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Houghtons Legacy of our time in the Premier League

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I do not know why you think I''m looking for an argument over this, LDC . I''m not. And I''ve not added any sort of ''interpretation''I have asked a perfectly reasonable question....... you''ve made a statement that you agree is ''obvious'' (ie that Hughton''s tactics did not work well enough, often enough) . So, what , so fundamental ,has happened over the course of the last 6 months or so that has led you to be of that opinion as opposed to the one that you repeated over and over again then; that basically Hughton was doing OK and working on the right lines ?I do not know what your definition of an ''argument ''is., but from my angle it''s a justified enquiry......

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Hughton''s legacy is that he kept us in the Prem for that extra year and we paid off our (external) debts.

 

 

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It''s the truth though. And he had the bottle to try and keep us up, unlike your hero.

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Hughton''s legacy is one of unmitigated failure.....

Failure to win football matches.

Failure to score goals.

Failure to stop conceding goals.

Failure to entertain.

If Hughton and his cronies ever get offered another managerial position in the top two divisions, then those responsible for employing them deserve every ounce of failure they will suffer.

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[quote user="Canary fun and games "][quote user="Herman "]It''s the truth though. And he had the bottle to try and keep us up, unlike your hero.[/quote]

We would have been comfortably top half had mcnasty no forced him out[/quote]You mean like Villa were Waveney?

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Hughton''s legacy of our time in the Premier League is that in future the clappers will have rounded edges.

 

 

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Villa are a club in crisis off the pitch with no money to spend he has worked wonders. The man is a genius.

Had he built on his work we would be challenging for a European place by now.

McNally has a lot to answer for

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[quote user="Canary fun and games "]Villa are a club in crisis off the pitch with no money to spend he has worked wonders. The man is a genius. Had he built on his work we would be challenging for a European place by now. McNally has a lot to answer for[/quote]

 

If only he had, instead of running away, with messy pants, to the mighty Villa.

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[quote user="Trevor Hockeys Beard"]Just how much has The Messier spent on players during his first two years at Villain?

there was a time when I thought he could walk on water - now it seems he can barely float.[/quote]Gotta feel a bit sorry for Lambert right now, knowing Roy Keanne is waiting to step in at the earliest opportunity. Nothing is more certain than that.

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[quote user="Reggie Strayshun"]I do not know why you think I''m looking for an argument over this, LDC . I''m not. And I''ve not added any sort of ''interpretation''I have asked a perfectly reasonable question....... you''ve made a statement that you agree is ''obvious'' (ie that Hughton''s tactics did not work well enough, often enough) . So, what , so fundamental ,has happened over the course of the last 6 months or so that has led you to be of that opinion as opposed to the one that you repeated over and over again then; that basically Hughton was doing OK and working on the right lines ?I do not know what your definition of an ''argument ''is., but from my angle it''s a justified enquiry......[/quote]

I don''t want to keep going over and over it - its been done ad nauseam.  But if he had done a little - just a little - better - and kept us up, everything the board held out for would have been accepted as a justifiable course of action.    The margins were that small.    I supported him till November, then supported the board''s decision to keep him on - and our home record was ok up to the WBA match, with good performances particularly against MC and Spurs.   But the inevitable conclusion is that we weren''t good enough often enough - and it doesn''t need me to have changed my position in the last six months to say that - its just stating a reality. 

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[quote user="lake district canary"] But the inevitable conclusion is that we weren''t good enough often enough - and it doesn''t need me to have changed my position in the last six months to say that - its just stating a reality. 

[/quote]OK. Fine, Lake. I can see what you are saying now. It wasn''t that difficult to do first time, surely ? There was no need for this kneejerk ''you are putting words in my mouth'' type guff.While on that subject , have you ever stopped and considered this ? There are a large number of regular posters on here, with an equally large range of views, opinions, agendas, concerns , writing styles etc. But, across this range of people you seem to very regularly complain that people are misquoting/misrepresenting/misinterpreting you/putting words in your mouth etc.  I''ve not done a scientific assessment of this but my feeling is that you grumble about such things more than the rest of posters put together. Never a day goes by seemingly than you are accusing someone of this trait.So my question is, have you ever wondered why this is ? Is there a reason for it ? This point is not meant maliciously, but in my walk of life if problems have a habit of recurring very regularly, I try to examine them and see of there is a factor that leads to them and do something about it to rectify it.

