The 'Novice'

[morty 0]

[quote user="Lessingham Canary"]Morty wrote; No, it won''t. But its a very fine line.

I wonder what the general mood would have been here today, had we only come away with a point?

Im sure you would agree the managers job is to set the team up, to play the way he wants them to, last couple of games (even when no midfield available) I could see a difference in the way the team was set up and they way they were being asked to play, and it looks much better, and will only improve in time as the players adjust, however once the players cross that white line its down to them, and in the main they did that last night, contrary to general feeling on this site we don''t have the best or strongest squad in the league, we may well be blessed with a decent sized squad that is strong in many area''s, but this is the same squad apart from one addition we had at the start of the season.

If the players carry on as they did last night, in the main, and as they did at home to Blackpool and away at Brum then we can mount a serious challenge,

There will be great highs ahead as we storm towards the end of the season, and probably a few lows, but give our new manager a dozen games before we question what he is about. If we only had come away with a point last night, I would have blamed the players, and before I get slated, I wont run down individuals, but one or two were poor in the second half, following on from the best 45 minutes from a Norwich side in a long time, poss Spurs at home was last?[/quote]I''m not criticising him, but for example the bringing on of Hoolahan was a risk. Yes he provided an assist for the goal, but he also gave the ball away at least 4 times before he did so.I think last night, when placed next to Saturdays result shows the remaining fragility / concentration problems that remain within the squad.We got away with taking our foot off the gas on Saturday, we almost didn''t last night.We really could do with another, good quality, midfielder in on loan. Or get Andreu up to speed / Vadis fit. We need solid options to close games out.

[Lessingham Canary 99]

Morty, I don''t think you were criticising him, your posts are generally very constructive, I agree on the midfielder, I think the fact that Andreu did not come on last night suggests the manager is not convinced he is up to speed with the level required in this league yet, I do hope Dorrans comes and offers something different, and we get a new paitr of boots for Olsson so he doesn''t keep ending up on his backside !

[morty 0]

[quote user="Lessingham Canary"]Morty, I don''t think you were criticising him, your posts are generally very constructive, I agree on the midfielder, I think the fact that Andreu did not come on last night suggests the manager is not convinced he is up to speed with the level required in this league yet, I do hope Dorrans comes and offers something different, and we get a new paitr of boots for Olsson so he doesn''t keep ending up on his backside ![/quote]Like I say, fine lines.2-1 down away from what do you do?Bring someone on to close the game out and go home with 3 points, or push for another goal?He got away with it a bit last night I think, and depending on which way you want to pitch it he was either "ballsy" or "slightly naive"But hey ho, it worked, thats all that really matters.We really could have done with Gary Oneill last night.

[kantata soul 0]

[quote user="morty"]We really could do with another, good quality, midfielder in on loan. Or get Andreu up to speed / Vadis fit. We need solid options to close games out.[/quote]Yep, midfield is still the problem area. We need to be able to hold onto the ball in order to soak up pressure just as much as we need to be able to attack. At the moment the only real improvement we''ve seen is being a bit more organised and a bit tighter.I can''t fault the need to tighten up in order to try and squeeze into the playoffs, but longer term we''ll need a lot more than that. My fear is that Alex Neil doesn''t have the ability to produce what''s required.

[morty 0]

[quote user="kantata soul"][quote user="morty"]We really could do with another, good quality, midfielder in on loan. Or get Andreu up to speed / Vadis fit. We need solid options to close games out.[/quote]Yep, midfield is still the problem area. We need to be able to hold onto the ball in order to soak up pressure just as much as we need to be able to attack. At the moment the only real improvement we''ve seen is being a bit more organised and a bit tighter.I can''t fault the need to tighten up in order to try and squeeze into the playoffs, but longer term we''ll need a lot more than that. My fear is that Alex Neil doesn''t have the ability to produce what''s required.[/quote]And one of the main issues is that we seem to have players that are unable to do both, its either one, or the other.The closest thing we have had to a dominant midfielder in recent times is Fer, and he was far from perfect.

