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Tetteys Jig

Is that the last we'll see of Ricky van Dogsdick?

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watching motd - have only just realised it was ricky van wasteofmoney whos pitiful attempt at a headed clearance (missed funnily enough) was what let fulham in for their goal

starting to wonder if maybe he needs glasses

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Thing is, some of his build up play is better than Hooper - did Hooper look any better when he came on? I''m not so sure. Although our performance had dropped by then so probably not a fair comparison.

But - his value will be so low at the moment I don''t think it will be the last we see of him. 8.5 million is a big out lay for us and i''m sure we''ll give him next season too unless we get an offer which recoups at least half what we paid - which wont happen.

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Yes, Mrs M, I really can''t understand why he chose BJ over Tettey. Turner looks better equipped for a scrap than Bassong, so I agreed with that. Not sure about the reason behind the Martin/Whittaker thing.

I actually think Elmander is the best of an appalling bunch. Unlikely to score, but he does occupy the defence a bit more, & looks more capable of supplying Snodgrass, Fer or whoever with a goal scoring chance.

We need a bit of luck now.

Wait - make that a lot of luck.

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I take your point on not having Bassong on the pitch, but instead of playing a defender who has hardly had a game this season, why not give Bennet a game who is match fit and a very good defender.

What I will say is, look at this team:

----------------------------?-----------------------

Martin---------Bennett-----?----------Olsson

Snodgrass--Johnson--Howson--Redmond

------------------Becchio---Hooper------------

That looks like a Championship winning squad for sure......despite half the team being from leeds :)

although who knows if snodgrass will still be here.

But anyway, we''re not down yet so we may as well keep fighting.

Agree we should keep Ricky as we won''t get very much for him atm

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We''ve had a problem with Snodgrass on the right and Redmond on the left all season yet still people pick them in those positions.

Can you see nothing?

Inverted wingers has not worked, will not work and will only continue to ruin the team.

Snodgrass must not play on the right.

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If I were in charge the biggest and the most expensive flop ever to come to Norwich city would be welcome to keep his shirt off in fact he would never again be permitted to put one on.

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RVW has become our very own version of Torres...Confidence destroyed, played in an unfamiliar and unsuited role, with massive questions being asked about how much was paid for them.As I''ve said before, top class players don''t become $hit overnight, but if you refuse to play to their strengths and don''t give them the support they need to perform then you can''t expect great results.Both Torres and RVW work better when they have someone alongside them to play them in, and whilst putting Redmond in a forward role yesterday was a novel idea, in truth it would have been better to have Hooper playing off RVW instead.I think we may as well write both our strikers off this season, as I don''t see that we''ll make the necessary changes in style of play (and considering the opposition we''re facing as well) to get them truly performing, and we have to focus on getting them ready for next season instead.Maybe Becchio and Elmander upfront for the last few games isn''t such a bad idea (even if neither are anywhere near as good as an on-form RVW or Hooper)...

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[quote user="Indy_Bones"]As I''ve said before, top class players don''t become $hit overnight, but if you refuse to play to their strengths and don''t give them the support they need to perform then you can''t expect great results.Both Torres and RVW work better when they have someone alongside them to play them in, and whilst putting Redmond in a forward role yesterday was a novel idea, in truth it would have been better to have Hooper playing off RVW instead.Maybe Becchio and Elmander upfront for the last few games isn''t such a bad idea (even if neither are anywhere near as good as an on-form RVW or Hooper)...[/quote]Neither RvW or Hooper has proven pedigree in a top league.  Scoring goals in Portugal, Holland or Scotland is often no proof of talent.  While I agree RvW is a almost certainly a better player than we have seen, it still might not make him good enough for this league.Of course playing in Hughton''s defend deep, build slow, select hackers side will not have helped any of our strikers chances to score goals.

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laughable. Once again ricky was not great but he was not bad. Snodgrass missed the easiest chance of the game which would have caused ricky to be called for execution and hooper had 35 minutes, stood like a statute either sulking and not being arsed, lucky if he touched the ball 10 times and we have a chaotic central midfield who misplaced 40% of passes. 6 players who ALSO played poorly and mypoically you single one out? Madness.

"Dogsdick" (when did we end up with average age fans of 12???) wasnt even in the worst three players on the pitch yesterday. His workrate matched his team mates and his movement did cause teams problem. His passing was erratic and his effort on target illogically saved by stockdale.