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[quote user="Reggie Strayshun"][quote user="lake district canary"] But the inevitable conclusion is that we weren''t good enough often enough - and it doesn''t need me to have changed my position in the last six months to say that - its just stating a reality.  [/quote]OK. Fine, Lake. I can see what you are saying now. It wasn''t that difficult to do first time, surely ? There was no need for this kneejerk ''you are putting words in my mouth'' type guff.While on that subject , have you ever stopped and considered this ? There are a large number of regular posters on here, with an equally large range of views, opinions, agendas, concerns , writing styles etc. But, across this range of people you seem to very regularly complain that people are misquoting/misrepresenting/misinterpreting you/putting words in your mouth etc.  I''ve not done a scientific assessment of this but my feeling is that you grumble about such things more than the rest of posters put together. Never a day goes by seemingly than you are accusing someone of this trait.So my question is, have you ever wondered why this is ? Is there a reason for it ? This point is not meant maliciously, but in my walk of life if problems have a habit of recurring very regularly, I try to examine them and see of there is a factor that leads to them and do something about it to rectify it.[/quote]

[:D] If posting on here is akin to real life, I would start to worry.  The issues on here are that there are some posters who seek to undermine you, or wind you up, or abuse you, rubbish what you say out of hand or a mixture of those things, for their own sad reasons.   Real life doesn''t come close.  On the whole the people I meet through work or socially are friendly, helpful and thankfully worthwhile dealing with.  Maybe I''m lucky, but this board is so far from that as to be unrecognisable.     So yes, there are times when people misrepresent you on here, especially if it is in their interests to misrepresent you because you have a differing opinion and they have no other way of dealing with it. It is much easier to ridicule or twist a poster''s words than come up with an argument sometimes.    Some posters do it to everyone - City 1st for instance - so its not just me that gets it.   I am very aware of it whether its about me or someone else - and if you are honest with yourself you will know that you have sometimes changed words or changed the meaning of what has been written occasionally - either intentionally or not - and I''ve shown evidence of that in the past.

In this thread you queried a statement I made, saying it was ridiculous - but one that you actually agree with!  That is why I questioned your reasoning about it. [quote user="Reggie Strayshun"][quote user="lake district canary"]when the tactics worked, they worked well - its just that they didn''t work well enough, often enough.   [/quote]Well, Lake, just read the bit I''ve highlighted, and you''ll see just how ridiculous that is.

Obviously you cannot deny that factually it''s true (at a superficial

level) but I''m sorry, to be a PL manager you need to have your tactics

work well MOST OF THE TIME. [/quote]See what I mean?  Calling it ridiculous, but then saying you agree with it. You then tried to qualify that with saying it was superficial and managers need to be better. But if you make statements like you did there, be prepared to take the flack. Saying it was a "knee-jerk" reaction is also a bit unfair.  Calling a statement that a lot of would say is accurate  "ridiculous" is asking for trouble, superficial or not. 

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Lake. Just to be clear on this (and I think you know it too !), I said right at the end that I saw what you were saying...not that I agreed with it. Now THAT''s putting words in mouths if eve I saw it !I also only meant that the fact you''d said something as obvious as that was ridiculous . Clearly I qualified it, quite reasonably, that it was true at a superficial level, simply because one cannot seriously disagree with anyone who said that Hughton''s tactics should have worked more often. Yet again you are trying to wriggle out of something, I fear.

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[quote user="Reggie Strayshun"]Lake. Just to be clear on this (and I think you know it too !), I said right at the end that I saw what you were saying...not that I agreed with it. Now THAT''s putting words in mouths if eve I saw it !I also only meant that the fact you''d said something as obvious as that was ridiculous . Clearly I qualified it, quite reasonably, that it was true at a superficial level, simply because one cannot seriously disagree with anyone who said that Hughton''s tactics should have worked more often. Yet again you are trying to wriggle out of something, I fear.[/quote]See below.[quote user="Reggie Strayshun"][quote user="lake district canary"]Yes - and weren''t we all.   I''m not going to say much about it anymore because I get shouted down, but when the tactics worked, they worked well - its just that they didn''t work well enough, often enough.   [/quote]Well,

Lake, just read the bit I''ve highlighted, and you''ll see just how

ridiculous that is. Obviously you cannot deny that factually it''s true [/quote]If that''s not agreeing, I don''t know what is......

