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Squad Strength - Looking back and forwards

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Okay I''m aware my post will oversimplify things but...

Given that the top of the champs is directly comparable to the bottom of the Prem (some stay up, some go back down) is anyone else slightly concerned that 2 players have gone, who ''some'' may rate as the better players and other clubs rate as the better players obviously?

Should we be improving the squad rather than letting people go, given we will need to be better than last season to go up automatically.

I guess my concern is that RvW (yet to be confirmed?) and Snodgrass going out are vastly superior to Lafferty and Grabban. And we have more rumours about other players (I know they all won''t go) exiting than any quality players coming in.

Could this signal that we are weakening our squad when we actually need to improve it to go up? Not scare mongering, just a slight concern I have.

Or was it all the systems fault last season, and purely playing more attacking will solve it.

FYI if Remond stays I think he will be our player of the season and rip it up, just concerned he cant do it alone.

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Wow. RvW vastly superior to Lafferty and Grabban? Amazing

 

Who says Redmond is ''doing it all alone'' as well? Are the likes of Grabban, Lafferty, Hoolahan, Surman, Murphy''s Pilkington, E.Bennett, Hooper, Fer all useless?

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at the back we started with a thin defence and it has not been improved; we need more and quickly - and apart from olsson, where we do have excellent cover with garrido, none of our defenders will attract attention.

I wont be crying if oneil signs. He is a major step up on bj whose his enthusiasm is fantastic but we have better players going forward and defensively he is too weak, covers ground but rarely wins the ball back, switches off and allow runners for 3 seasons now and his passing remains weak. cover after tettey and oneil only for bj please

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[quote user="York Canary"]

Wow. RvW vastly superior to Lafferty and Grabban? Amazing

 

Who says Redmond is ''doing it all alone'' as well? Are the likes of Grabban, Lafferty, Hoolahan, Surman, Murphy''s Pilkington, E.Bennett, Hooper, Fer all useless?

[/quote]

I certainly wouldnt assume the Murphys are the standard to gain us automatic promotion, nor Surman, E Bennett or Pilkington given lack of time on the pitch, tho they could be.

Time will tell if Lafferty and Grabban are good enough to deliver automatic promotion.

And my main concern is Fer wont be here at the start of the season, Adams is hardly talking like he''s staying.

Like I say, not being excessively negative, just worried that the players who could have the biggest impact are going and we are signing more journeyman players than real quality.

Hopefully my small fears will be completely unfounded.

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Bennett is a better centre half than Martin. Frankly, I''d rather see E Bennett at right back than Whittaker but the latter is superior to Martin. Our most pressing need is for a new right back. And, assuming Bassong''s departure, we need a new centre half to augment what should be our first choice partnership of Turner (who should be captain) and Bennett.

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[quote user="Highland Canary"]I''d rather see E Bennett at right back than Whittaker but the latter is superior to Martin.[/quote]So, your first choice right back is E Bennett followed bt Whittaker and lastly Russell Martin. Really?

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I think Adams has done good business with Lafferty and Grabban, and their potentially replacing RvW improves the squad rather than weakens it IMO.

But given the number of goals we shipped last year I still feel the defence is our Achilles heel, especially its lack of pace, so would like to see a couple of new faces here if possible - a new RB and a CB. A Martin Kelly on loan?

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[quote user="Downloads"]Okay I''m aware my post will oversimplify things but...

Given that the top of the champs is directly comparable to the bottom of the Prem (some stay up, some go back down) [/quote]err. we didn''t only play the bottom  of the PL last yearand we won''t only play the top of the Ch. this seasonwe have an extremely strong squad, way beyond what most others have and the mony to strengthen throught the season - bear in mind that we can loan in players for most of the season

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[quote user="Fuzzar"]I think Adams has done good business with Lafferty and Grabban, and their potentially replacing RvW improves the squad rather than weakens it IMO.

