Central midfield is rubbish

[lincoln canary (& Golden Coppel) 0]

[quote user="Gingerpele"]Lincoln your obsession with my ''obsession'' makes me laugh. My obsession is actually with complete parts like you who think you know what you''re talking about.

If your criticising him after Johnson! well give me strength. Just what I''d expect form you, a one hundred percent biased pathetic assessment of a decent player who you don''t like. Face facts mate, he''s playing. He''s been playing here fairly regularly for three seasons. He''s a premiership midfielder, get over it. He had to carry a midfield yesterday. Woefully exposed? He was one of three or four that actually looked like professional footballers yesterday.

And I hope you don''t rate Lambert, because he started Johnson a lot. And Swnasea bid for him. So....[/quote]

Garbage. BJ is not a decent premiership player. Hughton plays him because of his negative defensive tactics. Run a poll on here, 85% wouldn''t class him as premiership class.

[morty 0]

[quote user="lincoln canary"][quote user="Gingerpele"]Lincoln your obsession with my ''obsession'' makes me laugh. My obsession is actually with complete parts like you who think you know what you''re talking about.

If your criticising him after Johnson! well give me strength. Just what I''d expect form you, a one hundred percent biased pathetic assessment of a decent player who you don''t like. Face facts mate, he''s playing. He''s been playing here fairly regularly for three seasons. He''s a premiership midfielder, get over it. He had to carry a midfield yesterday. Woefully exposed? He was one of three or four that actually looked like professional footballers yesterday.

And I hope you don''t rate Lambert, because he started Johnson a lot. And Swnasea bid for him. So....[/quote]

Garbage. BJ is not a decent premiership player. Hughton plays him because of his negative defensive tactics. Run a poll on here, 85% wouldn''t class him as premiership class.[/quote]Thats a very big statement, you going to start a thread and keep count?

[Indy 3,297]

[quote user="morty"][quote user="lincoln canary"][quote user="Gingerpele"]Lincoln your obsession with my ''obsession'' makes me laugh. My obsession is actually with complete parts like you who think you know what you''re talking about. If your criticising him after Johnson! well give me strength. Just what I''d expect form you, a one hundred percent biased pathetic assessment of a decent player who you don''t like. Face facts mate, he''s playing. He''s been playing here fairly regularly for three seasons. He''s a premiership midfielder, get over it. He had to carry a midfield yesterday. Woefully exposed? He was one of three or four that actually looked like professional footballers yesterday. And I hope you don''t rate Lambert, because he started Johnson a lot. And Swnasea bid for him. So....[/quote] Garbage. BJ is not a decent premiership player. Hughton plays him because of his negative defensive tactics. Run a poll on here, 85% wouldn''t class him as premiership class.[/quote]

Thats a very big statement, you going to start a thread and keep count?
[/quote]

 

To be honest, Johnson and Wes would not be classed as Decent premiership players, but vital and good squad players. I don''t think Johnson is a first 11 in any team, just look at Hull, Cardiff & Palace he would not be a starter in those teams midfields.

 

That being said yesterday he was our best player, so that says a lot about the level pf perfromance and effort by the rest of the team.

 

He is a good back up player and I''m sure if Howson & Tettey were fit they would be ahead of Johnson.

[whoareyou? 0]

I''ve watched Tom Huddlestone at Hull a few times on TV this year now and he would have made a huge difference to ur team IMHO.He sits in that central defensive midfield position, breaks play up, always demanding the ball and play revolves around him.We missed a trick not signing him and we desperately need someone just like him ASAP.

[GJP 79]

[quote user="jas the barclay king"]I am starting to think Tettey might just be our best player... we lose so much when he is out. When Man utd were winning the champions leagues, despite sides that featured Beckham, Giggs, solskjaer, ronaldo etc... united fans used to always say Paul Scholes was their best player for what he bought to the team.. Uniteds worst ever prem season under fergie came when Scholes missed most of it injured....[/quote]

Paul Scholes was a world class player, one of the best midfielders of his generation. How would any team not miss him?

 

If anything it''d be better to compare Howson to him because his use of the ball his better than Tettey - but none of our midfielders are particularly similar to Scholes in style (or level of ability).

[Gingerpele 0]

Lincoln I don''t care if 99% of fans on here say he isn''t pl class. He is.

Two NCFC managers played him regularly. He is a premiership player. Get over it. Your obsession is pathetic.

[GJP 79]

[quote user="whoareyou"]I''ve watched Tom Huddlestone at Hull a few times on TV this year now and he would have made a huge difference to ur team IMHO.

