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Selling out our fans for a few pieces of silver.

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[quote user="hogesar"]Don''t understand why I wake up and still see this thread as active. Wiz admits he''s just trolling - it''s ALL he does - so hardly surprising. He''s not an NCFC fan - an NCFC fan doesn''t spend 90% of their time awake coming up with the next thing to criticise the club for, make a thread about it, and then get defensive when people point out he''s not actually an NCFC fan. I''ve defended him a few times but it''s all pretty sad and depressing - and embarrassing. But hey-ho.[/quote]

 

Oh brilliant hoggy, so perhaps the club will give me a refund on this season''s membership.

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Sorry Wiz, you know i''ve stuck up for you in the past.

And despite the views you''ve put across in the past being, shall we say, extreme in the least - I never doubted you as an NCFC fan.

But you surely have to see that posting stuff primarily to wind up / annoy fellow NCFC fans - whilst funny once or twice - doing it on repeat just seems boring and unnecessary to me. LDC had a habit of doing it for a while - posting thread after thread of pointless inane questions which just pissed off fans who had just seen their club relegated.

I think rather than lashing out at the club at every possible occasion - and if you are a NCFC fan - you should concentrate on using your membership to get you down to Carrow Road for a few games next season as i''d like to think they''ll be far more entertaining that what we''ve had over the past couple years.

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[quote user="Wizard of Waveney "]^ plastic[/quote]

 

You think Hull are paying by credit card Waveney ?

 

As to the OP - £7m plus £1m add-ons is good business for a player who can go for free after 12 months.  Snodgrass has always divided opinion because he undoubtedly makes a contribution in scoring a few goals and is the most effective player we''ve had for a free kick on goal going back at least 20 years.  But he does tend to slow the play up, and this just didn''t work with our striking options last year.  He was much more effective when we had Holt up front who could compete physically for crosses and also won free kicks just outside the box for Snoddy to take - those were all too rare last season when RVW rarely got a free kick even when he was pushed over.

 

Given our strength in the wing positions it makes sense to cash in on him at a sensible price.

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[quote user="littleyellowbirdie"]. Kid yourself he won''t be missed if it cheers you up, by all means, but make no mistake you are kidding yourselves.

Even now, I''d still say hang on to him and let him go on a free next season is worthwhile in a bid to win promotion. £8m is peanuts next to the annual revenue from the Premier League.[/quote]The fact is we don''t know LYB. It''s a gamble, in the same way not firing Hughton earlier was a gamble last season. But what is in no doubt is that this is the very last opportunity to get anything approaching 8 m for him. Anybody who thinks otherwise really ARE kidding themselves, just as Morty continues to kid himself that every bit of info put out by the official sources is BOUND to be true......

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Are you implying the club is lying to us then reggie? I take it you have proof to back this claim up?

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[quote user="morty"]Lol reggie, you''re a wee bit obsessed with me, aren''t you?[/quote]That''s another thing you kid yourself about Morts.I was merely illustrating your latest ridiculous, provocative and wholly inaccurate posting earlier in the thread.

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[quote user="hogesar"]LDC had a habit of doing it for a while - posting thread after thread of pointless inane questions which just pissed off fans who had just seen their club relegated.[/quote]

There was a reason for that.  After we were relegated I watched thread after thread, post after post of people who were full of certainty about things, ignoring any kind of wider view and just sticking with a one sided mantra and tirade against the manager.    I like to see a wider view - that yes, the manager was not getting it right - but also that players weren''t getting it right - fans were not helping with a constant undercurrent of negativity that could have boiled over at any time -  we kept getting injuries to key players - everything going through Snodgrass which either meant he scored or we didn''t score at all - and other things which I can''t be bothered to bring to mind.  My questions were not designed to p*ss people off - they were designed to try and get a wider view of things.   That isn''t popular as this board always likes to see extreme views - and even when I put across a view that I see as balanced,  it is taken way overboard and called extreme because it is different to what people want to see. 

You don''t seem to like it when people say stuff that is negative about Snodgrass - and I''m not the only one that does that - is that because you think you are right and can''t see a negative side to him - or is it that you just can''t stand the thought of our best player not really being that good?   

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Lol, look back at your posts you sad little man , you mention me in most of them.

However, care to expand on your claim that the club regularly lies to us?

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Dear Old Morts. He just lives in his little bubble and believes his own and others hype.It''s guys like him who''ve kept government spin doctors and the Daily Mail /Sun in business for so long. I bet he still believes Andy Coulson because he said he never hacked Millie Dowler''s phone.....

