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flecky76

Snoddy to leave tomorrow?

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[quote user="Surfer"]I''ll give him due, Snoddy can take a mean free kick, and he is very committed, but do you think that he''s suddenly going to be able to beat his man on the outside, or put in a consistent killer cross or corner? Or is he the man to replace Hoolahan and / or quickly link defense to attack ? - IMO - no, so I would''t be crushed to see him go.[/quote]

Agreed, but careful, you''ll have the know it alls on your back......    

To be serious, I think Snoddy would be better next season - because it is the championship and because the emphasis will be on attack, but I for one have had enough of watching him run into dead ends at the expense of his team mates.  If he stays, he will have to do better.

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[quote user="lake district canary"][quote user="Surfer"]I''ll give him due, Snoddy can take a mean free kick, and he is very committed, but do you think that he''s suddenly going to be able to beat his man on the outside, or put in a consistent killer cross or corner? Or is he the man to replace Hoolahan and / or quickly link defense to attack ? - IMO - no, so I would''t be crushed to see him go.[/quote]

Agreed, but careful, you''ll have the know it alls on your back......    

To be serious, I think Snoddy would be better next season - because it is the championship and because the emphasis will be on attack, but I for one have had enough of watching him run into dead ends at the expense of his team mates.  If he stays, he will have to do better.[/quote]Lambert wanted him......Hughton got him......Adams and Royle want to keep him but......Four Premier League clubs are reported to be after him.......If only these "know it alls" had the benefit of your expertise. [:S]

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about three hours to gohe better hurry up ..........

................... though probably not the most tactful thing to say

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The `imbalance` of our attack last season what not Snoddy''s fault - it was teams - or moreso - the lack of alternative.

We consistently attacked down that flank because it was our only effective one.

So as per usual, LDC is wrong. It''s not Snoddy that has to be better - it''s the rest of our attacking players. Who need to be as good as Snodgrass so that we''re willing to use the other flank, or central position, just as much as we have done snoddy this season.

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" We consistently attacked down that flank because it was our only effective one."

Seriously? I can accept that we did attack mainly down the right, but we had Olsson and Redmond on the left and Fer and Howson down the middle. Are you saying those players are not as effective as Snodgrass, or was it the case of we chose to play Snodgrass as our outlet man? If I recall we tore Man City defense a new one without the services of Mr. Snodgrass.

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Yes, we had Olsson (a full back - and our full backs barely overlapped all season, part of our tactics I''m sure).

The other alternative option was Redmond who''s crossing ability was about as good as mine. His shooting ability was dare i say worse. And i''m certainly no footballer.

Reciting one game where we attacked without Snodgrass is hardly arguing your point effectively, either.

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[quote user="hogesar"]The `imbalance` of our attack last season what not Snoddy''s fault - it was teams - or moreso - the lack of alternative.

We consistently attacked down that flank because it was our only effective one.

So as per usual, LDC is wrong. It''s not Snoddy that has to be better - it''s the rest of our attacking players. Who need to be as good as Snodgrass so that we''re willing to use the other flank, or central position, just as much as we have done snoddy this season.[/quote]

Snodgrass needs to improve, whether you like it or not, so don''t come it with the "LDC is wrong" stuff.   The whole lot of them need to improve next season, true, but in the matches I went to - and yes, watching the others in their entirety online too - seeing Snodgrass delay crossing nearly every time, seeing strikers time their runs, then seeing them hold back waiting, then seeing them stop running because they know a cross isn''t coming, then seeing them over the course of the season lose heart because they are not getting the service - is why he needs to improve and mix his play up more. 

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[quote user="lake district canary"]Snodgrass needs to improve, whether you like it or not, so don''t come it with the "LDC is wrong" stuff.   The whole lot of them need to improve next season, true, but in the matches I went to - and yes, watching the others in their entirety online too - seeing Snodgrass delay crossing nearly every time, seeing strikers time their runs, then seeing them hold back waiting, then seeing them stop running because they know a cross isn''t coming, then seeing them over the course of the season lose heart because they are not getting the service - is why he needs to improve and mix his play up more.[/quote]So why do all these managers rate him Lakey, why don''t they see what you see?

