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simmo_2

Crystal Palace & West Bromwich Albion

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Have learnt from the mistakes made by NCFC last season and not waited to get relegated before sacking the manager.

Have NCFC learned anything?

Are the youth team managers on standby!

(I doubt it)

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Interview on the today program with Chris Hughton this morning, said he was interested in the West Brom and Brighton jobs. He said that when you have been out of a job as long as he has you would be interested in a job like the Brighton one ( hope I haven''t miss quoted him there, I'' m sure I will be corrected if I''m wrong) and also he was interested in West Brom.

I get the impression he has been looking for work as a manager but nothing has come along.

Interestingly this interview was linked to the the work he is now doing on increasing BME representation as managers and also increasing BME representation in the Board room.

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[quote user="Jenkins"]Interview on the today program with Chris Hughton this morning, said he was interested in the West Brom and Brighton jobs. He said that when you have been out of a job as long as he has you would be interested in a job like the Brighton one ( hope I haven''t miss quoted him there, I'' m sure I will be corrected if I''m wrong) and also he was interested in West Brom.

I get the impression he has been looking for work as a manager but nothing has come along.

Interestingly this interview was linked to the the work he is now doing on increasing BME representation as managers and also increasing BME representation in the Board room.[/quote]

He will use the BME representative card to try and get a sympathy vote for another managers position, though he is far to weak to manage a football club but I think he could have a good media career as he is well liked by many.

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I see where you''re coming from and I think deep down that summed up my initial feelings when I heard the interview.

I think that is being unfair to him though, if he is out of work then he needs to do something and he has been moderately politically active in the past so his campaign here, if that''s what it is, is not out of character.

And I am sure he genuinly feels that there is prejudice against black managers, if you look at the fact there are 3 black managers and yet the playing population of the football league is around 25% he has a point.

However, if he has struggled to find work as a manager then my opinion is that is based on whether potential employers think he can do a good footballing job for them.

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[quote user="Jenkins"]I see where you''re coming from and I think deep down that summed up my initial feelings when I heard the interview.

I think that is being unfair to him though, if he is out of work then he needs to do something and he has been moderately politically active in the past so his campaign here, if that''s what it is, is not out of character.

And I am sure he genuinly feels that there is prejudice against black managers, if you look at the fact there are 3 black managers and yet the playing population of the football league is around 25% he has a point.

However, if he has struggled to find work as a manager then my opinion is that is based on whether potential employers think he can do a good footballing job for them.[/quote]

I agree, the risk maybe to great.

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[quote user="simmo_2"]Have learnt from the mistakes made by NCFC last season and not waited to get relegated before sacking the manager.

Have NCFC learned anything?

Are the youth team managers on standby!

(I doubt it)[/quote]

Apparently Peter Beardsley, the development team manager, is being considered.

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Indeed simmo, it''s an interesting one, I was very unhappy with him when he was here and certainly wanted him gone well before he went.

If you look at cv though, I think most would agree he had a pretty good record on paper before we appointed him, our position in the Prem at the end of his first season here will also look good, so I wonder how much the circumstances around his sacking from City has actually damaged him, quite a lot it would seem.

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[quote user="SwindonCanary"]It doesn''t look as if there''s a youth team manager in the running but favorite for next Newcastle manager is Fabricio Coloccini  ![/quote]Did you see Jamie Carraghers face on Monday night football, when he was told about Coloccini?Brilliant[:D]

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"And lo, there was much wailing and gnashing of teeth on the Pink ''Un"[url]http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/30632865[/url]

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I for one hope the managerial merry-go-round ends with Eddie Howe, Mick McCarthy, Steve McLaren all being poached from their current jobs.

It will weaken our competitors for promotion, and even linking and speculation may be unsettling, which can only help us

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[quote user="simmo_2"]Have learnt from the mistakes made by NCFC last season and not waited to get relegated before sacking the manager.

Have NCFC learned anything?

Are the youth team managers on standby!

(I doubt it)[/quote]

Although.... Fulham and Cardiff had both replaced their managers by now..... so are they repeating their mistakes?

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Well, they''ve not proved anything by changing their manager. They''ve both gambled.
The proof is in the pudding. If they stay up at the end of the season then fair play. If they don''t, it was pointless.

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[quote user="hogesar"]Well, they''ve not proved anything by changing their manager. They''ve both gambled.
The proof is in the pudding. If they stay up at the end of the season then fair play. If they don''t, it was pointless.
[/quote]Yesterday on Skysportsnews they showed a graphic showing how usually WBA stayed up when they changed manager and were relegated when they continued with the same manager. I think the wba board saw this and made their move.

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If you change manager and stay up it looks great.  If you go down well at least you gave it go, you would only change if the manager is on a downward cycle so I can’t really see the reason for sticking when the stakes are so high.

Bigger clubs can stick with a manger longer as they are not in a position where they will go down.  But for clubs like Sunderland, West Brom, Palace might as well change as survival and short term is all that matter.

It looks ridiculous if you go down and haven’t tried to change things.  We stuck with Hughton on a downward spiral, we didn’t even invest in the team in January so we literally did nothing and hoped for the best.  Easy to say in retrospect.

