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Tetteys Jig

Osvaldo

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Suspended for two weeks by Southampton. Another one on the growing list of srikers from abroad that have so far failed to adapt.

Cornelius, Helenius, RVW, Osvaldo. Plenty of big transfer fees shelled out there for what? about 5 goals between them?

Perhaps we''re better buying from the championship?

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What did he actually do to get suspended? I saw a saints fan on twitter said he turned up to training with a samauri sword. Sounds a bit of a loon.

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The sword theory is a joke because he looks like Jack Sparrow from Pirates of the Carribean. Probably a very gullible Saints fan believes it. Probably just a fight with another player.

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quote user="It''s Character Forming"

RVP, Aguero, Suarez...

When we have £25m, £38m and £27m then we might stand a chance of guaranteeing buying well from abroad.

On the other hand...

Shevchenko £35m to get the ball rolling...

Put it this way, far bigger names than RVW have crumbled at this level!

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I don''t really buy too much into this ''growing list of strikers from abroad that have failed to adapt...''

Osvaldo was always off the wall and to be fair today''s revelations should come as a suprise to nobody. RVW has had trouble with injuries and lets face it is playing a Norwich side struggling to provide that many chances throughout the season so far (as an extension to this point Hooper came in from a foreign league...) Helenius and Cornelius I agree appear not have settled, but I could name twice as many foreign strikers that have settled and scored goals (Benteke, Bony, Michu, all in our price range), similarly I can name twice as many players from the Championship that have turned out not to be good enough for the Premier League (Really where to begin!? Vydra, Boyd, Gayle, and thats just this season).

If signings from foreign leagues didn''t come off, why does ever single team in the Premier League sign players from foreign clubs?

Some signings will come off, some will tank, at the end of the day I don''t think there''s a sure fire way of guaranteeing success regardless of where you buy from.

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Why do you keep harping on about RvW being a flop and not settling into the EPL?

What evidence about his play suggests he can''t?

I am still waiting for an explanation as to what he needs to actually adapt to and how?

What do you actually expect him to be doing differently?

I am so at a loss with the criticisms of him. I actually wonder whether anyone actually watches the games?

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[quote user="TIL 1010"]

[quote user="Jimmy Smith"] Probably just a fight with another player.[/quote]

Ok that''s ok then.

 

[/quote]

Never said it was okay, but compared to bringing a samurai sword into training, it would be "just a fight"

As for the signings thing, I agree, every signing is a gamble, I was merely starting the debate and if anything, putting the RVW situation into context. I think some people got too excited at the start with RVW especially after his debut. The premiership isn''t easy.

It''s by no means the end of the road for RVW at Norwich, far from it, but he does need to fit in, be that he moulds into our tactics, we mould to his style of play or more likely, a combination of the two, we have seen recent signs that it isn''t far off, it will soon click I think.

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[quote user="snake-eyes"]Why do you keep harping on about RvW being a flop and not settling into the EPL?

What evidence about his play suggests he can''t?

I am still waiting for an explanation as to what he needs to actually adapt to and how?

What do you actually expect him to be doing differently?

I am so at a loss with the criticisms of him. I actually wonder whether anyone actually watches the games?[/quote]I suppose, in fairness, snakey, when a club like Norwich splashes out 8.5 m on a striker, most fans would have expected him to score more than one solitary goal by Feb. So I''m not altogether as surprised as you evidently are by the reaction. That said, there are mitigating circumstances, most of which have been debated ad infinitum on here.As regards foreign strikers, well, clearly it''s difficult to prove, but I''m sure that there have been , percentage wise, as many British born strikers who''ve underachieved as foreign ones. I mean , would anyone seriously suggest that Andy Carroll has been an unqualified success ? Closer to home, some of the players we''ve sold for big money over the years (Rosario, Fleck, Fashanu to name but 3) did not do a lot after leaving here.

