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wcorkcanary

Wes off in Jan?

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Sorry OldBob but I am with Monty on this!

To be bkunt the argument that Wes loses the ball more than everyone else is comolete tosh! An opinion based on perception and not on fact.

When Wes plays he shows for the ball all the time. As a playmaker you want this and as a result he has the most touches and possession of the ball. Tgerefore there is a greater chance of him losing it! Thus because he is in possession the most it appears like he gives it away the most.

There has never been any stats to prove this.

I just wish he would shoot more often.

Wes is a top player who would be a great asset to any side and would be a loss if he left.

Unselfish players are a rare asset!

Snake

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Oh come on, seriously, are we still having this argument? Wes isn''t a "premier league player"? Ask Hughton if he thinks he is a premier league player, ask Lambert, ask O''Neill? Hughton isn''t using him because his priority is clean sheets, not because he thinks he''s not good enough.

Its crazy to say he looses possession too much so we shouldn''t play him. All the players on the pitch yesterday were losing possession. If we didn''t play players because they give the ball away Bradley would never pull on the yellow and green again.

Wes gives it away far far less than most of our players. He knits our plays together and he can launch counter attacks too. Just look at the DVD of our first season back if you''ve forgotten that. Or the West Ham game the other week?

I certainly hope to see him play against Fulham now that Howson is injured.

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[quote user="snake-eyes"]Sorry OldBob but I am with Monty on this!

To be bkunt the argument that Wes loses the ball more than everyone

else is comolete tosh! An opinion based on perception and not on fact.

When Wes plays he shows for the ball all the time. As a playmaker

you want this and as a result he has the most touches and possession of

the ball. Tgerefore there is a greater chance of him losing it! Thus

because he is in possession the most it appears like he gives it away

the most.

There has never been any stats to prove this.

I just wish he would shoot more often.

Wes is a top player who would be a great asset to any side and would be a loss if he left.

Unselfish players are a rare asset!

Snake

[/quote][quote user="a1canary"]Oh come on, seriously, are we still having this argument? Wes isn''t a "premier league player"? Ask Hughton if he thinks he is a premier league player, ask Lambert, ask O''Neill? Hughton isn''t using him because his priority is clean sheets, not because he thinks he''s not good enough.

Its crazy to say he looses possession too much so we shouldn''t play him. All the players on the pitch yesterday were losing possession. If we didn''t play players because they give the ball away Bradley would never pull on the yellow and green again.

Wes gives it away far far less than most of our players. He knits our plays together and he can launch counter attacks too. Just look at the DVD of our first season back if you''ve forgotten that. Or the West Ham game the other week?

I certainly hope to see him play against Fulham now that Howson is injured.[/quote]Gentlemen, you are of course entitled to your opinion, which in this case is obviously always going to differ from mine.  Lambert certainly played him in our first season in the PL, whether he would have played him if he''d stayed we''ll never know.  Hughton doesn''t play him, I don''t think it''s just the clean sheet argument, maybe we play to a different system with better players, and it remains to be seen how much O''Neill plays him on the international scene which, tbf, is a very different kettle of fish to the PL.Not sure Snake whether that perception is one held solely by myself, rather think not, judging by rather a lot of other posts, but still, all a matter of opinions, tosh or not.I have a feeling he won''t be with us for much longer, new house or not, maybe ''til the end of the season, when all these opinions about him will become spurious.  Happy Christmas gentlemen.[;)]

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Gentlemen, you are of course entitled to your opinion, which in this case is obviously always going to differ from mine. Lambert certainly played him in our first season in the PL, whether he would have played him if he''d stayed we''ll never know. Hughton doesn''t play him, I don''t think it''s just the clean sheet argument, maybe we play to a different system with better players, and it remains to be seen how much O''Neill plays him on the international scene which, tbf, is a very different kettle of fish to the PL.

OdlRobert wrote:

Not sure Snake whether that perception is one held solely by myself, rather think not, judging by rather a lot of other posts, but still, all a matter of opinions, tosh or not.

I have a feeling he won''t be with us for much longer, new house or not, maybe ''til the end of the season, when all these opinions about him will become spurious. Happy Christmas gentlemen.

....................................................................

OldRobert - you wouldn''t be Robert Chase would you ? Pretty clueless so would not surprise me !

Everyone will remember his (Chase) opinion of Mark Robins & Efan Ekoku - 2 top class strikers we had at the club in the early 90''s. He sold those 2 players for peanuts - they were both contracted with us and were loyal & didn''t want to leave.

This situation stinks - very similar to Robins & Ekoku. What we are in discussion about is a very good player - not someone that''s average.

Hoolahan has a different game to any other player at this football club. I think you are pretty ignorant if you don''t know what that is. Hughton did play Hoolahan in that 2nd season when he took over but will be making the same mistake as Deehan & Chase in 94 if he was to allow Hoolahan to leave.