[Ray 111]

LDC,

I tend to agree, he could''ve done nothing but he took the decision to get involved and once that decision was made he simply had to make the next ones to maintain face.

Does he do what Phelan & co suggest or what has been suggested elsewhere, or something else altogether? Ultimately he chose the elsewhere but it was his decision. I guess having become visibly involved had it back fired then he really couldn''t have hidden behind "Nothing to do with me gov."

Re it being the easy thing to do, strictly speaking it was the easy thing to do for him, the harder thing to do would have been to do nothing, it reminds me of a story I once heard about a mountaineer, when interviewed after climbing Everest. He said he took the easy route, the interviewer said there is no easy route to the top of Everest, to which the mountaineer replied, every route to the top is easy for me, the difficult route would have been to stay at base camp.

[lake district canary 4,531]

[quote user="Ray"]LDC,

I tend to agree, he could''ve done nothing but he took the decision to get involved and once that decision was made he simply had to make the next ones to maintain face.

Does he do what Phelan & co suggest or what has been suggested elsewhere, or something else altogether? Ultimately he chose the elsewhere but it was his decision. I guess having become visibly involved had it back fired then he really couldn''t have hidden behind "Nothing to do with me gov."

Re it being the easy thing to do, strictly speaking it was the easy thing to do for him, the harder thing to do would have been to do nothing, it reminds me of a story I once heard about a mountaineer, when interviewed after climbing Everest. He said he took the easy route, the interviewer said there is no easy route to the top of Everest, to which the mountaineer replied, every route to the top is easy for me, the difficult route would have been to stay at base camp.[/quote]

[:D]  Good point, I understand that very well! 

[kantata soul 0]

[quote user="morty"][quote user="kantata soul"][quote user="morty"]We really could do with another, good quality, midfielder in on loan. Or get Andreu up to speed / Vadis fit. We need solid options to close games out.[/quote]Yep, midfield is still the problem area. We need to be able to hold onto the ball in order to soak up pressure just as much as we need to be able to attack. At the moment the only real improvement we''ve seen is being a bit more organised and a bit tighter.I can''t fault the need to tighten up in order to try and squeeze into the playoffs, but longer term we''ll need a lot more than that. My fear is that Alex Neil doesn''t have the ability to produce what''s required.[/quote]And one of the main issues is that we seem to have players that are unable to do both, its either one, or the other.The closest thing we have had to a dominant midfielder in recent times is Fer, and he was far from perfect.[/quote]Fer certainly had that ability, but the hardest bit is being able to get the whole team to hold onto the ball. We''ve often been found wanting when the ball goes backwards but gets knocked long instead of getting passed forwards again.

[morty 0]

[quote user="kantata soul"][quote user="morty"][quote user="kantata soul"][quote user="morty"]We really could do with another, good quality, midfielder in on loan. Or get Andreu up to speed / Vadis fit. We need solid options to close games out.[/quote]Yep, midfield is still the problem area. We need to be able to hold onto the ball in order to soak up pressure just as much as we need to be able to attack. At the moment the only real improvement we''ve seen is being a bit more organised and a bit tighter.I can''t fault the need to tighten up in order to try and squeeze into the playoffs, but longer term we''ll need a lot more than that. My fear is that Alex Neil doesn''t have the ability to produce what''s required.[/quote]And one of the main issues is that we seem to have players that are unable to do both, its either one, or the other.The closest thing we have had to a dominant midfielder in recent times is Fer, and he was far from perfect.[/quote]Fer certainly had that ability, but the hardest bit is being able to get the whole team to hold onto the ball. We''ve often been found wanting when the ball goes backwards but gets knocked long instead of getting passed forwards again.[/quote]Sloppy, sideways passes are what killed us last night.Its an indecision it seems. The players thinking "Sh1t, what do we do here, stick or bust?"And the finger could easily be pointed at the lack of a good leader on the pitch, with a footballing brain.Oneill being a good example of the kind of player we needed last night.