He sits in that central defensive midfield position, breaks play up, always demanding the ball and play revolves around him.

We missed a trick not signing him and we desperately need someone just like him ASAP.
[/quote]

Yup, he''s a quality player and I''d have been happy to see him here but there were many on here who said he isn''t good enough.

[lincoln canary (& Golden Coppel) 0]

[quote user="Gingerpele"]Lincoln I don''t care if 99% of fans on here say he isn''t pl class. He is.

Two NCFC managers played him regularly. He is a premiership player. Get over it. Your obsession is pathetic.[/quote]

He isn''t. And soon he''ll be back in the championship where he belongs.

[morty 0]

[quote user="lincoln canary"][quote user="Gingerpele"]Lincoln I don''t care if 99% of fans on here say he isn''t pl class. He is.

Two NCFC managers played him regularly. He is a premiership player. Get over it. Your obsession is pathetic.[/quote]

He isn''t. And soon he''ll be back in the championship where he belongs.[/quote]You starting that poll thread then?

[Gingerpele 0]

[quote user="lincoln canary"][quote user="Gingerpele"]Lincoln I don''t care if 99% of fans on here say he isn''t pl class. He is.

Two NCFC managers played him regularly. He is a premiership player. Get over it. Your obsession is pathetic.[/quote]

He isn''t. And soon he''ll be back in the championship where he belongs.[/quote]

I take it you thought Lambert was a rubbish defensive manager then? You don''t have a clue, you really don''t....

[Alby :) 0]

Bradley Johnson is far from the worst player in the world, but he will only ever get into the first team when we''re full of injuries.

He would be far better suited to the Championship - that''s his level.

[The Great Drinkell 50]

[quote user="Gingerpele"]We don''t really have a choice Jim Smih.

Howson won''t be fit, Tettey is out. Fer looked way off the pace today. Sticking Hoolahan in there isn''t going to help. If he could tackle, I''d suggest sticking Whittaker in at CM/DM.

But essentially, the midfield is going to get completely outdone against Manchester United.[/quote]

SAF left United with the worst midfield for years. Cleverley is very over rated and Ferguson is just eating back to fitness and Valencia is suspended.

Midfield id some where we could win the battle but on yesterdays performance I just can''t see it.

[Gingerpele 0]

Why was he a Premiership regular for two seasons? Still first choice at the start of the season, and back in the team after ONE central midfield injury? (Only took Tettey injury to get him back in...)???????????????

Some people really amaze me, yes we all have our opinions. But why are some people so insistent they know better than a whole host of professional football staff? At least one scout would have recommended him, Lambert may have suggested him or said yes, McNally would have agreed to do the negotiations. Lambert, Culverhouse and Karsa decided he was good enough, Hughton and his team have decided he is good enough. On a regular basis. Of course he isn''t the best in the world, he should be better at passing as a PL CM, but that hasn''t been a problem for the two management teams that have played him regularly in this top league.

We can all say what we don''t like about him, what he could or should do better. But at the end of the day he is a Premiership midfielder. And was in Lamberts all out attack (.....) team. So that completely invalidates Lincoln straight off the bat. Not that anything he says has any merit in my mind, don''t even know why i''m still replying to him. I really need to stop responding.... Its like a drug.

[Jacko 0]

We all know Johnson''s strengths and weakness. He works hard and can use his physical attributes to put himself about. He isn''t the most technically gifted player around and will surrender possession easily at times.

However, I would agree with Ginger Pele and say that he was actually our most effective midfielder yesterday. He is a very useful squad member which is indicated by the fact two managers with different footballing philosophies have seen fit to select him.

As for the criticism of Fer. I think he would be the first to admit he had an absolute stinker yesterday. However, he has been generally excellent for us this season.

I think the issue some people are overlooking is that because of Tettey''s injury and a lack of other options we''ve basically had no chance to rotate or shuffle the pack, meaning that Howson and Fer have been run into the ground recently. So it''s no surprise Howson is currently injured and Fer looks played out. But for me that shouldn''t be mistaken for laziness.

[Gingerpele 0]

P.S

I''m not actually having a mental breakdown, this is all quite funny really. And I really should be stopping here.

And Cambridge, agree, Fer unfit due to not getting a rest and adjusting to PL rather than lazy.

[ZLF 274]

We are painfully short of options in centre midfield and even wehn fully fit we really do not have much in the way of creativity.    That we we have so few options really does not help.   As Jim says playing 442 is only likely to be a short term success - with Fulham showing teh rest of the league how to smother us yesterday.

 

I dont think the problem is a lack of application/effort from the players,  its is around their technical capability and consistency.