Also LDC - 8 million doesn''t guarantee goals does it ? Fer put RVW one- on- one with their keeper. Result - ?????

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Do not feel alone OldRobert, regardless of the ''clueless'' abuse I agree with you.

It was noted that apparently Nottingham Forest and Wigan could be interested in Wes. Not any of the top six Premiership clubs then? Or even the middle or bottom Premiership clubs.

I think a reality check is needed here. Wes has been a great servant to Norwich City but most of his reputation was built in League One and the Championship.

Perhaps we got into the Premiership a year or two too late to see the best of him at this level. Wes is now 31 and is attracting interest from other clubs. Clubs at a lower level. Does not that in itself tell you anything?

The biggest problem with Wes is that he is virtually a one position, one system player who finds it extremely difficult to adapt to any change of system that the manager wants to play .... any manager, as has been seen from some of the games under Lambert and at international level.

Yes, he has done a very good job for us, but times move on, and this could be a good time for both him and us.

Having said all of that I would not be too happy to sell him without an adequate replacement, possibly an exchange deal somewhere? I believe there are some useful players at Wigan (a club mentioned), with Premiership experience who could be looking to move back to the Premiership?

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[quote user="Yellow Wall"]Do not feel alone OldRobert, regardless of the ''clueless'' abuse I agree with you.

It was noted that apparently Nottingham Forest and Wigan could be interested in Wes. Not any of the top six Premiership clubs then? Or even the middle or bottom Premiership clubs.

I think a reality check is needed here. Wes has been a great servant to Norwich City but most of his reputation was built in League One and the Championship.

Perhaps we got into the Premiership a year or two too late to see the best of him at this level. Wes is now 31 and is attracting interest from other clubs. Clubs at a lower level. Does not that in itself tell you anything?

The biggest problem with Wes is that he is virtually a one position, one system player who finds it extremely difficult to adapt to any change of system that the manager wants to play .... any manager, as has been seen from some of the games under Lambert and at international level.

Yes, he has done a very good job for us, but times move on, and this could be a good time for both him and us.

Having said all of that I would not be too happy to sell him without an adequate replacement, possibly an exchange deal somewhere? I believe there are some useful players at Wigan (a club mentioned), with Premiership experience who could be looking to move back to the Premiership?[/quote]My thanks Yellow Wall for your support.  Your comments are exactly the conundrum with Hoolahan imo, which have become more widely recognised as different systems are played, which he doesn''t really fit into.  It will be interesting to see what his future is.''Six Pack''...........others have disagreed with me on this thread without resorting to any form of personal remarks or abuse.  When you do the same, I may answer your post.[H]

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Barmy to sell any of the squad in January. No need, plus we need the cover. That''s why even Becchio wasn''t allowed to go to boro at the start of the season. Wes is a 1st team squad member, he''s just out of the team at the moment.

With regards to this perception that he''s a luxury and cannot adapt to different formations - I thought he was excellent vs palace despite being on the right hand side of midfield in a 442.

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The real questions are, Have we missed Wes when he''s not played? Is he ahead of Fer, Howson, Johnson & Tettey in Hughton''s mind?

 

I for one like Pilks would not be dissapointed either way, if they go or stay! I think we can afford to sell both Pilks and Wes without much impact to us.

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[quote user="Yellow Wall"]Do not feel alone OldRobert, regardless of the ''clueless'' abuse I agree with you.

It was noted that apparently Nottingham Forest and Wigan could be interested in Wes. Not any of the top six Premiership clubs then? Or even the middle or bottom Premiership clubs.

I think a reality check is needed here. Wes has been a great servant to Norwich City but most of his reputation was built in League One and the Championship.

Perhaps we got into the Premiership a year or two too late to see the best of him at this level. Wes is now 31 and is attracting interest from other clubs. Clubs at a lower level. Does not that in itself tell you anything?

The biggest problem with Wes is that he is virtually a one position, one system player who finds it extremely difficult to adapt to any change of system that the manager wants to play .... any manager, as has been seen from some of the games under Lambert and at international level.

Yes, he has done a very good job for us, but times move on, and this could be a good time for both him and us.

Having said all of that I would not be too happy to sell him without an adequate replacement, possibly an exchange deal somewhere? I believe there are some useful players at Wigan (a club mentioned), with Premiership experience who could be looking to move back to the Premiership?[/quote]

Wow - the''re really crawling out of their holes now ! out from under toillet seats, etc.. The blind leading the blind !

I was trying to explain how Hoolahan gave us different option thru the way he plays - it''s obvious you don''t understand.

I''m not carried away with how he played in League One or the championship - it was against the Man U, Arsenal, Chelsea, Man City in the premiership that I realized what a good player he is.

