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The Great Mass Debater

The future of Norwich City

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With QPR and Cardiff being bought by owners from Asia, Blackburn by the Venkys, Man City by the Sheiks, Fulham by wherever he''s from, Liverpool, Villa and Man Utd by the Americans and Chelsea by Russian Oil, it would seem everyone wants an English football plaything, with varying degrees of success.

 

So is it only a matter of time before we are picked off by some playboy, forced to play in blue and rebranded the Norwich Canaries, or can the club continue in its current form. For the first time in a long time we are debt-free and holding our own. But is ownership by a rich benefactor an inevitibility of the modern game, and if so, how long before it is likely to happen? Do people thing change is imminent, or can the club keep its soul and remain competitive?

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[quote user="The Great Mass Debater"]

With QPR and Cardiff being bought by owners from Asia, Blackburn by the Venkys, Man City by the Sheiks, Fulham by wherever he''s from, Liverpool, Villa and Man Utd by the Americans and Chelsea by Russian Oil, it would seem everyone wants an English football plaything, with varying degrees of success.

 

So is it only a matter of time before we are picked off by some playboy, forced to play in blue and rebranded the Norwich Canaries, or can the club continue in its current form. For the first time in a long time we are debt-free and holding our own. But is ownership by a rich benefactor an inevitibility of the modern game, and if so, how long before it is likely to happen? Do people thing change is imminent, or can the club keep its soul and remain competitive?

[/quote]

The Fulham owner is also American

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I guess not being in one of the "bigger" Cities makes us less attractive, but I am sure there will be a time when something happens and the ownership changes. At the end of the day our majority share holders are not getting any younger and that in itself indicates that paerhaps change is not so far away, not that I am wishing anything on them, on the contrary. I have mixed feelings about this, if we dont get investment and the majority of others do, then we are at a disadvantage (presuming they pile money in of course) and if we do the risk is relatively high that we end up being a Blackburn or have issues like we are seeing at Cardiff City. Perhaps the trick is having more than one new invester but somehow keeping overall control away from them, easier said than done though.....  I''m looking forward to seeing some of the replies from those who have a better insight and knowledge than myself, its a good topic...

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How it is these days.  And fans can''t always have it both ways.  You want the EPL, you want the money, you want football clubs to run like businesses.  So when decisions are made for the benefit of the business you have to suck it up.
Maybe it''s inevitable whether we like it or not. If you want to play with the big boys.  We''ll have to sell our arses out to a billionaire in the future.

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[quote user="Dubai Mark"]I guess not being in one of the "bigger" Cities makes us less attractive, but I am sure there will be a time when something happens and the ownership changes. At the end of the day our majority share holders are not getting any younger and that in itself indicates that paerhaps change is not so far away, not that I am wishing anything on them, on the contrary. I have mixed feelings about this, if we dont get investment and the majority of others do, then we are at a disadvantage (presuming they pile money in of course) and if we do the risk is relatively high that we end up being a Blackburn or have issues like we are seeing at Cardiff City. Perhaps the trick is having more than one new invester but somehow keeping overall control away from them, easier said than done though.....  I''m looking forward to seeing some of the replies from those who have a better insight and knowledge than myself, its a good topic...[/quote]
IMO we''re beyond investor material.  As in Championship club looking for a couple of million to help us out.   We''re now at the point if somebody wants to put serious money in they''ll want to be at least majority owner.

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[quote user="John from the Tomorrow People"] you want football clubs to run like businesses.  [/quote]

errr... says who ?

 

I''d like City to be a well-run football club.  But a business is aimed at making a profit, which I emphatically don''t want for us - any financial return should be part of securing the long-run future of the business, not at making money.

 

If you look at Man City, is it run like a business ?  Not at all, it''s basically run like a not-for-profit foundation that the owner uses to disburse part of his great wealth for the benefit of the club and part of Manchester.  Quite why a man from the Middle East has decided to do this is beyond me.  I could understand it if a die-hard fan became extremely wealthy, but he only comes to the UK at rare intervals.  Go figure.

 

Actually what really puzzles me are the American owners who buy up PL clubs expecting to make loads of money from them.  Do they even look at the report Deloitte put out every year which explains how the PL clubs make hardly any profit?

 

Maybe we should start a campaign for Delia to put a golden share into a trust for the supporters ?

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[quote user="Its Character Forming"]

[quote user="John from the Tomorrow People"] you want football clubs to run like businesses.  [/quote]

errr... says who ?

 

I''d like City to be a well-run football club.  But a business is aimed at making a profit, which I emphatically don''t want for us - any financial return should be part of securing the long-run future of the business, not at making money.

