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Tim Dawson

Pochettino - Walker all over again?

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Felt really sorry for Southampton fans this morning, it reminded me of Everton poaching Walker from us, that talented squad is about to be ripped apart and i suspect Lennon is the replacement for Pochettino.

I always wondered how far that squad of ours could have gone under Walker, a few clever signings along with youngsters like Eadie, and the emerging O`Neill, Bellamy and Andy Johnson coming thru the ranks.

Sadly it seems clubs seem to think they can only go so far and until they change that mentality that is all they will achieve.

Maybe one day we will see one of the so called underdogs rise and achieve a few years domination, sadly in this money driven era we live in i seriously doubt it, and for me thats a shame.......

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Totally agree Tim.
Pochettino has worked absolute wonders at So''ton, and it must be gut-wrenching for the Saints fans to see him walk (if indeed he does go). 

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A lot of truth in that, Tim, but it happens all the time, and has done for years.Most recently Rodgers to L''pool from Swansea. The Walker /Everton thing was long before the moneyed days we have now.I think that the crux of the matter is that nowadays it''s almost impossible for clubs of Norwich, Southampton, Swansea etc to do the sort of thing we did in the early 90''s, so if a good manager emerges, and he wants to excel, then the chances of him moving to a bigger club are not just pretty likely, but verging on 100%And it''s always been the case that there really is no point in smaller clubs resisting the advances of the big boys. Because in the end, money talks.

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Yes i agree with you Reggie, just saddens me as with us many years back what might have been.

Money wasn`t quite such a big issue back in the early 90`s and i really do think the football we played had we somehow kept everyone with an addition here and there we would have been a top six side throughout the nineties.

And for those too young to remember , for a season and a half we really did have something special.

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[quote user="Tim Dawson"] , for a season and a half we really did have something special.[/quote]Well, on a topical note, Tim, let''s be hoping that in eighteen months time, one of the big boys is beating a path to Carrow Rd trying to poach Neil Adams. Because, if that happens, it means we''ll have gone straight back up to the Prem, and be doing extremely well in it in 2015-16 !

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It''s a really sad indictment of the current state of the game that none of the ''smaller'' clubs can build anything special for very long.It would be interesting to see that if Adams were to build something similar to what Lambert achieved or indeed Mike Walker, would his love of Norwich be tested to breaking point by an offer from a big club? Who knows but would be nice to find out.

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On the plus side if your looking for a skip in the a couple of years time Pochettino Skip Hire will be offering some great introductory rates.

 

 

 

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[quote user="Reggie Strayshun"]A lot of truth in that, Tim, but it happens all the time, and has done for years.Most recently Rodgers to L''pool from Swansea. The Walker /Everton thing was long before the moneyed days we have now.I think that the crux of the matter is that nowadays it''s almost impossible for clubs of Norwich, Southampton, Swansea etc to do the sort of thing we did in the early 90''s, so if a good manager emerges, and he wants to excel, then the chances of him moving to a bigger club are not just pretty likely, but verging on 100%And it''s always been the case that there really is no point in smaller clubs resisting the advances of the big boys. Because in the end, money talks.[/quote]I think you''ve just highlighted another benefit of the Adams appointment. If he does succeed, and I think there''s a decent chance that he can, he''s the least likely of all the people to run off as soon as there''s another hole to bolt to.

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This shows why it is important to set up the kind of management structure Norwich are currently attempting. Southampton have Les Reed doing something similar to Norwich''s new Technical Director (although it does sound like Reed has slightly more power) and will mean that Southampton will probably be able to replace Pochettino without a huge amount of transitional issues. I imagine they will probably appoint someone like Oscar Garcia who has a very similar style of management and there won''t be a massive change in how they play football.

 

Pochettino is mostly responsible for match preperation and tactics, he doesn''t control training and transfers are mostly done above his head, he is also told which youth players need to be intergrated into the first team squad. By isolating the manager away from strategic, or high level decisions it is possible to avoid the massively destructive effect the lose of a manage, a la Walker, has.

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[quote user="Norfolk Canary"]This is totally irrelevant to Norwich City Football Club.........

If you want to have a w ank over Pochettino please visit a Spurs or Southampton forum...............[/quote]

Oh no, quick everyone, it''s the forum police, telling us what we can and can''t discuss...and in the process not understanding that it is relevant to NCFC....

I''d echo the point that this is about building the club rather than a reliance on one manager, although I wonder if when they have the premier ''B'' league promising managers (Adams?) could be poached to manage Chelsea ''B'' before graduating to the first team..

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[quote user="Hightower"][quote user="Norfolk Canary"]This is totally irrelevant to Norwich City Football Club.........

If you want to have a w ank over Pochettino please visit a Spurs or Southampton forum...............[/quote]

Oh no, quick everyone, it''s the forum police, telling us what we can and can''t discuss...and in the process not understanding that it is relevant to NCFC....

I''d echo the point that this is about building the club rather than a reliance on one manager, although I wonder if when they have the premier ''B'' league promising managers (Adams?) could be poached to manage Chelsea ''B'' before graduating to the first team..[/quote]To be fair, I started an almost identical thread to this last night (i.e. before this one was created) and it did occur to me after the event that I should have posted it in ''other football'', although given the recent hand wringing over our own management lately, the examples of others are arguably relevant.

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There have been some reports that Steve McClaren might be their next manager, how gutted would you be!

You might assume then (metaphorically) if that is the case, he might hand pick a couple of players from Derby, Hughes for example. This could result in weakened competition for the Championship, so overall the news that may be Pochettino moving to Spurs could be relevant to Norwich.