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I just don''t get this. I thought Snodgrass was outstanding in a disappointly ordinary team last season. I would expect him to be more oustanding in the coming season - unfortunately, several PL teams see it that way too so the issue may become academic from our perspective.

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[quote user="lappinitup"][quote user="lake district canary"]Snodgrass needs to improve, whether you like it or not, so don''t come it with the "LDC is wrong" stuff.   The whole lot of them need to improve next season, true, but in the matches I went to - and yes, watching the others in their entirety online too - seeing Snodgrass delay crossing nearly every time, seeing strikers time their runs, then seeing them hold back waiting, then seeing them stop running because they know a cross isn''t coming, then seeing them over the course of the season lose heart because they are not getting the service - is why he needs to improve and mix his play up more.[/quote]So why do all these managers rate him Lakey, why don''t they see what you see?[/quote]

Do all these managers see Snoddy week in week out, 90 minutes every match?  It is easy to look in and see good things about him - but watching him over two seasons, every minute of him being on the pitch, it is quite possible Norwich fans have a fairly good idea of the way he plays - and there are plenty of us who see his shortcomings and wonder if they outweigh his good points.   He is not rubbish and can improve - for me he needs to improve,  as if he stays and we get another season of lack of goals and he contributes to that lack of goals - then we will more than likely stay in the championship. They all have to improve - particularly Snoddy though, who so much play goes through - and if they don''t accept that then they should get on their bikes or be shown the door.

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Why do all the other managers rate him ?

Beats me, I can only tell you what I see...

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O.K time to reset this argument : statistically he may be the best player in the team, however the question is does the team play better without him or with him. IMO based on the play of the past two years, we are clearly unbalanced when he''s in the team, and I think we would play better without him.

But if you think differently, I''d be interested to hear an explanation of why, and not just repeating that he won POTS or some other team(s) apparently want him..

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[quote user="lake district canary"][quote user="hogesar"]The `imbalance` of our attack last season what not Snoddy''s fault - it was teams - or moreso - the lack of alternative.

We consistently attacked down that flank because it was our only effective one.

So as per usual, LDC is wrong. It''s not Snoddy that has to be better - it''s the rest of our attacking players. Who need to be as good as Snodgrass so that we''re willing to use the other flank, or central position, just as much as we have done snoddy this season.[/quote]

Snodgrass needs to improve, whether you like it or not, so don''t come it with the "LDC is wrong" stuff.   The whole lot of them need to improve next season, true, but in the matches I went to - and yes, watching the others in their entirety online too - seeing Snodgrass delay crossing nearly every time, seeing strikers time their runs, then seeing them hold back waiting, then seeing them stop running because they know a cross isn''t coming, then seeing them over the course of the season lose heart because they are not getting the service - is why he needs to improve and mix his play up more. 

[/quote]

Have to agree with everything you''ve written on this Lakey.

Snodgrass held up our attacks all too often last season leaving our goal poaching strikers hungry. When strikers are left hungry they then become lazy and lose confidence due to knowing they won''t receive early balls into the box.

Then they get lambasted for it!

It''s funny that fans will only remember the last few months of the season rather than the season in whole.

I clearly remember some on here calling for Snodgrass to be dropped earlier in the season due to lack of form! Also, for having a spat with fans in the snake pit and of course ''that penalty'' incident. Hughtons love child was subsequently never dropped and played himself out of bad form!

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lets also not forget how good pilks and bennet were on either flanks playing in the same team. I would only feel down if we sold snodgrass and didn''t spend the money on a quality player to go in the first team (we need a ball player like fox for example but he''s left and another winger to replace snodders)

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Has Robert Snodgrass left yet or is he still with us? I believe everything I read but have not seen any confirmation that he left.