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And this is the bit where reggie realises he has said something stupid that he can''t substantiate, and desperately tries to deflect from it.

You are an embarrassing idiot.

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[quote user="lake district canary"]My questions were not designed to p*ss people off - they were designed to try and get a wider view of things.   That isn''t popular as this board always likes to see extreme views - and even when I put across a view that I see as balanced,  it is taken way overboard and called extreme because it is different to what people want to see. 

[/quote]Hmm, Lake. You have a go at me for being economical with the truth, but, with respect ,the above is a complete travesty of what actually happened for the vast majority of last season. You views were anything but "balanced" . You had a view that was perfectly acceptable, and you were entitled to it. In your more lucid moments it was often thought-provoking. But balanced it wasn''t. Pretty extreme actually, because it was diametrically opposed to what it seemed the majority of people were advocating. You protested that it was not done merely to be contrary, and, I''m sort of inclined to believe that, though I often had my doubts (as did many others). People do not "want to see" anything. But they are entitled to their views. And so are you.But please do not try and grab the moral high ground over this. Because it won''t wash.

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[quote user="morty"]And this is the bit where reggie realises he has said something stupid that he can''t substantiate, and desperately tries to deflect from it.

You are an embarrassing idiot.[/quote]And THIS is the bit where Morts lets it slip that he views anybody who says anything that does not fit in with his narrow agenda as ''a liar''.Oh, and I nearly forgot ..also the bit where he resorts to the kindergarten insults.You can read him like a (children''s) book.

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[quote user="lake district canary"]fans were not helping with a constant undercurrent of negativity...[/quote]Just to clarify Lakey, you are talking about the fans on here rather than those at the games I assume, as you admitted you didn''t attend many. In which case I agree with you because I didn''t see or hear all the teeth gnashing ''n whingeing ''n wailing ''n whining ''n whimpering until I got home and turned my laptop on. 

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[quote user="Reggie Strayshun"]Dear Old Morts. He just lives in his little bubble and believes his own and others hype.

It''s guys like him who''ve kept government spin doctors and the Daily Mail /Sun in business for so long. I bet he still believes Andy Coulson because he said he never hacked Millie Dowler''s phone.....
[/quote]

 

I think that is the most bizarre thing I''ve seen on this message board and bearing in mind some of the other posters on here that''s really really bizarre.

 

 

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[quote user="lappinitup"] I didn''t see or hear all the teeth gnashing ''n whingeing ''n wailing ''n whining ''n whimpering until I got home and turned my laptop on. [/quote]Well, Lapps. I won''t do you the discourtesy of accusing you of ''lying'' , saying stuff that is ''unsubstantiable'' or other such nonsense. There are people on here who are much better at that than me.What I will say, however, is you must have experienced a very different thing  wherever you sit than where I did. As the season of disaster wore on I can assure you that, in my part of the ground , during the games there were plenty of the emotions beginning with ''w'' of which you talk. It CERTAINLY was not confined to this forum.

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Reggie, you going to back up these claims that the club is lying to us?
No, of course you''re not.

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[quote user="Reggie Strayshun"]What I will say, however, is you must have experienced a very different thing  wherever you sit than where I did. As the season of disaster wore on I can assure you that, in my part of the ground , during the games there were plenty of the emotions beginning with ''w'' of which you talk. It CERTAINLY was not confined to this forum.[/quote]You miss the point Reggie (nothing unusual there). Of course there was discontent in the ground but not to the extent there was on here. And poor old Lakey is influenced by what he reads on here rather than what''s really happened during the games. Why do you think he''s always blathering on about "negativity"? If the fans at games reacted like the people on here there''d be queues at Foundry Bridge waiting to throw themselves in the Wensum like lemmings.

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Morty. Let me spell it out to you in words of one syllable (or thereabouts) that even you might understand.First.....I don''t have to back up my opinions (yes, remember them ?) to someone like you.Second... and I''ll break it to you gently as you clearly are a naive, trusting soul....... all football clubs (not just Norwich) have been guilty from time to time of being a little less than straight with their fans. Economical with the truth, if you like. Over transfer fees, over player wages, over managerial appointments, over accounts, over recruitment policy. Etc. It may come as something as a shock to you, but...whisper it quietly. Not everybody tells the truth all the time. Mr Coulson (TC) being one example.