Therefore Norfolk Canary can quit needlessly complaining and be happy again.

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I feel that Pochettino won''t be able to take Spurs any further than Sherwood, AVB, Redknapp etc. He''ll be sacked and off back to Spain within a year, I reckon.

Serves Levy right. He should never have sacked Harry.

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[quote user="littleyellowbirdie"][quote user="Reggie Strayshun"]A lot of truth in that, Tim, but it happens all the time, and has done for years.Most recently Rodgers to L''pool from Swansea. The Walker /Everton thing was long before the moneyed days we have now.I think that the crux of the matter is that nowadays it''s almost impossible for clubs of Norwich, Southampton, Swansea etc to do the sort of thing we did in the early 90''s, so if a good manager emerges, and he wants to excel, then the chances of him moving to a bigger club are not just pretty likely, but verging on 100%And it''s always been the case that there really is no point in smaller clubs resisting the advances of the big boys. Because in the end, money talks.[/quote]I think you''ve just highlighted another benefit of the Adams appointment. If he does succeed, and I think there''s a decent chance that he can, he''s the least likely of all the people to run off as soon as there''s another hole to bolt to.[/quote]Hmm, LYB. There are a lot of ''ifs'' in that scenario , which, to be fair, you acknowledge.You could make the same response to what happened re Mike Walker. He''d been at Norwich a while, settled in, but when Everton came a -calling......?But let''s not get too ahead of ourselves. Me ? I''d just be very happy if Adams is even talked about re other jobs in 2 yrs time. For the reasons I outlined in my earlier post !!

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I do wonder how much the success of that team was down to Walker though. I was about 11 when he left and you can imagine my bedroom - wall to wall Norwich stuff. I had a poster of Everton ripped into pieces on my wall and actively hated them with a passion for years, but I do wonder if that Norwich team was more to do with the players. I had a childlike grasp of football at the time, so correct me if Im wrong, but the team moreorless picked itself, and I dont remember Walker making inspired tactical decisions. I wonder if much of it was the psychology of the group and the momentum we had - I also remember us being known as the ''away-day specialists'' back then - god how we could do with that at present.

 

I know that soon after Walker left the club declined, but we were doing OK with Deehan in charge, it was the fateful injury to Gunn that saw us suddenly plummet - football back then was about the first 11 really rather than the squad. Perhaps with a better managerial appointment than Deehan or certainly some better luck in the goalkeeping area, we might have survived Walker leaving. Maybe it was more the psychological effect, again like with Lambert, the fear that the bubble will burst once the Messiah left. Walker never really proved himself after that golden period, which really makes me wonder how much he was behind it, or how much he was along for the ride...

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[quote user="Tim Dawson"]Felt really sorry for Southampton fans this morning, it reminded me of Everton poaching Walker.[/quote]What goes around comes around. Never forgiven them for nicking Ron Davies from us. [:@]

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I saw that season on video. I think Norwich were second when Walker left (and had had the Uefa cup run).....They plummeted to 12th(?) after he went to Everton, and continued to plummet into the first division the season after.

So I think he did have a lot to do with the success of the team.

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[quote user="The Great Mass Debater"]

I do wonder how much the success of that team was down to Walker though. I was about 11 when he left and you can imagine my bedroom - wall to wall Norwich stuff. I had a poster of Everton ripped into pieces on my wall and actively hated them with a passion for years, but I do wonder if that Norwich team was more to do with the players. I had a childlike grasp of football at the time, so correct me if Im wrong, but the team moreorless picked itself, and I dont remember Walker making inspired tactical decisions. I wonder if much of it was the psychology of the group and the momentum we had - I also remember us being known as the ''away-day specialists'' back then - god how we could do with that at present.

 

I know that soon after Walker left the club declined, but we were doing OK with Deehan in charge, it was the fateful injury to Gunn that saw us suddenly plummet - football back then was about the first 11 really rather than the squad. Perhaps with a better managerial appointment than Deehan or certainly some better luck in the goalkeeping area, we might have survived Walker leaving. Maybe it was more the psychological effect, again like with Lambert, the fear that the bubble will burst once the Messiah left. Walker never really proved himself after that golden period, which really makes me wonder how much he was behind it, or how much he was along for the ride...

[/quote]Walker certainly used different tactical systems, particularly in Europe. The norm domestically was a flat back-four but in the away game with Bayern he played a sweeper (Culverhouse) and three centre-backs and sort-of wingbacks. One of the German morning papers described Bayern as having been beaten by "English cleverness".And Walker also used a sweeper (Bowen. because Culverhouse was suspended) away to Inter. Posters with better memories than mine may know what fomations he used in the home games against those two, and against Vitesse.

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So disappointing listening to TalkSport tonight of the interest in the Southampton job. And to think they were a season behind us in League One. Demonstrates both the success of Southampton, and need for, new investment in our club. The board''s benevolent management approach - we know best, we should be content with tier two football - is so uninspiring. Let''s hope we haven''t thrown away our best ever chance of getting back to the PL.

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Yes i agree Highland canary, its an easy league to get stuck in, just look at Leeds ( supposed big club) im sure it must be about ten years out of the prem now.

Priority must be to be promoted within two seasons, would be lovely if Adams could fuse together our youth, the core of our existing squad and a couple of experienced heads to get us back in the prem, but as you say we appear to have gambled.

There are probably 8-10 sides capable of winning the championship and i imagine almost all fancy hitting the play-offs, it will be the most competitive league next season with the biggest prize, whatever happens i think we are in for a rollercoaster ride......

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