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Canary On The Wire

The Wire Report: Blackpool 1-3 Norwich City

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Thought it was pretty obvious Joanna. We showed aspects of bad and good as underlined there. But by and large we weren''t very good. Second half saved us again. Thanks to those who appreciate the report. I only report on games I have watched.

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[quote user="splutcho"]Improved match report:

We weren''t very good, then it was half time, then they kicked it in our goal, then we were a bit better, then they did a header in their own goal and then luckily we kicked it in their goal two more times and then we won.

Only one paragraph and no cliches! Everybody wins. I think.[/quote]spot onand City certainly don''t use the mumbo jumbo you talk ofthey are collated by those who know there are enough saddos with mild aspergers who will pull themselves silly reading them to have any meaning they would have to factor in all the variables - something by it''s nature would be nigh on impossible to do (however even that fact is slowly beginning to penetrate the fog of dimness that swirls round your posts)as to this absurd twaddle"that the likes of Olsson and Redmond had to make obvious runs forward at

which point the threat from wide sticks out like a sore thumb."
as opposed to a run forward that is not obvious ... shrouded in a Harry Potter cloak of invincibility I supposeor"Who knows how many joyous City wins a brief study of heat maps for an

opposition full-back has yielded for those who only care about the

romance of the game?"

I have not the slightest clue what a heat map is, though I suspect it may well be something akin to lay lines or celestial orbits. I don''t doubt that all this stuff provides you with many hours of satisfaction but whether it has any relevance to the game of football  or how it is played is another matter. I further suspect it has the same relationship to football that train spotting has to running a railway or driving a locomotive.

If I have told you how it is, in a blunt fashion then perhaps that is for the best - rather than the condescention from those who are too polite to tell you that this stuff comes across as lunacy on stilts.

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[quote user="Herman "] "I have not the slightest clue...."

At last,we get to the problem.[/quote]blimey, old misery guts is going to tell us all about ''heat maps''

so sit quietly children and listen

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Why don''t you go do one you patronising old sod.....if you don''t like the report don''t bother commenting on this thread or forum and as for the rest of us so called "children, simpletons, binners or other insults you appear to throw at city fans because we can''t be arsed to be so high and mighty as you, you fishing troll....bog off to the ippo forum and report on you''re favourite team as you know so much on them. It''s the only time you contribute anything to this forum is regarding the binners.....makes me laugh, you have nothing but insults to fellow canaries.

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Where does he mention heat maps in the match report?

P.s a heat map is a bit of software telling you where a player has spent most of his time during a game,for example. I could get a bit more technical but i really can''t be bothered to google.

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err, you only contribute about ''you''re favourite team'' or I am posting on this thread............... which is not about the binners

as you have grasped this is a forum, where what you post up is replied toif you don''t like my replies then why not take your own advice

ps as to your suggestion of me being old that may only be from your perception ............. which appears to be from someone at primary school

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Opinions are generally subjective, but City 1st''s is evidently correct, indisputable, factual, etc.

I must reiterate, statistical analysis of football does not and should not be taken as gospel. But it adds another dimension to our understanding of the game. You don''t have to embrace it, the blood and thunder Philistines have their place as much as the ''stattos''.

Football is a romantic game, and the beauty of it is it can be enjoyed by all, young, old, or ''terminally dim''.

Thanks for reading. :)

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[quote user="Canary On The Wire"]Opinions are generally subjective, but City 1st''s is evidently correct, indisputable, factual, etc.

I must reiterate, statistical analysis of football does not and should not be taken as gospel. But it adds another dimension to our understanding of the game. You don''t have to embrace it, the blood and thunder Philistines have their place as much as the ''stattos''.

Football is a romantic game, and the beauty of it is it can be enjoyed by all, young, old, or ''terminally dim''.

Thanks for reading. :)[/quote]it would be a bit odd if you were putting up something that you knew wasn''t correct or factual etcas to understanding the game that is done by watching it, that is why scouts go to games and not sit and home drooling over meaningless mumbo jumboand talking of which..........what about these heat maps ?

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I happen to know a couple of scouts employed by professional football clubs (albeit in the Conference National) who yes, obviously, go and watch games...and produce dossiers on players containing, among other documents, heat maps of average position or ball touches for the player to illustrate how the player has influenced the game and enable comparisons to the teams'' own players which are difficult to put across in detail verbally- certainly difficult to recall and compare later.

