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Malky issues

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[quote user="TCCANARY"]

[quote user="crabbycanary"]KC, without accusing you of being a touch naive about stories being released by the media, and their timing, I would wager that this story has been on the backburner, just waiting for the ''right'' time, to come out. A stitch up? Yes, I guess it could be seen as that, but this is the real first major opportunity that Malkay has been primed for (if he was going to get our job, then I am sure the story would have come out then also). Tan has made sure that Malkay will struggle to get a job anytime soon Damning stuff all round[/quote]

 

I may not have the timing exactly right but didn''t Malkay make that public apology to Tan at the time we were looking to appoint Hughton''s successor. At the time most people thought he was trying the extricate himself from any legal issues to free himself up to take our job but that was the last he was mentioned in connection with us.

 

 

 

 

[/quote]

 

Could also explain why just as why just as we expected Malkay to be announced as the new boss talks suddenly ''stalled'', at the time speculation was that Malkay wasn''t happy to work under the structure that the club imposed on him but maybe a call from a source close to Tan was placed.

It does seem strange that Malkay is always the favourite for any vacancy that comes up but he never gets one.

 

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Firstly I certainly do not condone Racism , Sexism or Homophobia in any way but this seems a serious stich up in so many ways.

Tan has paid someone to trawl through "70,000 texts and 100,000 emails" and this is what he has come up with ? these are personal correspondences and not public outbursts Stupid and pathetic but still, If Malky was a Racist or Homophobe would there not be a significantly higher incidence ?

To me it appears to be about 1 thing only Money. Tan is responsible for setting up the structure at Cardiff and I do not believe the manager is free to write out cheques. The CEO is surely responsible or overseeing all dealings but still the finger is pointed at the Manager ?

Seems like a textbook case of a "Witch Hunt" to me

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sadly this will now (conviently) dwell upon the content of those texts - words and expressions which are in everyday conversations .... and if they were so terrible, why were they not brought to the fore or robustly dealt with before ?if all the texts have been readable then it would suggest that they contained evidence of the shady deals that have been suggested at - something that may well have been revealed to MacKay when he tried to claim compensationagain why were they not brought out into the open and MacKay challenged about them ?could it be that it was not only his hands (allegedly) in the till ?because as offensive as those comments are, the real concern here should be the level of supposed corruption who else was involved and how widespread was this particular case ?

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[quote user="PurpleCanary"]The Mail piece is dangerously unclear. But if I have read it right only one of those obnoxious tweets/emails quoted is from Mackay. All the others are from Moody.The second point is that if Mackay and Moody did get away with (over-)spending money Tan thinks they shouldn''t have done, which is what he was saying before, then where we the checks from the club''s chief executive (if I remember rightly a Tan appointment) to watch out for that? If what is now being alleged is underhand criminality that would be a different matter.[/quote]As far as the money goes this, if true, seems to be the only new aspect:The law firm are understood to have discovered a series of papers relating to certain transfers that were not included in official transfer documents. Investigators also discovered the authorisation of payments to agents for deals in which there was no evidence of their involvement.And all this has come about through a raid on Moody''s house. Even if true, which is yet to be proved,  it doesn''t necessarily mean Mackay was involved, just as most of the offensive texts and emails seem to have come from Moody.

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All quite damning. Especially after the tweets from Jon Parkin and Ibrahim Farah. We dodged a bullet. It seems Malky was offered the job here in the summer but you have to wonder whether he pulled out or whether Norwich learnt of his wrongdoings at Cardiff.

Same goes for West Brom who were interested in Malky but then very quickly lost interest.

I always found it quite strange as to why Malky suddenly apologised to Tan and dropped legal action. Now we know why. Always thought he was a decent bloke. Oh how wrong you can be.

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[quote user="PurpleCanary"][quote user="PurpleCanary"]The Mail piece is dangerously unclear. But if I have read it right only one of those obnoxious tweets/emails quoted is from Mackay. All the others are from Moody.The second point is that if Mackay and Moody did get away with (over-)spending money Tan thinks they shouldn''t have done, which is what he was saying before, then where we the checks from the club''s chief executive (if I remember rightly a Tan appointment) to watch out for that? If what is now being alleged is underhand criminality that would be a different matter.[/quote]As far as the money goes this, if true, seems to be the only new aspect:The law firm are understood to have discovered a series of papers relating to certain transfers that were not included in official transfer documents. Investigators also discovered the authorisation of payments to agents for deals in which there was no evidence of their involvement.And all this has come about through a raid on Moody''s house. Even if true, which is yet to be proved,  it doesn''t necessarily mean Mackay was involved, just as most of the offensive texts and emails seem to have come from Moody.[/quote]I would have thought that this comment from Tan suggests MacKay was involved, up to his neck " "I gave him a big budget and he spent it on the wrong people.

We were supposed to have a main striker and we signed a 20-year-old,

paying him £45,000 a week.

"We paid more than £10million. The reported £7.5million is not the right

number. It was over £10million. And, guess what? He hardly started.

