Sporting CP post Ricky

[Google Bot 3,255]

I don''t follow Portuguese football, so not aware how Sporting''s transfers have been in the past season, obviously knew they had money problems and that was a big factor in us landing Ricky.  So i could be completely off target here for wondering if Ricky leaving them was actually a bonus.  …But was it?

I wasn''t aware they were doing so well until i saw the tables in portugal just now.

Comparing last seasons tables to this years shows a dramatic improvement, especially in terms of Goals scored, and points gained, see here:

Current Season

[img]http://www.supportat.net/forumfiles/sportNow.png[/img]

Last Season with RvW

[img]http://www.supportat.net/forumfiles/sportThen.png[/img]

As quick comparison, i wanted to go further after reading this, to search out Sporting''s current top goal scorers and compare their hit rates with Ricky''s last season to see if they are simply more prolific, or getting more shots per game (i.e. the team is playing better as a whole) - However, i could only find this seasons stats unfortunately and didn''t want to spend too long on it.

So, concentrating on Ricky, it showed something, according to the site i visited (whoscored.com) he''s had 31 shots for us over the course of the season so far, and it appears that he had 16 shots for Sporting in his final 4 games alone… 1 of which he scored from.  

Appreciate it''s only 4 games so unfair to compare, But, by his average of 1 goal per 16 shots, he should therefore have scored two for us by his 32nd shot…. at the Weekend i hope!! So that''s a bit of good news to come out of this! :)

My intention is not to slate the guy, as i will quite happily sing his praises and stand up for him, i strongly feel with the right support he could become a goal hero here.  What i''m trying to achieve is that by being objective… Have we bought a dud like many say, or have we turned him into one?

Anyone have info on his strike rates at Sporting, and able to compare them to the current strikers there now?!

[mrs miggins 0]

i haven''t watched them this season, but last season, i watched them quite a bit, and I''ve got to say, i thought we had a fantastic player on our hands, unfortunately he has zero confidence and he''s not getting into quite the same spaces as he did for Lisbon. I''ll also say the difference in defending from the premier league is phenomenal; another thing thats not helping

[mrs miggins 0]

why did i put so much commas in.....very dramatic

[Holtcantshoot 0]

You get very few opportunities at Premier League level. Like it or not when playing for the relegation teams you have to take that one chance that falls to you a game. Rodallega managed that on Saturday but then he''s only got 6 in all competitions this season himself.I don''t think RVW''s finishing is quite up to scratch at premier league level unfortunately. Too many times like on Saturday he''s not taken the great chance that has come to him. But he can probably go to  big club in Portugal or Scotland and be a goal machine next year so there''s no reason for him to be too down on himself.

[mrs miggins 0]

but having watched him a lot (quite a lot), he does have the finishing ability. However, he hasn''t shown it here-he looks like a baby dear thats lost his mother....i think that would make a disney film.

[Google Bot 3,255]

Ah, but in watching, were you seeing highlights or complete matches? I wonder if he was getting 6,7,8 chances a game and only sticking 1 home. If that''s the case then it would explain not only why he''s not doing it here, but also why they''ve scored near double this season.

Like i say not beating on the guy as i think the quality is there, but i do wonder if we''re being too harsh on him to expect goals when he''s only having 1, maybe 2 chances per game. That kind of striker, if he did exist, certainly wouldn''t be in our price bracket.

[mrs miggins 0]

No, watching the whole game, you can''t judge someone on highlights, or Gary Doherty would still be playing for us.

Are we being too harsh on him....I don''t think so, he hasn''t shown anything like the player he is, but i think he will. To me he still seems unsettled as well as not being confident

[Indy 3,283]

Two thing that people have highlighted, one is lack of chances for him this season and confidence, both can of these could be changed if he stays with us for next season if we are relegated. A fit RVW in the championship could be an awsome weapon, but will he stay or is the second level of English football not high enough for his ambition? Can we afford him in the championship?

[ron obvious 1,495]

He''ll never score if he spends so much time around the half way line as he did on Saturday. What on Earth was he thinking of? Surely he couldn''t have been asked to play there.

I can only imagine his confidence is so low he doesn''t want to take responsibility for attempting to score (I know he was in a good position once, for his chance, but that was by far the exception).

[It's Character Forming 1,160]

I think you can''t judge him fairly at the moment - the guy''s confidence is gone.

I think it''s a mix of the Prem being a tougher league for a striker and the appalling service he''s received. Early in the season I remember him making numerous runs into channels pointing where he wanted the ball delivering on the ground, but the pass was never played.

Hard to tell how good he is but I''m pretty sure he''s not a dud, but the way we''ve used him over the season has turned him into one.

I wonder if he''ll play for us again. It''s possible because we''d make a massive loss if we sold him. I hope he doesn''t start Sunday because it would so no one any favours

[Google Bot 3,255]

Well, let''s be fair - let''s take the Fulham match, you make that kind of reflex shot in the area, goal vicinity and it will normally squeeze through, even if the keeper gets a finger to it. Stockdale was incredibly quick and got his hand around it and thus no goal. Off the back of that Johnson really should have put the ball home too. I don''t believe in good luck/bad luck just happening, but i believe you create your own. I think he could be starting to turn it around if we continue that first half performance.

So, i would be tempted to start him again if it wasn''t liverpool we''re facing, unfortunately it is them!!