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Thats fair comment snake-eyes.......clearly there are a few on here who do believe that RVW is shocking, worst ever signing or whatever. I must stress I am not one of them and that despite my frustrations I believe that he will utlimately come through and prove that he is money well spent. I can undertand to a certain degree though how some may have this impression, particularly if you watch the games only on live tv, on a stream or only highlights, as there is no way you can see his quality work off the ball and movement. However, if you are at the ground, I am sure you get the bigger picture and can see he is quality and just now missing that piece of luck all strikers need to start firing.

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I think Southampton are to be congratulated . Some clubs would have had an accidental clash of heads and not lost a player for 3 games.

 

 

Shame Liverpool didn''t show such high moral values with Rat Face. 

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On Saturday my son went to get his programme from one of the stalls.

 

We always play a game on the way down, where we try and guess who is on the front.  When he saw it was Ricky, he shouted "It''s Rickyyy" with all the delight of an enthusiastic youngster (he''s 10). 

 

The woman selling the programmes said "He needs to pull his finger out!" to which my son looked very perplexed and looked at me asking " Why Dadda?"

 

I responded to the lady " What do you mean by that?"

 

She replied " Well he''s rubbish he don''t score!"

 

I responded a little curtly " It would help if he actually got the ball in goal scoring areas.  You can''t score if you don''t get the ball."

 

She looked totally confused and lost when she replied " I suppose so.".

 

Is this the general ignorance of our fans?  I am all up for differing opinions, but when a view is based on nothing but blind ignorance, I do get very frustrated, thus my reactions sometimes on here for which I apologise for.

 

Snake [:(]

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Yeah your right he does see the ball a lot, out in the wide positions where he has no chance of scoring, because he''s got frustrated from out complete lack of service and so has gone hunting for the ball.

It''s just like Ashton in the season we went down, looking for the ball because we couldn''t give the right service.

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[quote user="birchfest"]Yeah your right he does see the ball a lot, out in the wide positions where he has no chance of scoring, because he''s got frustrated from out complete lack of service and so has gone hunting for the ball. .[/quote]There was a bit of that going on during the Hull game, it''s true, BF, but actually I was quite impressed with how disciplined he was at , in the main, NOT doing that. tbh, if I''d had as little supply as he had for most of that game, I''d have got frustrated, and gone looking for the ball a lot more.

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He''s damned if he does and damned if he doesn''t.

 

If he keeps his discipline as has been said and doesn''t go looking for the ball, he will be criticised for not working hard enough or doing enough, and with the lack of supply he won''t score.

 

If he goes looking for the ball and drops deep or wide he is then out of position to be able to score goals.

 

When a situation arises like this, the problem is clearly not with him, but elsewhere.

 

The fundamentals of the game have not changed in over 100 years.  The aim is surely to win the game and score goals and that is why you have strikers, who have the best skillset to do this most often.  Otherwise, why do they exist?

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[quote user="snake-eyes"]

 

The fundamentals of the game have not changed in over 100 years.  The aim is surely to win the game and score goals and that is why you have strikers, who have the best skillset to do this most often.  Otherwise, why do they exist?

[/quote]I think, snakey, at the risk of doing a bit of devil''s advocacy, I''d say that I''d disagree. The fundamentals of the game HAVE changed over the last 40 yrs or so.Today it''s more about not conceding than scoring, certainly in large tracts of European professional football. OK you get the Barcelonas of this world, but even they put a lot more store on defence than they used to.This is not another excuse to indulge in another round of Hughton bashing, but Chris is very much the embodiment of the current game. His number one aim is to keep things tight at the back. Hence all this "zonal" stuff. Scoring lots of goals is definitely the secondary aim. And it is borne out by scorelines !

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Whilst i kind of agree Regie with some managers aims the fundamental aim of any game or sport is to win. To do that you must score. The way you go about it may be different but the ultimate goal is to win.

otherwise why bother?