 

Fer IS the best midfielder we have,  unfortunately he is not yet showing that week in week out,  when he does he will double his value and move on so its a bit of a double edged sword,   Fulham was one of the uninfluential games he has - and we always struggle when he is not a presence in the game.    Needs to refine his creativity further. 

 

BJ is bj;   full of effort and committment,   but IS consistent,  you know what you are going to get, the only variable being how many passes he will mis place.   For an enforcer (for me personally) he does too much running around and too little tackling,  he should be a squad player not a regular starter.   I think thats where the club see him and he starts as Tettey & Howson are injured.

 

Howson is this seasons most improved player;   he is better when he has Tettey behind him,  and worse when BJ is there.   As part of a 2 man CM partnership he has a tendency to become more anonymous but his movement and discipline aare great, together with his strong shooting ability, but adding a consistent presence and improving his creativity for others are his two improvement areas.

 

Tettey is a limited player in terms of scope,  but he does his allotted role superbly and allows howson and Fer to perform.  We have missed his influence enormously.

 

Our main problem is that beyond them we only have Wes as an option,  whom the manager seems to struggle to find a role.

 

Buying midfield options is a key priority for this squad (I am starting to think Bridcutt may actually be a good idea :-s) - both with a Tettey alternative and a creative cm (a younger stronger wes?) the priorities - even over centre backs.

 

 

[lincoln canary (& Golden Coppel) 0]

[quote user="Gingerpele"]Why was he a Premiership regular for two seasons? Still first choice at the start of the season, and back in the team after ONE central midfield injury? (Only took Tettey injury to get him back in...)???????????????

Some people really amaze me, yes we all have our opinions. But why are some people so insistent they know better than a whole host of professional football staff? At least one scout would have recommended him, Lambert may have suggested him or said yes, McNally would have agreed to do the negotiations. Lambert, Culverhouse and Karsa decided he was good enough, Hughton and his team have decided he is good enough. On a regular basis. Of course he isn''t the best in the world, he should be better at passing as a PL CM, but that hasn''t been a problem for the two management teams that have played him regularly in this top league.

We can all say what we don''t like about him, what he could or should do better. But at the end of the day he is a Premiership midfielder. And was in Lamberts all out attack (.....) team. So that completely invalidates Lincoln straight off the bat. Not that anything he says has any merit in my mind, don''t even know why i''m still replying to him. I really need to stop responding.... Its like a drug.[/quote]

When lambert signed him it was because that was the calibre of player we could attract, high championship standard. That''s where we went shopping as we were in our infancy in terms of a premiership side. It''s normal practice. He was signed because he was better than what we had at the time. That''s it. I can''t remember clubs queuing up for us signature, and even Leeds fans didnt rate him that highly.

There''s no point in arguing on this. The majority on here don''t believe he is good enough. Your BJ love clouds your judgement. Either that or you enjoy supporting the minority and the battle that goes with it.

[Gingerpele 0]

lincoln, I support the club.

I really couldn''t give a monkeys what the majority on here think. And the majority on here these days consists of overly negative prats like you and trolls. Most sensible level headed posters have been driven out or just given up trying.

I don''t have a BJ love cloud, you have a BJ hate cloud. Its pathetic you can be so insulting to a player who has only done his best at the club. And really hasn''t been that bad.

Personally, I would rather trust the judgement of Lambert and co, and Hughton and co. Than you. Goodbye.

[Mason 47 1,376]

As I said on another thread, it was really apparent to me yesterday that their 5-man midfield made it very difficult for our 4.

Johnson was far and away the best midfielder, but given Fer''s nightmare he was left trying to play the entire middle relatively solo and we all know that isn''t what we want him for. Whenever he broke rank to chase a ball down or make a block, it opened space in behind him that Fer just wasn''t covering yesterday; see their second goal for evidence of this.

That said, 3 central midfielders against 2 means they are always likely to have a spare man, lo and behold the spare man scored the winner. As much as I want to be angry or whatever, I can''t see anything we could do with current available personnel to change things yesterday.

The only saving grace in Fer''s performance is the look on his face when Redmond of all people got booked taking down their breakaway after Leroy had surrendered the ball. Regardless of fatigue, he knows he took a knee yesterday and I would hope for a reaction against United.

[Gingerpele 0]

And Lincoln, please point me to this majority anyway? Most i''ve seen on this thread don''t seem to be agreeing with you? But you ignore that and keep on your completely failing argument. Must be fun in your bubble.

And in addition to another mention about Johnson having to play the entire midfield on his own, he also had to cover for Olsson who had a very poor game defensively. Every block at LB i saw in the second half came from Johnson.