But given the number of goals we shipped last year I still feel the defence is our Achilles heel, especially its lack of pace, so would like to see a couple of new faces here if possible - a new RB and a CB. A Martin Kelly on loan?[/quote]I agree that unless there is a U-turn on Bassong we will need a CB and a RB. Three CB''s isn''t enough even if Whittaker can play there as well. One RB isn''t enough either, even if Benno can play there.However, last season it was our away form that relegated us. Our goals conceded wasn''t that far different to a few other teams.Failing to score is huge. If you are not even a threat you invite far more pressure onto your defense - especially if the forward play fails to last and breaks down quickly.We conceded 62 goals last season. Fulham 85, Cardiff 74, West Brom 59, Aston Villa 61, Sunderland 60, Newcastle 59. Our home defensive record was looking very impressive for most of the season as well.We scored 28 goals last season, Fulham 40, Cardiff 32. Basically other than Cardiff and Crystal Palace (33), every team in the league scored at least ten goals more than us.As it stands I think we have improved the strike force - the only striker we have actually lost so far is Elmander. We have replaced him with Lafferty who I feel is better at this time. He''s more mobile and arguably more aggressive. We have also brought in Grabban who is a good all round striker. RVW looks like he could be going on loan. I would argue they are similar in stature but Grabban is more accustomed to playing English football, seeing as that is where he has played.Defense needs improvement. But mainly due to being low in numbers in that area anyway. It''s why Yobo was brought in in January.

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good points ChickenI think that many forget that the transfer window does not theoretically apply in the Championship and so it may mean that we ''go with what we have got'' and rely upon filling in any gaps as they arise by loaneesas you rightly point out, if we don''t score we are not going to get points, and that is not solely due to the failings of the strikersHughtons approach of defensive play at all costs, meant we really attacked in numbers and how ever good you are if the ball is not put in front of you you will not scoreI would further suggest that is why Grabban and lafferty were brought in early to allow them to train and work with the rest of the squad as quickly as possible, to get a good understanding of each other

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[quote user="City1st"][quote user="Downloads"]Okay I''m aware my post will oversimplify things but...

Given that the top of the champs is directly comparable to the bottom of the Prem (some stay up, some go back down) [/quote]err. we didn''t only play the bottom  of the PL last yearand we won''t only play the top of the Ch. this seasonwe have an extremely strong squad, way beyond what most others have and the mony to strengthen throught the season - bear in mind that we can loan in players for most of the season

[/quote]

Think you misunderstood.

I was saying that as the quality of the bottom of the Prem is comparable to the top of the Champs, that we ''may'' need to improve tbe quality of the squad rather than let the better players leave, but that part will all be in the eye of the beholder and ppl will view players as they see them.

But then again our squad may be so strong that losing a few of them wont matter and ppl may view Laffs and Grabban as awsome signings.

Time will tell, was just seeking some views from peeps.

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"I was saying that as the quality of the bottom of the Prem is

comparable to the top of the Champs, that we ''may'' need to improve tbe

quality of the squad rather than let the better players leave,"
that still doesn''t make any sensewe are in the Champs, so will be playing Champs teamswhat has the PL got to do with it ?

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so you realise how it makes no sense to you  either nowas to ''letting players go'' do you actually know how player contracts work ?

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I understand my statement perfectly, it is just your limited intelligence that hinders you.

And yes I understand contracts, no doubt better than you given your dimwittedness.

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well, why not indulge us all and explain what you mean - it would make my dimwittedness all the more apparent

ps if you do grasp the implications of contracts then you would not talk about ''letting go''

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Okay, I will sincerely put the whole of our previous conversation out of mind and genuinely make another attempt to word it differently in the slim hope you will keep an open mind and take the post in the spirit of football banter it is meant, dealing in shades of grey and not black and white.

I''m aware we wont be playing Prem teams next season.

I''m trying to suggest the quality of the bottom Prem teams is generally comparable to the top of the Champs teams for starters. So if I try to put this another way, if in a season it were possible for the bottom 4 Prem teams, to play the top 4 Champ teams, they would fair well against each other, thus being similar in quality. Its all shades of grey and is just a statement that somemay agree with.