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[quote user="Reggie Strayshun"]Morty. Let me spell it out to you in words of one syllable (or thereabouts) that even you might understand.First.....I don''t have to back up my opinions (yes, remember them ?) to someone like you.Second... and I''ll break it to you gently as you clearly are a naive, trusting soul....... all football clubs (not just Norwich) have been guilty from time to time of being a little less than straight with their fans. Economical with the truth, if you like. Over transfer fees, over player wages, over managerial appointments, over accounts, over recruitment policy. Etc. It may come as something as a shock to you, but...whisper it quietly. Not everybody tells the truth all the time. Mr Coulson (TC) being one example.[/quote]So you basically have nothing, yup, thats what I thought[Y]

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[quote user="lappinitup"]You miss the point Reggie (nothing unusual there). Of course there was discontent in the ground but not to the extent there was on here. And poor old Lakey is influenced by what he reads on here rather than what''s really happened during the games. Why do you think he''s always blathering on about "negativity"? If the fans at games reacted like the people on here there''d be queues at Foundry Bridge waiting to throw themselves in the Wensum like lemmings. [/quote]OK Lapps. Not too sure why there needed to be the gratuitous insult in there, but there we go. You''ve clarified your point, and thanks for that. Your original post did rather read that it was only when you turned on your laptop, and tuned into Pink Un forum, that you heard any whinging and whining . But now I see that''s not the case.

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[quote user="Reggie Strayshun"][quote user="lappinitup"]You miss the point Reggie (nothing unusual there). Of course there was discontent in the ground but not to the extent there was on here. And poor old Lakey is influenced by what he reads on here rather than what''s really happened during the games. Why do you think he''s always blathering on about "negativity"? If the fans at games reacted like the people on here there''d be queues at Foundry Bridge waiting to throw themselves in the Wensum like lemmings. [/quote]OK Lapps. Not too sure why there needed to be the gratuitous insult in there, but there we go. You''ve clarified your point, and thanks for that. Your original post did rather read that it was only when you turned on your laptop, and tuned into Pink Un forum, that you heard any whinging and whining . But now I see that''s not the case.[/quote]Thanks Reggie. And now can you see how susceptible youngsters like Lakey are influenced by what they read on here and react accordingly?

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[quote user="lappinitup"][quote user="Reggie Strayshun"]What I will say, however, is you must have experienced a very different thing  wherever you sit than where I did. As the season of disaster wore on I can assure you that, in my part of the ground , during the games there were plenty of the emotions beginning with ''w'' of which you talk. It CERTAINLY was not confined to this forum.[/quote]You miss the point Reggie (nothing unusual there). Of course there was discontent in the ground but not to the extent there was on here. And poor old Lakey is influenced by what he reads on here rather than what''s really happened during the games. Why do you think he''s always blathering on about "negativity"? If the fans at games reacted like the people on here there''d be queues at Foundry Bridge waiting to throw themselves in the Wensum like lemmings. [/quote]

I am of course influenced by what I read on here - but I also go to

sufficient matches to get a good idea of what goes on there too.  Its

not rocket science - but people keep telling me that crowds getting

negative - whether openly or behind the scenes - does not affect  a

club.  But it does.  I''m not blaming anyone - just saying how it is. 

Negativity is bad for a football club - whether its the manager, players

or fans - or all three.  

Just before the home game with Man City I started a thread to suggest people keep their cool and keep supporting, even if things went badly. Why did I do that? Because I could sense that things were coming to a boiling point.  It only needed one bad performance for things to spill over into outright rage.   It didn''t happen because we played well that day - and that has been the story most of the season - unrest behind the scenes, people not happy and just waiting to be able to let their frustration out.  That it didn''t happen until the West Brom game is because Hughton and the team just managed to get the results to prevent it.

The sum total of Lambert leaving, existing players getting a bit unsettled because the new manager was asking them to do things a bit differently, fans fed up because they are not getting what they are used to seeing, a manager trying to develop a system that would sustain us in the division - then this last  season new players coming into that mixture and not getting immediate results - all perpetuated the negative feeling that has pervaded everything to do with Norwich over the last two years, whether its on here or fans you talk to.   Its no wonder Hughton failed - everything was against him - maybe much like everything was against Moyes at MU - following a hugely successful manager is perhaps one of the hardest things to do in football. 

If Hughton deserves any credit it is for taking the job on in the first place.   But I wouldn''t expect any of his detractors to accept that  - any more than they gave him credit for any of the good results we did get.   He failed - I have no qualms about that - and we move on - but the bigger picture is now how we treat the next manager. Keep positive and we will do well - too much negativity and it will reflect on the pitch.   As sure as eggs is eggs.   Ask one or two Man City fans if you disagree with me - they know all about too many fans having a downer on the club - it was endemic every year being in the shadow of MU for so long (until the money arrived).  The problem is we don''t have the excuse of being in the shadow of a bigger club.........