He has 1 horror moment - that inexplicable pass to a phantom norwich player when he had to waut far too long for any city player to getinto the box for a cross - lack of supporting players as always. (where the shocking Whittaker should have been instead of that mad run into the box)

If you wonder why we lost ask why

1. we changed 3 positions in a relatively solid back 4? It created and caused us problems

2. we brought whittaker in - our teams weakest defender ( a player with just 2 wins and 2 cleans sheets in his 14 starts for us this season, conceding 27)

3. why bj started ahead of the far superior Tettey

4. 3 the other our cm were played out of position

5. we ignored starting with the tettey howson fer as our building block - with them we are an impressive team.

6 how johnson (woeful passing, nil won tackles) stays on the pitch of a howson who was then dominant midfielder?

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Why was he even in the squad yesterday?

 

The inclusion of RVW in the squad, let alone the team was the only fault I could find on Adams yesterday, ut what a fault!

 

The guy looks shot to bits, no confidence and is now scared to get anywhere near the ball. The clueless pass to noone while we were attacking the Fulham box in the 2nd half epitimises his lack of confidence and urgency to get rid of the ball ASAP. He''d of better shooting or putting the ball across the face of the goal if he was that unsure of what to do but to do what he done would have looked silly in a unday morning match!

 

I''m still convinced hes a good player and his record in Europe proves that but its obvioyus of the pressure of being a big money signing (for NCFC)in the top flight has been to much for him to handle.

 

I''ve said for a while now the only reason hes been playing has been to try and justify signing him but why oh why did Adams fell it right to play him especially in our very precarious position?

 

Shouldn''t play again this season, if not ever for the club.

 

Like others have touched on, Snoddy ripping the ball out of his hands and missing the penalty against Villa could turn out to be looking back in hindsight a massive moment in our season. RVW taking it and scoring would of likely seen us win a game we had most of the play and his confidence would of gone up which likely would have led to further better results!

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[quote user="GJP"]Bennett is far from an example of a very good defender.[/quote]

The boys got everything to be a premiership defender; he''s young, tall, strong (when he wants to be), has a bit of pace. If he gets a long run of games in the championship it will do him wonders.

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[quote user="jas the barclay king"]just seen his shot on motd... it was unlucky... but the rest of his play was woeful[/quote]He was lucky they didn''t show his invisible man howler in the 2nd half.And to think we were sweating that he wouldn''t come here if we''d gone down last season......[:$]

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[quote user="ZippersLeftFoot"]how johnson (woeful passing, nil won tackles) stays on the pitch of a howson who was then dominant midfielder?[/quote]I find it almost unbelievable that in this system, the player who attempted the most passes (82, over 30 more than the next highest) was our worst passer of the ball: Bradley Johnson.

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precisely CFJ - who can you build from a base like that? The choice of BJ at the base of the diamond staggers belief.

Its a roll the is teh outlet for the backl line, the player expected to spread play in a role that demands he will touch and pass the ball more than any player. Its a defensive role so an ability to tackle is essential, along with positional discipline and ability to read the game.

We give to a player who is the worst passer at the club (worst cm passer in the premier league for the two previous seasons) who wins less tackles than the defensive powerhouse that is the much maligned Redmond (a creative player, like wes, maligned and ridiculed for constantly "losing possession" despite BJ doing so far more frequently week in week out). Even the allegedly anonymous Fer & Howson won teh ball more than BJ.

BJs effort can not be faulted - but again effort over capability, as with snoddy, is harming how our team can perform - both are fundamental weakness limiting how we can perform.

If we are to persist with the diamond then at least pick players for their strengths. At the base Tettey is the pick, with Howson as the alternative, Tettey far superior and disciplined defensively and a light year ahead in keeping possession. If we need more expansive passing then howson is the choice.

At the point it has to be Wes, snoddy is simply too slow with the ball at his feet and unable to pass create a chance - play him to his strength, which is as an inverted winger on the right.

That leaves the left flank - for fer.

But sensibly our best formation is a 451 with tettey howson and fer bossing the middle. We have them fit, ffs use them

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[quote]But sensibly our best formation is a 451 with tettey howson and fer bossing the middle. We have them fit, ffs use them[/quote]Spot on, and here''s exactly how I''d set it up:[url=http://sharemytactics.com/9599/][img]http://sharemytactics.com/9599/Norwich-City-formation-tactics.png[/img][/url]Whilst Bassong hasn''t been at his best, he certainly hasn''t fallen to the standard than some suggest, although truthfully he could easily be replaced by Yobo for the next 4 as well.Martin and Olsson will play more like wing backs with their trademark forward runs helping massively on the flanks, Tettey will keep the middle secure whilst offering solid distribution to the more adventurous Fer and Howson.Wes gets his normal free role behind the front men, and if we want extra pace or a change there, then either Redmond or Snoddy can come in.RVW and Hooper get the nod upfront as a proper striker partnership, with Hooper acting as more of a provider whilst still offering a threat himself.That''s how I''d do it for the last 4 games anyway (injuries permitting of course)...