No sure we''re not looking for ''just'' a goal scorer in that game, we''ll be needing someone to hold the ball up reliably. Not sure he''s the right fit for that. In fact, i don''t think we''ve even got that player at our expense. Elmander on his own, with an attacking midfield who will support him may be out best option. But then, even with that making sense, i would probably shake my head were it to be Adams starting line up. Our forwards have been a joke. :(

[wooster 134]

Parma Ham wrote a very convincing piece a while back suggesting that Peter Crouch would have been a better signing for us with CH''s style of play, rather than RVW.

I''m not having a go at CH but I do think our style of play hasn''t suited RVW and thus his confidence has been undermined over the season.

With a new regime it would be nice to see a revitalised strike force but I guess that''s for next season.

[Google Bot 3,255]

Crouch - yes, would have been immense here. One of the biggest niggles that developed over time for me, was Hughton''s failure, despite being a nice man who all the players liked*, of keeping Holt here.

Let''s not kid ourselves, if he was still here we wouldn''t be in this situation, sure we may only be only 3 points better off - but it''s the fine lines that matter when you''re down the pack.

It upset me at the time when he left, in terms of who he was and what he''d done for us - but at the same time i thought that would signal a change in us, and that Chris would play ''his way'', attacking wide players with a genuine threat upfront. But, He actually descended us to the point where Holt became the player we needed most. Never did he look to exploit Ricky, and this is despite Ricky talking to the media between being signed and start of season explaining that he can''t play the one up front role. But, despite the warnings giving out by the player himself, we all knew how that panned out.

For me, that identifies his biggest failing here and shows that the intended plan, and the actioning of it, were quite a distance apart. I''m not sure if there were other transfer targets which couldn''t be landed and that changed things somewhat, but it seems to me that he placed everything on the hope that RIcky would be a 1 in 3 goal scorer. Quite naive in hindsight.

* Try and read that without me sounding bitter!! :)

[MancCanary 0]

[quote user="Skijumptoes"]Crouch - yes, would have been immense here. One of the biggest niggles that developed over time for me, was Hughton''s failure, despite being a nice man who all the players liked*, of keeping Holt here.

Let''s not kid ourselves, if he was still here we wouldn''t be in this situation, sure we may only be only 3 points better off - but it''s the fine lines that matter when you''re down the pack.

It upset me at the time when he left, in terms of who he was and what he''d done for us - but at the same time i thought that would signal a change in us, and that Chris would play ''his way'', attacking wide players with a genuine threat upfront. But, He actually descended us to the point where Holt became the player we needed most. Never did he look to exploit Ricky, and this is despite Ricky talking to the media between being signed and start of season explaining that he can''t play the one up front role. But, despite the warnings giving out by the player himself, we all knew how that panned out.

For me, that identifies his biggest failing here and shows that the intended plan, and the actioning of it, were quite a distance apart. I''m not sure if there were other transfer targets which couldn''t be landed and that changed things somewhat, but it seems to me that he placed everything on the hope that RIcky would be a 1 in 3 goal scorer. Quite naive in hindsight.

* Try and read that without me sounding bitter!! :)[/quote]

Great post Skijumptoes, I totally agree. It maddens me that we lost Holt, and we''ve waste Rcky. The 2 of them together would me brilliant I think. The classic big man small man (well, skinny man!) combo. Holty would be holding up, flicking it on, and generally doing exactly what NO ONE in this team has been able to do since. Ricky or Hooper would''ve scored more goals with Holt, that''s for sure.

[Holtcantshoot 0]

[quote user="Skijumptoes"]Well, let''s be fair - let''s take the Fulham match, you make that kind of reflex shot in the area, goal vicinity and it will normally squeeze through, even if the keeper gets a finger to it. Stockdale was incredibly quick and got his hand around it and thus no goal. Off the back of that Johnson really should have put the ball home too. I don''t believe in good luck/bad luck just happening, but i believe you create your own. I think he could be starting to turn it around if we continue that first half performance.

So, i would be tempted to start him again if it wasn''t liverpool we''re facing, unfortunately it is them!!

No sure we''re not looking for ''just'' a goal scorer in that game, we''ll be needing someone to hold the ball up reliably. Not sure he''s the right fit for that. In fact, i don''t think we''ve even got that player at our expense. Elmander on his own, with an attacking midfield who will support him may be out best option. But then, even with that making sense, i would probably shake my head were it to be Adams starting line up. Our forwards have been a joke. :([/quote]Have to agree here. We needed a target man in the vein of Wilfried Bony. What we seem to have ended up with was three lightweight goalscorers, all with a poorer strike rate than Bony, and a target man past his prime who couldn''t even get in the Bolton team when he was. Just taking the last two 1-0 defeats into account it''s quite clear that it is our striker''s inability to either convert or create chances for others this season that will relegate us.

[Google Bot 3,255]

Yes indeed converting or creating are the two underlined aspects of a striker, the big concern looking back throughout the season is a complete lack of partnerships. I just can''t see any form of understandings between players like we had with Hoolahan & Holt, as an example.

Players just don''t appear to be on the same wavelengths and fully in sync with one another.

On paper, there''s absolutely no reason (When matching skill sets and physical ability) why Elmander with either Hooper or Ricky shouldn''t work/yield goals… But it hasn''t/doesn''t/won''t!

In the final games, i think it''s incredibly important that an understanding builds between one of our providers and goal scorers, possibly to the point that they are singled out in training and deliberately put through some set plays, american football style to try and force it through?!

I''m no manager/coach/trainer though, so it''s probably a silly suggestion. :-/