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If we are keeping Pilks Bennett Murphy and Redmond then we wouldn''t necessarily need to invest in a winger should Snoddy leave. I personally believe he would be an absolute star at championship level. I don''t want to see him leave, but if he does I will take some solace in the fact that the board have held out for some serious money, rather than just selling him on the cheap in a panic because he only has 1 year left on his contract. That and the fact that we already have the players to fill the gap.

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[quote user="mrs miggins"]lets also not forget how good pilks and bennet were on either flanks playing in the same team.[/quote]Some truth in this Miggo. My belief is that EBenno and ,perhaps to a lesser extent,Pilks were a big miss last season. There will be those who trot out the "how do you know ?" argument, but because of their absence Snods was pretty much guaranteed a place. I''m not sure I agree with LDC that he needs to be singled out for criticism . He was inconsistently mediocre in a vast ocean of inconsistent mediocrity last season. There is no doubt that he has the wherewithal to be a PL quality player, and, as I''ve said before, the fact is that if he wants to go and some PL team is prepared to stump up the cash...that''s where he''s headed.

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I think it is worth mentioning that Snodgrass was out for a fair bit of time as well. Injuries hit us quite hard last season.We''ll never know if those players being available more often would have kept us up, but we do know that them not being available certainly did not help our situation.I think we had several players that had to carry knocks through the season because of more serious injuries elsewhere. Sometimes being pressed back into action far too soon. Which it looked like with Pilkington.When you look at how many assists and goals Pilks got the season before and some of his performances earlier in the season such as against Chelsea where he gave some good service to Wolfswinkel and the two seemed to have some understanding.I find it interesting that people think Bennett would have made more of an impact when the evidence suggests it to be the other way around from the previous two seasons. Not that Benno wouldn''t have done, he''s a very positive type of player and would have offered us pace in behind as well as to run at defenders.If the world cup is anything to go by in trends, pace, pace and more pace is going to be key.

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I agree that injuries were a big factor last season, as they disrupted continuity and players'' form throughout. Yes, there will always be injuries, but last season was the worst I can remember. I wonder if that is why McNally and the Board are bringing in the Technical Director.

Pilks does seem to be injury prone and that may limit his contribution next season (if he stays). Also, how will Bennett do after missing almost all season. Without Snods, City would then be down to 20 year old Redmond and 19 year old Murphy. Grabban can play out wide, as can Lafferty, if he comes, so that may be less of a problem.

Pace could be the key, and Grabban''s signing seems to indicate that Adams may think so as well.

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Snodgrass is a fine player, and our best player last season. However, as the team was set out we were setting ourselves up for a fall.

Snod has a consistently ''ok'' delivery- he hits the box with a decent high ball more often than not. However, he often needs time to put said ball in, which in a team playing up to a single poacher and a gameplan geared towards quick attacks was never going to be particularly effective.

With Holt/ Wilbraham/ Morison this would work as they can attack the ball, our forwards last season need to be picked out in the second-or-so they create for themselves. Redmond''s delivery was sub-par so often that Snod remained our attacking focal point and is what I see as the starting point for our attacking failures.

I firmly believe Adams will shoot for pace on the wings and workrate in the middle, so if we could move Snod in behind the striker I could see it working out. If not and we can get 7 or 8 million for him, I would take that and reinvest in speeding up the rest of the team.

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it''s not a rumourMcNally normally phones round fans when a bid has come inusually rounds up the fee, signing on and agents fees, plus add ons etc so that we know exactly what the amount iswhy not get on the list ?

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I don''t think I can possibly discuss this with you any further LDC because literally everything factual and logical goes against everything you say. I''ll list a few.

1) You say that Snodgrass is the one who has to improve ''in particular''. Why? He was our best player last season and even if you don''t believe that he was a huge distance away from the worst. The worst player on a team NEVER wins POTS. Or scores and assists in the top league in England.