What gets me is that we don’t seem to have learnt our lesson.  Adams seems capable of stringing a few good results together, followed by some terrible ones.  The result is upper mid table.  Play offs at best, but would you (at this current time) trust him to name a team and tactics to beat a team over two games, let alone in the final. 

Sometimes a change is necessary just to shake things up and give yourself the best chance.   

 

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Their is one big difference between Palace. WBA and most Prem teams & Norwich

They are all run on a business basis with the aim of achieving the maximum possible as far as league placings go

We are owned by Delia (62%) - we have paid off all our debt (lost Lambert on the back of paying debt off early) and she can continue to enjoy her Saturday afternoon football (she not bothered which league - her stated aim is to remain debt free) without having to put her hand in her pocket

Thats the bottom line

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For the benefit of the neanderthals and those that think money grows on trees, it needs to be pointed out that staying debt free is one of the main requirements for a successful ongoing football club.  Ever since year dot, Norwich has been a smaller club in relation to many of the other clubs and we have punched above our weight over many of  the years since 1972.   Trying to develop the club has been hamstrung by debt over those years and since the onset of the premiership and the explosion in player wages, it has made it even harder to compete.    But we''ve still had some great years, with of course the usual ups and downs.  Right up to Lambert, money was a problem - and he should really receive the freedom of Norwich for what he (and Grant Holt) did for our club.  Thanks to the quick rise, we are now one of the financially most stable clubs in the country.  You risk that at your peril.

Success on the pitch is harder.  Keeping or getting rid of a manager mid-season is a lottery.  Our board chose to keep Hughton. They live with that decision and that is fine, it was their decision to make.  They also chose Adams and they have to hope he delivers at least the play-offs now.  Personally couldn''t give a t*ss what other clubs do - sometimes decisions seems bizarre whether a club gets rid or keeps a manager too long - look at Wenger (if you can bear it).....he could have been moved many times but he is still there, despite relative lack of success for such a well off club. 

We have Adams now and it is pretty plain he is staying.  I don''t like it, but with Phelan it could work. So now I''ll say the same as I said last season - criticise the manager by all means, but for the sake of the club we have to stop calling for his head.    It didn''t do any good last season and it won''t do any good this.   I called time up for Hughton last November after that week in Manchester, but after that and once it was plain the board were going to stick with him I tried to see the possible positives and stuck with it.  We have to stick with Adams.There. I''ve said it.

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I disagree, being debt free is great. But surely a club is better of being £10 – £20m in debt and staying in the prem.  If we had spent last Christmas perhaps we would have stayed up.   Im talking about a small amount in the grant scheme of things, not risking the whole club, manageable debt.  Its risky but I think worth it.

I also disagree that people are calling for the manager’s head, some are obviously, but the support is not united in this.  The main problem seems to be people are split.  Same happened last year; we would win one and hope that we had turned a corner. But that never happened and time ran out.  The indecision cost us, and that pattern seems to be repeating itself.  The last two home games wee great, but now after a dismal display it all seem like another false dawn. 

 

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[quote user="lake district canary"]look at Wenger (if you can bear it).....he could have been moved many times but he is still there, despite relative lack of success for such a well off club.  [/quote]

The reason Arsenal is well off is infact Wenger. In economic ways he has transformed the club, and managed carefully while Arsenal repaid their debts from building Emirates.

He is perhaps a bit too careful and stubborn at times, but his success off the field is fantastic

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[quote user="grefstad"][quote user="lake district canary"]look at Wenger (if you can bear it).....he could have been moved many times but he is still there, despite relative lack of success for such a well off club.  [/quote]

The reason Arsenal is well off is in fact Wenger. In economic ways he has transformed the club, and managed carefully while Arsenal repaid their debts from building Emirates.

He is perhaps a bit too careful and stubborn at times, but his success off the field is fantastic[/quote]

My argument was that he has stayed despite relative lack of success on the field, not off it.    Stability and financial well being is the most important thing for that club - and us.   Anyway I doubt many Arsenal fans are happy at the price of season tickets/tickets there......its them that''s paying for the Emirates. 

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In terms of being debt free we''ll see how that looks when the parachute payments disappear.Palace, WBA and Newcastle for that matter have learnt nothing for that matter.

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[quote user="Newton"]

 We are owned by Delia (62%)

 [/quote]

Delia & MWJ jointly hold 53% of the shareholding.

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We are owned by Delia (62%) - we have paid off all our debt (lost Lambert on the back of paying debt off early) and she can continue to enjoy her Saturday afternoon football (she not bothered which league - her stated aim is to remain debt free) without having to put her hand in her pocket

Let''s get this straight, the only reason we stayed out of administration in League one was that we had to agre to pay back the whole of the debt if reached the Premier & stayed up for a second season. We had to pay the debt, the board did not as you say chose to pay it back early.

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Er Tilly are you asking me or Boring boring for the source. Mine would be the Shareholders meetings where they explained why we had to pay the debt when we did. It''s also the first time in over 60 years I''ve been accused of being a binner, usually I''m down as a happy clapper.

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