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Spot on, ZLF. I cannot for the life of me understand how BJ got the nod over Tettey. He''s just about the first name on the team sheet for me.

Tettey, Fer & Howson definitely the best combo I''ve seen this season. Wes was awful Saturday, but when he plays like he did against CP & Manure he looks by far our most creative player. Like many others, I''d love to see EB as a wing back, but it might be too late for that this season. Imagine him, Olsson, Redmond & Josh playing; our counter attacks would certainly be a lot more entertaining!

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I reckon it was because Adams wanted the fullbacks to get forward and Johnson is the insurance. I''d play both Tettey and Johnson. I like Howson too but all I ever hear is "that''s not his true position". Unfortunately I''m not sure he has one. Except perhaps as cover for Fer. You can quote your pass success rates until you''re blue in the face it won''t alter the fact that football is a team game and those that compliment eachother make the best team.

 

 

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How on Earth he keeps getting a start beggars belief, especially at such a vital time in the clubs history. He''s lacking in confidence totally, and seems to offer nothing to the team.

For me he will definitely leave in the summer no matter what league we''re in, and I wouldn''t be surprised if his contract is just terminated to get him off the payroll. I honestly can''t see anyone paying a fee for him. The £8.5mill will just have to be an enourmous write off.

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It may begger your belief how he gets a start Jonzey, but perhaps you should reflect on the fact that both Hughton and Adams selected him for their teams, they see him in training and clearly know his capabilities.

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[quote user="nutty nigel"]

I reckon it was because Adams wanted the fullbacks to get forward and Johnson is the insurance. I''d play both Tettey and Johnson. I like Howson too but all I ever hear is "that''s not his true position". Unfortunately I''m not sure he has one. Except perhaps as cover for Fer. You can quote your pass success rates until you''re blue in the face it won''t alter the fact that football is a team game and those that compliment eachother make the best team.

[/quote]

Howson''s position is in the centre of midfield. Playing through the middle. Which is where Fer is also at his best.

 

Howson is like any other player - if he''s not playing in a role that totally suits him then he''s unlikely to play to his best. But because he''s got more to his game than someone like Johnson he is more adaptable.

 

Johnson is just not good enough in any area to justify playing ahead of Tettey, Howson or Fer. Doesn''t win enough tackles and doesn''t keep the ball. You say it''s a team game and players need to compliment each other so surely you must realise that the best way to do that is have as many players as possible who can pass the ball to each other and keep it with a yellow shirt.

 

The more Johnson is involved at this level the worse we will be for it.

 

 

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"The more Johnson is involved at this level the worse we will be for it."

Didn''t hurt us the last two seasons..

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Well if you look at some of the goals we conceded last season it did hurt us. Quite a bit. As I tried pointing out at the time, look at the goals we conceded from teams moving through his area of the midfield far too easily. Either because he was too slow to deal with the danger that was on top of him or because he had got caught up the pitch and couldn''t get back.

 

Johnson is ok to have in the squad but if you keeping having him start games in the Premier League it''s going to catch up with you because what he offers you defensively just isn''t enough to make up for what he lacks elsewhere.

 

Just one of those things we''ll have to learn the hard way by the looks of it.

 

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nutty nigel: I like Howson too but all I ever hear is "that''s not his true position". You can quote your pass success rates until you''re blue in the face it won''t alter the fact that football is a team game and those that compliment each other make the best team.

BJ has the worst passing success rate for a central midfielder playing above 15 games in the league for the last two seasons. It just isn''t good enough, even with his other excellent qualities like his heading, work rate and attitude, he should be a backup player.

I think Johnson reads the game and has more vision than Howson, just BJ lacks the technical ability to go with it. Howson on the other hand has a great shot on him, and is at his best when bringing the ball forwards, but just zero vision, he gets to the final third and has little idea what to do with the ball.

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So had Johnson not played last season - we''d have finished higher than 11th? Top 10 then?!

I think it''s all to easy - I know you don''t rate Johnson - but to pin an entire midfields movement down to one player is slightly harsh.

You rate Howson very highly yet his tracking on several occasions at the weekend were poor.

Adams is now the third manager in a row to pick Johnson as part of his central midfield in the Premier League. That tells me enough.

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[quote user="hogesar"] Adams is now the third manager in a row to pick Johnson as part of his central midfield in the Premier League. That tells me enough.[/quote]

I guess we''ll see where we end up if Adams keeps picking him, this season and beyond.

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Johnson wasn''t as bad as people make out at the weekend. Our best balls in behind the defence came from him. Having said that, all too often this season, we''ve tried to pass it around and then the ball goes to Johnson and he loses it. He has destroyed our momentum on too many occasions.

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