"Why pay so much for a main striker, pay £45,000 a week, more than Craig Bellamy, and then don''t start him?
"again, why the sudden smokescreen about ''racist texts'' ?what other fingers are in this till ?

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[quote user="City1st"][quote user="PurpleCanary"][quote user="PurpleCanary"]The Mail piece is dangerously unclear. But if I have read it right only one of those obnoxious tweets/emails quoted is from Mackay. All the others are from Moody.The second point is that if Mackay and Moody did get away with (over-)spending money Tan thinks they shouldn''t have done, which is what he was saying before, then where we the checks from the club''s chief executive (if I remember rightly a Tan appointment) to watch out for that? If what is now being alleged is underhand criminality that would be a different matter.[/quote]As far as the money goes this, if true, seems to be the only new aspect:The law firm are understood to have discovered a series of papers relating to certain transfers that were not included in official transfer documents. Investigators also discovered the authorisation of payments to agents for deals in which there was no evidence of their involvement.And all this has come about through a raid on Moody''s house. Even if true, which is yet to be proved,  it doesn''t necessarily mean Mackay was involved, just as most of the offensive texts and emails seem to have come from Moody.[/quote]I would have thought that this comment from Tan suggests MacKay was involved, up to his neck " "I gave him a big budget and he spent it on the wrong people.

We were supposed to have a main striker and we signed a 20-year-old,

paying him £45,000 a week.

"We paid more than £10million. The reported £7.5million is not the right

number. It was over £10million. And, guess what? He hardly started.

"Why pay so much for a main striker, pay £45,000 a week, more than Craig Bellamy, and then don''t start him?
"again, why the sudden smokescreen about ''racist texts'' ?what other fingers are in this till ?

[/quote]Not at all. That is months-old stuff from Tan complaining about over-spending. About the wrong players (in Tan''s retrospective amateur view) being bought for too much and being paid (again in Tan''s retrospective amateur view) too much in wages. As said before, if Tan didn''t have in place an effective CEO keeping an eye on that then it was Tan''s fault.And bear in mind those complaints from Tan were all known about when we made Mackay our first choice as manager in the summer. And by all accounts if was Mackay who turned us down (in effect) rather than the other way round.What is new is the allegation (apparently only revealed by a recent raid) that there were - beyond the overt over-spending Tan mentions - secret fees to agents and fees to people who had no right to be paid anything. And Mackay may have been involved in that - IF IT HAPPENED - or he may not.If Tan had known about any secret overspending - effectively corruption - it is very hard to believe, given his animosity towards Mackay and Moody, that it would only have come out now.

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You may be right Purple, but if so, why did Mackay drop his legal action and apologise in such a grovelling fashion?

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If you were being pursued by a madman who had lots of money and wanted to get you at any cost I think you might well apologise in such a grovelling fashion even if you had done nothing wrong.

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[quote user="I.S."]You may be right Purple, but if so, why did Mackay drop his legal action and apologise in such a grovelling fashion?[/quote]Who knows, but probably because he wanted to get back into football management and that couldn''t happen until the case was settled. It is a fact that we then went after Mackay to replace Hughton. And I cannot believe we would have shown any interest in Mackay if it had been known - or even just suspected - on Planet Football (which is a very small world) that he had been party to corruption. The overt oversending we knew about and presumably simply would not have allowed to happen at Carrow Road.I am just looking at this with a lawyer''s kind of mind. In essence there are two people allegedly involved here and two kinds of allegations. One historic and not on the fact of it alleging anything illegal, and a new allegation, which might involve illegality (either real criminal illegality or footballing illegality).The danger is ignoring these potential differences of personnel and allegations and assuming everything abiut everybody.

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irrespective of whose fault it is, it does not mean that no ''corruption took placeif Tan should have been more dilgent and so is guilty then where MacKay in his diligence over signing players ?any delay in bringing this out would most likely be to having to investigate this, hence it only being now that there has been a raid I would hardly think either that there was not any "secret fees to agents and fees to people who had no right to be paid anything" it goes with the territory , otherwise what would be the purpose of ''overspending'' ?neither do I agree that these complaints are merely coming from Tan''s supposed amateurish knowledge of the game - more, that it would take some while to see that the player(s) in question were not up to the quality thoughtI expect the paper trail to lead back to Watford at some point ...... how much will be hushed up will have to be seenbut if past behaviour is anything to go by then football will do it''s damnest not to have the stone lifted too high and for too long, so expect the concentration to be on the racist texts, a very convenient diversion to demonstrate that football is ever vigilante in it''s mission to keep football clean

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But surely Purple, legal action could be dropped quietly without losing much face, if Mackay had a good opportunity to get back into mangement (which presumably has not materialised).

The fact he was almost humiliated in the way the apology was made implies that perhaps there was more to it. Time will tell.

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I was told by a mate who speaks to footy agents from time to time immediately after Malky left Cardiff that he would be unlikely to be available for our job (if we sacked Hughton) or indeed any job because Tan was going after him for alleged improper payments relating to transfer dealings so he would be likely to have his hands full with legal disputes for a while.

Maybe the alleged racist/homophobic messages were discovered as a part of the investigations into that and was an added bonus for Tan.

