possession loss is hugely minimised.

To make matters worse their goalscorer is level with Olsson when whits loses it; by is nowhere to be seen when Jota collects the ball on our box - did he really outpace Olsson?? Our nearest player is the much criticised Lafferty - once again covering for our left back on leave. Or is that a left winger who finds defending an inconvenince yet is so attackingly excellent that has fewer assists than either of the derided right backs and the same number as garrido despite many more starts??

Neil did make mistakes - but I dont accept that he set them out to play that incompetently on sat. That first goal highlights why we have problems - our so called best uncriticisable players showing lack of desire, discipline, responsibility and team work. Martin, Olsson & BJ repeated those mistakes time and again on sat, as they have all season. Can they explain their actions? Or simply recognise their incompetence?

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Thanks for the replies, some very good points on AN from both camps. I guess the truth is we don''t know enough about him yet although he has certainly made mistakes or shown a lack of conviction in horses for courses IMO. That said, he is surely right that the side we put out Saturday was on paper more than good enough.

I was surprised at the timing of Adams departure. The long layoff he has taken suggests burn out to me but he didn''t do a bad job with this bunch of egos. I think this has been recognised by supporters.

Neil will benefit from having his coach here. He also seems to have the humility to go with the ambition and grit so let''s hope he is the character we need.

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It''s early days but this post for me has the potential to be post of the year. Mainly because I agree with all of it! Something has been missing in the deepest depths and spirit of our club. I think you are correct that the ever hard working Adams was probably burnt out. He could see some of the complacency we all saw. And as a player and commentator he was never someone to accept complacency ....not that kind of person.

I think we are looking at a full-ish rebuild. Take the £14m we may get for Redmond and Olsson. Clear out those players at the end of the season who think they are greater than the club and feel we are below them.....we badly need players like Bentford''s.....but maybe there are some current players who AN recognises are willing to work hard for the soul of our club and they have a future. I cannot tell who they are. But I do see some spirit missing on the field. I agree about the lack of spirit on the pitch evidenced by the poor body language and social media commentary. I cannot stand hearing from players anymore, what they need to do, how it''s only one match etc etc. ....prefer them to say nowt and realise they are privileged beyond maybe 99% of us fans.

Neil has been handed an attractive proposition in taking on a club lying 7th but his appointment is an odd one. In so many ways he could be on a hiding. But I agree with RH in that we have to stick with him, get fully behind him ( as I did Adams), I also agree with building on youth, McGrandles, Murphys, the lad loaned at Swindon, McGeehan, Toffolo etc. mix with people like O''Neil, Jerome. Plus we bring in two or more solid performers. We should also promote Rudd.

I read Highland''s view that this may mean we suffer and I do agree that the lowering parachute money means we could be less competitive. But for me, we start again and set a new platform to build upon for the Premiership.

This year was always going to be difficult. The Championship though is the best league for me. It''s mostly honest and hasn''t got huge benefactors simply buying who they want from the world''s shopping list and effectively buying success. League 1 is the same. But this is no ''little Norwich'' mentality because I want us to compete like Southampton in the Premiership. They have done it like we did in the early 90s. We can do it again. Relegation was something that happened but what an opportunity we missed.

Birmingham will be interesting. But I predict a solid defeat I''m afraid. They are another team re building after a tough time. This ''malaise phase'' is something we are just starting to see and we need renewal.

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he has zero percentage win average with Norwich.

Saturday was the first Alex Neil team, the rest was Adams and Phelan. Saturday was the first outing for AN''s strategy and style.

Punt and run was about all there was on offer.

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Please someone point at one thing on Saturday that makes you think AN has a clue about the players or championship football. Show me where he is not a very large step back from Adams?

The Man or Woman that sits next to you every Saturday , would they of put that team out in those positions, would you clearly demotivate a team before kick off? Would you have a plan B if your wild plan A was not working.

We had just found winning ways and then some idiot comes in and changes the game and he wonders why the players lacked enthusiasm.

You only change a losing game. Of course the players had no heart, they are having to take orders from someone way out of their depth that has little idea. Then he comes on the media and tells them its all their fault. This guy will make Roeder look like a good idea.

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With basically all players available Adams put a flat 442 made up of all centre midfielders without playing the diamond, a flat midfield against Wigan away. The tactics were hoofball (obviously with that lineup), but the difference was that the team showed a bit of desire against a really poor Wigan team and won, just.

Alex Neil had no centre midfield options, no centre back options, with a man down on his back room staff (who''s coming in this week). Against a team who are much better than wigan and are firmly in the play-offs, above us, still.

Yes everyone was poor last game from the manager to the players to the fans. But it''s one game, I could perhaps give you the benefit of the doubt if this was next week against Birmingham but it''s not, it''s his first game more or less, in very difficult circumstances. The fact is, the jury is out.

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I think this goes to my point that for our club one season down for the prem and still in touching distance we cannot be talking about selling and rebuilding for next season. What type of nonsense is that, we have average players, but they are senior and have experience. What AN needs to do is win the big 6 pointers and beat the lower teams such as brum.

We can still achieve promotion, but cannot rest on our laurels, we need new players in ASAP that can walk into our first team and have quality.

Some of our fans have thrown in the towel completely. I did not agree with Neil adams, he was here too long, we did not shape the new squad enough in the summer and should have sold some players

o''neill is a better player than johnson

AN is an unknown but he cannot rest, this season is Not yet over but it can be very quickly if he does not get the lads playing well immediately and new additions join the group.

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I agree with this.

 

Saturday was frustrating . It was also a wake up call for anyone who thought that we would stroll the Championship.  But the main factors were:

 

Injuries. Whilst we all rubbed our eyes in disbelief when we saw the line up, it isn’t immediately apparent what else we could do. Yes we could have played 3 central defenders, but 2 get in each others way, and 3 would probably have resembled the KeyStone Cops.  Personally I would have played Whittaker left back with Olsson in front.  I’ve seen enough of Wes on the left of a four to know it doesn’t work.

 

Time. I suspect that the injuries were timed as such that complete change of formation (three at the back, diamonds etc) could not be imposed by a new manager .

 

Whittaker. Didn’t want to play there, did his best, but was awful. Reminded me of a performance many moons ago when Chris Llewellyn ended up as a right back , and looked like a rabbit in the headlights.  Whittaker is limited in the extreme and wouldn’t get in my squad let alone first XI

 

Brentford. They were excellent. And their coach outthought our coach from the first minute.  Their 16 sat in the area stopping Martin coming forward . They had clearly watched the video / pro zone from last weeks game.  They also held the highest line I’ve seen all year, not for them defending the 18 yard box, but significantly higher. Cue an inordinate amount of Offsides.

 

Phelan. Well it didn’t help did it?

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