[Ray 111]

Morty,

"Sloppy sideways passes are what killed us" The main point being the ''sloppy'' bit, sideways is OK if you keep the ball and are 2 - 0 up. The sloppy comes from the individual player, nothing really to do with the Manager or Captain, if they have to be told to concentrate for 90 mins, then perhaps they shouldn''t be in the team!

"What do we do here stick or bust", if they didn''t know that before they went on the pitch then there is something wrong. Surely overall startegy has been discussed.

"Lack of a good leader with a footballing brain", I refer to to the Bournemouth scenerio I posted about earlier and ''a plan from elsewhere''. Pretty certain our current captain has a footballing brain, that said O''Neil would be an addition we could do with, but who goes? Tettey?

[Reggie Strayshun 0]

It seems to me that it is indeed individual errors(as opposed to poor team selection/tactics) that is costing us. OK in the end it did not cost us last night, but, sure as hell, it does have the potential to cost us. Big time.Whilst it''s never possible to cut out these errors 100%, it surely does say something about the standard of coaching over the past few months that we do seem to make the same sloppy errors time after time. You do not have to read too far between the lines to know that this is something of an Alex Neil pet hate, and that he sees it as something of a priority to rectify. Time will tell.

[morty 0]

[quote user="Ray"]Morty,

"Sloppy sideways passes are what killed us" The main point being the ''sloppy'' bit, sideways is OK if you keep the ball and are 2 - 0 up. The sloppy comes from the individual player, nothing really to do with the Manager or Captain, if they have to be told to concentrate for 90 mins, then perhaps they shouldn''t be in the team!

"What do we do here stick or bust", if they didn''t know that before they went on the pitch then there is something wrong. Surely overall startegy has been discussed.

"Lack of a good leader with a footballing brain", I refer to to the Bournemouth scenerio I posted about earlier and ''a plan from elsewhere''. Pretty certain our current captain has a footballing brain, that said O''Neil would be an addition we could do with, but who goes? Tettey?[/quote]Re your last point, I wasn''t necessarily advocating shoehorning Oneill in purely for certain qualities, but I feel he is the type of player who would have been handy to bring on, when Charlton brought it back to 2-1. A steadying, experienced influence.

[Ray 111]

Morty,

Agree with your point and at times I could do with a ''steadying influence'' not sure O''Neil would be the best protagonist in my case though!!!!

[Shyster 0]

Well, what a clusterf*ck of a thread this turned out to be.

Nobody questioning Adams & Phelan''s resignations and if their actions were justified or even f*cking necessary, just a bunch of the ultra-naive counter-argument.

Don''t ever question why the majority of you wound up with menial jobs with just enough to cover the season ticket and maybe a home shirt at the beginning of a season.

[hogesar 9,615]

[quote user="morty"][quote user="Lessingham Canary"]Morty, I don''t think you were criticising him, your posts are generally very constructive, I agree on the midfielder, I think the fact that Andreu did not come on last night suggests the manager is not convinced he is up to speed with the level required in this league yet, I do hope Dorrans comes and offers something different, and we get a new paitr of boots for Olsson so he doesn''t keep ending up on his backside ![/quote]Like I say, fine lines.2-1 down away from what do you do?Bring someone on to close the game out and go home with 3 points, or push for another goal?He got away with it a bit last night I think, and depending on which way you want to pitch it he was either "ballsy" or "slightly naive"But hey ho, it worked, thats all that really matters.We really could have done with Gary Oneill last night.[/quote]

I think your O''neil point is incredibly valid, but I think most people are missing the point. I think it''s more the players we had available made his mind up to be ''ballsy'' as you put it, and take the risk. Because we didn''t have a good solid DM on the bench to help close the game out, Hoolahan was probably the next best option as he''ll press high up the pitch and hopefully relieve some of the pressure on the midfield and defence. Yes, he gave the ball away a few times. Oddly enough so did Tettey (who also missed a crucial challenge in the build up to one of their goals) but he seems to escape that criticism.