2) There aren''t ''plenty'' of others who see it how you apparently do. There''s a couple on here but you''re genuinely in the minority. I''ve told you how i know this but i''ll repeat. He won POTS. I live in the area, i''m surrounded by NCFC fans and i go to every home game and some away games. You''re in the minority. In this case, the minority are wrong. You can blast ''opinion'' comments at me as much as you like but factually and statistically you are wrong and eventually you will come to that understanding but never mind.

3) He''s scored and assisted in the Premier League in a team where multi-million pound midfielders and strikers were unable to do so. And no, it''s not because Snodgrass is an enigma of the kid who bullied you and wouldn''t let you play football when you were in Middle School.

4) He is the only player who has attracted public attention from MULTIPLE PREMIER LEAGUE CLUBS. Do you know why that is? I''ll tell you. Because professional football scouts and managers have watched him play, probably videos from the ENTIRE SEASON before making a bid - and decided he is Premier League quality and worth shelling out 6+ million on a guy with a year left on his contract.

There''s more but you bore me so i''ll stop now. The fact lharman (an Ipswich fan, by the way) agrees with you, speaks volumes.

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I wonder in the Championship if Snodgrass might be best played through the middle. He is our dead ball specialist, he gives his all and, in my opinion at least, does get balls into dangerous areas. Personally, I think the strikers were more to blame last season for our lack of goals particularly RvW. Many on this board seem to believe that Rvw''s movement is ''good''. I think quite the reverse. Much of time my view of last season was that RvW tended to amble around, often without obvious purpose, or seemed to run deliberately behind the defenders almost as if he didn''t want the responsibility of the ball. But to get back on message, Snodgrass whether through the middle or on the wing would get good balls into dangerous areas next season - Hooper and a target man who we also badly need in the team would feast on his service.

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[quote user="hogesar"]I don''t think I can possibly discuss this with you any further LDC because literally everything factual and logical goes against everything you say. I''ll list a few.

1) You say that Snodgrass is the one who has to improve ''in particular''. Why? He was our best player last season and even if you don''t believe that he was a huge distance away from the worst. The worst player on a team NEVER wins POTS. Or scores and assists in the top league in England.

2) There aren''t ''plenty'' of others who see it how you apparently do. There''s a couple on here but you''re genuinely in the minority. I''ve told you how i know this but i''ll repeat. He won POTS. I live in the area, i''m surrounded by NCFC fans and i go to every home game and some away games. You''re in the minority. In this case, the minority are wrong. You can blast ''opinion'' comments at me as much as you like but factually and statistically you are wrong and eventually you will come to that understanding but never mind.

3) He''s scored and assisted in the Premier League in a team where multi-million pound midfielders and strikers were unable to do so. And no, it''s not because Snodgrass is an enigma of the kid who bullied you and wouldn''t let you play football when you were in Middle School.

4) He is the only player who has attracted public attention from MULTIPLE PREMIER LEAGUE CLUBS. Do you know why that is? I''ll tell you. Because professional football scouts and managers have watched him play, probably videos from the ENTIRE SEASON before making a bid - and decided he is Premier League quality and worth shelling out 6+ million on a guy with a year left on his contract.

There''s more but you bore me so i''ll stop now. The fact lharman (an Ipswich fan, by the way) agrees with you, speaks volumes.[/quote]

Ok. We''ll agree to disagree.  No problem.  I see what I see - and I see a player who could do a lot better for the team than he does. But I hope if he stays he is instrumental in getting us promoted - and if he goes it will be interesting to see how he does in another team.  The Leeds team he was in and was captain of looked good on paper, but they did not get promoted with him as the main playmaker and since he''s been at Norwich we''ve struggled for goals - except from him.   

You carry on what you believe and I''ll carry on what I believe. I''ll be happy to be proved wrong and that he runs riot next season if he stays.   But if he stays and we don''t do well, or he goes and doesn''t do that well at another club.....I''ll be renewing this conversation with you...........

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