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An earlier comment suggested that we should perhaps recruit a striker from the Championship. Well we did just that last January, but he''s never been given a chance!

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The Ricky debate is a fascinating one. He isn''t scoring goals, what a waste of money vs he doesn''t get any chances because the supply line is rubbish, give him a chance - (OK, that''s simplifying it to the nth degree).

 

The thing is, I don''t think that either position is true, I also think that he''ll come good. He has had chances in games, not a huge amount but he has. The handful that I can recall, he probably could have done better with or, in the case of the header at Hull (a) and the header against Fulham, been denied by top-class goalkeeping.

 

His movement has been discussed and it is sharp, he appears to have good feet and he has demonstrated he''ll stick his head in where it hurts, all good attributes for a striker to have. What he needs is a bit of luck. Look at some of the rubbish that goes in, Bardsley against Man U the other night for example, you can''t legislate for something powder puff like that going in past De Gea and then Stockdale turning into a crap Gordon Banks against Ricky''s header. I felt for him in the Hull game, after he had gone off there was that melee in the box when it looked like Ryan Bennett might score again, the ball seemed to sit for an eternity just outside the 6 yard box crying out for a RVW to lash it home, in the end everyone sort of looked at it and it was cleared, THOSE chances haven''t been dropping to him.

 

A return of one goal is disappointing but I''m convinced he isn''t a waste of money, he''s also had SOME chances, so it''s not ALL down to the supply line.

 

If only he''d taken that penalty against Villa.....[:|]

 

 

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[quote user="snake-eyes"]The way you go about it may be different but the ultimate goal is to win.

otherwise why bother?[/quote]Very much depends on the circumstances, snake. If you are in the happy position of Man City, with lots of money and the need to out score and out perform the MU/ Arsenal/Chelsea set, then clearly their remit is to fill the squad with top-notch strikers and go out to win each game comfortably. It was a bit like that with us (albeit at a lower level !) in our Lge One season.But for the vast majority of mere mortal clubs, there are games where the the ultimate objective is not necessarily to win. More not to get beaten. And, despite what some of the Hughton supporters would claim, there have been plenty of occasions over the last few months where we have set out from the first whistle with precisely that objective.  Whether it''s right or whether it''s wrong...well that is another debate for another time, but winning games is no longer the priority in many cases.

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[quote user="Warren Hill"]

The Ricky debate is a fascinating one. He isn''t scoring goals, what a waste of money vs he doesn''t get any chances because the supply line is rubbish, give him a chance - (OK, that''s simplifying it to the nth degree).

 

The thing is, I don''t think that either position is true, I also think that he''ll come good.

 

 

[/quote]Yes Warren, it is perhaps over simplified a bit, but I''d agree that what you have put in your first paragraph is essentially the nub of the debate.I do however have a bit of a problem with your second line. The trouble being that we have not as yet really ever supplied him with the ammunition to prove his worth one way or the other. So we will not be able to say whether either premise is ''true'' until we have given him a fair crack of the whip. I remember the situation with Andy Cole all those years ago. Basically he was one of those strikers who, on his day was deadly, but his percentage chance conversion rate was patchy at best. When he went to MU, he was playing alongside operators who could feed him loads of ammunition, and consequently he scored regularly. Whenever they had an off day, or came up against a team who stifled the supply (rare), Cole looked average at best.So until we have settled upon a formula that actually supplies RvW with the chances, then I''m afraid the jury will have to remain out on whether he''s been a good buy or not.But, like you I''d like to think he will come good eventually.

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RVW:

Needed to adapt to England and English game.

Unfortunate with his toe injury.

Plays in an uncompromising system that is not tailor-made to his style.

Perhaps not quite the superstar/superstriker we all expected.

1+1+1+1= A bit of a disappointment.

All adds up, but I too think he''ll come good at Carrow Road and if not at Hughton.s Norwich City then elsewhere.

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