Really impressed with you pointing out that those interested are from the lower divisions - did you kick your heels when you made that point ? What swap him for Callum Macmanaman ?? there are hundreds of wingers like him in the lower divisions - a dollar a dozen. No one would touch them with a barge pole - yet you want to swap Hoolahan for him !!!!.

It''s christmas - why not give away a class player for a b-grade average Joe.

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The club are pretty savvy with these things. I suspect if Wes is off then someone else is already lined up and coming in.

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I must be the only person on the planet that doesn''t actually rate Wes Hoolahan THAT much at THIS level. I think he''s overrated here to be honest. I think there are now better options out there. If he goes... meh. Not as if he''s playing anyway is it.

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[quote user="Six Pack"]

Wow - the''re really crawling out of their holes now ! out from under toillet seats, etc.. The blind leading the blind !

I was trying to explain how Hoolahan gave us different option thru the way he plays - it''s obvious you don''t understand.

I''m not carried away with how he played in League One or the championship - it was against the Man U, Arsenal, Chelsea, Man City in the premiership that I realized what a good player he is.

Really impressed with you pointing out that those interested are from the lower divisions - did you kick your heels when you made that point ? What swap him for Callum Macmanaman ?? there are hundreds of wingers like him in the lower divisions - a dollar a dozen. No one would touch them with a barge pole - yet you want to swap Hoolahan for him !!!!.

It''s christmas - why not give away a class player for a b-grade average Joe.[/quote]Your post is so full of cliches is doesn''t warrant a response.  Anyway, apparently I''m blind so I''d have trouble typing it anyway.[:|]

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Let''s all take part in a bit of Wes bashing shall we?! What''s he ever done for us anyway!?

Dear God, what''s wrong with you people!?

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Come on Alby, it is Christmas after all, what else are we gonna do!? Bit of Wes bashing, tremendous entertainment for city fans everywhere!

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Jeez, when i posted the original question i wondered if it(wes leavin in Jan) was being mentioned anywhere else...or was it Irish pres/radio just bumping one if their own....as they have repeatedly with Shane Long leaving W Brom soon (they say). It wasnt intended to ignite Wes bashing or slagging off of other posters. What it does show is that Wes does divide opinion....is he luxury we cant accommodate or is the missing piece of a jigsaw CH is struggling to complete? would he be completely surplus to requirements if someone like toivonen came in.?

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wcorkcanary wrote:would he be completely surplus to requirements if someone like toivonen came in.?

...........................................................................

You sure this toivonen''s is any good ??

That''s the problem isn''t it - all these mercenaries with their edited "you tube" clips, impressive CV''s with goal scoring records against B- grade defences.

I can only go by what I see on the football pitch & results. We can get Toivonen but like some we got this year - I wouldn''t bet he is as good as Hoolahan - at what he does.

We acquired quite a few "headless" chickens last window - good at bombing into the opposition penalty area; some people scoring "wonder" goals -real hit & miss. We haven''t got someone that can retain the ball & kept it from the opposition.

We have been on the "back foot" in most matches because we lack such a player.

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[quote user="Yellow Wall"]Do not feel alone OldRobert, regardless of the ''clueless'' abuse I agree with you.

It was noted that apparently Nottingham Forest and Wigan could be interested in Wes. Not any of the top six Premiership clubs then? Or even the middle or bottom Premiership clubs.

I think a reality check is needed here. Wes has been a great servant to Norwich City but most of his reputation was built in League One and the Championship.

Perhaps we got into the Premiership a year or two too late to see the best of him at this level. Wes is now 31 and is attracting interest from other clubs. Clubs at a lower level. Does not that in itself tell you anything?

The biggest problem with Wes is that he is virtually a one position, one system player who finds it extremely difficult to adapt to any change of system that the manager wants to play .... any manager, as has been seen from some of the games under Lambert and at international level.

Yes, he has done a very good job for us, but times move on, and this could be a good time for both him and us.

Having said all of that I would not be too happy to sell him without an adequate replacement, possibly an exchange deal somewhere? I believe there are some useful players at Wigan (a club mentioned), with Premiership experience who could be looking to move back to the Premiership?[/quote]

.......................................................................

Still want to swoop him for someone from Wigan Yellow Wall ??

Just reiterating - it''s easy to tell if a player is any good by their performances against the top 6 clubs.

Manure are the champions - their hot-shot team looked pretty ordinary yesterday didn''t they ? - with Hoolahan carving them up - think anyone from Wigan can do that ??

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A poster on the not606 site has said that Wes''s house is up for sale!

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[quote user="JF"]A poster on the not606 site has said that Wes''s house is up for sale![/quote]

I can safely say it wasn''t a couple of weeks ago. His old one might be , I know this as my mate is wiring his new build house which is brought and paid for !!

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