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In a similar way, statistical analysis showed that trying to steal bases may be an exciting activity (at least for baseball fans) but being disciplined as a batter and forcing the pitcher to throw 4 balls and hence get you on base via a walk, is a much better strategy - for the average baseball player.

Insights like that can help you build a squad out of slow running and hence less expensive hitters so you can then put you money into buying and developing fantastic young pitchers, and hence compete with a very small payroll v''s the "big boys"

Either way, it''s still just a game,,, enjoy it.

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[quote user="City1st"]ps as to your suggestion of me being old that may only be from your perception ......[/quote]That "perception" no doubt being based on the way you interact with 95% of other posters on this site, which is generally a response which comes across as superior, obnoxious and arrogant and the work of someone who thinks themselves "better" than the majority of people on here.I mean, maybe you are, but you don''t have to be such a serial tosspot.

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[quote user="Surfer"]In a similar way, statistical analysis showed that trying to steal bases may be an exciting activity (at least for baseball fans) but being disciplined as a batter and forcing the pitcher to throw 4 balls and hence get you on base via a walk, is a much better strategy - for the average baseball player.

Insights like that can help you build a squad out of slow running and hence less expensive hitters so you can then put you money into buying and developing fantastic young pitchers, and hence compete with a very small payroll v''s the "big boys"

Either way, it''s still just a game,,, enjoy it.[/quote]I don''t think statistical analysis has no place in football. It can clearly be useful. But some sports lend themselves more to this kind of analysis than others. Particularly the likes of baseball, where you have particular frozen moments that frequently occur (such as the instance quoted above I don''t pretend to understand). Cricket is another such. But football, being much more fluid (theoretically a game could start and continue uninterruptedly for two sets of 45 minutes without a single break in play), produces many less such moments.

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[quote user="Bor Bor Bor"]Statistically, 98% of City 1st''s posts are aggressive put downs, the other 2% being picture quizzes with no pictures in.

Match report was accurate enough, and very readable, thanks for the effort.[/quote]sometimes you just have to laugh out loud  and  pretend you are watching inbetweeners clips on youtube to everyone else in the room [:D]

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COTW, I would like to add my name to the list of posters that enjoy your reports. Please continue with them and ignore the criticism. I also agree with you about statistics, the use of which is mainly criticised by those who don''t understand concepts like normal distribution and regression to the mean. You probably have already seen it, but if you have not, I would recommend "The Numbers Game" by Chris Anderson and David Sally, which I found to be a very interesting read.

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Baseball is a good sport for statistical analysis, but if I may offer this analog - there are statistics such as Runs, Hits, Errors (Goals, Shots on Target, Corners) etc. All basic stuff, and if you focus too much on those w/o context you can get a very false picture of what went on in a game.

On the other hand a hitting analysis - where does a batter tend to hit a ball - can let you position your outfield players, and in a similar way a passing analysis - like http://i.imgur.com/fqQXp1U.png - may help identify a tactical weakness.

At the end of the day it''s much more important to understand WHY you want to measure something and WHY you will do with that information than just gathering up data for data''s sake, else statistics can quickly become lies and damn lies.

Or - just watch the game, and have a pint later talking over why we couldn''t get a cross in today ... it''s still fun. Isn''t It?

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Oh for an edit button :-(

Baseball is a good sport for statistical analysis, but if I may offer this analog - there are statistics such as Runs, Hits, Errors (Goals, Shots on Target, Corners) etc. All basic stuff, and if you focus too much on those w/o context you can get a very false picture of what went on in a game.

On the other hand a hitting analysis - where does a batter tend to hit a ball - can let you position your outfield players, and a pass analysis - like http://i.imgur.com/fqQXp1U.png - may help identify a tactical weakness.

At the end of the day it''s much more important to understand WHY you want to measure something and WHAT you will do with that information, rather than just gathering up data for data''s sake, or else statistics can quickly become lies and damn lies.

Or - just watch the game, and have a pint later talking over why we couldn''t get a cross in today ... it''s still fun. Isn''t It?