[RvWs 4 year contract 0]

Johnson was asked to do too much yesterday.

Not only did he have to cover for Fer who had one of his worst games since joining, he had to cover defensively as well.

[lincoln canary (& Golden Coppel) 0]

[quote user="Gingerpele"]And Lincoln, please point me to this majority anyway? Most i''ve seen on this thread don''t seem to be agreeing with you? But you ignore that and keep on your completely failing argument. Must be fun in your bubble.

And in addition to another mention about Johnson having to play the entire midfield on his own, he also had to cover for Olsson who had a very poor game defensively. Every block at LB i saw in the second half came from Johnson.[/quote]

Do you think BJ would get into any other premiership first 11? Also how do you explain the Leeds fans opinion of him? And the fact he wasn''t always a regular for them?

[Nuff Said 5,119]

[quote user="lincoln canary"][quote user="Gingerpele"]And Lincoln, please point me to this majority anyway? Most i''ve seen on this thread don''t seem to be agreeing with you? But you ignore that and keep on your completely failing argument. Must be fun in your bubble.

And in addition to another mention about Johnson having to play the entire midfield on his own, he also had to cover for Olsson who had a very poor game defensively. Every block at LB i saw in the second half came from Johnson.[/quote]

Do you think BJ would get into any other premiership first 11? Also how do you explain the Leeds fans opinion of him? And the fact he wasn''t always a regular for them?[/quote]Personally, I would rate the opinions of Lambert and his management team AND Hughton and his management team higher than that of Leeds fans.

[lincoln canary (& Golden Coppel) 0]

[quote user="Nuff Said"][quote user="lincoln canary"][quote user="Gingerpele"]And Lincoln, please point me to this majority anyway? Most i''ve seen on this thread don''t seem to be agreeing with you? But you ignore that and keep on your completely failing argument. Must be fun in your bubble.

And in addition to another mention about Johnson having to play the entire midfield on his own, he also had to cover for Olsson who had a very poor game defensively. Every block at LB i saw in the second half came from Johnson.[/quote]

Do you think BJ would get into any other premiership first 11? Also how do you explain the Leeds fans opinion of him? And the fact he wasn''t always a regular for them?[/quote]Personally, I would rate the opinions of Lambert and his management team AND Hughton and his management team higher than that of Leeds fans. [/quote]

If it suits an agenda than yes why not.

[Herman 9,754]

I would rate the opinions of Jan Moir and Melanie Phillips higher than that of Leeds fans.

[GJP 79]

There''s just no spark in midfield without Howson.

[rowdyman 0]

Parker ran the show yesterday our midfield need far to long on the ball and give it away far too often, when they get in tight areas they look clueless, the worrying thing Fulham looked classier than us on occassions and they are in the bottom three. not enough of our guys were busting their guts to get in vital areas and the service to our frontmen was awful. i hate to think what Manure will do to us saturday we have to raise it by such a long way.

[Warren Hill 0]

[quote user="rowdyman"]Parker ran the show yesterday our midfield need far to long on the ball and give it away far too often, when they get in tight areas they look clueless, the worrying thing Fulham looked classier than us on occassions and they are in the bottom three. not enough of our guys were busting their guts to get in vital areas and the service to our frontmen was awful. i hate to think what Manure will do to us saturday we have to raise it by such a long way.[/quote]

 

At least Arsenal are top, eh?[;)]

 

 

[Paul Spector 0]

Given our lack of options in midfield, should we look to the youth team - namely Cam McGeehan?

From the people I speak to at the club, the lad is really highly rated by the management. Yesterday we were crying out for another body in midfield when we were getting completely over-run. Wouldn''t Cam would be an alternative to playing others out of position?

The likes of Ward-Prowse et al at Southampton were playing at a younger age.

Surely we need to at least consider him as an option, even if only from the bench. FA Cup perhaps?

Or can beggars be choosers?

Thoughts?

[Fergodsake 0]

We have serious issues with squad balance, that is pretty obvious, not enough players in the central midfield especially those who are creative passing players, two slightly too similar strikers, a number of solid wingers but not enough with any real creative flair, too few centre backs. Essentially we are 3 or 4 players short of a full balanced squad. Essentially with another season and a good pair of transfer windows we could end up with a very strong squad. Unfortunately we have far too many players at the enforcer end of the technical spectrum to make much of a go at it this season. Huddlestone would have been a great buy, but that would have meant spending a lot of money on a player with a rep for having glass knees, straight after the purchase of Leroy Fer who was already discount because of his previous knee related issues.