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The fact that you two don''t seem to think this is real life baffles me. If it''s not real life then what is it?

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[quote user="nutty nigel"]The fact that you two don''t seem to think this is real life baffles me. If it''s not real life then what is it?[/quote]

Never fear, Nige . Can''t speak for LDC, but I certainly know football is real life.Try telling a Brazilian that football is ''not real life'' this morning !

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[quote user="nutty nigel"]The fact that you two don''t seem to think this is real life baffles me. If it''s not real life then what is it?[/quote]

Do you spend your time in "real life" being sworn at, being ridiculed for holding an opinion, trying to have a decent conversation with people and being interrupted by total idiots and/or loonies?   I don''t.   I have never been in such a place as this in real life and frankly wouldn''t want to.  Some of the people on here are decent fair minded individuals who you can have a laugh with/discuss with, without any sh*t thrown in - and I wish there were more of them - but on the whole - this place resembles a schoolboy''s playground with bullies trying to rule the roost.  Its a shame some who are old enough to know better didn''t leave that aspect of life behind, when they grew up.     Bullying, ridiculing, belittling, winding up and abuse all goes on, on here - and the only place I have seen that is at school......then not again until I joined this board - and the only reason I joined the board in 2009 is because I was sick of reading the abusive cr*p that was on there at that time.  There are of course some real life aspects to the board, but what friendship and camaraderie there is, is quite often lost in a sea of bitterness and bile.  

Still the place to come to talk about Norwich though! [:D]

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[quote user="lake district canary"] and the only reason I joined the board in 2009 is because I was sick of reading the abusive cr*p that was on there at that time. 

[/quote]Don''t really understand the logic of that statement, Lake. What you are effectively saying is ...''.I saw all the hatred and bile that''s spouted on Pink Un forum and thought , "I''d like some of that "....''Presumably the level of strife on here is in direct proportion to how NCFC are doing as a team/club ? We have just been through a period of poor play, poor results, poor management, and relegation . So is it altogether surprising that people are going to be a) frustrated, b) angry and c) of wildly differing opinions as to what to do to remedy it , particularly when many posters appear at the best, intransigent ?

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[quote user="Reggie Strayshun"][quote user="lake district canary"] and the only reason I joined the board in 2009 is because I was sick of reading the abusive cr*p that was on there at that time.  [/quote]Don''t really understand the logic of that statement, Lake. What you are effectively saying is ...''.I saw all the hatred and bile that''s spouted on Pink Un forum and thought , "I''d like some of that "....''[/quote]

Why would you think that?   The logic of starting to post on the board was to try and bring some balance to debates at the time (around Gunn''s departure).   The bile was so over the top by a few posters  -  if people did put forward more reasonable views they were shouted down/abused and ridiculed.    My putting my views across and standing up to the bully type posters has caused me a lot of bother, but that is what you get for standing up to people who are giving you grief.   Its never really bothered me that much, although in the early days it did upset me that putting across reasonable arguments could be met with such unpleasantness, but this is still the best place to talk about our club.   Bullies and trolls and loonies exist in society as well as on here - but at least on here you can answer them back and give them some grief in return - something bullies don''t like as by definition they like to be the top dog, even though underneath they are insecure cowards.  I don''t tend to get involved in arguments and unpleasantness in real life - and if I ever do meet negative people or people I don''t like in real life, then I  walk away.    This board is still the only good place for us to discuss our club.  Real life in some ways maybe, but in other ways, totally not.

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[quote user="lake district canary"]Why would you think that?   The logic of starting to post on the board was to try and bring some balance to debates at the time (around Gunn''s departure).   The bile was so over the top by a few posters  -  if people did put forward more reasonable views they were shouted down/abused and ridiculed.    My putting my views across and standing up to the bully type posters has caused me a lot of bother, but that is what you get for standing up to people who are giving you grief.  