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[quote user="lappinitup"]Thanks Reggie. And now can you see how susceptible youngsters like Lakey are influenced by what they read on here and react accordingly?[/quote]Sorry Lapps. Perhaps I am being obtuse this afternoon, or maybe you are not expressing yourself clearly enough,but you''ll need to clarify that again. Are you suggesting that I (and presumably others) should tailor/amend our postings on here to take account of people like Lake''s sensitive nature ?! Or should it be him that ''reacts accordingly''.If it''s the former, then I''m afraid you are wasting your breath. It''s a total non-starter.

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Wondering why Wiz won''t answer the question if he had ever seen Snodgrass play in real life (and not just on a stream)? Is it because he doesn''t support the team??? The original couch potato fan full of opinion but zero support?

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Even recognising all his faults, he is both mine and my eight year old sons favourite player so will be gutted to see him leave. Always gave his all and even when not playing well never hid from the ball which players with arguably more skill have done.

I concede anything over £6m is a decent price given last year of contract.

Probably don''t need to replace him in terms of playing position but we do need that iconic player who shows commitment and passion for the shirt ..could lafferty be that man and become the new holt????

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[quote user="lake district canary"]

I am of course influenced by what I read on here - but I also go to sufficient matches to get a good idea of what goes on there too.  Its not rocket science - but people keep telling me that crowds getting negative - whether openly or behind the scenes - does not affect  a club.  But it does.  I''m not blaming anyone - just saying how it is.  Negativity is bad for a football club - whether its the manager, players or fans - or all three.  


Just before the home game with Man City I started a thread to suggest people keep their cool and keep supporting, even if things went badly. Why did I do that? Because I could sense that things were coming to a boiling point.  It only needed one bad performance for things to spill over into outright rage.   It didn''t happen because we played well that day - and that has been the story most of the season - unrest behind the scenes, people not happy and just waiting to be able to let their frustration out.  That it didn''t happen until the West Brom game is because Hughton and the team just managed to get the results to prevent it.


The sum total of Lambert leaving, existing players getting a bit unsettled because the new manager was asking them to do things a bit differently, fans fed up because they are not getting what they are used to seeing, a manager trying to develop a system that would sustain us in the division - then this last  season new players coming into that mixture and not getting immediate results - all perpetuated the negative feeling that has pervaded everything to do with Norwich over the last two years, whether its on here or fans you talk to.   Its no wonder Hughton failed - everything was against him - maybe much like everything was against Moyes at MU - following a hugely successful manager is perhaps one of the hardest things to do in football. 


If Hughton deserves any credit it is for taking the job on in the first place.   But I wouldn''t expect any of his detractors to accept that  - any more than they gave him credit for any of the good results we did get.   He failed - I have no qualms about that - and we move on - but the bigger picture is now how we treat the next manager. Keep positive and we will do well - too much negativity and it will reflect on the pitch.   As sure as eggs is eggs.   Ask one or two Man City fans if you disagree with me - they know all about too many fans having a downer on the club - it was endemic every year being in the shadow of MU for so long (until the money arrived).  The problem is we don''t have the excuse of being in the shadow of a bigger club.........





[/quote]

 

Lakey, no matter how many times you spin it or seek a new angle to make the same point repetitively ( ad nauseam ) you can''t change the facts. You say no wonder Hughton failed....everything was against him. Well, everything was not against him. After escaping from the lower end of the table at the eleventh hour in his first season he then had lots of money to spend on players to fit into a system that was in his domain to control. We all know what happened. The bottom line is that in his second season we went backwards, ending up with 11 fewer points and were relegated.

You then attempt to support your argument by using the Moyes factor at Manchester United. Well, everything was also not against David Moyes at Manchester United. I''m sure United were expecting and prepared to allow some slippage in Moyes first season. What they didn''t expect was that Manchester United would end up below the position Moyes achieved with Everton the previous season, and well below what Everton achieved last season, it has to be said, with a new manager ( Martinez ), who also had the difficulty of following what many would say was a very successful Moyes management period at Everton, but Martinez rose to the challenge.  Digest these last four highlighted words carefully . Failing to achieve that are the reason that Hughton and Moyes are no longer in the jobs they had, not because everything was against them.   

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