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[quote user=" Badger"]COTW, I would like to add my name to the list of posters that enjoy your reports. Please continue with them and ignore the criticism. I also agree with you about statistics, the use of which is mainly criticised by those who don''t understand concepts like normal distribution and regression to the mean. You probably have already seen it, but if you have not, I would recommend "The Numbers Game" by Chris Anderson and David Sally, which I found to be a very interesting read.[/quote]Certainly interesting, Badger, but there are times when the authors are so in love with statistics and oblivious to commonsense that they can''t see the wood for the trees. An example is their argument that Chelsea should have bought Darren Bent rather than Torres, which has a flaw the size of the Grand Canyon running through it.

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[quote user="PurpleCanary"][quote user=" Badger"]COTW, I would like to add my name to the list of posters that enjoy your reports. Please continue with them and ignore the criticism. I also agree with you about statistics, the use of which is mainly criticised by those who don''t understand concepts like normal distribution and regression to the mean. You probably have already seen it, but if you have not, I would recommend "The Numbers Game" by Chris Anderson and David Sally, which I found to be a very interesting read.[/quote]Certainly interesting, Badger, but there are times when the authors are so in love with statistics and oblivious to commonsense that they can''t see the wood for the trees. An example is their argument that Chelsea should have bought Darren Bent rather than Torres, which has a flaw the size of the Grand Canyon running through it.[/quote]Still, it makes for a good debate and in the case of Darren Bent, we will never know because it didn''t happen.Statistics have their place in the great scheme of things and I am sure all football clubs use them because they seem to get something of value from them. Personally I like facts and figures as they give you a sense of what is going on but they are not infallible so that approach is certainly not flawless. Unexpected things happen in football and that is what makes the game so appealing. We know that bottom can beat top and giant killing does occur and thankfully no amount of studying facts and figures will ever alter that.Some like the statistical side of the game and others like the beauty and unpredictability. It shouldn''t cause any argument because both of those factors compliment each other and make the game the thing we love.[:D]

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[quote user="PurpleCanary"][quote user=" Badger"]COTW, I would like to add my name to the list of posters that enjoy your reports. Please continue with them and ignore the criticism. I also agree with you about statistics, the use of which is mainly criticised by those who don''t understand concepts like normal distribution and regression to the mean. You probably have already seen it, but if you have not, I would recommend "The Numbers Game" by Chris Anderson and David Sally, which I found to be a very interesting read.[/quote]Certainly interesting, Badger, but there are times when the authors are so in love with statistics and oblivious to commonsense that they can''t see the wood for the trees. An example is their argument that Chelsea should have bought Darren Bent rather than Torres, which has a flaw the size of the Grand Canyon running through it.[/quote]I agree to some extent Purple, but as Ricardo points out, it contributes to the debate. The Darren Bent point was his goals tended to be more critical (i.e. earned more points) than Torres. It''s also worth pointing out that the big difference to the statistics used related  to the 10/11 season when Torres only scored 10 goals for Chelsea compared to 17 for Bent (Sunderland/ Villa). Had they used subsequent data for both Bent and Torres, neither would have fared very well! The problem is inherently one of extrapolation: trying to predict future behaviour from historic data, which we know is a vary imprecise science with a wide margin of error. From a historical perspective, however, it certainly supports a claim that commentators might make that "Bent scored crucial goals." As ever with statistics, the danger lies in trying to do too much with them and not being aware of their limitations.

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[quote user="splutcho"]Stop trying to hound City 1st out...

I only need "terminally dim" for a full house on my C1 bingo card![/quote]

And he also does good spoof lyrics!