So if one were to accept that if not directly comparable, that this could be true, then to be at the top of the Championship, we would need to retain the quality of the squad and not weaken it, which is once again shades of grey because fans will always have differing views about players - But this is after all why people come on footy boards, to chat about things that arent black and white.

Lafferty could be a very useful player for us, a sort of Holt replacement and Grabban has the proven goals at this level, but I will only be convinced once it happens for them, for us, and am just concerned at the possibility of losing all of Snodgrass, RvW and Fer - Who are obviously rated by other clubs.

But hey, I''m not expecting anything back but veiled insults, but then again I hope reasoned footy chat can be had!

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FYI, I could have broken it down further and indicated how I realise 2 seasons wont be the same, but all statements I make allow for a little leeway, and it is late too.

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You''re right there, Downloads, no two seasons are the same.

I guess that''s why many football fans remain interested in the game.

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it is still as meaningless as it was beforethe season is spread over playing ALL clubs, not those around you, be they in the PL or Chtherefore it is how you fare against ALL of those others not some small numbersquads also change and playing styles will adapt to both the opponents on a tactical basis, and the league they are in on a strategic basis so it is worthless to compare one season in one league with the next season in another league

as to veiled insults might I point out that i merely asked if uou knew how contracts work... that''s allthe insults came from you as with"it is just your limited intelligence that hinders you.

And yes I understand contracts, no doubt better than you given your dimwittedness.

"as you strike me as someone similar to Tom Ovendish I shall depart this thread

whether that is an insult or not that will be for you and Tom to decide

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Given you have insulted many a post before, maybe its understandable. Most football fans talk about conversations that don''t deal in absolutes, its just opinions, you seem to lack that understanding that it doesn''t make an opinion invalid.

But given that you misunderstood for a third time, that I can''t help you with - Maybe find someone to translate into words of one syllable for you?

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To get this back on trackI like the signings todate & I do not thing the exit of Snoddy will waeken the team as Adams is looking to play a faster attackiung style of play which would not have suited SnoddyWhat does worry me is that Adams is not being allowed to build a squad but being forced to wait till players leave before aquisitions are made - this is a dangerouse policyIe if he wants O''Neil get him now before he goes elsewhere and why have we not reinforced the defence, Martin looks dodgy & Bassong will not be played - I will tell u why, Adams can only bring in when one goes

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Thanks Newton, I''m guessing that BJ or Tettey are done if O''Neil comes in, would guess we don''t need 3 defensive midfielders?

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[quote user="Downloads"]Thanks Newton, I''m guessing that BJ or Tettey are done if O''Neil comes in, would guess we don''t need 3 defensive midfielders?[/quote]

He''s more a CM or RM than a DM. He''s is a better passer and more of a CM than Tettey and BJ so in that respect he is an improvement. He must have been half-decent to get promoted with QPR and play nearly 30 games. I think he could be really useful for us you know. Known to have a great work-rate and combined with good passing , it could be a winner. We''ll see.

As for RvW and Fer being rated by other teams..I agree with Fer to an extent and would love to keep him. Though no big teams or even mid-table teams have been firm in their interest (that we know of). If he goes, then we get decent money and try to replace with someone who is good (at least for this level). As for RvW..he''s only had concrete interest (by the looks of it) from St Etienne, and even then only on loan!

I like the way the team is shaping up and didn''t mind losing Snoddy for the money we got and for the way we want to play i.e. with pace. My only concern is having a strong and settled defence too. They look good enough at the moment, but we definitely need another CB (unless we''re using Gafaiti, which is fair enough). Maybe a loan in that area would be good. Not convinced by Whitts, but this could be his year (and a good level for him) and we have Benno who I hope to see play a big part in our season. I also hope R.Bennett finally gets a place cemented as he''s a great passer from the back and could start some of our swift counters. He also seems composed to me and good in the air. He''s captained at this level at a young age and needs that run of games to show his potential. Praying Olsson stays too

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