Russ Martin - becoming a liability

[grefstad 0]

Surely Adams must have seen by now that Russ is a liability at centrehalf. He lost almost all headers vs Blackburn, and too many other duels too.

He has lost pace, and is far from the "Norfolk Cafu" we once knew.

I was hoping for R.Bennett in the second hald, sadly it took an injury to Garrido before he entered the frame, but the defence looked much more solid with Ryan B at the back. Won most headers, and a threat on setpieces offensively too ( header against the bar).

For me, it is a coinflip, Martin or Whittaker as RB. I dont rate any of them, to be honest.

But Ryan B needs to get a chance as CB for some games now. I think he will do well.

Sadly Adams has chosen Martin to be captain, and he seems undroppable because of this.

Apart from that little moan, great game tonight, great comeback.

[Buh 0]

grefstad - negative as always.

[St Georgey 0]

Hopefully Cuellar''s arrival will be the catalyst for Martin to be moved to right-back. I''d rather him there than Whitaker.

[grefstad 0]

[quote user="Buh"]grefstad - negative as always.[/quote]

Looking for ways to improve the team is not negative. Martin has been poor for quite a few games now, and I think he is undropable because he is captain. He lacks the height and pace to play CB.

Got other qualities though, but he is no CB

[St Georgey 0]

Usual crowd popping up tonight to criticise anyone wanting to discuss matters. Same old shite about being negative etc etc

[Buh 0]

Saw how s4it Martin was tonight all the way from Norway did you?

[Sussexyellow 55]

Negative or not it is a fair point. Russ is not good enough in the air to play at CB. And there are likely to be a lot of aerial duals with big forwards that will need to be won in this division.

The defence looked much more solid after the halftime reshuffle. Hopefully Neil Adams will take note.

[Jim Smith 2,314]

Does not need Cuellars arrival to force the change . Ryan Bennett must be given a run at CB. If Garrido is injured I assume he will be there on Saturday.

[GJL Mid-Norfolk Canary 1,735]

dont know about Turner and Cueller at centre half though??......no a lot of pace there?

[St Georgey 0]

That pairing would be slow. But they''ve played together before, I think, so that''s a plus.

Bennett certainly deserves a chance alongside Turner first though

[danielsroundabout 9]

I agree with Grefstad that Martin is a non-runner as far as centre back is concerned (the pun was accidental) but think it a no-brainer when chosing between him and Whittaker for right-back. I would opt for Martin every time and don''t really understand why a certain minority can talk of little after a game, other than Martin''s perceived shortcomings.

[grefstad 0]

[quote user="Buh"]Saw how s4it Martin was tonight all the way from Norway did you?[/quote]

Arrogant much, or just ignorant?

I was at the top of the Barclay tonight, as I was on Saturday vs Watford, and I have a feeling I am watching mote Norwich games luve than you are. About 10-15 per season (home and away).

You know I got a good point, so dont come with this Johnny Foreigner dross.

Martin is nowhere good enough to play CB for Norwich.

[mrs miggins 0]

agree, against big striker that blackburn have, martin is best at RB, he''s good at RB

[gabba 0]

Martin is an average player hyped up beyond belief. If we want to play a passing, counterattacking game and go on the offensive more, then Whittaker''s superior technique and versatility wins hands down.

[kingsway 94]

A typical over critical viewpoint from a Norwich fan!

How many chances did Blackburn have tonight?

Not a lot!

I remember thinking to myself how assured I feel with steady eddy Russell Martin in the side!

I agree that Ryan Bennetts a better CB but Russell Martins far from being a liability and I''d rather him at RB than Whittaker!

[grefstad 0]

[quote user="Even Keel"]Martin is an average player hyped up beyond belief. If we want to play a passing, counterattacking game and go on the offensive more, then Whittaker''s superior technique and versatility wins hands down.[/quote]

Its not only the lack of height and muscle against big forwards, but I feel he is also significantly slower than he was just 2 seasons ago.

This means that it is more risky for us to play a high pressing game, as we did for 90% of the second half. If Blackburn have had a player with genuine pace and tarvetted Martin on the counter, we would struggle, as Turner is not the quickest either.

Turner is OK at this level, but we need more pace alongside him ( preferrable someone who can head as well). R.Bennett can head, but is not quick on the first 10 yards. Better on longer runs

[danielsroundabout 9]

Move Martin from CB and he is no longer a liability. Put Whittaker where you like, he''ll remain a liability.

[grefstad 0]

I dont look forward to seeing Connor Sammon play against Russ on Saturday....

[gabba 0]

[quote user="grefstad"][quote user="Even Keel"]Martin is an average player hyped up beyond belief. If we want to play a passing, counterattacking game and go on the offensive more, then Whittaker''s superior technique and versatility wins hands down.[/quote]

Its not only the lack of height and muscle against big forwards, but I feel he is also significantly slower than he was just 2 seasons ago.

This means that it is more risky for us to play a high pressing game, as we did for 90% of the second half. If Blackburn have had a player with genuine pace and tarvetted Martin on the counter, we would struggle, as Turner is not the quickest either.

Turner is OK at this level, but we need more pace alongside him ( preferrable someone who can head as well). R.Bennett can head, but is not quick on the first 10 yards. Better on longer runs[/quote]Yes, Bennett''s much better than Martin at CB, but I hope that doesn''t mean Martin replaces Whittaker at RB. Adams is trying to get players to rotate, and this suits Whittaker as he can play in all the midfield and defensive positions. Whittaker is like Garrido, he looks bad if he''s surrounded by donkeys who have a bad passing game.On your lack of pace point, we could do with a quick defensive midfielder/playmaker, Tettey and Johnson are too limited.