[/quote]Well, what I stated was certainly an interpretation that could indeed be inferred from what you wrote.....So, basically , what you were saying is that you felt that, having seen all the nastiness  on here at first hand, you could in some way redress the balance by your more ''reasonable'' methods. The ultimate end, presumably, being to try to hound out the bullies, by showing them the error of their ways (or have I ''misunderstood ''THAT too ?)So, five years on , Lake ,how successful do you feel you''ve been in your honourable quest ?

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[quote user="Reggie Strayshun"][quote user="lake district canary"]Why would you think that?   The logic of starting to post on the board was to try and bring some balance to debates at the time (around Gunn''s departure).   The bile was so over the top by a few posters  -  if people did put forward more reasonable views they were shouted down/abused and ridiculed.    My putting my views across and standing up to the bully type posters has caused me a lot of bother, but that is what you get for standing up to people who are giving you grief.   [/quote]Well, what I stated was certainly an interpretation that could indeed be inferred from what you wrote.....So, basically , what you were saying is that you felt that, having seen all the nastiness  on here at first hand, you could in some way redress the balance by your more ''reasonable'' methods. The ultimate end, presumably, being to try to hound out the bullies, by showing them the error of their ways (or have I ''misunderstood ''THAT too ?)So, five years on , Lake ,how successful do you feel you''ve been in your honourable quest ?[/quote]

Life is a mixture of good, bad and somewhere in between - imo roughly - 20% good, %20% bad, 60% in between.   This board is imo - roughly - 60% bad, 20% good and 20% in between.  That isn''t going to change because of  me or any one poster, however long they are on the board for, but as I keep saying, the more people that are positive, the better it is.  There is nothing that negativity hates more than positivity - as is shown to the reaction to people who show a positive viewpoint.  Positivity flies in the face of what the negative types are all about - people feel almost comfortable being negative - because it is easier to be negative than positive. 

We expect the team to be positive so why don''t we try to be too?  If things go badly, a more positive viewer will recognise the bad things but  try to take the positives away from the experience so they can build on those for next time.   The negative viewer will just see bad things - and will take those onboard and be stuck with them for a future occasion.  I''ve lost count of the times that I''ve been told I''m wrong for seeing positives in defeats and bad performances.   For the negative viewer it is all bad.    For the positive viewer it is not all good - because losing isn''t good - but they will take what positives they can. 

Quest? Its not a quest - just a Norwich supporter wanting to see a more positive outlook on what is the only decent talking shop about our club.  Negativity does not prevail in real life - so it doesn''t have to on here.  

 

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You two should just swap phone numbers, because I can pretty much assure you that no one else is even vaguely interested in what you are whining on about.

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[quote user="morty"]You two should just swap phone numbers, because I can pretty much assure you that no one else is even vaguely interested in what you are whining on about.[/quote]

Its called discussion. I know you don''t like that kind of thing  unless it is on your terms, but there it is......no-one asked you to like it.

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[quote user="lake district canary"][quote user="morty"]You two should just swap phone numbers, because I can pretty much assure you that no one else is even vaguely interested in what you are whining on about.[/quote]

Its called discussion. I know you don''t like that kind of thing  unless it is on your terms, but there it is......no-one asked you to like it.

[/quote]And it is Norwich City related how?

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[quote user="morty"]You two should just swap phone numbers, because I can pretty much assure you that no one else is even vaguely interested in what you are whining on about.[/quote]Sorry, Morty. I didn''t realise that the Pink Un forum was your own personal fiefdom where  you make the rules.You may like to think it is.But.....I''ve got  news for you . (and this applies to your pseudo confrontational partner in crime TC too, btw)  .It isn''t.

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[quote user="morty"][quote user="lake district canary"][quote user="morty"]You two should just swap phone numbers, because I can pretty much assure you that no one else is even vaguely interested in what you are whining on about.[/quote]

Its called discussion. I know you don''t like that kind of thing  unless it is on your terms, but there it is......no-one asked you to like it. [/quote]And it is Norwich City related how?[/quote]

It started off as a question from Nutty about "real life", so the conversation has turned into talking about the merits of this board as opposed to real life - and this board is to do with Norwich City.  Its not difficult - all you have to do is read through the thread.  If you can''t be bothered to do that, then you have nothing really to say, have you?   

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