I''m only speculating but my take on this is that maybe he made Malky aware of what he knew at the time and a deal was struck between the two of them whereby Tan agreed not to expose his conduct in return for Malky dropping his legal action and issuing an the apology that he did. However, Tan appears to have been biding his time since until he could extract his ultimate revenge. Revenge is a dish served cold as they say and the beauty of it is that even if Tan has technically breached some agreement he made with Mackay and Moody by doing this (which he may not have if he can show he had to disclose the info under league rules) it seems to me that they can hardly revive their claims for wrongful dismissal if this evidence is all genuine.

The morale of the story here would appear to be don''t mess with Malaysian billionaires!

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"The morale of the story here would appear to be don''t mess with Malaysian billionaires!"if only there were some other who could give his informed opinion of the ''inscrutability'' of the orientalwhere be he now ?

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I can''t help but speculate on this. My theory is that Malky may have been our first choice as manager. Negotiations may have been very advanced when VT possibly boycotted it by tipping off our board about this story. That would explain the sudden unreserved apology by Malky around the time he was being linked with the Norwich post, then the extended level of radio silence with appointing our man. I think our board got wind of the story and did a dramatic U-turn. Adams was in the right place at the right time.

If this is how it panned out then credit to the board for acting accordingly. Ironically, it''s beginning to seem that Adams is a good appointment. He''s tactically strong, good with the players and, although inexperienced, seems to be learning.

Of course, these are only allegations with Malky, we don''t know whether or not they are true.

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Also, imagine the other scenario. We''d have appointed Malky. Done the pre-season. Signed a couple of overpriced players on high wages before this story breaking. Malky would have had no choice but to resign. We would have been managerless 3 games into a new season. We have avoided a disaster here.

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They are my thoughts also Michael, but if they were not true, and if I were Malkay, I would have already issued a very strongly worded solicitors statement threatening legal action against, the Mail etc.

There seems to be a deafening silence at the moment..........

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[quote user="Michael Starr"]Also, imagine the other scenario. We''d have appointed Malky. Done the pre-season. Signed a couple of overpriced players on high wages before this story breaking. Malky would have had no choice but to resign. We would have been managerless 3 games into a new season. We have avoided a disaster here.[/quote]

eh ?

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I don''t think it would be about worrying Tan, I''d do it to clear my name if I were innocent. Unfortunately, Moody''s resignation today suggests guilt.

Also, as much as I detest racism, sexism and all the other isms, sometimes, private messages between two people should be left private.

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It is dangerous to speculate. I followed a recent court case which was reported in the DM very closely, and while I would not say the DM was factually incorrect, the piece could be deemed less than rigorous, complete or balanced as was demonstrated by the outcome of the subsequent court case. The DM is in the business of selling news, not reporting it. However, it is unusual that MM apologised in the circumstances but if something was amiss then the club was culpable for not having adequate controls in place.

Almost as unusual as it would be as if PC would acknowledge that the NCFC board would have done their due diligence and would have more inside information than he has and therefore the board made the right decision based on the info available at the time and he and others were wrong to criticise it.

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[quote user="Michael Starr"]I don''t think it would be about worrying Tan, I''d do it to clear my name if I were innocent. Unfortunately, Moody''s resignation today suggests guilt.

Also, as much as I detest racism, sexism and all the other isms, sometimes, private messages between two people should be left private.[/quote]

On the face of that sounds all well and good but when criminality is involved it simply has to be used as evidence, for instance terrorists communicating in order to commit an atrocity.

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I think that the point was that these were not criminal in the sense of dodgy money dealingsbut they do suggest that one or both parties are not that bright in that you do not put down in writing what you would not like to come out into the open at a later datethe offensive texts are a mere sideshow............ though they do provide a convenient diversion................ but for who, is the real question ?

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We all have to be careful with what we say on this thread as we''re going by rumour / speculation, but what''s happened certainly throws up numerous debates. Message privacy. Racism. Accusations. It''s good to see some sensible posts on this board for a change, where people are not calling each other names or point scoring.

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[quote user="I.S."]But surely Purple, legal action could be dropped quietly without losing much face, if Mackay had a good opportunity to get back into mangement (which presumably has not materialised).

The fact he was almost humiliated in the way the apology was made implies that perhaps there was more to it.
Time will tell.[/quote]No. I.S. Sadly with legal action it is not like this message-board where - if proved wrong - you (I don''t mean you but a few I could name)  resort to bluster or say nothing!The point is Mackay started a legal action for compensation. Two things followed from that. Firstly his claim represented bad publicity for Tan and Cardiff. Secondly, Tan and Cardiff will have had to start spending money on a defence.If you decide to drop the action you have to say so publicly and say you have withdrawn unreservedly any allegations you have made. You cannot hint that really deep down you still think you have a case. It has to be a grovel. That it was doesn''t indicate anything at all.

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Many seem to relish the opportunity to speculate on this matter. Human nature, I suppose. However, to digress, my own speculation is, " I wonder if Tony Pulis may now find his way back to Crystal Palace?"  Stranger things have happened in the ever surprising world of football.

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