 

If you look at Man City, is it run like a business ?  Not at all, it''s basically run like a not-for-profit foundation that the owner uses to disburse part of his great wealth for the benefit of the club and part of Manchester.  Quite why a man from the Middle East has decided to do this is beyond me.  I could understand it if a die-hard fan became extremely wealthy, but he only comes to the UK at rare intervals.  Go figure.

 

Actually what really puzzles me are the American owners who buy up PL clubs expecting to make loads of money from them.  Do they even look at the report Deloitte put out every year which explains how the PL clubs make hardly any profit?

 

Maybe we should start a campaign for Delia to put a golden share into a trust for the supporters ?

[/quote]
Says anybody who enjoys the trappings of the EPL.  Were happy taking Murdoch''s Sky money, and that''s the aim, to continue to do so.  Unfortunately it what it''s all about, business.

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I see your point John and agree that it would have to be a majority share for a major investor to be interested.

Also, picking up on the point regarding why the investor from Abu Dhabi has invested......I think this is a different situation and is a lot about money being pumped in indirectly from the UAE/Abu Dhabi itself through the owner to use a Premier League side as a global opportunity to promote Abu Dhabi, Etihad and all things UAE. They have the money to spend huge sums on these things and are on an absolute mission, just like has happened with Emirates investing huge amounts not just in Arsenal but also in other top clubs across Europe and in many other sports.    

 

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Ajax are a very successful Business, but as a club they constantly disappoint their supporters by selling their top players,after qualifying for the Champs lge, and then failing to progress beyond the group stage. They regularly win the dutch league, and their fans want more. ...but even they would now need a mega investor to step up to regular last eight champs lge level.

Norwich have been successful Club this last few years and are now a debt free Business,but the fans want more, to bring us into the next level ,ie survival assured and regular qual for europe, could be achieved by the continuing smart moves of the board and management....beyond that we''d need the mega money too.

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Not all foreign owners are bad. Not all British owners are good.Financial Fair Play is supposed (note the "supposed") to produce a more level playing field by reducing what rich owners can put into clubs.The chances of anyone being willing to invest a significant amount of money In Norwich City without gaining control of the club are on the anorexic side of slim.The likelihood of the club attracting some majority investment through a serious takeover bid is better than it was two or three years ago (when a search produce zilch). But all that shows is that possible suitors at that time didn''t look beyond the superficial problems to see the underlying strengths.Before the (in the long run) inevitable change of ownership there may be at least one boardroom move. I gather (this may or may not be well-known) Alan Bowkett has some business interests abroad that require attention. And the key task of the financial restructuring has been achieved. Possibly he feels his work is done. Not that Bowkett stepping down as chairman or even from the board would affect where power ultimately lies at Carrow Road. Where it always did. As indicated by a couple of recent straws drifting past in the wind.

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[quote user="John from the Tomorrow People"][quote user="Its Character Forming"]

[quote user="John from the Tomorrow People"] you want football clubs to run like businesses.  [/quote]

errr... says who ?

 

I''d like City to be a well-run football club.  But a business is aimed at making a profit, which I emphatically don''t want for us - any financial return should be part of securing the long-run future of the business, not at making money.

 

If you look at Man City, is it run like a business ?  Not at all, it''s basically run like a not-for-profit foundation that the owner uses to disburse part of his great wealth for the benefit of the club and part of Manchester.  Quite why a man from the Middle East has decided to do this is beyond me.  I could understand it if a die-hard fan became extremely wealthy, but he only comes to the UK at rare intervals.  Go figure.

 

Actually what really puzzles me are the American owners who buy up PL clubs expecting to make loads of money from them.  Do they even look at the report Deloitte put out every year which explains how the PL clubs make hardly any profit?

 

Maybe we should start a campaign for Delia to put a golden share into a trust for the supporters ?

[/quote]
Says anybody who enjoys the trappings of the EPL.  Were happy taking Murdoch''s Sky money, and that''s the aim, to continue to do so.  Unfortunately it what it''s all about, business.
[/quote]Rupert Murdoch does not own BSKYB.

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the club wont go any further than 7th or 8th in the next few years if we have very very good seasons, you lot can dream all all you like but its the harsh realityif you want to win anything the next level is big money investment, like it or not its the state of modern top flight footballthe board at present would not do any harm to apply for planning permission for carrow road expansion for a 40000 seater, you dont have to build it, just apply for it, approval would make the club very appealing for a big money investor, if the board have the best interest of the club at heart they will look for a buyer, and pitch the club as a premier league mid table regular with potential to grow and a fan base able to sustain high wages through ticket sales if the stadium is expanded

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First you were saying it is inevitable a billionaire will take us over

Now it''s all about the Murdoch money. Which is a different thing altogether.

Doesn''t the £70m we now get from TV make it less, rather than more likely that we''ll seek a rich owner?