[Guest]

Some liability - we''ve conceded a massive 2 gosls in 3 games.

Did you not see him close Dyer down at pace against Watford and put in a superb block? I don''t think he has lost any pace to be frank, and not sure what you base that on.

Clearly he is not going to be a massive physical presence, but considering Blackburn apparently have a 10mil+ striker in Rhodes, and were unbeaten in 14 games, exactly how many decent chances did they have tonight? 3/4? How many after the team got to grips with Blackburn''s physical presence (e.g after 15 mins) in the first half?

[Gingerpele 0]

[quote user="Even Keel"]Martin is an average player hyped up beyond belief. If we want to play a passing, counterattacking game and go on the offensive more, then Whittaker''s superior technique and versatility wins hands down.[/quote]

Lololololololol.

No he''s not, he''s underrated if anything. Whittaker is near useless, slows down play, goes for goal far too often, can''t defend. Martin is head and shoulders above him in so many ways it''s just hilarious you think Martin is average and overhyped despite every single time he plays so many people moan about him actually doing a good job. Quite possibly an even bigger scapegoat than Johnson.

[gabba 0]

[quote user="Gingerpele"][quote user="Even Keel"]Martin is an average player hyped up beyond belief. If we want to play a passing, counterattacking game and go on the offensive more, then Whittaker''s superior technique and versatility wins hands down.[/quote]

Lololololololol.

No he''s not, he''s underrated if anything. Whittaker is near useless, slows down play, goes for goal far too often, can''t defend. Martin is head and shoulders above him in so many ways it''s just hilarious you think Martin is average and overhyped despite every single time he plays so many people moan about him actually doing a good job. Quite possibly an even bigger scapegoat than Johnson.[/quote]Hilarious given that you''re the one with the gay crush on Johnson, I take it your judgement of Martin must be clouded on a similar basis!

[The Great Wall Of Tettey 0]

For me the back 4 should always be

olsson turner bennett(bassong depending?) Martin

Whittaker is a handy cover player as can play both sides. Martin may appear to be ''lazy'' as the change in position does warrant a different style of play, but a few games at RB and you''ll see the old Russ back. Neither him or Whittaker are perfect and it''s all down to personal opinions

[Jim Smith 2,314]

[quote user="grefstad"]I dont look forward to seeing Connor Sammon play against Russ on Saturday....[/quote]

The day we start fearing Connor Sammon is the day we may as well give up!

[Downloads 35]

[quote user="grefstad"]

Arrogant much, or just ignorant?

I was at the top of the Barclay tonight, as I was on Saturday vs Watford, and I have a feeling I am watching mote Norwich games luve than you are. About 10-15 per season (home and away).

You know I got a good point, so dont come with this Johnny Foreigner dross.

Martin is nowhere good enough to play CB for Norwich.[/quote]

Buh, you just got owned chap.

For what its worth, I feel you are spot on Grefstad.

He can play at CB, but he''s not a great one and we already have better in the squad at CB. Also making him captain is a problem for Adams as it does make him near impossible to drop, making Ruddy captain would resolve this - Not likely now.

For me I don''t understand why you would give Bennett a 3 year deal not to play in the Champs, if he doesn''t play here then how will he be good enough for the Prem as a young player if thats where we want to be?

This isn''t negative - Wanting your team to be the best it can be doesn''t detract from a good night, as any manager would say, there is always room for improvement - In our case its making the defence a little tighter.

[tom cavendish 0]

As a central defender Martin is weak in the air. Whittaker is better than Martin at right-back. Martin doesn''t even make many challenges and often fails to get back to a position to defend. I think he is a low Championship to League 1 standard.

[Buh 0]

Yawn, just couldn''t be bothered to answer the canary caller.

[lake district canary 4,531]

Please lay off Martin.  He''s captain for a reason and a solid and experienced performer at this level.  Bennett came on and did well - which is of course what he has to do to get in the team. Its all about competition for places, but Martin - as captain - will probably be the first choice cb as long as we are winning matches and not conceding too many.  Whittaker on form is a good player going forwards - and that is what we all want to see - us going forwards. If we let in the odd goal, as last night, then we just make sure we score more at the other end, as last night.   There is flexibility in the squad and we have coped well with Olsson and Garrido missing - so there is no issue here - unless we start letting in goals.  The two goals against us this season have been exceptional - a pin point cross and a fabulous first time strike.   There is no issue with any of the defence at the moment imo, except to say that they will get better as the season progresses and the team does well.

[ReadingCanary 0]

This is the same Russ Martin who has contributed to letting only 1 goal in at home....Playing against teams who have players like Rhodes and Deeney

[grefstad 0]

[quote user="ReadingCanary"]This is the same Russ Martin who has contributed to letting only 1 goal in at home....Playing against teams who have players like Rhodes and Deeney[/quote]

Agreed it is hard to argue against success, but us not conceding more than 2 goals is certainly not down to Martin'' solid displays. On tbe contrary, I argue that both goals could easily have been avoided, espescially the one at Wolves if Bennett played CB.

Blackburn scoree from a knockdown from Gestede, in another duel where we did not challenge properly.

I dont remember if it was Turner or Martin (sat far away) but we lost the challenge quite easily, and Cairney scored a wonder goal. Admittedly, 9 out of 10 he does not score on that occasion, but my point is that Martin is being let off the hook easily, disquised by our goalscoring exploits of late.

Also, when Martin moved to right back, he did not impress much. Overrun on a few occassions, and the crossing for the near-Blackburn goal at the end came from his side.