In the end, it was Hoolahan with yet another assist this season which saved us the points, so nothing to be unhappy about!

[morty 0]

[quote user="hogesar"][quote user="morty"][quote user="Lessingham Canary"]Morty, I don''t think you were criticising him, your posts are generally very constructive, I agree on the midfielder, I think the fact that Andreu did not come on last night suggests the manager is not convinced he is up to speed with the level required in this league yet, I do hope Dorrans comes and offers something different, and we get a new paitr of boots for Olsson so he doesn''t keep ending up on his backside ![/quote]Like I say, fine lines.2-1 down away from what do you do?Bring someone on to close the game out and go home with 3 points, or push for another goal?He got away with it a bit last night I think, and depending on which way you want to pitch it he was either "ballsy" or "slightly naive"But hey ho, it worked, thats all that really matters.We really could have done with Gary Oneill last night.[/quote]

I think your O''neil point is incredibly valid, but I think most people are missing the point. I think it''s more the players we had available made his mind up to be ''ballsy'' as you put it, and take the risk. Because we didn''t have a good solid DM on the bench to help close the game out, Hoolahan was probably the next best option as he''ll press high up the pitch and hopefully relieve some of the pressure on the midfield and defence. Yes, he gave the ball away a few times. Oddly enough so did Tettey (who also missed a crucial challenge in the build up to one of their goals) but he seems to escape that criticism.

In the end, it was Hoolahan with yet another assist this season which saved us the points, so nothing to be unhappy about!

[/quote]Not unhappy in the slightest. Like you say, he had little choice, due to players available.But I''ll be interested to see what happens when he does have a few options available.

[Lessingham Canary 99]

I think once AN has had 12-14 games we will know if the use of the word novice is the correct one to describe him, a full compliment of players at his disposal and then we will see the whole picture. In the meantime we are not in a bad position considering the ups and downs of this season so far, never straight forward being a football fan, especially if your team are yellow and green!

[DundeeFc 0]

Hardly a novice you get a good laugh reading some of the forum experts on here lol..it''s funny how you write off Scottish football but have no clue about the teams in the league lol..it''s like saying i hate golf but I''ve never watched it I just assume its crxxp because it looks boring

[lake district canary 4,531]

[quote user="DundeeFc"]Hardly a novice you get a good laugh reading some of the forum experts on here lol..it''s funny how you write off Scottish football but have no clue about the teams in the league lol..it''s like saying i hate golf but I''ve never watched it I just assume its crxxp because it looks boring[/quote]

Its worse than that. Some of our fans think that Norwich is the centre of the known world and that anything or anyone outside the ring road could not possibly be any good.  Also, to some of them, anyone that leaves Norwich is either mad or stupid, or both.  I''d ignore it. They make a noise, but say very little.  Imo most of our fans know that although he was a bit of an unknown quantity, we have a manager who has achieved real success already and who in four weeks has made an  impact in the way we all regard our football club - still improvements to make of course, but the signs are good.

Calling AN "novice" is insulting and inaccurate, but then if you were familiar with the original poster, you wouldn''t be surprised........... 

[Katie Borkins 1]

[quote user="lake district canary"]Also, to some of them, anyone that leaves Norwich is either mad or stupid, or both.  I''d ignore it.[/quote]

Well you would say that, wouldn''t you?

[quote user="lake district canary"]They make a noise, but say very little. [/quote]

Unlike your manifold threads....

[quote user="lake district canary"]Calling AN "novice" is insulting and inaccurate, but then if you were familiar with the original poster, you wouldn''t be surprised...........  [/quote]

Shyster is a Pink Un legend.  A narcissistic, allegedly self-made catering "millionaire" who is Tory to his bones, slightly misogynistic and utterly politically incorrect.  By rights I should despise him, but I''m really quite fond of him.