And there''s a difference between a club being well run and using the TV money to enhance the team, like we have, to a business that aims primarily at making a profit - which no team in the Prem does at the moment.

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[quote user="Houston Canary"]The clubs themselves may not be profitable, but the owners are making tons of money from merchandise.[/quote]

The figures we see published for Man U include masses of merchandising income despite which they don''t make much profit. I suspect this is the rationale for buying the club tho - hoping to improve the worldwide merchandising tho I think Man U is pretty much the biggest sports brand worldwide already so I''m not convinced. It would be different if they could crack the US market in a big way of course - any sign of that happening Houston? If not I suspect they''ll be disappointed by the return they get,

It seems to me the US major leagues are basically a licence to print money thanks to wage caps, no relegation, and draft systems to spread talent around. I find it odd that US businessmen invest in the PL without noticing that not a single one of these apply, hence Prem clubs don''t make much in the way of profits.

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[quote user="A Load of Squit"]"It''s Character Forming"

Now it''s all about the Murdoch money. Rupert Murdoch does not own BSKYB.

[/quote]

Yes, I was answering a comment by John which said it was all about the "Murdoch money".

Anyway, what % of Sky TV does Murdoch''s company own?

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I''ve nothing against Delia & Michael, they have been excellent owners, but by god I wished Tony Fernadez would have opted for us instead of QPR. Decent generous bloke who has invested massively in the club, and it was only miss-management that saw them relegated. Despite relegation they''re going to get a new stadium, and most likely promotion again. He has a lot of press in Asia, and would have been ideal to raise Norwich''s global profile. Every Air Asia flight has announcements about their sponsorship of QPR along with in flight magazine articles. There''s not many about like him, mega rich, honest and decent. 

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Tony Fernandes has proven himself to be naïve and stupid and while he''s not as slimy as the Tans of this world or as corrupt as the Abrahmoviches he is certainly not a man I want anywhere near the club.

He wanted a crap low budget club to go with his crap low budget airline and he got it in QPR, a true hole of a club.

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[quote user="Its Character Forming"]Just looked it up... News Corp is the largest shareholder of BSkyB with 39.9% according to the Guardian. Not really sure what that proves but there you go.[/quote]
Murdoch is Chief Exec & Chairman.  He may not have his whole hand in the pie but he certainly has a finger in it.

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No reason why Norwich cannot survive and prosper as a mutual type company. A lot depends on where Delia and Michael''s shares end up and whilst we continue to look for investors I do not see the board relinquishing ownership.

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[quote user="Buh"]Tony Fernandes has proven himself to be naïve and stupid and while he''s not as slimy as the Tans of this world or as corrupt as the Abrahmoviches he is certainly not a man I want anywhere near the club. He wanted a crap low budget club to go with his crap low budget airline and he got it in QPR, a true hole of a club.[/quote]

!! Naive & stupid enough to be a well respected self made billionaire !! Have you ever flown Air Asia? I have many times with work in Indonesia and Malaysia, and they''re no worse than many full fare European airlines. They are on a different level to the Ryanairs and Easyjets typically associated with budget airlines. He knows when to put his hand in his pockets to get good press and raise his profile, such as the free flights he laid on for the Philippine cyclone victims and relief efforts. 

The QPR deal was no doubt swung by them being London situated. It will be a shrewd business move moving stadium, as I bet they''ll generate huge income from the sale of Loftus Road to developers. Rumour has it, he was apparently interested in Norwich, but I don''t know if this was just a made up link to do with his Lotus connections.

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[quote user="John from the Tomorrow People"][quote user="Its Character Forming"]Just looked it up... News Corp is the largest shareholder of BSkyB with 39.9% according to the Guardian. Not really sure what that proves but there you go.[/quote]
Murdoch is Chief Exec & Chairman.  He may not have his whole hand in the pie but he certainly has a finger in it.
[/quote]

Nicholas Ferguson is Chairman and Jeremy Darroch is CEO of BskyB, when the phone hacking sandal broke Rupert and his son had to abandon their attempt to take over at BskyB.

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Aren''t Everton proving that it''s possible to challenge the top clubs with an English owner and sensible spending?

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[quote user="Waveney canary"]I would be happy with a foreign owner if it meant that mcnasty and bowkett disappeared and the second coming happened[/quote]

 

Is that when you swap hands?

 

 

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[quote user="Waveney canary"]I would be happy with a foreign owner if it meant that mcnasty and bowkett disappeared and the second coming happened[/quote]

Nurse,nurse he is out of bed again !

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[quote user="TIL 1010"]

[quote user="Waveney canary"]I would be happy with a foreign owner if it meant that mcnasty and bowkett disappeared and the second coming happened[/quote]

Nurse,nurse he is out of bed again !

[/quote]

This made me laugh so much I had to change my adult nappy

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