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[quote user="Canary On The Wire"]I happen to know a couple of scouts employed by professional football clubs (albeit in the Conference National) who yes, obviously, go and watch games...and produce dossiers on players containing, among other documents, heat maps of average position or ball touches for the player to illustrate how the player has influenced the game and enable comparisons to the teams'' own players which are difficult to put across in detail verbally- certainly difficult to recall and compare later.[/quote]you are talking out of your ar se and well the rest of us know it, even if you don''t - best thing to do when in a hole is to stop diggingscouts will be appointed and used on a basis of trust .. in their integrity, competence and insight of the game - they will not have to produce some celestial chart to prove their case, ptherwise why use them if you don''t trust them ?you clearly have a very limited grasp of the game, if any at all and sound very much like Tom Ovendish and his ludicrous claims of being a scoutthat a scout in the Conference league is sat like some obssesive train spotter counting every touch of player is complete bo llox to say the least, if only because the logistics of that task are almost impossible - most scouts will be watching one or two players at the mostwhat purple spoke of earlier, and even you seem to have some flimsy awareness of, is that statistics are only valid if there is some form of control and adjustments are made for any variables - something that again is virtually impossible in football, and even what are collated are worthless, as a missed shot could be from 40 yars out after going past 2 defenders and being closed down or could be an Akinbyi hoof into row z from 10 yards out  - likewise the former could be a desperate shot with a few seconds left and the latter could be that dear old Ade had his shirt tugged just before he shothowever in the la la land of mumbo jumbo none of this is ever factored in, no grasp that players tip tapping the ball along the back four to run down the clock will feature far higher in your astrology chart than two very decisive tackles that saw the outnumbered defender then having to hoove the ball up field or into touch - both of which count as an unsuccessful pass in the world of www.saddo.comthat is why scouts watch the games, why fans watch the games and that is why opinions are made from watching what actually happened on the pitch - not meaningless old tosh that is probably available on the NHS for those with limited social skills

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[quote user="Bor Bor Bor"]Statistically, 98% of City 1st''s posts are aggressive put downs, the other 2% being picture quizzes with no pictures in.

Match report was accurate enough, and very readable, thanks for the effort.[/quote]That''s so unfair Bor.At least 50% revolve around an unhealthy paranoia with those unspeakables down the A140. Obsessed or what ? [:D]COTW -Like most on here I enjoy reading your reports. Keep it up. If someone on here had their way all football correspondents would become an extinct species.

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The part where it''s suggested that we totally abandon any attempts at passing football in favour of hoofball is a wonderful example of the naivity that is so prevalent, but overall quite an enjoyable read. It''s a sort of "through the eyes of a plastic" piece written for a students union newspaper. I especially liked the bit where Turner''s rating is bookended by the words ''mammoth'' and ''ace''.

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[quote user=" Badger"][quote user="PurpleCanary"][quote user=" Badger"]COTW, I would like to add my name to the list of posters that enjoy your reports. Please continue with them and ignore the criticism. I also agree with you about statistics, the use of which is mainly criticised by those who don''t understand concepts like normal distribution and regression to the mean. You probably have already seen it, but if you have not, I would recommend "The Numbers Game" by Chris Anderson and David Sally, which I found to be a very interesting read.[/quote]Certainly interesting, Badger, but there are times when the authors are so in love with statistics and oblivious to commonsense that they can''t see the wood for the trees. An example is their argument that Chelsea should have bought Darren Bent rather than Torres, which has a flaw the size of the Grand Canyon running through it.[/quote]I agree to some extent Purple, but as Ricardo points out, it contributes to the debate. The Darren Bent point was his goals tended to be more critical (i.e. earned more points) than Torres. It''s also worth pointing out that the big difference to the statistics used related  to the 10/11 season when Torres only scored 10 goals for Chelsea compared to 17 for Bent (Sunderland/ Villa). Had they used subsequent data for both Bent and Torres, neither would have fared very well! The problem is inherently one of extrapolation: trying to predict future behaviour from historic data, which we know is a vary imprecise science with a wide margin of error. From a historical perspective, however, it certainly supports a claim that commentators might make that "Bent scored crucial goals." As ever with statistics, the danger lies in trying to do too much with them and not being aware of their limitations.[/quote]I know, Badger, but that is the nonsense. Of course Bent scored more "critical" goals than Torres. In  2009-10, which is the main season The Numbers Game looks at here, Bent was the main striker in a not very good Sunderland side that ended with a -8 goal difference. By definition Bent was likely to score either the only goal in a draw or the winner in a 1-0 or a 2-1. So he racked up loads of "critical" goals.Torres, by contrast, had a rival striker in Kuyt (plus Gerrard close to double figures) in a Liverpool team that ended with a +26 goal difference, and so was winning games by wider margins than were Sunderland. So Torres'' goals were doubly less likely to be"critical". Someone else might be a scorer and in any event if his was, say, the third goal in a 3-0 or a 4-1 win then by this absurd definition it wasn''t critical.

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