[DundeeFc 0]

With the amount of money being spent in the English top league if you do get promoted how can you compete with the giants up there ? You would need to spend millions on over paid money grabbers to compete.i actually feel sorry for championship teams

[lake district canary 4,531]

[quote user="Bor Bor Bor"][quote user="lake district canary"]Also, to some of them, anyone that leaves Norwich is either mad or stupid, or both.  I''d ignore it.[/quote]

Well you would say that, wouldn''t you?

[/quote]

Yes - and most of the guff aimed at exiles is from

narrow minded parochial single brain cell fans who can''t see past their

noses, let alone the ring road.

[morty 0]

And you maintain that you don''t intentionally court abuse?Brilliant[:D]

[Katie Borkins 1]

Moving away hasn''t done much for you...

[lake district canary 4,531]

[quote user="Bor Bor Bor"]Moving away hasn''t done much for you...[/quote]

Maybe it has, maybe it hasn''t.........but my singular or multiple brain cells tell me that one of the things that makes this board so unpleasant, is those that think they are better because either they are season ticket holders or live in Norwich itself - and then try to push that false superiority on to exiles or to any one that they think isn''t worthy.    There aren''t many of them, but they spoil things for exiles on here.

Nutty Nigel has already said it today - we are all supporters and should be as one.  

He has a point. 

[Mr Jenkins 0]

Fans that go to games are undoubtedly superior.

That''s what fans do, they go to games!

[lake district canary 4,531]

[quote user="Mr Jenkins"]Fans that go to games are undoubtedly superior.

That''s what fans do, they go to games![/quote]

And there we have it in one.  

So an 85 year old man who has been a season ticket holder since 1946 and who can no longer get to games is less worthy, or someone who used to go every week but can''t any more through illness is a less worthy supporter, or a season ticket holder for twenty years who has had to move abroad to find work is less worthy?

If you feel superior because you go to matches every week, I think you are living in too small a world.  The only feeling you should have if you are able to go every week is one of gratefulness that you are able to - and is another reason why people who go to matches should learn to enjoy it more and express it in making more noise.   There are hundreds and thousands of supporters throughout the world who would relish the chamce of going to CR every week but are no longer able.  

The responsibility is with you lot that go every week. You cheer for us at the ground, you represent footballing communtity that is Norwich City - and you should realise you are part of a bigger picture that doesn''t stop outside the ground.   Superior my ar*e. Some of you on here that act superior because you go to matches every week are utterly deluded.  Have some humility and recognise that all fans are of equal value, whatever their circumstance, from the 85 year old who can no longer go, the 45 year old who has to work overseas, or the 20 year old unemployed who would love to go every week but can''t afford it. 

Think you''re superior? If you think that - "parochial single brain cell narrow minded" fits much better.  Imo.

[morty 0]

[:D]

[Mr Jenkins 0]

Bor Bor Bor wrote the following post at 13/02/2015 7:32 PM:

Jimmy Smith wrote:

So he''s unlikely to feature prominently this season now? He''s been "a week away" for about 2 months now and then this? Thing is, he''s played plenty of football (Under 21''s, Chicago Fire) so he must have a level of fitness back. Just what is the deal here?

He''s dead.

We had to free up a couple of squad places so Alex Neil could bring in some mediocre Jocks.

Colney was turned into a rugged forest wasteland. McNally is a big fan of "The Hunger Games". You may note we haven''t seen Garrido for some time either.

Look, I can''t say too much on a private forum so PM me if you want to know more.

My initial reaction is that somebody has an inferiority complex!😄

[Katie Borkins 1]

Sorry Lakey, but you are contradicting yourself.

You say it is important for supporters to attend and get behind the team and show support. This helps the team perform better in a positive atmosphere.

By definition then, if you are not able to attend to support the team then you are less useful to the team as a supporter.

I suspect you realise this, and all your repeated lecturing and sermonising is merely a subconscious response to your own irrelevance.